FaboBabo.3581

Who needs Chrono, you'll have rene and FB.

Ez Pz balance.

More diversity, much flexible.

30 sec Portal lul

Dont play mesmer

> @"Tiah.3091" said:

> About inconsistency, I think this is much better example:

> _"soulbeasts are currently overperforming in competitive game modes, so we're lowering the power of some of the skills used in their builds"

> "Dolyak Stance: This skill no longer applies retaliation. Instead, it now reduces incoming condition damage and physical damage by 33% for the duration of the stance in addition to its other effects."_

>

> Seriously, I rofled like crazy.

Lol thats a flat buff ?

> @"DemonSeed.3528" said:

> If you guys are seriously leaving, can I have some stuff you don't need anymore? I know the changes are not favourable in many ways but I experience this on every single class that I've become desensitized to it. I can only try to adapt and accept with each change, and try to not stay sour about it for long. I guess my main draw to this game is all the builds, classes, weapon sets, etc I get to constantly switch to so it's not as bad on my end since I like to change things up frequently. I know the changes are rough, but I think we'll have to see in the next few weeks if any changes will need to be considered. Maybe Anet wanted to spend more time with their families during the holiday so they made this patch as untasty as possible so many don't play for the time being XD *tinfoil*

No you can't - me and many others will Simply keep stuff if anything will get good again soon - in a few years or something.

Seems like The General answer for the question is ; No , they weren't happy back then.

Yeah Goodbye guys. Cya in a few months maybe

> @"Me Games Ma.8426" said:

> I would recommend Sword Offhand and Illusions using Persistence of Memory, Phantasmal Haste and Phantasmal Force.

> If you use that you can fight on 19+ might the whole time.

>

> When you summon the Sword phantasm you gain 8 might and when it dies you gain 11 Might. And if you run Phantasmal Haste it dies pretty quickly. Combined with SotEther thjs makes a really good leveling build.

Keep in mind that u need to hit with your own sword to grant yourself AND the phantasm the 8 might.

Fun fact : in wvw u grant yourself 4 might only due to skill split , but phantasm still gets it 8 stacks.

I was like wth ?

> @"KryTiKaL.3125" said:

> > @"babazhook.6805" said:

> > > @"enkidu.5937" said:

> > > > @"WraithOfStealth.1624" said:

> > > > Aside from specific classes being overtuned or not, if you want to tone down condition damage or application rate across the board, you really have to take into account how this will affect **every other** condition build. Reading the post i can tell that there is not much of a problem with most other condi builds, so i'm a bit confused as to why this would require a global nerf to conditions.

> > > I wonder if we could get a compromise between the two extremes: stacking in duration (as it was in the first years), and intensity (as it is now). Maybe cap fire and confusion stacks at 10 max., and let every additional application of fire / confusion increase duration.

> > >

> > > I totally agree with you, that there are already enough tools (=condi cleanses), but they are almost useless against some of the condi bomb madness, nowadays. I just died because of a one-second fire tick for 8.8k (vs. core guard + scourge), though I had several condi cleanses ready-to-use. So this post is completely unbiased . . . xD

> > >

> >

> > I think there still a bias among the entire playerbase when it comes to a condition death. As example you died to an 8.8 burn tick. This means you had around that in health remaining. Had a power build removed that 8.8k of health in a single attack (and there many attacks that do this much damage and more) , would you react the same way?

>

> To be completely honest, it has less to do with the damage or dying to it but rather it has to do with how *frequently* this damage can be done or reapplied.

>

> Take for instance Warrior and Eviscerate. Eviscerate can hit for 10k up to 14k (sometimes more but these are the numbers I see with mara/zerk gear). Eviscerate only does this kind of damage if the Warrior has 3 full bars of Adrenaline, at least 10+ stacks of Might, plus Swiftness (damage bonus of 3% from Warrior's Sprint), Peak Performance (20% damage increase for 6 sec after Physical skill is used aka Bull's Charge), and we assume Burst Mastery is traited. Also keeping in mind that it has a very telegraphed animation, the hit only applying after the full, very short distance leap is performed. If you miss (blind), it is blocked, invuln'd, interrupted, or evaded you lose all of that adrenaline and it goes onto at least a 6 and a half second cooldown not counting needing to build 3 bars of adrenaline again plus setting everything else up.

>

> Another example could be Core Guardian. Yes it can deal out a significant chunk of burst in a very short amount of time, but this all requires timing and actually landing a chain of skills. This is typically done with its burst combo of "Shield of Wrath (wait for duration to tick lower) > Weapon swap > Mighty Blow > Judge's Intervention (used near the end of Mighty Blow animation) > Virtue of Justice > Smite Condition (optional). Glacial Heart also may proc during this combo. Keep in mind this is the main big damage source for Core Guardian and to pull it off essentially requires all of these skills to be off cooldown, it also requires that it not be dodged, or invuln'd, or blocked, or miss (blind), or interrupted. It is also very telegraphed because you can see them waiting for their Shield of Wrath duration to tick down before they do it.

>

> Do you see the differences here? There are no big telegraphs to all of this condition output from some of these classes with condi heavy builds. Mirages near constantly just have their illusions/clones/phantasms active because Anet gave them access to having like 9 of them active at one time without really any indication that they are about to shatter their clones, not to mention scepter auto attack applying Torment alone. Yes the illusions perform an animation to depict the shatter....except they do this animation *after* the effect/damage already happens.

>

>

kill clones, dodge initial phantasm attack so they wont even spawn. 3 clones is the Limit. F2 has a 21 second CD when traited. Mirage attacks can be blocked/blinded too?

Mirage combo is , axe 2 , axe 2 , jaunt , axe 3 , F2, so it spent a lot of things too. Axe 2 is easy telegraphed, most mirages use dodge in between so it cant get canceled - dodge or block this. If u run away, axe 3 will never hit u. You can still dodge to block the whole Axe 3. Mirages will shatter after Axe 3 so u can mitigate the shatter "burst" too.

Plenty of ways to counter the Class, just like any other one...

Scepter has 900 range and is clunky as hell. The shatter animation is when a RANGED clone is running towards u with 10 Units/second - movespeed. Try auto it once with any power class, and your gucci.

Stay out of meele to avoid Shatters - Plenty of good Players could do this vs me - so negating my only win condition.

Did anyone of u actually died to any form of Mesmer, without their Shatters?

Vs. any good player i'm struggling to ever have 3 clones at the same time...

Problem is ; bad players just dont want to kill my clones. They think they only need to damage me, so in fact they simply try to ignore my class mechanic.

Same thing as running into a Reaper when shroud is 100% and afterwards crying, because it had so much HP.

> @"LaFurion.3167" said:

> Conditions are no longer damage over time (in all game modes, but especially in wvw and pvp).

>

> The mechanic of "condi cleanse" has basically been totally outpaced by power creep and just how quickly and how many conditions a lot of these overperforming classes can stack up on you. The damage is now basically just power burst now, just applied condi = death. Resistance is basically the only thing that can save you if you get hit by a condi bomb, which back in the day was relatively easy to do. Nowadays its just a joke. And the fact that there is no defensive stat to negate condition damage is laughable when you really look at how much the condi's hit for.

>

>

> I just had a condi mirage just murder me. Like straight up, I could not touch him, he toyed with me by jaunting around every time I got close, invising when I got close, confusing me with clones for a split second then he was gone again, sword leap away when I got close again. Then he shatter me, all I hear is poof poof poof no cast time no animation just 30 different conditions on me then I go down.

>

> I honestly think it is time to reduce condition damage (a lot of people have been asking for a flat damage nerf accross the board but I worry what this will do to core specs). Either nerf condition damage by 15% in wvw and spvp and go from there, OR nerf mirage and scourge condition application RATE or DAMAGE. These two classes have far too many conditions far too easily. And when you look at other condi builds that have become absolutely obsolete such as burn warrior or guardian that has like 2 damaging conditions only at 1/5th the application, it really makes me wonder what Anet is thinking.

>

>

> Please. I honestly don't think it is justifiable at all. In open world or raids, who cares. But the players on the receiving end of this joke are becoming fed up. Honestly, how can a mirage (who is one of the most mobile, evasive, pseudo tanky classes in the game mind you) do that much damage? And how can it be that if a scourge touches you catch every disease under the sun?

>

> Either slow down the damage conditions do (like DOUBLE the time it takes to deal damage so I can actually react instead of having to blow everything to survive) or lower condition damage. PLEASE.

>

Kill clones. Cleanse or dont attack when confu is up. Dont get confused by clones (lol). Play a duelling class if u want to duel. 30 different condis ?

Scourge ????

The prestige ; 3 seconds Stealth every 24 seconds when traited. Signet ; 2 seconds Stealth every 30 seconds. Completly broken perma Stealth Mirage.

How many people of u have fun by getting one shotted from any profession?

There is no fun in war but hypocrisy

> @"Crab Fear.1624" said:

> > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said:

> > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said:

> > > and at the cost on their endurance regen.

> >

> > Just commenting on this bit _again_.

> > Exhaustion doesn't work on mirage. It works on DD because DD has access to endurance gain skills.

>

> yes it does. exhaustion takes a 20 second dodge recharge and make it 23-24 seconds

>

>

> it works. the point is to put a longer time between uses.

>

> i wish UC broke stuns, I wouldnt care about exhaustion at all

10 seconds per dodge.

6 seconds endurance is a 60% endurance loss. It Works on dazes , so it punishes dodging while dazed. What class gets punished by dodging while dazed ?

> @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > @"FaboBabo.3581" said:

> > > @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said:

> > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said:

> > > > > > Cloak needs to be tied to EM, exhaustion 2 or 3 secs as a cost.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Boom fixed

> > > > >

> > > > > This is dumb. Mirage having a 2-3 automatic exhaustion on all dodges at all times would make it straight up unviable.

> > > >

> > > > i mean if it breaks stun, not just because

> > >

> > > The op doesn't say anything about dodging CC.

> > >

> > > Mirage cloak just needs to be restricted on CCs that prevent dodging. Remove stunbreak on Elusive Mind, replace it with something else like Mirage Cloak let's you strafe and move backwards at full speed. Done.

> >

> > Stop with the useless backward full speed bs.

>

> Dude imagine scepter ambushing directly at a person at super speed away from them. It'd be awesome. If you think that's useless, you're probably not very bright.

Not interested. Way too situational.

I dont kite , i hunt.

> @"Fortus.6175" said:

> > @"FaboBabo.3581" said:

> > > @"Fortus.6175" said:

> > > > @"FaboBabo.3581" said:

> > > > > @"Trevor Boyer.6524" said:

> > > > > Condi Mirage feels broken because there are only a handful of builds in the game that can actually deal with them. All of the other builds/classes actually can't deal with them at all in any way. This creates an effect where the Condi Mirage effects the intra-class dynamic in special ways that other classes do not. In shorter words, the Condi Mirage is the biggest culprit that pushes otherwise viable specs completely out of play because it is able to counter them so hard, that those specs become useless in games where a Condi Mirage is present.

> > > > >

> > > > > The above effect is mainly due to:

> > > > > * Condi Mirage having too much burst and attrition, with a mixture of power and condi damage. Only a handful of builds are even capable of out bruising a Condi Mirage on a node to make it run. These are the builds being played by people who say "Fighting Condi Mirage is a l2p issue."

> > > > > * Too much chase potential. Nothing in the game can escape a Condi Mirage that actually wants to kill you, aside from stealth spam. So that effect I mentioned: If you aren't playing one of the classes that can out bruise the Condi Mirage, you lose because you can't even out mobility or run from as counter play.

> > > > > * Too much disengage potential. Nothing in the game can solo chase and kill a Condi Mirage that actually wants to live. Between stealth, 4x ground target teleports, and portal entre, you would need 1 person like a Herald "who has great chase potential" to actually pressure the Mirage while it is teleporting around the map, and then have a couple guys camp the first portal so that when it tries to portal back after kiting Herald away, they can jump it. It's like a 2 to 3 man job to kill a Condi Mirage who knows how to survive. The same cannot be said for any build in the game, outside old bunker specs in previous metas where DPS was significantly lower. So the effect I mentioned again: There is no special counter spec to be devised that is somehow good at chasing and eliminating Condi Mirage more quickly than some other build. It can kite everything equally as well as anything else.

> > > > > * So what happens is, if you cannot just "bully it off node or out bruise it" there is no reason to chase it or run from it. This leaves a very small margin of viable builds to play that do not get hard countered by Condi Mirage.

> > > > >

> > > > > **So in the end it's not that Condi Mirage is overpowered. We aren't necessarily looking at an overpowered spec here. We are looking at a spec that is THE NON-META CRUSHER. Holosmiths can be disengaged or chased and played around with sheer mobility. Reapers can be highly out mobilized and countered by rando off meta ranged. Firebrands can be bursted down by the most random off meta power DPS. Ect Ect, all other meta specs can actually be countered by ultra random off meta deviations, which is good actually and balanced play. But Condi Mirage, if you can't out-bruise it with statistical attribute tied methods, there is no counter play to it. <- This my friends is exactly WHERE Condi Mirage is broken, and where it needs patching.**

> > > > >

> > > > > I highly urge Arenanet to change Jaunt to a 2 ammo skill, or to significantly increase the CD of jaunt ammo. This would eliminate a bit of Mirage mobility, its chase/disengage, and make more room for counter play around the Mirage for those specs that cannot statistically stand toe to toe with it. The reason why this is so important is because right now, if a spec who cannot stand toe to toe tries to run, the Condi Mirage can keep the fight on him and force him into the fight due to way too much mobility. I'll guarantee you that this is largely the reason why so many people complain about Condi Mirage.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > 1 : Those are the builds, that well - counter Mirage.

> > > > 2: Where would u wanna run to? Are we in WvW? Communicate with Teammates.

> > > > 3: Play 4 mid 1 far , win over 4 mid cause Mes is bad at Team fighting - use the win.

> > > > 4: U could stop double dodging in Plat+ , while i Stand still and my clones attack only.

> > > >

> > > > So since we're talking about frustration ; I think its frustrating that one Class can provide itself 100% boon uptime on 8-10 insanely strong Boons. Even More Frustrating if 50% of all classes got more endurance Regen then the Dodge Spec of Mes. Veeeery Frustrating if people call out "broken blocks and blinds" if i play axe/torch and sword/sword illu/inspi/mirage.

> > > >

> > > > You got me right ? THOSE MAD BLINDS - oh wait cut the last S , but those mad BLOCKS - oh wait cut the last S.

> > >

> > > *looks at profile picture, mirage, alrighty"

> > >

> > > Look man, the capability of mirages to jerk people around a point is insanely strong. You DO have blind**S**, every shatter is one. Just to put into reference how insanely strong that is, a grandmaster trait on ele applies blind to ONE target, on burn, 8 secs ICD, meanwhile, mesmer has a non-grandmaster which applies AoE blinds on each shatter (and you have more than one).

> > >

> > > Right now they are frustrating to play agaisnt, they teleport around all the time, can get better positioning, chase you or port out until the fire subsides. Honestly, it takes the effort of several people to get one mesmer down, if at all, most of the time you are lucky if you can push it away for long enough before it contest the point again. I know 2 people who like me are in platinum, they got there playing mirage, the moment they play anything else, they get frustrated because "wow no blinds uptime, so little burst, cant toy people around". The build is virtually carrying them when they barely ever play mesmers.

> > >

> >

> > Tells me i got blind on shatter als Illu/Insp/mirage - exactly those guys i was referring too.

> >

> > Gj not reading, but answering my Post.

>

> Every class have strong traitlines. Just be happy mesmers have 2 strong builds, and several workable ones, unlike eles, that have 0 working ones.

): better nerf other classes. Why would you ask for a Buff to your class which has in your words "0 working" builds.

Legit

> @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > @"Crab Fear.1624" said:

> > > @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said:

> > > > Cloak needs to be tied to EM, exhaustion 2 or 3 secs as a cost.

> > > >

> > > > Boom fixed

> > >

> > > This is dumb. Mirage having a 2-3 automatic exhaustion on all dodges at all times would make it straight up unviable.

> >

> > i mean if it breaks stun, not just because

>

> The op doesn't say anything about dodging CC.

>

> Mirage cloak just needs to be restricted on CCs that prevent dodging. Remove stunbreak on Elusive Mind, replace it with something else like Mirage Cloak let's you strafe and move backwards at full speed. Done.

Stop with the useless backward full speed bs.

> @"TheDevice.2751" said:

> > @"KrHome.1920" said:

> > > @"TheDevice.2751" said:

> > > Again, I don't believe that just by your word. anyone can say stuff like that.

> > First of all: I don't care whether anyone in this forum believes what I am saying or not.

> >

> > Now, to answer your question (a Spellbreaker duelling build):

> >

> > Demolisher or Marauder Amulet (both can do the job)

> > Scholar Rune

> > Spite/SR/Reaper (313 / 312 / 213)

> > Axe/F + GS works as well as Axe/F + D/Wh

> > Energy Sigil on both weaponsets (mandatory)

> > Corrupt Boon (for obvious reasons)

> > Spectral Armor (SA+Shroud combo when he bursts and you run out of dodges)

> > Spectral Walk (to kite Rampage - you can also fear chain Rampage with Corrupt Boon if you are skilled enough)

> >

> > Bait auto stunbreak (and stability) right a the beginning of the fight with Wh4 or GS5, corrupt might and retaliation, then burst to 50% to bait auto Endure Pain, then kill him.

> >

> > edit: Ah I forgot the most important and of course most obvious thing: Predict Full Counter!

> >

> > > Guards are allowed to do _multiple_ things. Necromancers can do ONE thing: do aoe damage.

> > Your burst as a Reaper hardcounters Firebrands (in every teamfight I am the one who destroys the Firebrand) and NCSY! + burst is a hardcounter to the whole Guardian defense mechanic which is blocks.

> >

> > I have to ask: Which league division are you? I guess not above silver.

>

> ok buddy. Whatever you say. All i have to do is bait out his Endure Pain and kill him lol. What, are you fighting bronze sb? lol cmon man. thats the laziest explanation. As if like it always happens that simple. First of all, kitten are you doing about his enture pain? how are you kiting that? You're not because its pretty hard to kite a war and you already kited his rampage right? And... he still has counters... aaaand yeah. What?

>

> now what the anti-mirage build for necros? This I GOT to hear.

Cant read ur rank.

> @"Fortus.6175" said:

> > @"FaboBabo.3581" said:

> > > @"Trevor Boyer.6524" said:

> > > Condi Mirage feels broken because there are only a handful of builds in the game that can actually deal with them. All of the other builds/classes actually can't deal with them at all in any way. This creates an effect where the Condi Mirage effects the intra-class dynamic in special ways that other classes do not. In shorter words, the Condi Mirage is the biggest culprit that pushes otherwise viable specs completely out of play because it is able to counter them so hard, that those specs become useless in games where a Condi Mirage is present.

> > >

> > > The above effect is mainly due to:

> > > * Condi Mirage having too much burst and attrition, with a mixture of power and condi damage. Only a handful of builds are even capable of out bruising a Condi Mirage on a node to make it run. These are the builds being played by people who say "Fighting Condi Mirage is a l2p issue."

> > > * Too much chase potential. Nothing in the game can escape a Condi Mirage that actually wants to kill you, aside from stealth spam. So that effect I mentioned: If you aren't playing one of the classes that can out bruise the Condi Mirage, you lose because you can't even out mobility or run from as counter play.

> > > * Too much disengage potential. Nothing in the game can solo chase and kill a Condi Mirage that actually wants to live. Between stealth, 4x ground target teleports, and portal entre, you would need 1 person like a Herald "who has great chase potential" to actually pressure the Mirage while it is teleporting around the map, and then have a couple guys camp the first portal so that when it tries to portal back after kiting Herald away, they can jump it. It's like a 2 to 3 man job to kill a Condi Mirage who knows how to survive. The same cannot be said for any build in the game, outside old bunker specs in previous metas where DPS was significantly lower. So the effect I mentioned again: There is no special counter spec to be devised that is somehow good at chasing and eliminating Condi Mirage more quickly than some other build. It can kite everything equally as well as anything else.

> > > * So what happens is, if you cannot just "bully it off node or out bruise it" there is no reason to chase it or run from it. This leaves a very small margin of viable builds to play that do not get hard countered by Condi Mirage.

> > >

> > > **So in the end it's not that Condi Mirage is overpowered. We aren't necessarily looking at an overpowered spec here. We are looking at a spec that is THE NON-META CRUSHER. Holosmiths can be disengaged or chased and played around with sheer mobility. Reapers can be highly out mobilized and countered by rando off meta ranged. Firebrands can be bursted down by the most random off meta power DPS. Ect Ect, all other meta specs can actually be countered by ultra random off meta deviations, which is good actually and balanced play. But Condi Mirage, if you can't out-bruise it with statistical attribute tied methods, there is no counter play to it. <- This my friends is exactly WHERE Condi Mirage is broken, and where it needs patching.**

> > >

> > > I highly urge Arenanet to change Jaunt to a 2 ammo skill, or to significantly increase the CD of jaunt ammo. This would eliminate a bit of Mirage mobility, its chase/disengage, and make more room for counter play around the Mirage for those specs that cannot statistically stand toe to toe with it. The reason why this is so important is because right now, if a spec who cannot stand toe to toe tries to run, the Condi Mirage can keep the fight on him and force him into the fight due to way too much mobility. I'll guarantee you that this is largely the reason why so many people complain about Condi Mirage.

> > >

> >

> > 1 : Those are the builds, that well - counter Mirage.

> > 2: Where would u wanna run to? Are we in WvW? Communicate with Teammates.

> > 3: Play 4 mid 1 far , win over 4 mid cause Mes is bad at Team fighting - use the win.

> > 4: U could stop double dodging in Plat+ , while i Stand still and my clones attack only.

> >

> > So since we're talking about frustration ; I think its frustrating that one Class can provide itself 100% boon uptime on 8-10 insanely strong Boons. Even More Frustrating if 50% of all classes got more endurance Regen then the Dodge Spec of Mes. Veeeery Frustrating if people call out "broken blocks and blinds" if i play axe/torch and sword/sword illu/inspi/mirage.

> >

> > You got me right ? THOSE MAD BLINDS - oh wait cut the last S , but those mad BLOCKS - oh wait cut the last S.

>

> *looks at profile picture, mirage, alrighty"

>

> Look man, the capability of mirages to jerk people around a point is insanely strong. You DO have blind**S**, every shatter is one. Just to put into reference how insanely strong that is, a grandmaster trait on ele applies blind to ONE target, on burn, 8 secs ICD, meanwhile, mesmer has a non-grandmaster which applies AoE blinds on each shatter (and you have more than one).

>

> Right now they are frustrating to play agaisnt, they teleport around all the time, can get better positioning, chase you or port out until the fire subsides. Honestly, it takes the effort of several people to get one mesmer down, if at all, most of the time you are lucky if you can push it away for long enough before it contest the point again. I know 2 people who like me are in platinum, they got there playing mirage, the moment they play anything else, they get frustrated because "wow no blinds uptime, so little burst, cant toy people around". The build is virtually carrying them when they barely ever play mesmers.

>

Tells me i got blind on shatter als Illu/Insp/mirage - exactly those guys i was referring too.

Gj not reading, but answering my Post.

> @"Trevor Boyer.6524" said:

> Condi Mirage feels broken because there are only a handful of builds in the game that can actually deal with them. All of the other builds/classes actually can't deal with them at all in any way. This creates an effect where the Condi Mirage effects the intra-class dynamic in special ways that other classes do not. In shorter words, the Condi Mirage is the biggest culprit that pushes otherwise viable specs completely out of play because it is able to counter them so hard, that those specs become useless in games where a Condi Mirage is present.

>

> The above effect is mainly due to:

> * Condi Mirage having too much burst and attrition, with a mixture of power and condi damage. Only a handful of builds are even capable of out bruising a Condi Mirage on a node to make it run. These are the builds being played by people who say "Fighting Condi Mirage is a l2p issue."

> * Too much chase potential. Nothing in the game can escape a Condi Mirage that actually wants to kill you, aside from stealth spam. So that effect I mentioned: If you aren't playing one of the classes that can out bruise the Condi Mirage, you lose because you can't even out mobility or run from as counter play.

> * Too much disengage potential. Nothing in the game can solo chase and kill a Condi Mirage that actually wants to live. Between stealth, 4x ground target teleports, and portal entre, you would need 1 person like a Herald "who has great chase potential" to actually pressure the Mirage while it is teleporting around the map, and then have a couple guys camp the first portal so that when it tries to portal back after kiting Herald away, they can jump it. It's like a 2 to 3 man job to kill a Condi Mirage who knows how to survive. The same cannot be said for any build in the game, outside old bunker specs in previous metas where DPS was significantly lower. So the effect I mentioned again: There is no special counter spec to be devised that is somehow good at chasing and eliminating Condi Mirage more quickly than some other build. It can kite everything equally as well as anything else.

> * So what happens is, if you cannot just "bully it off node or out bruise it" there is no reason to chase it or run from it. This leaves a very small margin of viable builds to play that do not get hard countered by Condi Mirage.

>

> **So in the end it's not that Condi Mirage is overpowered. We aren't necessarily looking at an overpowered spec here. We are looking at a spec that is THE NON-META CRUSHER. Holosmiths can be disengaged or chased and played around with sheer mobility. Reapers can be highly out mobilized and countered by rando off meta ranged. Firebrands can be bursted down by the most random off meta power DPS. Ect Ect, all other meta specs can actually be countered by ultra random off meta deviations, which is good actually and balanced play. But Condi Mirage, if you can't out-bruise it with statistical attribute tied methods, there is no counter play to it. <- This my friends is exactly WHERE Condi Mirage is broken, and where it needs patching.**

>

> I highly urge Arenanet to change Jaunt to a 2 ammo skill, or to significantly increase the CD of jaunt ammo. This would eliminate a bit of Mirage mobility, its chase/disengage, and make more room for counter play around the Mirage for those specs that cannot statistically stand toe to toe with it. The reason why this is so important is because right now, if a spec who cannot stand toe to toe tries to run, the Condi Mirage can keep the fight on him and force him into the fight due to way too much mobility. I'll guarantee you that this is largely the reason why so many people complain about Condi Mirage.

>

1 : Those are the builds, that well - counter Mirage.

2: Where would u wanna run to? Are we in WvW? Communicate with Teammates.

3: Play 4 mid 1 far , win over 4 mid cause Mes is bad at Team fighting - use the win.

4: U could stop double dodging in Plat+ , while i Stand still and my clones attack only.

So since we're talking about frustration ; I think its frustrating that one Class can provide itself 100% boon uptime on 8-10 insanely strong Boons. Even More Frustrating if 50% of all classes got more endurance Regen then the Dodge Spec of Mes. Veeeery Frustrating if people call out "broken blocks and blinds" if i play axe/torch and sword/sword illu/inspi/mirage.

You got me right ? THOSE MAD BLINDS - oh wait cut the last S , but those mad BLOCKS - oh wait cut the last S.

> @"notebene.3190" said:

> Not attempting to be flippant or silly or mean. I respect the OPs position and opinion. To me, this is always the answer, and I can't say it any better. Plus I enjoy remembering Robin from time to time. :3

>

>

>

> "I'm exercising the right not to walk."

> "Thank you Mr. Dalton. You just illustrated the point."

This was nice and made me forgot my random anger about OP.

Just kidding here it is.....

HA GOTYA

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/60424/idea-for-core-mesmer-im-ready-for-ur-hate-its-k#latest

:'D

> @"DanAlcedo.3281" said:

> > @"hellsqueen.3045" said:

> > > @"DanAlcedo.3281" said:

> > > > @"hellsqueen.3045" said:

> > > > > @"DanAlcedo.3281" said:

> > > > > There is always the other side of the coin.

> > > > >

> > > > > Did you kitten up a Mechanic or Bad Dps?

> > > > >

> > > > > (Most) people are toxic for a reason.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > People are toxic at all levels for content in this game.

> > > > People were toxic about your DPS output in dungeons and in the open world.

> > > > There is no excuse for being an A hole to people, no matter what level content, but lower level stuff should have next to none.

> > > > Who cares if someone messes up a mechanic? Yeah, it makes things take longer but maybe talk to that person and ask and see if you can help them and if they don't have a clue, maybe ask them to drop out or something because they need people who know what they are doing and if they don't leave and you fail again then kick them. Then that leaves the person in question with a choice, do they do the right thing for everyone if they still don't have a clue what they are doing and find people who can teach them more slowly or do they keep being a burden and get kicked even after they were politely asked if they would drop out.

> > > > I don't know why there are so many people who play this game who think their success is the only thing that matters, everyone is trying to have fun and learn and succeed and play, just because your success is less guaranteed, it doesn't mean you should be a jerk about it.

> > > >

> > >

> > > The problem here is that there are level of toxicity.

> > >

> > > I understand its feels bad when you get called names, but people also shouldn’t ger offended by the tiniest

> > > bit of hostility.

> > >

> > > And more often then not there is a Reason his Teammates are getting Hostile.

> > >

> > > People are not some evil douchbags.

> > >

> > > You have to trigger them first.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > There may be a reason that lead them to being hostile, but perhaps those people shouldn't jump to hostility if someone doesn't know something.

> > And yes, sometimes people are just that. Sometimes people are angry and cruel people, there are garbage people in this world and video games are not going to be immune to having those people exist. Sometimes you may just get someone on a bad day, other times you might just get someone who is like that constantly.

> > This is not just restricted to GW though, it's all kinds of games. It is just kitten that it exists in all kinds of games because it sucks that hatred and anger exist everywhere.

>

> You have a very sad perspective of the world.

>

>

>

Pretty objective

Axe/torch - sword/sword hybrid mirage. Illu/inspi/mirage - sustained damage , healing and mobility - stays meele 99% of Time - only disengages when skills are off CD or you can outkite some skills - example reaper shroud ; Blink away annd wait it out if u cant sword 2 / 4 or axe 3

> @"RabbitUp.8294" said:

> Has anybody tried the new Mirage runes? If (6) really doesn't have an icd, it could be extremely strong, especially against outnumbered situations.

Tried them , felt underwhelming. Range is small if i remember correctly + felt like ICD of 1 sec or something.

For Condi/Hybrid Tormenting is insane right now. Adventurer and Traveler were always good.

> @"babazhook.6805" said:

> > @"FaboBabo.3581" said:

> > > @"babazhook.6805" said:

> > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said:

> > > > > @"babazhook.6805" said:

> > > > > The Rune fine with the changes. a 13 stack torment application is still only a 2200 heal. I get more on my warrior with a shout and have 6 shouts I can use right after the other. If you are consitently getting it with 13 torment stacks every dodge or shatter, you have more to worry about then whether it healed uyp the enemy by 2k.

> > > >

> > > > and you did the math for more than just single target? Say when shattering and hitting more than 1 target (when 1v2 or 1v3 fighting in WvW or Spvp)?

> > > >

> > > > Warrior shouts do not scale up according to enemy last time I checked, at least not the healing component. That is not even getting into the issues that this heal is on your main offensive and defensive ability as mirage, your dodge.

> > >

> > > Warriors shouts heal all allies (up to 5) around you. I can heal my allies for 14000 health sum totl PLUSgive 5 of them all 100+ endurance for more dodges.

> > >

> > > You do not measure the balance of a rune based upon what it might do in a ZERG fight. There any manner of skills and abilities that see there effects multiplied exponentially in a zerg fight. While I do not participate in many Zerg fights they are NOT dominated by Mesmers nor will they be with this rune. The mesmer might be able to save himself for a period of time but once allies in the zerg fall mesmer will have to run or die.

> >

> > Its not about zerging but outnumbered roaming.

> >

> > Ur warrior vs 1 or 4 is meaningless for the heal Value. Rune of torment vs 1 or 4 is a big difference.

>

> Predicated on that Mesmer being able to apply toment stacks at will to 4 different players. Quite frankly if 4 players facing one mesmer are always hit by torment stacks each time that mesmser tries and apply them, they have learn to play issues. If a mesmer is able to apply his full potential of torment stacks to 4 different players at will hE ptobably does not need those heals to beat them.

>

> Again the stacks have to be APPLIED. If one of those 4 a DE at range with rifle, a second a ranger at range using a longbow, the third a warrior in close using resistance and the fourth a scourge applying his shades how many torment stacks is that mesmer able to APPLY? Don't base a runes potentcy on 4 peoples standing in a group saying "hit me". A staff Daredevil can use IP and hit 5 guys standing in a group saying hit me too and generate a whole lot of healing if they just stand and take it.

Now ; how many houres did u play Mirage with Torment Runes in WvW in the last 24-36 houres?