EpicTurtle.8571 Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Less than 33% of the player base plays a dead mode and is entitled to fuck over the main mode of play because they can't learn to adapt. If i read that right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levetty.1279 Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > that's a pretty generalized and rude thing to say > > > > > > Especially since PvP requires more skill than PvE. > > > > PvP players spend all their time complaining how every single class, mechanic and skill is OP and want everything dumbed down. They are the single biggest reason why the combat in this game never actually got anywhere. > > > > In theory PvP should require more skill then fighting npcs, in practice Guardian zerg lootstick famers in PvE are more skilled then PvP players because at least they know how to move around and probably use condi cleanse from time to time. > > Normally your statements would just be viewed as trolling but you actually believe them. > > PvP players want balance and are entitled to it. Balance should never take PvE into consideration when it'll effect PvP. This is because you can change PvE content according to balance changes. > > The skill involved in PvE is minimal. I would say Bronze tier requires more skill than PvE as people have trained Chimps to be successful at MMO raids It really doesn't take a lot of skill to log into a forum and say 'insert skill/class/build/log in button here is too strong nerf pls' or ' you disagree with me so you are a troll'. PvE players want a fun game and as they out number PvP players, actually know some of the mechanics and keep the electricity running at Anet they are entitled to it. Balance should never take PvP into consideration when it'll effect PvE. This is because PvP is dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abelisk.4527 Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > > that's a pretty generalized and rude thing to say > > > > > > > > Especially since PvP requires more skill than PvE. > > > > > > PvP players spend all their time complaining how every single class, mechanic and skill is OP and want everything dumbed down. They are the single biggest reason why the combat in this game never actually got anywhere. > > > > > > In theory PvP should require more skill then fighting npcs, in practice Guardian zerg lootstick famers in PvE are more skilled then PvP players because at least they know how to move around and probably use condi cleanse from time to time. > > > > Normally your statements would just be viewed as trolling but you actually believe them. > > > > PvP players want balance and are entitled to it. Balance should never take PvE into consideration when it'll effect PvP. This is because you can change PvE content according to balance changes. > > > > The skill involved in PvE is minimal. I would say Bronze tier requires more skill than PvE as people have trained Chimps to be successful at MMO raids > > It really doesn't take a lot of skill to log into a forum and say 'insert skill/class/build/log in button here is too strong nerf pls' or ' you disagree with me so you are a troll'. > > PvE players want a fun game and as they out number PvP players, actually know some of the mechanics and keep the electricity running at Anet they are entitled to it. Balance should never take PvP into consideration when it'll effect PvE. This is because PvP is dead. Good idea. Let's kill off a gamemode and make GW2 earn less revenue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levetty.1279 Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 The game mode is already dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinks.2057 Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > > that's a pretty generalized and rude thing to say > > > > > > > > Especially since PvP requires more skill than PvE. > > > > > > PvP players spend all their time complaining how every single class, mechanic and skill is OP and want everything dumbed down. They are the single biggest reason why the combat in this game never actually got anywhere. > > > > > > In theory PvP should require more skill then fighting npcs, in practice Guardian zerg lootstick famers in PvE are more skilled then PvP players because at least they know how to move around and probably use condi cleanse from time to time. > > > > Normally your statements would just be viewed as trolling but you actually believe them. > > > > PvP players want balance and are entitled to it. Balance should never take PvE into consideration when it'll effect PvP. This is because you can change PvE content according to balance changes. > > > > The skill involved in PvE is minimal. I would say Bronze tier requires more skill than PvE as people have trained Chimps to be successful at MMO raids > > It really doesn't take a lot of skill to log into a forum and say 'insert skill/class/build/log in button here is too strong nerf pls' or ' you disagree with me so you are a troll'. > > PvE players want a fun game and as they out number PvP players, actually know some of the mechanics and keep the electricity running at Anet they are entitled to it. Balance should never take PvP into consideration when it'll effect PvE. This is because PvP is dead. Not too sure since I'm sure I type more APM than any raid player is required to do on any raid in this game, and I'm literally playing piano while doing so..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daishi.6027 Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 Depends what we mean by "OP" I think everyone has their own version and tries to defend their point based on what they subjectively believe is OP. Mirage has good match-ups and that is where most of the cries come from. For 5v5 conquest it is not OP. It has a strong role, but does not directly hard carry the game in solo/duo (which ranked is based on), strong 1v1s is not solely relevant to the criteria of "OP" and mirage rarely shines in the others. In addition It is also a class that is not usually stacked, and considered a loss to do so by some. WvW people strongly argue about mirage, but balance was never designed around skirmishing/havoc, that is not relevant to the criteria of "OP". That said class balance changes are rarely made for the sake of WvW unless something is significantly problematic on a large group scale. PvE I'm just salty power build isn't viable. idc what condi can do, to me Mirage will always be UP. It will be nerfed if A-net wants to reduce it's match-ups, but doing so will make it inferior to Chrono given what they both currently offer even if the roles are a bit different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musty.3148 Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 > @"EpicTurtle.8571" said: > In what world does PvP require more skill? Seriously? HAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bod.8261 Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > If it necessary .please Strengthe other professions not nerf mirage ,mirage is so intersting I have to hugely disagree. The last thing this game needs is even more powercreep. If Anet decides that some spec is overperforming then they should bring it down. Personally I think Mirage is way less problematic than scourge and spellbreaker ever were. Mirage is only a good duelist and roamer. The only thing "broken" (compared to other specs) is EM and it's hard to nerf without making it useless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levetty.1279 Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > > > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > > > that's a pretty generalized and rude thing to say > > > > > > > > > > Especially since PvP requires more skill than PvE. > > > > > > > > PvP players spend all their time complaining how every single class, mechanic and skill is OP and want everything dumbed down. They are the single biggest reason why the combat in this game never actually got anywhere. > > > > > > > > In theory PvP should require more skill then fighting npcs, in practice Guardian zerg lootstick famers in PvE are more skilled then PvP players because at least they know how to move around and probably use condi cleanse from time to time. > > > > > > Normally your statements would just be viewed as trolling but you actually believe them. > > > > > > PvP players want balance and are entitled to it. Balance should never take PvE into consideration when it'll effect PvP. This is because you can change PvE content according to balance changes. > > > > > > The skill involved in PvE is minimal. I would say Bronze tier requires more skill than PvE as people have trained Chimps to be successful at MMO raids > > > > It really doesn't take a lot of skill to log into a forum and say 'insert skill/class/build/log in button here is too strong nerf pls' or ' you disagree with me so you are a troll'. > > > > PvE players want a fun game and as they out number PvP players, actually know some of the mechanics and keep the electricity running at Anet they are entitled to it. Balance should never take PvP into consideration when it'll effect PvE. This is because PvP is dead. > > Not too sure since I'm sure I type more APM than any raid player is required to do on any raid in this game, and I'm literally playing piano while doing so..... Ask your piano teacher what condi cleanse is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retsuko.2035 Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 Mirage is at a good place. The devs had a duelist role or small skirmish/havoc role for this spec. It's doing well at this role, but is by no means OP. Ever since the start of this game and also in other mmo's, you always see certain classes that are weak against one and strong against another. I feel mirage has the same against certain classes and builds. If you can't cope with a mirage, please instead of QQ'ing on forum about it, please learn to play against one, or build your class or play a class that can cope with them. Take in mind, mirage is mostly just strong in small scale duel fights. When it comes to 5v5 and larger, their effectivity diminishes greatly. Asking for a nerf on mirage is only making the spec absolute and that's not what Anet wants. I got to admit, mirage has finally made it possible for me to put up a decent fight against a thief class with a decent chance of winning. My condi mirage however couldn't win against a guildie of mine who was running shadow's embrace. Whether you win or lose has a lot to do with your build, and smart good players adept to their opponents in order to win. Elusive mind is the problem? I think not. Why would it be OP if someone uses a dodge to lose a condi, he or she only become more vulnerable with lack of dodges thereafter. You can't spam dodge and the dodge has two more purposes beside EM, which are ambush and avoid damage. Depending on opponent, elusive mind could be a useless trait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinks.2057 Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > > > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > > > > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > > > > that's a pretty generalized and rude thing to say > > > > > > > > > > > > Especially since PvP requires more skill than PvE. > > > > > > > > > > PvP players spend all their time complaining how every single class, mechanic and skill is OP and want everything dumbed down. They are the single biggest reason why the combat in this game never actually got anywhere. > > > > > > > > > > In theory PvP should require more skill then fighting npcs, in practice Guardian zerg lootstick famers in PvE are more skilled then PvP players because at least they know how to move around and probably use condi cleanse from time to time. > > > > > > > > Normally your statements would just be viewed as trolling but you actually believe them. > > > > > > > > PvP players want balance and are entitled to it. Balance should never take PvE into consideration when it'll effect PvP. This is because you can change PvE content according to balance changes. > > > > > > > > The skill involved in PvE is minimal. I would say Bronze tier requires more skill than PvE as people have trained Chimps to be successful at MMO raids > > > > > > It really doesn't take a lot of skill to log into a forum and say 'insert skill/class/build/log in button here is too strong nerf pls' or ' you disagree with me so you are a troll'. > > > > > > PvE players want a fun game and as they out number PvP players, actually know some of the mechanics and keep the electricity running at Anet they are entitled to it. Balance should never take PvP into consideration when it'll effect PvE. This is because PvP is dead. > > > > Not too sure since I'm sure I type more APM than any raid player is required to do on any raid in this game, and I'm literally playing piano while doing so..... > > Ask your piano teacher what condi cleanse is. V Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZhouX.8742 Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 Mirage is rather broken in PvP at the moment, but we know what anet does to classes in balance. They don't shave, ever - they only flat out destroy classes. But it will be interesting to see what route they take with Mirage, they've already noted it's presence (Ben) and will be making adjustments, but this will most likely be in the game mode of PvP only which is fine (Sorry wvw, they still don't consider you pvp yet!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonoly.4352 Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 It will receive some adjustments for PvP like a bunch of other things, but I would be surprised if it were to the extent that some of the more vocal players are expecting. Mirage is a selfish dps elite spec that can be hard to pin down and can condi (and power) burst like a truck. That's its design. That's all it does. It provides absolutely no team support or utility whatsoever. It can be a real burden if caught up in a team fight where its burst is so easily attenuated and its survivability becomes "cut and run" providing no real impact during a team brawl or point presence - a bit like Thief which Mirage is modelled on. At that point its all about the potency of well used portals and that's been a core part of the Mesmer role in PvP since the dawn of time and hardly something to get one's knickers in a twist over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuka Cola.8520 Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 Of course it will be nerfed. Its not about the if, but when. I just hope they don't something dumb and give, say, a 5 ICD on sword ambush leaps or decrease the leap to 250 range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carighan.6758 Posted January 1, 2018 Share Posted January 1, 2018 > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > If it necessary .please Strengthe other professions not nerf mirage ,mirage is so intersting I disagree for two reasons: * For the simple one, maybe we shouldn't judge the balance of an implementation which frankly shouldn't even exist. Just scrap it and redo from nothing. Best balance approach in the case of the utter mess that is mirage. * Second, even ignoring that, if something is overpowered, that implies (the word!) that it should be nerfed. That's the whole point, it is above the target point for average power level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vieux P.1238 Posted January 1, 2018 Share Posted January 1, 2018 It would be stupid to nerf Mirage now. I don't know if you have noticed, but except for a few classes that still want to remain in there broken state...cough..(Firebrand-Scourge)... ppl are actually building around mirages & others. & adapting. I mean instead of building a glassy spammy build that is hoping to one shot everyone. There going for less damage & a bit more cleans & sustain builds. & it Working. Nerfing mirage at this point would just bring it back to square one where they tickled everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Ketsu.4569 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 Sorry, but at the very least Mirage perma-evade needs a nerf. Mirage played correctly can chain evades for a full 12 seconds, and then teleport away to stealth if things don't go their way. Numerous platinum mes players in sPvP do this and they are 100% unkillable due to there being no real counterplay to this strategy. A class that has full immunity to everything cannot be realistically balanced by buffing other things. It's a broken mechanic by design. Anyone who thinks mirage is balanced does not know how to play it. Played right you absolutely cannot die in any 1v1 matchup regardless of what they are running. Finally with sword ambush and jaunt you have almost as much rotation as a thief. Defenses of a warrior + mobility of a thief = anyone who thinks this is at all balanced is severely delusional. The ONLY problems Mirage faces is that it cannot kill a good Firebrand, cannot hold points well, and unlike Scourge Mirage actually requires an amount of skill to play. If this was not the case we would be seeing 2+ per team past 1500 elo in sPvP just like Necro. But in straight up 1v1 Mirage is god mode don't even try to deny it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EpicTurtle.8571 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said: > Sorry, but at the very least Mirage perma-evade needs a nerf. > > Mirage played correctly can chain evades for a full 12 seconds, and then teleport away to stealth if things don't go their way. Numerous platinum mes players in sPvP do this and they are 100% unkillable due to there being no real counterplay to this strategy. > > A class that has full immunity to everything cannot be realistically balanced by buffing other things. It's a broken mechanic by design. > > Anyone who thinks mirage is balanced does not know how to play it. Played right you absolutely cannot die in any 1v1 matchup regardless of what they are running. > > Finally with sword ambush and jaunt you have almost as much rotation as a thief. Defenses of a warrior + mobility of a thief = anyone who thinks this is at all balanced is severely delusional. > > The ONLY problems Mirage faces is that it cannot kill a good Firebrand, cannot hold points well, and unlike Scourge Mirage actually requires an amount of skill to play. If this was not the case we would be seeing 2+ per team past 1500 elo in sPvP just like Necro. But in straight up 1v1 Mirage is god mode don't even try to deny it. > > Actually wrong, let's count out the Mirage based evasion you can get in 12 seconds. 3 natural dodges over 12 seconds assuming you start with full endurance (vigor regen makes 1 dodge per 6.66 seconds so not quite 12 seconds) That's 3 seconds of evasion. IAmbush is another 1 seconds for a total of four. Now we have False Oasis assuming you popped it immediately when you starting dodging which gives one mirror which is 5 seconds. Cool cool, now we've got 2 more utilities that generate mirrors for 2 more seconds which is 7 total evasion seconds. And if you happen to have 3 illusions up and are taking the illusion distortion trait you get 3 more mirrors for a total of 10 seconds of mirage sourced evasion. Note I'm not counting distortion since base mesmer has access to that, tbf you don't even necessarily have to count the natural dodges either since every class gets those too, but i'm being 'fair'. Now you can only get the extra evasion seconds all used in combination once every 40 seconds. And assuming you're just chaining evasion skills back to back you're probably not putting out much damage either. And assuming you took only evasion related skills and Jaunt you have exactly 1 source of stealth, which is only if you're running torch. Nice try on the exaggeration though, your apocryphal story game is tops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown.3976 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > that's a pretty generalized and rude thing to say > > > > Especially since PvP requires more skill than PvE. > > PvP players spend all their time complaining how every single class, mechanic and skill is OP and want everything dumbed down. Oh that's true, there will always be a poster child for the "poor state of balance" in PvP mode; now it's FB and mirage, before it was the scourge, before that it was the berserker, and before that, it was the scrapper, and before that, it was the minion master necro (fun PvE build that was killed off due to PvP concerns) and before that, it was the DH (anet, pls un-nerf DH LB for PvE mode) and before that, it was the bunker chrono, and before that, it was the druid. If anything, this thread just shows that's no hope of reconciliation between PvE and PvP; PvE players wants fun, balance is of little concern, PvP players wants the power-creep gone. More skill-splits, Anet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EpicTurtle.8571 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"Unknown.3976" said: > > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > > @"Jinks.2057" said: > > > that's a pretty generalized and rude thing to say > > > > > > Especially since PvP requires more skill than PvE. > > > > PvP players spend all their time complaining how every single class, mechanic and skill is OP and want everything dumbed down. > > Oh that's true, there will always be a poster child for the "poor state of balance" in PvP mode; now it's FB and mirage, before it was the scourge, before that it was the berserker, and before that, it was the scrapper, and before that, it was the minion master necro (fun PvE build that was killed off due to PvP concerns) and before that, it was the DH (anet, pls un-nerf DH LB for PvE mode) and before that, it was the bunker chrono, and before that, it was the druid. > > If anything, this thread just shows that's no hope of reconciliation between PvE and PvP; PvE players wants fun, balance is of little concern, PvP players wants the power-creep gone. More skill-splits, Anet. > That last statement is a little misrepresentative of the issues. PvE cares about PvE based balance which has different issues than PvP based balance. Which of course would be remedied by ANet doing more split balancing since each side keeps getting pissed at the other over changes that affect the others game mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Ketsu.4569 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"EpicTurtle.8571" said: > > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said: > > Sorry, but at the very least Mirage perma-evade needs a nerf. > > > > Mirage played correctly can chain evades for a full 12 seconds, and then teleport away to stealth if things don't go their way. Numerous platinum mes players in sPvP do this and they are 100% unkillable due to there being no real counterplay to this strategy. > > > > A class that has full immunity to everything cannot be realistically balanced by buffing other things. It's a broken mechanic by design. > > > > Anyone who thinks mirage is balanced does not know how to play it. Played right you absolutely cannot die in any 1v1 matchup regardless of what they are running. > > > > Finally with sword ambush and jaunt you have almost as much rotation as a thief. Defenses of a warrior + mobility of a thief = anyone who thinks this is at all balanced is severely delusional. > > > > The ONLY problems Mirage faces is that it cannot kill a good Firebrand, cannot hold points well, and unlike Scourge Mirage actually requires an amount of skill to play. If this was not the case we would be seeing 2+ per team past 1500 elo in sPvP just like Necro. But in straight up 1v1 Mirage is god mode don't even try to deny it. > > > > > > Actually wrong, let's count out the Mirage based evasion you can get in 12 seconds. 3 natural dodges over 12 seconds assuming you start with full endurance (vigor regen makes 1 dodge per 6.66 seconds so not quite 12 seconds) That's 3 seconds of evasion. IAmbush is another 1 seconds for a total of four. Now we have False Oasis assuming you popped it immediately when you starting dodging which gives one mirror which is 5 seconds. Cool cool, now we've got 2 more utilities that generate mirrors for 2 more seconds which is 7 total evasion seconds. And if you happen to have 3 illusions up and are taking the illusion distortion trait you get 3 more mirrors for a total of 10 seconds of mirage sourced evasion. Note I'm not counting distortion since base mesmer has access to that, tbf you don't even necessarily have to count the natural dodges either since every class gets those too, but i'm being 'fair'. Now you can only get the extra evasion seconds all used in combination once every 40 seconds. And assuming you're just chaining evasion skills back to back you're probably not putting out much damage either. > > And assuming you took only evasion related skills and Jaunt you have exactly 1 source of stealth, which is only if you're running torch. > > Nice try on the exaggeration though, your apocryphal story game is tops. You're forgetting additional sources from runes and weapon sigils, that brings it to 12s. And even if you were right, 10 seconds is still ridiculous so you're point is moot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EpicTurtle.8571 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said: > > @"EpicTurtle.8571" said: > > > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said: > > > Sorry, but at the very least Mirage perma-evade needs a nerf. > > > > > > Mirage played correctly can chain evades for a full 12 seconds, and then teleport away to stealth if things don't go their way. Numerous platinum mes players in sPvP do this and they are 100% unkillable due to there being no real counterplay to this strategy. > > > > > > A class that has full immunity to everything cannot be realistically balanced by buffing other things. It's a broken mechanic by design. > > > > > > Anyone who thinks mirage is balanced does not know how to play it. Played right you absolutely cannot die in any 1v1 matchup regardless of what they are running. > > > > > > Finally with sword ambush and jaunt you have almost as much rotation as a thief. Defenses of a warrior + mobility of a thief = anyone who thinks this is at all balanced is severely delusional. > > > > > > The ONLY problems Mirage faces is that it cannot kill a good Firebrand, cannot hold points well, and unlike Scourge Mirage actually requires an amount of skill to play. If this was not the case we would be seeing 2+ per team past 1500 elo in sPvP just like Necro. But in straight up 1v1 Mirage is god mode don't even try to deny it. > > > > > > > > > > Actually wrong, let's count out the Mirage based evasion you can get in 12 seconds. 3 natural dodges over 12 seconds assuming you start with full endurance (vigor regen makes 1 dodge per 6.66 seconds so not quite 12 seconds) That's 3 seconds of evasion. IAmbush is another 1 seconds for a total of four. Now we have False Oasis assuming you popped it immediately when you starting dodging which gives one mirror which is 5 seconds. Cool cool, now we've got 2 more utilities that generate mirrors for 2 more seconds which is 7 total evasion seconds. And if you happen to have 3 illusions up and are taking the illusion distortion trait you get 3 more mirrors for a total of 10 seconds of mirage sourced evasion. Note I'm not counting distortion since base mesmer has access to that, tbf you don't even necessarily have to count the natural dodges either since every class gets those too, but i'm being 'fair'. Now you can only get the extra evasion seconds all used in combination once every 40 seconds. And assuming you're just chaining evasion skills back to back you're probably not putting out much damage either. > > > > And assuming you took only evasion related skills and Jaunt you have exactly 1 source of stealth, which is only if you're running torch. > > > > Nice try on the exaggeration though, your apocryphal story game is tops. > > You're forgetting additional sources from runes and weapon sigils, that brings it to 12s. > > And even if you were right, 10 seconds is still ridiculous so you're point is moot. Runes and Sigils don't come from the Mirage, anyone can use them ergo they don't count. Yeah 10 seconds where your damage output is low because it's super obvious you're blowing your evasions and ambush windows or if you just stood there for 10 seconds while the Mirage just hammered at you and didn't disengage, you're a pretty tactless player. Are you just mad because the giant purple flash isn't enough to notify you that you need to dodge or condi cleanse soon? You really blew through that post without actually reading didn't you. And since I don't feel the need to be fair, it's 7 seconds since the natural dodges are things everyone gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Ketsu.4569 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"EpicTurtle.8571" said: > > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said: > > > @"EpicTurtle.8571" said: > > > > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said: > > > > Sorry, but at the very least Mirage perma-evade needs a nerf. > > > > > > > > Mirage played correctly can chain evades for a full 12 seconds, and then teleport away to stealth if things don't go their way. Numerous platinum mes players in sPvP do this and they are 100% unkillable due to there being no real counterplay to this strategy. > > > > > > > > A class that has full immunity to everything cannot be realistically balanced by buffing other things. It's a broken mechanic by design. > > > > > > > > Anyone who thinks mirage is balanced does not know how to play it. Played right you absolutely cannot die in any 1v1 matchup regardless of what they are running. > > > > > > > > Finally with sword ambush and jaunt you have almost as much rotation as a thief. Defenses of a warrior + mobility of a thief = anyone who thinks this is at all balanced is severely delusional. > > > > > > > > The ONLY problems Mirage faces is that it cannot kill a good Firebrand, cannot hold points well, and unlike Scourge Mirage actually requires an amount of skill to play. If this was not the case we would be seeing 2+ per team past 1500 elo in sPvP just like Necro. But in straight up 1v1 Mirage is god mode don't even try to deny it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually wrong, let's count out the Mirage based evasion you can get in 12 seconds. 3 natural dodges over 12 seconds assuming you start with full endurance (vigor regen makes 1 dodge per 6.66 seconds so not quite 12 seconds) That's 3 seconds of evasion. IAmbush is another 1 seconds for a total of four. Now we have False Oasis assuming you popped it immediately when you starting dodging which gives one mirror which is 5 seconds. Cool cool, now we've got 2 more utilities that generate mirrors for 2 more seconds which is 7 total evasion seconds. And if you happen to have 3 illusions up and are taking the illusion distortion trait you get 3 more mirrors for a total of 10 seconds of mirage sourced evasion. Note I'm not counting distortion since base mesmer has access to that, tbf you don't even necessarily have to count the natural dodges either since every class gets those too, but i'm being 'fair'. Now you can only get the extra evasion seconds all used in combination once every 40 seconds. And assuming you're just chaining evasion skills back to back you're probably not putting out much damage either. > > > > > > And assuming you took only evasion related skills and Jaunt you have exactly 1 source of stealth, which is only if you're running torch. > > > > > > Nice try on the exaggeration though, your apocryphal story game is tops. > > > > You're forgetting additional sources from runes and weapon sigils, that brings it to 12s. > > > > And even if you were right, 10 seconds is still ridiculous so you're point is moot. > > Runes and Sigils don't come from the Mirage, anyone can use them ergo they don't count. Yeah 10 seconds where your damage output is low because it's super obvious you're blowing your evasions and ambush windows or if you just stood there for 10 seconds while the Mirage just hammered at you and didn't disengage, you're a pretty tactless player. Are you just mad because the giant purple flash isn't enough to notify you that you need to dodge or condi cleanse soon? You really blew through that post without actually reading didn't you. And since I don't feel the need to be fair, it's 7 seconds since the natural dodges are things everyone gets. You are grasping at straws and are completely delusional. The current meta build for mirage is superior rune of the adventurer. Doesn't matter if it comes from the mesmer or not if it can get away with slotting it. Nearly the entire sPvP community agrees it is broken. Please tell me you are at least in gold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EpicTurtle.8571 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 I didn't say it wasn't broken in sPvP. The only things I said about it were that PvP doesn't take much skill and is practically a dead game mode as well as that your assertion of having 12 consecutive non overwritten seconds of evasion was wrong, which it is. If you're busy being concerned with whatever the copy pasta build is for a class it's no wonder you think it's OP. And no I'm not in gold, frankly I washed my hands of PvP aside from dailies as it got super boring, it's still super boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrHome.1920 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"EpicTurtle.8571" said: > I didn't say it wasn't broken in sPvP. The only things I said about it were that PvP doesn't take much skill and is practically a dead game mode as well as that your assertion of having 12 consecutive non overwritten seconds of evasion was wrong, which it is. If you're busy being concerned with whatever the copy pasta build is for a class it's no wonder you think it's OP. And no I'm not in gold, frankly I washed my hands of PvP aside from dailies as it got super boring, it's still super boring. - you don't do high level pvp - you don't do pvp at all - you start a discussion about the irrelevant question whether a mirage has 10 or 12 seconds of evasion time - you question the skills of high level pvp players that say condi mirage is broken - you leave a side note that pvp in ths game sucks anyway Hilarious! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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