Anyone Hoping For A Support Warrior Spec?

[Skyy.5380]

Everyone ignores my monk idea : D

I WANT THAT ANYWAYS; fist your enemies to death. or fist them so other can kill them or ah whatever

 

> @"Skyy.5380" said:

> I was reading about a monk spec in another thread and I really got into it. My idea of a great support build as a new elite specc would be a NO WEAPON "Monk" that as an class mechanic can swap between ying & yang (names are optional).

>

> The Warrior already has almost all weapons available in the game so a no weapon variant would make sense. Being able to upgrade your fists and/or getting fistweapons (foci as option) if no weapon would be 2 problematic.

>

> The idea is that you can swap between ying & yang to alter between offensive and defensive boons (instead of a weapon swap). Ying offers you 5 unique skills that give protecting boons like Regeneration, Aegis and maybe Resistancew. Yang offers you 5 unique skills, more damage orientated that offer offensive boons like Might, Fury and Quickness. As an "Adrenalin" skill you could get something that can refresh the durations of your boons or renew it therefore used at the CORRECT TIME can be massively benefitial but requires some game knowledge to register those moments.

>

> The elite skill could be some kind of stationary healing source; Massive heal output for a short time but stationary so people have to stand close by (I stole the idea of wow's Tranquility on druid). Correctly used can outsustain even heavy boss damage in raids, wasted punishes you with a long cooldown (even possible to discount cooldown if yo heal (not overheal!) certain amounts to make it harder to master).

>

> This makes it very interesting to play in raids/fractals. It can't be able to maintain all boons on max stats (by weapon swapping) tho because that would be way 2 overpowerd. You rather have to choose if you want offensive or defensive boons on that specific time. Offensive boons deals way more dps passively and actively due to the nature of the weapon skills, protecting boons therefore less dps, more heals/cleanses etc.

>

> The concept of a Monk fits well into cantha's theme, I'm not sure if warrior is the correct place to put it tho.

 

 

[Grand Marshal.4098]

> @"Skyy.5380" said:

> Everyone ignores my monk idea : D

> I WANT THAT ANYWAYS; fist your enemies to death. or fist them so other can kill them or ah whatever

>

> > @"Skyy.5380" said:

> > I was reading about a monk spec in another thread and I really got into it. My idea of a great support build as a new elite specc would be a NO WEAPON "Monk" that as an class mechanic can swap between ying & yang (names are optional).

> >

> > The Warrior already has almost all weapons available in the game so a no weapon variant would make sense. Being able to upgrade your fists and/or getting fistweapons (foci as option) if no weapon would be 2 problematic.

> >

> > The idea is that you can swap between ying & yang to alter between offensive and defensive boons (instead of a weapon swap). Ying offers you 5 unique skills that give protecting boons like Regeneration, Aegis and maybe Resistancew. Yang offers you 5 unique skills, more damage orientated that offer offensive boons like Might, Fury and Quickness. As an "Adrenalin" skill you could get something that can refresh the durations of your boons or renew it therefore used at the CORRECT TIME can be massively benefitial but requires some game knowledge to register those moments.

> >

> > The elite skill could be some kind of stationary healing source; Massive heal output for a short time but stationary so people have to stand close by (I stole the idea of wow's Tranquility on druid). Correctly used can outsustain even heavy boss damage in raids, wasted punishes you with a long cooldown (even possible to discount cooldown if yo heal (not overheal!) certain amounts to make it harder to master).

> >

> > This makes it very interesting to play in raids/fractals. It can't be able to maintain all boons on max stats (by weapon swapping) tho because that would be way 2 overpowerd. You rather have to choose if you want offensive or defensive boons on that specific time. Offensive boons deals way more dps passively and actively due to the nature of the weapon skills, protecting boons therefore less dps, more heals/cleanses etc.

> >

> > The concept of a Monk fits well into cantha's theme, I'm not sure if warrior is the correct place to put it tho.

>

>

 

It's crucial for warriors to get a new weapon. It allows for more buildcraft. Some of our weapons are redundant in competetive (all OH but Axe), Shield and Warhorn aside.

 

As for "marrying" warrior with Guardian (cause Guardian's have defense magic used by Monks), I'm not a fun of the idea.

 

Right now the 2 biggest contenders for warrior are: Double PistolWarrior/Elementalist-like spec (cause of fields), or Staff-Spear Warrior/Thief-like spec (a duelist)

 

Monk is an idea too, but unarmed, double foci or double scepters are a step beyond in imagination.

[Telgum.6071]

Absolutely. While I prefer DPS roles, all core, berserker and spellbreaker already work in most game modes.

 

Meanwhile support is a banner/bubble bot nearly useless, I would like to see a Defense rework + Commander specialization, relying on shouts, banners or another new warrior ability. With pistols in both hands, so we get new ranged options.

 

Monk would be nice too, but we already have the Daredevil so I wouldn't bet for it.

 

At this point support is the class with most sense for the warrior, a well designed spec could give us a permanent place on WvW zergs, a meta build in PvP and with enough luck, a guaranteed place on fractals/raids. We don't need a new DPS spec for that, just some improvements for the current one.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

> @"Telgum.6071" said:

> At this point support is the class with most sense for the warrior, a well designed spec could give us a **permanent place** on WvW zergs, a meta build in PvP and with enough luck, a guaranteed place on fractals/raids. We don't need a new DPS spec for that, just some improvements for the current one.

 

Isn't that Support Spellbreaker for open field zergs? Even for GvG groups. There is also a less popular might-share Berserker with battle standard running around for GvGs mostly.

 

Healbreaker in PvP is as meta as it gets, not to mention Burstzerkers always being a glass cannon option which can down in 2 or 3 hits.

 

In any case, as long as this new spec has a traitline dedicated to damage, some decent self-defense and minors that work well, I'll be fine. 3 Support traitlines though is a major no.

[Fueki.4753]

> @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> Isn't that Support Spellbreaker for open field zergs? Even for GvG groups. There is also a less popular might-share Berserker with battle standard running around for GvGs mostly.

> Healbreaker in PvP is as meta as it gets, not to mention Burstzerkers always being a glass cannon option which can down in 2 or 3 hits.

> In any case, as long as this new spec has a traitline dedicated to damage, some decent self-defense and minors that work well, I'll be fine. 3 Support traitlines though is a major no.

 

People want a **real** support elite specialization.

Spellbreaker offers nothing supportive to Shout Spellbreaker, the support all comes from core.

 

[Grand Marshal.4098]

> @"Fueki.4753" said:

> > @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> > Isn't that Support Spellbreaker for open field zergs? Even for GvG groups. There is also a less popular might-share Berserker with battle standard running around for GvGs mostly.

> > Healbreaker in PvP is as meta as it gets, not to mention Burstzerkers always being a glass cannon option which can down in 2 or 3 hits.

> > In any case, as long as this new spec has a traitline dedicated to damage, some decent self-defense and minors that work well, I'll be fine. 3 Support traitlines though is a major no.

>

> People want a **real** support elite specialization.

> Spellbreaker offers nothing supportive to Shout Spellbreaker, the support all comes from core.

>

 

How is that fun tho? How will that allow you to tag bags? How will it feel like warrior and not guardian (the heavy armored profession with plenty of support capabilities). In the end what we say here doesn't matter, but I've yet to see anyone proposing a meaningful spec focused on "support" that feels like warrior and is not just some type of support we can get by fixing core (mobile banners on the warrior, with pulsing boons when traited on top of their flat stat increase, would take care of a lot of folk who want to support as warriors). Boom, Discipline, Tactics and ANY spec and you got yourself a support. Berserker does damage well, SPellbreaker does strips well. The new specs needs something NEW for warrior, not something we already have and can buildcraft with.

 

In any case, we are in the long waiting game now until we get info from anet.

[Zaraki.5784]

> Anyone Hoping For A Support Warrior Spec?

 

I don't, as a warrior purist i think fighting is our duty, not babysitting/healing/buffing allies, let these to other classes.

[Fueki.4753]

> @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> How is that fun tho?

Fun is subjective, so it can't be answered.

I, for one, would welcome Arenanet to reintroduce Paragons as a Warrior elite specialization.

Paragons already are support-oriented Warriors in GW1, so it fits well.

And their signature weapon is ranged and one-handed, filling that wish of some players as well.

 

How will that allow you to tag bags?

In case of paragon, you tag enemies by throwing your spear.

In they get guns, you shoot it

Or else, you shoot your Bow or Rifle.

 

> How will it feel like warrior and not guardian (the heavy armored profession with plenty of support capabilities).

In my opinion, the feel of Professions or Elite Specializations is mostly decided how the skills look like and and the general theme.

Thus, getting a Paragon-themed yellow/golden Elite Specialization based on singing would feel significantly different that a mostly blue Guardian would ever feel.

 

> In the end what we say here doesn't matter, but I've yet to see anyone proposing a meaningful spec focused on "support" that feels like warrior and is not just some type of support we can get by fixing core.

It's not about fixing core though. It's getting support in addition to it.

> mobile banners on the warrior, with pulsing boons when traited on top of their flat stat increase, would take care of a lot of folk who want to support as warriors

I like the current iteration of banners better than possibly having them tied to my back.

And I don't think banners should get pulsing boons, they already are sufficiently effective.

Pulsing boons sounds more like something that could be effects of Paragon Chants.

 

Boom, Discipline, Tactics and ANY spec and you got yourself a support. Berserker does damage well, Spellbreaker does strips well.

And stripping boons is something offensive, not something supportive.

 

> The new specs needs something NEW for warrior, not something we already have and can buildcraft with.

Having actual, META-viable support (or at least close to that) for high-end content would be something new for Warriors.

Shout-healing Spellbreaker do not fill that space.

[Kodama.6453]

@""Fueki.4753"

In general, it seems that one big problem with elite specs is that many people are too overly attached to "conventional" roles of classes.

I read repeatedly from people here on the forum that we shouldn't get stuff like support warrior, tank ranger, etc. because "you wouldn't expect them to have that playstyle when you are creating a character of this class".

 

Which is a shame, considering that these expectations are exactly what this game tries to make different. Giving you the freedom to do exactly this, picking a character just based off of their themes and then get elite specs which enable you to fill any roles that is desired (damage, tank, support).

It has some appeal to be able to play a character with a rogue thematic like thief, yet being able to have a bruiser playstyle with it thanks to daredevil.

Or picking a mighty warrior who thrives in the thick of battle, but grows into an experienced veteran who is now supporting their allies and rallying them for battle instead of claiming all the glory himself.

 

 

[Fueki.4753]

> @"Kodama.6453" said:

> @""Fueki.4753"

> In general, it seems that one big problem with elite specs is that many people are too overly attached to "conventional" roles of classes.

> I read repeatedly from people here on the forum that we shouldn't get stuff like support warrior, tank ranger, etc. because "you wouldn't expect them to have that playstyle when you are creating a character of this class".

>

> Which is a shame, considering that these expectations are exactly what this game tries to make different. Giving you the freedom to do exactly this, picking a character just based off of their themes and then get elite specs which enable you to fill any roles that is desired (damage, tank, support).

> It has some appeal to be able to play a character with a rogue thematic like thief, yet being able to have a bruiser playstyle with it thanks to daredevil.

> Or picking a mighty warrior who thrives in the thick of battle, but grows into an experienced veteran who is now supporting their allies and rallying them for battle instead of claiming all the glory himself.

In my opinion, if people want to _only_ see conventional roles, they should go and play conventional games.

GW2 is far from conventional and should continue to set itself further apart.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

I have played plenty of SBP and Core (even Berserker) in a more supportive role, be it might share, boon strip, cleanses.

 

And it gets absolutely boring after some point. Frankly this is my opinion and whatnot, but, again, as long as Core gets fixed, I'll be ok. Cause then I'll buildcraft better and I won't buy EoD for a bs support warrior spec. Play scrapper bruh.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

> @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> I have played plenty of SBP and Core (even Berserker) in a more supportive role, be it might share, boon strip, cleanses.

>

> And it gets absolutely boring after some point. Frankly this is my opinion and whatnot, but, again, as long as Core gets fixed, I'll be ok. Cause then I'll buildcraft better and I won't buy EoD for a bs support warrior spec. Play scrapper bruh.

 

It all depends on the skill sets and traitline though now doesn't it?

 

Whatever the weapon set ends up being can very well be DPS viable, and the triatline may very well have a personal DPS line within it (even our core support line does that).

 

I fully anticipate having both a viable DPS build and a viable support build from the new e-spec. I do not think we'll end up with a heavy armor version of Druid.

[Telgum.6071]

> @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> > @"Telgum.6071" said:

> > At this point support is the class with most sense for the warrior, a well designed spec could give us a **permanent place** on WvW zergs, a meta build in PvP and with enough luck, a guaranteed place on fractals/raids. We don't need a new DPS spec for that, just some improvements for the current one.

>

> Isn't that Support Spellbreaker for open field zergs? Even for GvG groups. There is also a less popular might-share Berserker with battle standard running around for GvGs mostly.

>

> Healbreaker in PvP is as meta as it gets, not to mention Burstzerkers always being a glass cannon option which can down in 2 or 3 hits.

>

> In any case, as long as this new spec has a traitline dedicated to damage, some decent self-defense and minors that work well, I'll be fine. 3 Support traitlines though is a major no.

 

I've played them all. Spellbreaker WvW is a bubble bot and Zerker in GvG isn't a thing compared to other DPS classes (and that zerker with banner is the class I play the most). HEalbreaker in PvP is something good in my opinion, but I'm on silver so who knows.

 

The thing is Spellbreaker is a good tank but a mediocre support. I personally want a real support with healing and/OR buffing abilities.

 

Well, Firebrand can be used as either support or condition damage, and I think power is good too. I want the same, it doesn't need to be 100% support.

 

> @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> > @"Fueki.4753" said:

> > > @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> > > Isn't that Support Spellbreaker for open field zergs? Even for GvG groups. There is also a less popular might-share Berserker with battle standard running around for GvGs mostly.

> > > Healbreaker in PvP is as meta as it gets, not to mention Burstzerkers always being a glass cannon option which can down in 2 or 3 hits.

> > > In any case, as long as this new spec has a traitline dedicated to damage, some decent self-defense and minors that work well, I'll be fine. 3 Support traitlines though is a major no.

> >

> > People want a **real** support elite specialization.

> > Spellbreaker offers nothing supportive to Shout Spellbreaker, the support all comes from core.

> >

>

> How is that fun tho? How will that allow you to tag bags? How will it feel like warrior and not guardian (the heavy armored profession with plenty of support capabilities). In the end what we say here doesn't matter, but I've yet to see anyone proposing a meaningful spec focused on "support" that feels like warrior and is not just some type of support we can get by fixing core (mobile banners on the warrior, with pulsing boons when traited on top of their flat stat increase, would take care of a lot of folk who want to support as warriors). Boom, Discipline, Tactics and ANY spec and you got yourself a support. Berserker does damage well, SPellbreaker does strips well. The new specs needs something NEW for warrior, not something we already have and can buildcraft with.

>

> In any case, we are in the long waiting game now until we get info from anet.

 

In my opinion it doesn't have to be a copy of the guardian, I think warrior makes more sense buffing allies, giving them alacrity, might (perhaps even breaking through the 25 stacks limit) or even carrying banners on the back or something like that. A better version of the bannerslave but also compatible with wvw and pvp and ranged capabilities outside the condition longbow and the single-target rifle, able to empower itself and its allies.

 

Yeah, I would like that. The banner bot has a permanent place in all the raid bosses with only two abilities, imagine a well designed spec around the banners :#

[Grand Marshal.4098]

> @"Lan Deathrider.5910" said:

> > @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> > I have played plenty of SBP and Core (even Berserker) in a more supportive role, be it might share, boon strip, cleanses.

> >

> > And it gets absolutely boring after some point. Frankly this is my opinion and whatnot, but, again, as long as Core gets fixed, I'll be ok. Cause then I'll buildcraft better and I won't buy EoD for a bs support warrior spec. Play scrapper bruh.

>

> It all depends on the skill sets and traitline though now doesn't it?

>

> Whatever the weapon set ends up being can very well be DPS viable, and the triatline may very well have a personal DPS line within it (even our core support line does that).

>

> I fully anticipate having both a viable DPS build and a viable support build from the new e-spec. I do not think we'll end up with a heavy armor version of Druid.

 

You know warrior better than most warriors, so I'm happy you get my point, although I must admit I failed to fully explain it.

 

A warrior spec can be support, but as long as it has a traitline with viable dmg traits which I can pick I'll be happy. What I am against is the idea which seems to hover around about the new espec being a specialization with an Inventions-type of approach.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

> @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> > @"Lan Deathrider.5910" said:

> > > @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> > > I have played plenty of SBP and Core (even Berserker) in a more supportive role, be it might share, boon strip, cleanses.

> > >

> > > And it gets absolutely boring after some point. Frankly this is my opinion and whatnot, but, again, as long as Core gets fixed, I'll be ok. Cause then I'll buildcraft better and I won't buy EoD for a bs support warrior spec. Play scrapper bruh.

> >

> > It all depends on the skill sets and traitline though now doesn't it?

> >

> > Whatever the weapon set ends up being can very well be DPS viable, and the triatline may very well have a personal DPS line within it (even our core support line does that).

> >

> > I fully anticipate having both a viable DPS build and a viable support build from the new e-spec. I do not think we'll end up with a heavy armor version of Druid.

>

> You know warrior better than most warriors, so I'm happy you get my point, although I must admit I failed to fully explain it.

>

> A warrior spec can be support, but as long as it has a traitline with viable dmg traits which I can pick I'll be happy. What I am against is the idea which seems to hover around about the new espec being a specialization with an Inventions-type of approach.

 

These were my two takes on a Support E-spec neither of which lack in damage:

 

Pistol/Pistol Spec

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/92430/elite-spec-idea-commander

 

Land Spear Spec

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/101823/elite-spec-taichou

 

The traitlines are more or less the same.

 

Honestly I prefer the utilities I came up with under Taichou but prefer the Pistol/Pistol skills from the Commander and if I were to consolidate those two ideas that is what I would shoot for (pun intended).

 

The 'Commands' from Commander could be reworked into F2-F5 skills though, but I'd rather have an F2 that is a Burst from OH weapons (or second burst from two handers).

 

[draxynnic.3719]

> @"Grand Marshal.4098" said:

> > @"Telgum.6071" said:

> > At this point support is the class with most sense for the warrior, a well designed spec could give us a **permanent place** on WvW zergs, a meta build in PvP and with enough luck, a guaranteed place on fractals/raids. We don't need a new DPS spec for that, just some improvements for the current one.

>

> Isn't that Support Spellbreaker for open field zergs? Even for GvG groups. There is also a less popular might-share Berserker with battle standard running around for GvGs mostly.

>

> Healbreaker in PvP is as meta as it gets, not to mention Burstzerkers always being a glass cannon option which can down in 2 or 3 hits.

>

> In any case, as long as this new spec has a traitline dedicated to damage, some decent self-defense and minors that work well, I'll be fine. 3 Support traitlines though is a major no.

 

Apart from Druid, that's pretty much what's been happening, so they've probably learned from that and will lay out the traitlines accordingly.

 

> @"Kodama.6453" said:

> @""Fueki.4753"

> In general, it seems that one big problem with elite specs is that many people are too overly attached to "conventional" roles of classes.

> I read repeatedly from people here on the forum that we shouldn't get stuff like support warrior, tank ranger, etc. because "you wouldn't expect them to have that playstyle when you are creating a character of this class".

>

> Which is a shame, considering that these expectations are exactly what this game tries to make different. Giving you the freedom to do exactly this, picking a character just based off of their themes and then get elite specs which enable you to fill any roles that is desired (damage, tank, support).

> It has some appeal to be able to play a character with a rogue thematic like thief, yet being able to have a bruiser playstyle with it thanks to daredevil.

> Or picking a mighty warrior who thrives in the thick of battle, but grows into an experienced veteran who is now supporting their allies and rallying them for battle instead of claiming all the glory himself.

>

>

 

This. A thousand times, this.

 

ArenaNet said pretty much right from the beginning that the intent was that professions wouldn't be locked into roles - you could play Warrior and not be locked into tanking or DPS roles just because that's what people expected of warrior, you could also find ways to support or find alternative (to tanking) ways to control.

 

We've got core warrior and two elite specialisations that already do what is expected of warrior. If a hypothetical "support" elite specialisation is like Firebrand, Chronomancer, Tempest, or Renegade in that it can also tank, control, and/or put out strong DPS, then having that elite specialisation _also_ providing a big boost to support _if built for it_ doesn't stop you from also having another way to play a Warrior in its "expected" roles.