Everything wrong with Revenant (pvp)

[JayAction.9056]

> @"Ertrak.9506" said:

> I know this thread is about revenant in general in spvp, but what if darkrazor's daring granted pulsing stability in its AoE in addition to its currents effects? Also what if the renegade trait Rightous Rebel (the one that increases the duration of f4) also allowed to clear a condition every 3s in addition to its current effects (if I recall correctly, this would be a total of 2 conditions cleared over 6s?)

 

Darkrazor's Daring is already supposed to have that functionality according to its tooltip.

 

The second thing you mentioned would be a buff but nowhere near enough to push renegade into viability

 

The heal alone is enough to keep renegade unviable. It's a 3/4 second cast time heal with a base of like 4.5k (people crit 2 or 3 times that amount on short 2second cds) and it requires you to stay in an area to receive the rest of the effect???

 

That doesn't work in pvp and it will never work unless the healing is scaled to the point it's better than glint. Usually you pop your heal and want to *MOVE AWAY* from the area where damage is. This one requires you to stay in place for near 10 seconds to get the effect. You will die every time you use that heal if you are using it when you need it, guaranteed.

 

 

*Nothing* in renegade toolkit is deadly even if enemy gets hit and does not care to move out of the effects. This goes for the utility skills and short bow. The numbers of everything damaging is about 1/3 of what it should actually be if not an even worse fraction/percentage. Also cast times+energy costs are way too high.

 

Let's not forget these extremely high cost, weakened, water down utilities can actually be killed for some reason and have their effects completely negated.

 

*Edit;* oh and the main thing about renegade is that it's supposed to be a damage buff to condi rev? Well condi rev damage is now no longer that potent in pvp. (Not that it really was in the first place, especially compared to POF specs). So it's much much worse off than previously.

 

*EDIT #2*

I have made core rev specs that will beat renegade 1v1. No lie.

[Burtnik.5218]

> @"JayAction.9056" said:

 

> I have made core rev specs that will beat renegade 1v1. No lie.

 

Cute but core rev already been shitting on herald as well. Well before they removed the block and pull, now idk how it would go. Its so easy to play around glint heal but its not that easy to play around Jalis hammers.

[mtodaj.4507]

Energy costs on utility skills are problematic and lowering then increasing cooldowns is a bad idea as well. Due to our lack of utility choices, the cooldowns should be low.

I think all upkeep toggles should be moved to elites and reduced to 5 upkeep cost except against all odds which should be 7.

Invocation line should reduce the cooldown of legend swapping by 50% then increase the cooldown of the break stun trait to 15sec.

Cleansing Channel should remove 2 boons

Spontaneous Destruction cooldown should be 5sec

Eye for an Eye cooldown should be 15sec

Shortbow skill #2 should be torment.

Shortbow skill #3 should be poison.

Shortbow skill #5 should be bleeding.

Ice Razor should at least be an ice field.

Razor Claw bleeds need a longer duration

Dark Razor add an mist that causes a pulsating 1.5 sec evade every 3sec

Break Razor increase initial heal amount.

Just my 2cents

[JayAction.9056]

Patch in 3 days??? Hopefully Renegade sees some buffs that take it from being the worst POF spec by a good margin, yeah?

 

I would like to see the spec be top 250 viable.

 

It's barely a 1200 rating spec for a person playing less than meta rated specs at 1700 FFS.

[RobMonty.3719]

Jade winds says, legendary assassin buff when used... *nothing happens* it does not post this boon at all....

 

The new patch seemed to sound good for Rev, I find it that im dying twice as easy now... not sure why, as if they made some silent adjustment and took half the armor class away...

Removing the only real dmg they do, quickness on impossible odds... Gawd... Who are these morons?

 

Revenant DPS builds are just getting worse and worse...

 

[Zyllias.9538]

Rev just need a 20% additional passive damage reduction and l2p. A condi cleanse for Shiro maybe.

Anyway i'm sure Anet will do Something better if have to, i personally see better change this last patch, but it's just me i guess.

[Chungo.3169]

I think we are not the few who were much better with IO before the patch of 2/6, now it feels slow and clumsy.

[BlaqueFyre.5678]

Precision Strike and Unrelenting Assault need to only hit the Targeted player, and they need to add back the stealth tracking because any other skill activated on a Target before it entered Stealth still tracks into Stealth.

[JayAction.9056]

> @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said:

> Precision Strike and Unrelenting Assault need to only hit the Targeted player, and they need to add back the stealth tracking because any other skill activated on a Target before it entered Stealth still tracks into Stealth.

 

Yeah I agree with this.

 

They nerfed precision strike so many times it became worse to use than the 33% reduced sword auto chain. I think this was done because people were complaining about being cleaved by a melee skill while stealthed in melee range. So stealth became a near invuln used against rev.

[Aza.2105]

Whats wrong with rev is simple. Its the most balanced and honest class in the game, that actually has a risk and reward factor. And also has various weaknesses. Comparing the class with other classes that are top tier then it makes them seem very weak. The reality is that every class needs to be brought down to the level of rev. Then pvp would be mildly healthy.

[XxsdgxX.8109]

> @"Aza.2105" said:

> Whats wrong with rev is simple. Its the most balanced and honest class in the game, that actually has a risk and reward factor. And also has various weaknesses. Comparing the class with other classes that are top tier then it makes them seem very weak. The reality is that every class needs to be brought down to the level of rev. Then pvp would be mildly healthy.

 

Exactly, but so many short-sighted players want to power-creep and buff Revenant so its on par with other **busted** classes.

Terrible thing to do that just keeps feeding this endless cycle of absolutely **terrible** balance.

 

Perfect balance is indeed impossible but achieving good/fair balance isn't. **Not most games** are as unfairly unbalanced as this.

They could at least balance Risk/Reward, great example is the way Revenant is right now: High Risk/High Reward.

In comparison to it Spellbreaker is Low Risk/High Reward, Holosmith is Mid Risk/ High Reward, Druid is **LOW Risk**/High Reward. **Right there is the key to having a fair, decent balance**. It's not that complicated to understand.

 

[Ragion.2831]

So out of what can only be explained by madness i decided to try ranked again with only Rev after several unranked games. Currently in platinum division so got to play against higher level players. These are things about the class that stood out to me

 

- Endurance regen is too low even with shiro and energy sigils. There are too many attacks that have to be dodged. I really dont know why they nerfed the endurance gain on shiro when S/D thieves literally can spam Flanking Strike, miss 3 times in a row and spam dodge roll and still be fine. Yes i had a 1v1 with one in plat.

 

- Phase traversal cost is still too high. This really is more of a nuisance than anything, Ive used it when the cost was 20 so the difference is extremely noticeable Because of the cost, thieves always have advantage since you have to wait for them to port back instead of wasting energy getting to them. They already have infinite evades, stealth and block plus the benefit of not dealing with 2 skill costs at the same time

 

- Everything requires awkward targeting or has too long of a cast time. I still get screwed by UA animation. sword 4 targeting is just strange sometimes. You have to spin sometimes when trying to hit death strike on sword 5 or it wont hit. Gint elite takes too long to come out for the range it has. Staff 2 range is just bad and only does damage if the first strike hits. Staff 4 cast time is so unnecessary. If you don't LOS, by the time you finish casting it you are going to get hit with more condis. It just seems that everything about rev is intended to make your life as difficult as possible for no reason.

 

- Finally and what tends to go unmentioned is the f1 skill. It gives you boons that you already can easily get on the legend. Is that really the best thing they could come up with? The boon duration is not a good enough reason for the class to only have one F skill. Its not like you are going to keep it active for the boon duration when running out of energy can get you killed (Meanwhile if you run out of initiative its no big deal :/)

[JayAction.9056]

> @"Ragion.2831" said:

>

> - Everything requires awkward targeting or has too long of a cast time. I still get screwed by UA animation.

 

Have you tried using mace? The bulk of the damage comes from mace #2 after enemies sit in it for 4 seconds. Look how tiny the field is. In plat+ games it hits literally nobody, and it does less damage than other classes condis. Or you notice the melee skills that don't cleave stealth so they can be rendered useless?

 

Everything you said about shiro is true. It just can't compete with thieves tool set.

 

Tbh from season 1 to season 5 it felt like they were nerfing rev with the intent of just making it straight up lose rather than balance it. Too many of the nerfs turned match ups that were sometimes winnable into pretty hard loses unless you were just outright better by a good margin.

[Buran.3796]

> @"Aza.2105" said:

> Whats wrong with rev is simple. Its the most balanced and honest class in the game, that actually has a risk and reward factor. And also has various weaknesses. Comparing the class with other classes that are top tier then it makes them seem very weak. The reality is that every class needs to be brought down to the level of rev. Then pvp would be mildly healthy.

 

Is not that simple, because if you nerf the other classes to Herald's level, you still will notice that this class only has a single competitive build. So, even with Herald being somewhat close to "decent", core Rev and Renegade are "trash tier" in terms of PvP. Core Rev was never good at PvP, and Renegade design just plain screams, at every dimension, "I'll never will exist in PvP".