What keeps you from raids?

[Narcemus.1348]

I have wanted to raid for a long time, they have some of the coolest content, and story. I do not have a group of friends big enough to play a raid and having no experience I have no interest in playing with a pug and letting them down, and haven't had any luck finding a raid guild accepting newbies.

[GDchiaScrub.3241]

Did all my raiding experience in Everquest 2. Follow a scripted event, and optimize output. I no longer have interest in playing that way.

 

"I've been there, and done that." - TLDR

[Artaz.3819]

Ultimately, too much of a time commitment for raids is why I left WoW. It's not the hours put in the game overall (since I have way more than I should), it's the 'must show up consistently' at x time for x+ hours. + Been there, done that in prior life. Yawn - burnt out for many more years to come. Besides, rather view the highlighted story elements elsewhere.

[LanfearShadowflame.3189]

I suppose I could have gone with 'other' since several of those reasons actually apply, but I went with the group aspect because it's probably the biggest hurdle for me.

 

My first issue with raiding is typically timing. I'm NA, but I don't typically play NA prime time. I'm in bed by 9pm eastern and asleep by 930pm _typically_ because I'm up at 5am. So playing between 8pm and midnight, and a lot of guilds raid between 8pm and 10pm, just doesn't work for me. The best time for me to raid would _probably_ be first thing on a weekend morning, like between 8am and 11am eastern time. Its really hard to find people around NA at that time. I know, I've looked. I could probably do something later in the day _maybe_, but again real life takes precedent and weekends are the only time I have for errands.

 

The second issue is people. I have no tolerance for kittens. None. I have massive amounts of patience. I don't mind dying, its part of the learning process. However, finding (potentially) 9 people that I can tolerate for an extended period of time that aren't a bunch raging douches is much harder than one would initially think.

 

And finally there's the whole class expectation thing. I have many, but they aren't all necessarily geared for w/e specific flavor some random person desires.

[Fallesafe.5932]

> @"Cyrin.1035" said:

> For those of you that do not like raiding, what is it that keeps you from this content?

>

>

>

 

Rewards... plain and simple.

 

I'm not going to spend a year of headache and stomach-acid getting up to speed in raids so that I can have new skins for my character. That's absurd. Give me new gear with better stats, and THEN I'll make the effort.

 

And yada yada... save me the speech about how that's not the way this game works. I'm aware of your preference for a game with no rewards. That's why I stopped playing.

[Oldirtbeard.9834]

> @"Chris McSwag.4683" said:

> > @"Oldirtbeard.9834" said:

> > > @"Cynn.1659" said:

> > > > @"Oldirtbeard.9834" said:

> > > >make story modes available for those of us that have ZERO interest in Legendary Armor and just want to PLAY THE STORY.

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > So you want anet to waste dev time making content that will be dead on arrival. All those people that claim to want the story, will start a new crusade complaining that rewards are not good enough. There is no reason for anet to make something that will be only touched once.

> > >

> >

> > So you just want to waste Dev time making content for a tiny fraction of the PVE player base, how's that a good return on my Gem store investment?

> >

> > Unfortunately there's only one option to choose from for the poll, I was branching out from my initial choice,so just to be crystal clear I'm on topic still.

>

>

> First, your “return on gemstore investment” is that at least 90% of the game(past, current and future) is very casual friendly in the sense that you can play whatever you want, however you want and still complete it.

>

> Second, the fraction of the game that you feel is inaccessible is only inaccessible because of restrictions other players impose on you, not the content itself. This has an obvious work-around in playing with friends or making an own group.

>

> Third, you can’t expect a game to be developed around your personal wants and needs based on your gemstore consumption.

>

 

Of course I can that's called smart business practice listening to your customer base, perhaps I'm wrong and only the Raiders buy tons of Gems. However making a game mode with exclusive lore for the few when every other game mode has tiers of difficulty such as 4 tiers of Fractals, Match Making PVP, WVWVW that changes based on your server groups performance to bring a balanced experience.

 

But Raids, nope, that's just an exclusive playground to 'nobility' apparently.

 

How do you think it feels to play an 'Elite' Spec that never had it's moment in the Meta the fabled Power Reaper, god forbid you expect to have your Elite Spec be Elite in the Expansion it was released in. So when do I get to have Reaper be Elite, which Expansion, do I have to wait for the eventual death of the game many years down the road and find a GW2 Emulator that has Devs that Beef up Reaper then (I'd pay good money for that over Gems if any one from Elysium is listening)?

[STIHL.2489]

> @"Fallesafe.5932" said:

> > @"Cyrin.1035" said:

> > For those of you that do not like raiding, what is it that keeps you from this content?

> >

> >

> >

>

> Rewards... plain and simple.

>

> I'm not going to spend a year of headache and stomach-acid getting up to speed in raids so that I can have new skins for my character. That's absurd. Give me new gear with better stats, and THEN I'll make the effort.

>

> And yada yada... save me the speech about how that's not the way this game works. I'm aware of your preference for a game with no rewards. That's why I stopped playing.

 

If you want a gear treadmill I can suggest a bunch of games for you! There is no shortage of generic MMO's that are more then happy to keep giving you more power creep to grind after..

 

For those of us who don't.. our options are limited.

 

So, it's better for you who like the generic stuff to go enjoy that until you burn out.. and we can all hove around our little place without that nonsense.

 

Everyone would happy with that direction.

[Manasa Devi.7958]

Also option 5.

 

I'm basically not interested in any kind of game mode that doesn't let me be up and running within a minute of logging on.

[Oldirtbeard.9834]

> @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > @"Fallesafe.5932" said:

> > > @"Cyrin.1035" said:

> > > For those of you that do not like raiding, what is it that keeps you from this content?

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Rewards... plain and simple.

> >

> > I'm not going to spend a year of headache and stomach-acid getting up to speed in raids so that I can have new skins for my character. That's absurd. Give me new gear with better stats, and THEN I'll make the effort.

> >

> > And yada yada... save me the speech about how that's not the way this game works. I'm aware of your preference for a game with no rewards. That's why I stopped playing.

>

> If you want a gear treadmill I can suggest a bunch of games for you! There is no shortage of generic MMO's that are more then happy to keep giving you more power creep to grind after..

>

> For those of us who don't.. our options are limited.

>

> So, it's better for you who like the generic stuff to go enjoy that until you burn out.. and we can all hove around our little place without that nonsense.

>

> Everyone would happy with that direction.

 

Then you have those of us that were the Raid Finder Heros in WoW that bumped off easy raids for subpar rewards because we enjoyed the story,enjoyed the battle at our skill level, and the rewards were w/e as far as I was concerned. I have no interest in Legendary anything, it's a ridiculous amount of money for skins that are on par with some Gemstore outfits and Black Lion Ticket Weapon Skins. I guarantee you for 20 to 25 dollars and my collection of dyes I could make a character that looks as good as any one in a full set of Legendaries. One thing I don't have is Story trapped behind not only a skill wall, but also a META minded Nobilty's Wall.

 

Story Mode Raids should have been developed years ago, now you have a community with a festering schism.

[Curennos.9307]

Google around for a raid training group and most of these issues will be solved.

[STIHL.2489]

> @"Curennos.9307" said:

> Google around for a raid training group and most of these issues will be solved.

 

Yah.. I keep hearing this.. I also keep hearing that there is no truth to this.

[Curennos.9307]

> @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > @"Curennos.9307" said:

> > Google around for a raid training group and most of these issues will be solved.

>

> Yah.. I keep hearing this.. I also keep hearing that there is no truth to this.

 

I can't speak for others' experience, but in mine...I joined a raid training discord after googling for ~5min. In full exotics as a support chrono, I got my first boss kill shortly after. This was maybe 20min total of doing things before the raid. The same thing happened to, at last count, five or so friends of mine, who also joined a raid training discord. There is definitely truth to it - there's a BUNCH of raid training thingies if you just google 'GW2 raid training'.

 

When I actively raided (about a month ago - while doing college stuff. I left both discords around finals season to avoid pings and whatnot), we got kills when the highest DPS was like...10k. We did mechanics, adjusted, etc. Most people were new, with 1-2 experienced/trainers in the raid (always at least one person who knew how things went, and possibly others who just needed the weekly kill).

 

I tried to find a good way to phrase this, but couldn't. Forgive me if this comes off as rude, but anyone who says there is no truth to this is full of it ^^; It takes a couple minutes to google, find a discord, join and get acquainted with how things work. When I was in one such discord, there were pings around the clock for the lowest tier of raiders (separated people into tiers based on bosses they had exp with. Good system for new players, but limiting if you already knew what you were doing).

 

Edit: Pardon. Finals seasons and I've just consumed an entire pizza to fuel my rage-studying. The one I joiend was 'GW2 Raid Academy', found

. There's also several others I believe if you google 'GW2 raid training'

[RICOH.6280]

Other

 

I don't understand them and how the LFG works and I don't want to 'step on others toes' as a noob, so I just keep on playing the PvE aspect of the game.

[daynay.1089]

I would like to many one day, from all the talk in chat and on the forum there is no way I could do it. I am not geared for raid or even dungeons for that matter don't do them either .

[daynay.1089]

oops I mean maybe

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

> @"Velran.1052" said:

> Another "people are mean to me" or "I want to play my useless build" thread (which can be solved by MAKING YOUR OWN GROUP?!?), With a hint of "I never done raids but they are too easy for me". Get it together people, You're literally giving yourself excuses to not do something because its slightly harder.

 

I wish it were that simple, but the skill curve in GW2 is not a bell shape. It is an inverted curve. There are a lot of good players, a lot of bad players, and very few who sit in the middle. This is because the knowledge that makes one capable of self improvement inevitably leads to a really high performance. The scales go like this:

 

RNG build < Roleplay (snowflake) build < PVP/WvW hybrid builds in PVE < PVE dedicated build < Meta aware build < Premade Meta comp.

 

Most of the complaints you are getting are from people who have a PVE dedicated or meta aware build. I myself like to play Scrapper. It is by no means impotent, as I build my scrapper to do maximum damage while having as many group buffs as possible. There isn't anything in the game that I couldn't complete on my scrapper, but I'll never get accepted into a raid group on him because he isn't part of the Meta comp. I could switch to an alternative class (if I am fortunate enough to have one), but the fact remains that I want to play on my scrapper.

 

So, if I go to make my own team and am going to allow all classes, I open with the "all classes welcome" tag in the LFG. If I don't, then meta scrubs will kick me off of my own team. The problem with allowing all classes is this: I am not going to get a team full of PVE dedicated or meta aware builds. I would love to have one of those. I am going to get RNG builds and snowflake builds. I.E. staff camping power necros, greatsword camping chronomancers, signet sword warriors, bearbow rangers, etc. People who haven't grasped the concept of damage per second yet. I can't work with these people, because they don't even understand the _theory_ of good play. I would have to fly to their home and dedicate a week to teaching them how to play the game.

 

This means that people who want to play their classes get stuck between a rock and a hard place. The people who can win won't accept you. If you try to make your own, you'll get people who can't win. You can say to just join a guild of like minded people, but these don't just drop from the sky. I have yet to see a single one.

[ReaverKane.7598]

Yeah, i'm also having trouble finding a permanent group.

So, if you're in EU, want to **learn** raids (and do some, like at least escort weekly) PM me ingame. I need good people to raid with.

[ionix.9054]

I have tried to find a static group on three occasions (which required significant effort in itself), twice during only vale guardian and once after gors was released. In each instance, we only had the full group on the first night (even though we completed Vale Guardian!). The rest of our attempts we spent most our time trying to fill the group with pugs (who in general were very rude people).

 

Further, there are so many encounters now and I've been out of the loop so long, I feel that there are very few people who are willing to take me along so I can learn the raids. I figure nearly everyone just wants to grind it out and get it done.

 

 

 

[Lyp Sao.1375]

I just want to jump with my little ones through the fluffy flowers in Kryta :p <3

[juhani.5361]

The biggest-- no interest in everything about the mechanics of raid bosses, with extra shades of commitment, group stuff, and general intimidation factors =)

 

I really hate MMO boss mechanics in general-- world bosses in GW2 are the exception (fun! casual! truly voluntary!). Story bosses in this game are already giant pain in the butt with mechanics that make no actual sense. So, throwing myself at the same giant megaboss over and over again ad nauseum for hours on end is unappealing. Then, doing it a group with super-competitive people on top of it all... After all that, you have to do it on a regular schedule.

 

I'm way too laid back and relaxed to start. I've already encountered that kind of uber-competitive ranty talk after a choya pinata event failed once. Chat filled up with all kinds of blame and post-event analysis, combined with frustration and elite rage. Over a pinata. Who cares? People who take games way too seriously. That really isn't me, so I won't inflict myself on them.

[Esterie.7409]

I'd love to get into raids, both for the difficult content, story, and I'm more than a little bummed my mastery level is not max (I have all other masteries in the game & have been thinking about starting an LFG for escort to get it out of the way, though I'm still nervous). However, due to real life situations, I can't play the game for more than 30-45 minutes at a time. This past week I can only count on two fingers the number of times I was able to play for a solid, uninterrupted hour or more. I never know when I'm going to have to run and help with something, and it would be super inconsiderate to tell to the other 9 people I'd be playing with "sorry, gotta go for I don't even know how long".

 

So yes, the time investment is the biggest barrier to get into raids for me. I've had people tell me I'm lazy, that I'm not trying hard enough to get into raids. That if I really wanted to raid, I'd find a way. How, though? Tell the people I take care of that are asking for help to hold on because I need my virtual rewards? Puhh. Those claims are beyond unfounded so I don't bother explaining my situation to make them see that the mind is willing, but my living situation and job are not. It sucks to be told you're too lazy to do certain content because of factors outside of your control. But that's the way it is, and it's a bummer, but there are lots of other things I enjoy in game that I can do easily around my schedule.

[STIHL.2489]

> @"Curennos.9307" said:

> > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > @"Curennos.9307" said:

> > > Google around for a raid training group and most of these issues will be solved.

> >

> > Yah.. I keep hearing this.. I also keep hearing that there is no truth to this.

>

> I can't speak for others' experience, but in mine...I joined a raid training discord after googling for ~5min. In full exotics as a support chrono, I got my first boss kill shortly after. This was maybe 20min total of doing things before the raid. The same thing happened to, at last count, five or so friends of mine, who also joined a raid training discord. There is definitely truth to it - there's a BUNCH of raid training thingies if you just google 'GW2 raid training'.

>

> When I actively raided (about a month ago - while doing college stuff. I left both discords around finals season to avoid pings and whatnot), we got kills when the highest DPS was like...10k. We did mechanics, adjusted, etc. Most people were new, with 1-2 experienced/trainers in the raid (always at least one person who knew how things went, and possibly others who just needed the weekly kill).

>

> I tried to find a good way to phrase this, but couldn't. Forgive me if this comes off as rude, but anyone who says there is no truth to this is full of it ^^; It takes a couple minutes to google, find a discord, join and get acquainted with how things work. When I was in one such discord, there were pings around the clock for the lowest tier of raiders (separated people into tiers based on bosses they had exp with. Good system for new players, but limiting if you already knew what you were doing).

>

> Edit: Pardon. Finals seasons and I've just consumed an entire pizza to fuel my rage-studying. The one I joiend was 'GW2 Raid Academy', found

. There's also several others I believe if you google 'GW2 raid training'

 

That's your story.. I could share a few others that were far less as befitting. Do Think they are full of shit.. well since I knew them in real life.. I'd gonna take their word over yours.

 

#Edit Added:#

 

Also.. I would like everyone to read this, you can see they made a very Raid specific class, Chrono, for those that do not know, this is one of the "Trinity" in GW2, and since a Chrono is a Mesmer, I find it unlikely that someone would go though the effort to unlock the elite spec line and still only be in Exotic.

 

So it's pretty safe to bet, this was not their Main, and I'd wager that this was most likely a Metabattle Listed as Meta for the Raid, and since Chrono is one of the most sought after Trinity, Second being a Druid and the last being a PSW. I guess because a lot of people like to be Melee.

 

So this poster did their homework and did some in game grinding and set up, long before that "5 min google search" , gonna bet they also watched some Youtube and what have you to know their role as well.

 

So, just to be clear... That was a whole lot more work that went into this, then a "5 min google search"

 

Now before anyone says "Well yah, that is what you should do".. well lets be clear.. **that is exactly the kind of time commitment that most of the players saying they don't have the time to do.. don't have the time to do**...

 

Now again.. for me.. if I wanted to deal with that.. I'd play my Previous MMO (or never have left as it were). Raids in today's MMO landscape is like "Oh wow.. Raids .. that's' like .. so... Umm **generic**"

 

[Brimstone.3807]

> @"Grim West.3194" said:

> All Raids = Build meta from a website and memorize a video from another website. Rince, repeat, ad nauseam. Been there, done that.

>

> zzzzzz... snore... zzzzzz

 

lol....This, so much this.

[Electro.4173]

Kind of a mix of a handful of the potential options.

 

Time commitment certainly plays a part. I'm not too keen on the idea of spending hours and hours researching builds and watching videos of every encounter to have an idea of what's going to happen, and I don't want to go in completely blind because I don't like inconveniencing other people with my own inexperience. Plus, I usually don't really play for long periods of time in large chunks, its usually a half hour here, some real life stuff, maybe log back in for 45 minutes later, go to work, come back and play another hour when I get home. I have other games I want to play, other things I want to do online, and real life stuff to deal with, GW2 isn't my end-all time sink even when I'm not at work.

 

Build issues is another thing. Most of my characters definitely don't run anything close to what would be considered "meta" and I don't really like the idea of changing up any of them to fit that premise. And while I know that its possible to beat raids with more than just meta builds, for someone that's new and just getting into raids there's probably a lot less leeway for me to get away with non-meta builds than there would be for someone with a ton of experience and a raid guild behind them.

 

People is probably the biggest issue. I'm not in a guild, and with my sporadic play schedule I'd have little to offer a raid guild if I were to look for one as I'm probably never going to become a "regular raider" or anything like that. So it'd have to be pugs, which means less tolerance for learning and more time spent trying to get a group together. But perhaps more importantly, I have this thing where I absolutely hate inconveniencing other people with my own lack of experience / skill. If I can bash my head against something solo then its all good, I'll take the time to learn the encounter even if its slow-going and I have to stop out of frustration now and then. But the second you throw other people into the mix and I'm now not wasting my time but ALSO wasting their time by dragging the group down, then I'm just like "NOPE!". I want no part of that, it makes me feel terrible. It doesn't even matter if they're the nicest people on the planet, super patient and willing to teach, I'm still going to end up feeling bad.

[Nutjob.9021]

It's too demanding, but not in a fun way. You have to learn your script for your build and the boss and pretty much do exactly the same thing every single time. It's mind-numbingly tedious. And you are at the mercy of your friends/allies. If they aren't in the mood to play, you are out of luck because the other option is PUGs, which are almost always doomed to failure or to take ten times as long as a decent group to get anywhere.

 

I don't like having to rework my character's build or being forced to play alts, just to be effective on raids. My build works great in PvP, WvW, fractals and of course in PvE. It should carry its weight in raids if I play it skillfully (which I do).

 

I don't like that legendary armor is locked behind raids. I detest raids so much that I am not getting legendary armor if that is the cost.