Make THIEF the BIS in PVE/RAID DPS

[Casiano.2705]

Yep, we could use some pve revamps, since this thread is all about high end PvE,

 

Whenever I see the notes on Snow crows, that power thief is useless in all game/RAID encounters and they only kept it because their leader us a diehard thief fan, it makes my heart sunk.

[Zedek.8932]

Excelsior.

 

Not sure, man.

The problem of threads like this is similar to walking into a kindergarden class and ask whether they want ice cream or broccoli.

 

I see you say "raid", but then, yelling "make it better by * insert buffs * does no good in every way.

What I also fail to understand why many people - not all, this thread is for once comparibly diverse - go for damage. For example, I love Deadeye because I am a solo player. I sit (or stand) on a ledge from behind and shoot people in the head while the others can have their twitchy gameplay. Unlike Ranger I do not have annoying pets or stupid weaponry. When stuff is getting rough I pull my daggers and go melee. This is what defines the qualities for this profession for me.

 

Many peole just yell "DMG" as if they want to mount something on MacOS, or "profession X has Z" (but leave out we have Y, too).

 

I have yet to see a thread in the Thief forums that does not contain comparisons off the reality, too much theorycrafting, simple screams for buffs or a mad DeceiverX :-)

 

 

[Casiano.2705]

The only thing that the devs can do right now is increase/decrease damage modifiers, they don't have the resources to do a revamp on thief as of this time.

 

It was a bold move to revamp mesmers and it's a good thing, and I hope that we can be revamped as well into a well rounded class that has multiple capabilities e.g. group healing, tanking support etc.

 

Even raiding and fractal community to some extent are getting fed up on the new holy trinity of druid-chrono-bannerslave.

 

And if they only insist/want thieves to be pigeon holed to only one aspect e.g. damage, then we should be able to dish out insane dps in high end pve

[Yureii.4236]

I think increased initiative gain while under the effects of quickness or alacrity would help with the dps a bit

[TwiceDead.1963]

> @"Yureii.4236" said:

> I think increased initiative gain while under the effects of quickness or alacrity would help with the dps a bit

 

Alacrity I definitely get, but Quickness is a scary prospect when it comes to Deadeye, as they have the capability to apply themselves with _very long_ quickness durations, with only 30% Boon Duration applied to themselves... Hell with 38% boon duration you can sustain Quickness for an entire Minute, and if RNGsus favors you with the right cantrip theft (or if you're fighting Mesmers), you can keep it going even longer.

 

Granted, you sacrifice some offensive stuff to achieve that.

 

... I keep forgetting this is a Raid scenario, PvE, where you basically have Perma-quickness anyway. Nevermind~

[Yureii.4236]

> @"TwiceDead.1963" said:

> > @"Yureii.4236" said:

> > I think increased initiative gain while under the effects of quickness or alacrity would help with the dps a bit

>

> Alacrity I definitely get, but Quickness is a scary prospect when it comes to Deadeye, as they have the capability to apply themselves with _very long_ quickness durations, with only 30% Boon Duration applied to themselves... Hell with 38% boon duration you can sustain Quickness for an entire Minute, and if RNGsus favors you with the right cantrip theft (or if you're fighting Mesmers), you can keep it going even longer.

>

> Granted, you sacrifice some offensive stuff to achieve that.

>

> ... I keep forgetting this is a Raid scenario, PvE, where you basically have Perma-quickness anyway. Nevermind~

 

Yeah, itd be a really sweet synergy with Be Quick or Be Killed, maybe a bit OP but itd definitely be fun

[Aplier.7829]

> @"Yureii.4236" said:

> > @"TwiceDead.1963" said:

> > > @"Yureii.4236" said:

> > > I think increased initiative gain while under the effects of quickness or alacrity would help with the dps a bit

> >

> > Alacrity I definitely get, but Quickness is a scary prospect when it comes to Deadeye, as they have the capability to apply themselves with _very long_ quickness durations, with only 30% Boon Duration applied to themselves... Hell with 38% boon duration you can sustain Quickness for an entire Minute, and if RNGsus favors you with the right cantrip theft (or if you're fighting Mesmers), you can keep it going even longer.

> >

> > Granted, you sacrifice some offensive stuff to achieve that.

> >

> > ... I keep forgetting this is a Raid scenario, PvE, where you basically have Perma-quickness anyway. Nevermind~

>

> Yeah, itd be a really sweet synergy with Be Quick or Be Killed, maybe a bit OP but itd definitely be fun

 

Definitely OP. Quickness already increases the rate at which the Thief takes actions, which with our relatively strong autoattack on every weapon already makes a very good dps buff.

 

If anything, it should be alacrity that provides a faster initiative regeneration, as alacrity 's purpose is to shorten cooldowns on skills and the initiative system acts like a shared cooldown on our weapon skills.

[Casiano.2705]

let my lucid dreaming be in action for this very moment,

 

PVE only.

 

Minor Master trait: unrelenting strikes, whenever you gain fury, the effects of quickness will be 50% more effective' the new resulting quickness speed will be 75%

[Casiano.2705]

Thief is going down hill in every patch. Now that they hit pvp wvwv hard,

 

Maybe its time to make amends and at least make thieves better in pve,

 

If this downward trend continous we will be the unwanted class in every game mode

[Curennos.9307]

Instant DE Mark would be a nice start to things. Then add in a 'Get 50% more effectiveness from vuln' to one of the core traitlines (12.5% dmg increase at full vuln stacks).

 

Change DE Renewing Gaze to, instead of giving Regen every time a Marked target dies, give a small damage buff - either a small stackable bonus, or a slightly larger but not-stackable to help with target switches.

 

I can't speak much for DD, but IIRC Deadeye's Revealed Malice trait could also use some love - I don't think it's been used, ever. DE trait options seem to have a dmg option, a utility/support option, and a defensive option. I find Revealed malice utterly fails as a dmg option. I thiiiink pvp DE's take iron sight anyway, so this wouldn't screw anyone over.

 

They could rework some of our unused utilities - I don't think I've ever seen anyone use Scorpion Wire, Caltrops, of Smoke Screen. Hell, they could double the damage of all our stealth attacks in PvE as a whole (though I'm thinking of backstab specifically). Doing so might have Revealed Malice see some usage.

[Casiano.2705]

to add on the OP that i have.

 

remove the weapon restriction on some traits outside specialization.

 

eg. like Curennos.9307 suggested.

 

1. dagger training to poison training, applicable to all weapons not just dagger chance to poison enemies added icd 3 secs to counter application

 

2. ankle shots to achilles weakness - applicable to all weapons not just pistol on cripple application increase icd from 8 to 15 secs

 

3. swindler's equilibrium to assassins equilibrium - applicable to all weapons not just sword, increase ICD from 30 to 40secs

 

and we will not touch staff master and rifle silent scope to maintain elite specialization flavor

 

[Fierlor.2697]

You know a class is broken when you walk into a raid lobby and there are constantly missing entire classes. I will see necro and revenant from time to time, never any thieves. I want to raid but I only play thief. Feels_bad_man.jpg.