PvP/WvW Skill Split Release

[Jace al Thor.6745]

> @"Darkened.4076" said:

> > @"Tapps.1479" said:

> > PLease take a look at soulbeast damage. on ele i'm getting bye 24k maul and 26k worldy impact. Single abilites probably shouldn't be able to do 100% of a characters life

>

> This sounds more like a L2P issue, than one of balance. The only way the ranger is hitting you that hard is if you are running no defense in your gear. Also, there is such a thing as dodge+evade.

 

Not only that but the ranger is running just squishy and both of those skills have extremely obvious animations.

[LUST.7241]

I don't understand how some skills are getting 1 second increases...but then the cooldown is also increased by 10s. That seems like it resolves nothing.

[Toron.4856]

So Ben,

 

Can you already tell if the pvp balance is going to between before or after the next season?

[Master Ketsu.4569]

> @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said:

> Hey folks!

>

> I've been promising a list of edits to our initial post and finally here they are! I'm hoping to get the full list re-translated and posted in all languages by mid next week.

>

> A few notes:

> We'd mentioned several times that we were going to consider unsplitting some things. We decided to hold off on that for now, but we will be considering unsplits for the next full balance release.

>

> Keep in mind that balance is a moving target. We know we have more to do!

>

> **Warrior**

> • Rampage: Reduced the cooldown from 180 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced transform duration from 15 seconds to 10 seconds.

>

> **Revenant**

> Skills

> • Forced Engagement: Reduced the energy cost from 25 to 10. Increased the cooldown from 10 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

>

> **Thief**

> Skills

> • Larcenous Strike: Reduced the power coefficient from 15% in PvP and WvW

> • We decided not to do the following buffs;

> • Heartseeker

> • Shadow Shot

> • Infiltrator’s Strike

> Traits

> • Swindler's Equilibrium: Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

>

> **Ranger**

> Skills

> • Seed of Life: Increased the cooldown from 1 second to 3 seconds in PvP only

> • Rejuvenating Tides: Reduced the base healing per pulse by 15% in PvP only

> • Solar Beam: Reduced the damage by 17% in PvP only

> • Celestial Avatar: Increased the cooldown from 15 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP only

> Traits

> • Refined Toxins: Increased the cooldown from 5 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP only

> • Rugged Growth: Reduced the healing by 50% in PvP only

> • Grace of the Land: Reduced the number of Might stacks applied from 3 to 2 in PvP only

> • Fortifying Bond: Reduced duration of shared Might stacks from 10 seconds to 5 seconds in PvP only

> • "We Heal as One!:" Reduced duration of copied Might stacks from 10 seconds to 5 seconds in PvP only

> • Fresh Reinforcement: Reduced shared Might duration 10 seconds to 5 seconds in PvP only

>

> **Engineer**

> Skills

> • Light Strike: Reduced the damage by 40% in PvP only

> • Holo Leap: Reduced the damage by 17% in PvP only

> • Corona Burst: Reduced the Might stacks granted per pulse from 2 to 1 in PvP only

> • Holographic Shockwave: Reduced the damage by 22% in PvP only

> • Detection Pulse radius increased from 600 to 1200 in PvP and WvW.

>

> **Elementalist**

> Skills

> • Arcane Blast: Reduced the maximum Ammo count from 3 to 2 in PvP and WvW

> • Plasma Beam: Reduced damage by 20% in PvP and WvW

> • Tornado: Reduced the cooldown from 150 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced the transform duration from 15 seconds to 10 seconds in PvP and WvW.

> Traits

> • Electric Discharge: Reduced the power by 28% in PvP and WvW

>

> **Mesmer**

> Skills

> • Phantasmal Disenchanter – Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

> • Illusionary Riposte: Increased the cooldown from 12 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

> • Illusionary Swordsman: Increased the cooldown from 15 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW. Decreased the number of might stacks from 8 to 4 in PvP and WvW

> • Mirror Blade: Reduced damage by 14% in PvP and WvW

> • Signet of the Ether: Reduced the cooldown from 35 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

> • Illusionary Counter: Reduced the cooldown from 8 seconds to 6 seconds in PvP and WvW

> • Jaunt: Reduced damage by 50% in PvP and WvW

> Traits

> • Elusive Mind: This trait now applies 3 seconds of Exhaustion when breaking a stun

> • Bountiful Disillusionment: Reduced Stability duration from 5 seconds to 3 seconds in PvP and WvW. Decreased Might stacks from 5 to 3 in PvP and WvW

> • Mental Anguish: Reduced bonus damages from 15% and 30% to 10% and 20% respectively in PvP and WvW

> • Confounding Suggestions: Increased cooldown from 5 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

>

> Edit: Forgot Ramage and Tornado edits in initial posting.

 

On one hand, these are mostly good changes and it's good to see that mesmer burst / infinite evade is being toned down.

 

But on the other, it's sad to see yet another season with Renegade traits being almost totally ignored when It's almost unanimously accepted among the community that they are lacking. Will Renegade traits ever get a pass or should we just accept that Revenant drew the short straw when it comes to PoF?

 

 

[dzeRnumbrd.6129]

Great, thanks for listening to the Scourge player's feedback Ben. Nice to know we didn't waste our time writing those posts.

[Vegeta.2563]

> @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said:

> **Thief**

> Skills

> • Larcenous Strike: Reduced the power coefficient from 15% in PvP and WvW

> • We decided not to do the following buffs;

> • Heartseeker

> • Shadow Shot

> • Infiltrator’s Strike

> Traits

> • Swindler's Equilibrium: Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

 

I'm ok with these changes.. however..

 

> • Dagger Autoattack chain: Reduced damages by 15% overall in PvP and WvW

> • Sword Autoattack chain: Reduced damages by 14% overall in PvP and WvW

 

Maybe for Dagger, Wild Strike could get an endurance gain buff to make up for the damage loss? I mean if I'm gonna be hitting with a wet noodle, I think some sort of defensive alteration is needed.

 

For sword, maybe perhaps, Crippling Strike could get cripple or weakness duration increase?

 

Then you have skills like Signet of Agility, which endurance gain dropped from 100 to 50 for PvP, from the February 22, 2017 patch. Then later on became shared with WvW on the September 22, 2017 patch. Are these type of skills getting their own treatment as well?

[BjornIronside.6873]

When is this patch ? Tonight ?

[PaRaPhReNiA.8763]

> @"BjornIronside.6873" said:

> When is this patch ? Tonight ?

 

I think they said something like "after season 10" but not a set date. I feel like today is very unlikely

[Master Ketsu.4569]

> @"BjornIronside.6873" said:

> When is this patch ? Tonight ?

 

This is a different occasion, they asked for player feedback before finalizing the patch ideas which means it still has to be passed to whatever Anet calls their programming team. This means it will take them at least a week most likely 2-3. My guess is April 3rd.

[OriOri.8724]

> @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said:

> Hey folks!

>

> I've been promising a list of edits to our initial post and finally here they are! I'm hoping to get the full list re-translated and posted in all languages by mid next week.

>

> A few notes:

> We'd mentioned several times that we were going to consider unsplitting some things. We decided to hold off on that for now, but we will be considering unsplits for the next full balance release.

>

> Keep in mind that balance is a moving target. We know we have more to do!

>

> **Mesmer**

> Skills

> • Phantasmal Disenchanter – Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

> • Illusionary Riposte: Increased the cooldown from 12 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

> • Illusionary Swordsman: Increased the cooldown from 15 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW. Decreased the number of might stacks from 8 to 4 in PvP and WvW

> • Mirror Blade: Reduced damage by 14% in PvP and WvW

> • Signet of the Ether: Reduced the cooldown from 35 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

> • Illusionary Counter: Reduced the cooldown from 8 seconds to 6 seconds in PvP and WvW

> • Jaunt: Reduced damage by 50% in PvP and WvW

> Traits

> • Elusive Mind: This trait now applies 3 seconds of Exhaustion when breaking a stun

> • Bountiful Disillusionment: Reduced Stability duration from 5 seconds to 3 seconds in PvP and WvW. Decreased Might stacks from 5 to 3 in PvP and WvW

> • Mental Anguish: Reduced bonus damages from 15% and 30% to 10% and 20% respectively in PvP and WvW

> • Confounding Suggestions: Increased cooldown from 5 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

>

> Edit: Forgot Ramage and Tornado edits in initial posting.

 

What in the world? Exhaustion does not fit on EM, period. Mesmer has not flat endurance regen to balance it out, but on top of that, exhaustion doesn't address the actual issue that a stunbreak on dodge is just too powerful. Just remove the stunbreak instead. Please. Its a healthier nerf and also won't make the trait feel like shooting both of your feet off. I don't understand why you guys are so insistent on tacking on this mechanic instead of addressing the problem that EM has in a reasonable manner.

 

Then you go and nerf mirror blade, mental anguish and confounding suggestions, but leave shatter storm and imagined burden alone? Look, I get it, you are trying to tone down mesmer's burst potential, and I can get behind that. But if that is your actual goal, then why would you not touch shatter storm and imagined burden? Imagined burden is honestly fine, it just combos too much with chronophantasma and Signet of the ether right now (so remove that interaction somehow, at the very least with chronophantasma), which by the way is now also getting a CD reduction as well? No complaints about that, it needed one, but it seems counterintuitive to your goal of reducing our burst potential as long as you leave imagined burden alone. Lastly disenchanter needed to be nerfed imo, but I would rather have seen it get a reduction in its damage and reduced the boon strip to 4 instead of a 50% increase in the CD.

[Toron.4856]

> @"OriOri.8724" said:

> > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said:

> > Hey folks!

> >

> > I've been promising a list of edits to our initial post and finally here they are! I'm hoping to get the full list re-translated and posted in all languages by mid next week.

> >

> > A few notes:

> > We'd mentioned several times that we were going to consider unsplitting some things. We decided to hold off on that for now, but we will be considering unsplits for the next full balance release.

> >

> > Keep in mind that balance is a moving target. We know we have more to do!

> >

> > **Mesmer**

> > Skills

> > • Phantasmal Disenchanter – Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > • Illusionary Riposte: Increased the cooldown from 12 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > • Illusionary Swordsman: Increased the cooldown from 15 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW. Decreased the number of might stacks from 8 to 4 in PvP and WvW

> > • Mirror Blade: Reduced damage by 14% in PvP and WvW

> > • Signet of the Ether: Reduced the cooldown from 35 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > • Illusionary Counter: Reduced the cooldown from 8 seconds to 6 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > • Jaunt: Reduced damage by 50% in PvP and WvW

> > Traits

> > • Elusive Mind: This trait now applies 3 seconds of Exhaustion when breaking a stun

> > • Bountiful Disillusionment: Reduced Stability duration from 5 seconds to 3 seconds in PvP and WvW. Decreased Might stacks from 5 to 3 in PvP and WvW

> > • Mental Anguish: Reduced bonus damages from 15% and 30% to 10% and 20% respectively in PvP and WvW

> > • Confounding Suggestions: Increased cooldown from 5 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

> >

> > Edit: Forgot Ramage and Tornado edits in initial posting.

>

> What in the world? Exhaustion does not fit on EM, period. Mesmer has not flat endurance regen to balance it out, but on top of that, exhaustion doesn't address the actual issue that a stunbreak on dodge is just too powerful. Just remove the stunbreak instead. Please. Its a healthier nerf and also won't make the trait feel like shooting both of your feet off. I don't understand why you guys are so insistent on tacking on this mechanic instead of addressing the problem that EM has in a reasonable manner.

>

> Then you go and nerf mirror blade, mental anguish and confounding suggestions, but leave shatter storm and imagined burden alone? Look, I get it, you are trying to tone down mesmer's burst potential, and I can get behind that. But if that is your actual goal, then why would you not touch shatter storm and imagined burden? Imagined burden is honestly fine, it just combos too much with chronophantasma and Signet of the ether right now (so remove that interaction somehow, at the very least with chronophantasma), which by the way is now also getting a CD reduction as well? No complaints about that, it needed one, but it seems counterintuitive to your goal of reducing our burst potential as long as you leave imagined burden alone. Lastly disenchanter needed to be nerfed imo, but I would rather have seen it get a reduction in its damage and reduced the boon strip to 4 instead of a 50% increase in the CD.

 

Agree, just remove the stunnbreak on dodge entirely. Its just better.

[Ben Phongluangtham.1065]

> @"Toron.4856" said:

> So Ben,

>

> Can you already tell if the pvp balance is going to between before or after the next season?

 

Can't give dates yet. Too many things can change between now and our planned release.

[Arkantos.7460]

where are the REvenant buffs?!?!?!?!?

you guys buffed Jalis and mallyx ..... and now ... no buffs ...rly

Revs needs the condicleanse

and where are the trait changes ... WE WAITED AGES FOR THAT BALANCE... no more passiv procs

[Arkantos.7460]

> @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said:

> > Hey folks!

> > **Revenant**

> > Skills

> > • Forced Engagement: Reduced the energy cost from 25 to 10. Increased the cooldown from 10 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

# where is the rest!?

 

i mean :

_ Coalescence of Ruin: Reduced the power coefficient of the second impact from 1.75 to 1.5 (-14%) in WvW only. Reduced the power coefficient of the third impact from 2.25 to 1.75 (-22%) in WvW only.

Razorclaw's Rage: Increased the Bleeding duration from 2 seconds to 4 seconds in PvP and WvW

Icerazor's Ire: Increased the Power coefficient from 3.7 to 4.6 (+24%) in PvP and WvW

Soothing Stone: Increased the number of conditions cleansed from 3 to 5 in PvP and WvW

Vengeful Hammers: Reduced the upkeep cost from 7 to 6 in PvP and WvW

Embrace the Darkness: Increased the attribute bonus from 10% to 15% in PvP and WvW

Banish Enchantments: Increased the number of boons removed from 2 to 3 in PvP and WvW

Pain Absorption: Reduced the energy cost from 35 to 30 in PvP and WvW

 

Traits

 

Eye for an Eye: Increased the cooldown from 45 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

Versed in Stone: Increased the cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

Soothing Bastion: Increased the cooldown from 25 seconds to 60 seconds in PvP only

_

 

i mean changes for passivs are long waited for ALL CLASSES,

i dont want double shrunk engis or double endure pain wars all time in every fight ....this is so dissapointing !!!!!

 

also rev needs the extra condicleanse

rly DO THE PASSIV CHANGES FOR ALL CLASSES

 

# YOU WERE ON THE RIGHT WAY TO BALANCE WITH THE PASSIVS!!

[Egorum.9506]

> @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said:

> > @"Toron.4856" said:

> > So Ben,

> >

> > Can you already tell if the pvp balance is going to between before or after the next season?

>

> Can't give dates yet. Too many things can change between now and our planned release.

 

Thank you for keeping us updated

[synergy.5809]

> @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said:

>

> Things outside of basic numbers changes (changing the way a skill works) are not splittable.

 

and that is why these changes will not save pvp/wvw

[Master Ketsu.4569]

> @"Arkantos.7460" said:

> where are the REvenant buffs?!?!?!?!?

> you guys buffed Jalis and mallyx ..... and now ... no buffs ...rly

> Revs needs the condicleanse

> and where are the trait changes ... WE WAITED AGES FOR THAT BALANCE... no more passiv procs

 

The changes Ben posted are "in addition to / append" to the original post by Gaile. All the other changes not mentioned are still happening.

[floody.4951]

first of all thank you @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" for checking in on us so frequently :)

i personally think that you delivered good changes towards nerfing current meta builds, yet many many many other weapons, heals or utilities outside of the meta are not as viable as the ones youre nerfing. balancing isnt just nerfing one thing, its about buffing other stuff to mix up things. remember gw1 with the weekly changing effects which buff this traitline and that secondary spec? i dont remember what it was called, but things like that perfectly mixed up meta and it kept the game alive.. people get bored after playing stuff for 2 months straight. i dont expect u to change meta weekly, but at least make unfavored stuff viable to enhance build diversity and maybe grow the community cuz of it :) im part of the Guild Wars franchise for more than 10 years now and the build diversity aspects were the main thing which made me enjoy the game so much..

 

Engi Examples (i dont play other specs):

-revert the grenade range nerf -> make it 1200 range again

-continue to buff firearms traitline -> pistol will have more usage & hybrid builds get to be viable

-revert the elixir condi cleanse nerf (change a trait in elixirs which makes condis be removed on elixir usage) -> give elixir builds a spot again

-give us back the bomb trait which healed us on every bomb planted -> would help out core or scrapper by a huuuuge amount

-revert some scrapper dmg nerfs -> it literally hits like a wet noodle, dmg coefficients even on marauder/demolisher are unreasonably low, even with the dmg being that low, they have no chance to survive the heavy heavy amount of unblockable burst by sd thief or huge crits of spellbreaker -> it needs some counter pressure again

-continue buffing shield, increase its knockback range and reduce cooldowns or whatever -> alternative to rifle

-buff sword -> the number 2 is just way out of place, a complete rework has to happen, maybe something with immobilize or even burn to make it a hybrid weapon? pleeeeeease

 

thanks in advance, i hope youre taking the community serious :)

 

[Tapps.1479]

> @"Darkened.4076" said:

> > @"Tapps.1479" said:

> > PLease take a look at soulbeast damage. on ele i'm getting bye 24k maul and 26k worldy impact. Single abilites probably shouldn't be able to do 100% of a characters life

>

> This sounds more like a L2P issue, than one of balance. The only way the ranger is hitting you that hard is if you are running no defense in your gear. Also, there is such a thing as dodge+evade.

 

i was running ele with muraders amulet so yes zero defence but if i want to hurt anything I have to run that, demolishers might have saved me but i would only have 12k hp so I still think a 26k worldly impact would kill me. second of all both hit me from stealth, there was no animation showing it coming i was just dead, instantly.

[Blackjack.5621]

hardcore sustain nerfs and overall nerfs to most classes and the most OP build gets hit with 15% ... kinda disappointed

http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=086d2b-1521009657.jpg

[Sinner B.8592]

The druid as a support in WvW is already unwanted in most groups and these nerfs will reinforce this. This is due to the dominance of firebrand, as they can bring buffs such as resistance, stability and aegis. This leaves druid in wvw with the niche role of support in small havoc groups due to its burst healing and disengage potential, with superspeed and stealth, however buffs are not needed in a zerg engagement.

The decrease of the healing modifiers is understandable as the general idea in pvp is tho allow things to die more often. The same could be said for WvW, however due to the glassy nature of ranged damage builds, (Staff Weaver and Hammer Rev) this was never an issue. Furthermore, **the increase of the cooldown of Celestial Avatar will demolish the only WvW role in which druid shines** , as mentioned above; the decrease in access to the group wide disengage will ultimately kill the role and certain havoc compositions along with it.

The Grace of the Land Changes are also unnecessary in both gametypes as they heavily limit the +1 and teamfight value of Druid as compared to Firebrand

[Patrick.2987]

> @"Blackjack.5621" said:

> hardcore sustain nerfs and overall nerfs to most classes and the most OP build gets hit with 15% ... kinda disappointed

> http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=086d2b-1521009657.jpg

 

Firebrand will also remain supreme sadly. Sustain still way too good and still miles ahead in terms of healoutput to tempest for example.

[Toron.4856]

> @"Patrick.2987" said:

> > @"Blackjack.5621" said:

> > hardcore sustain nerfs and overall nerfs to most classes and the most OP build gets hit with 15% ... kinda disappointed

> > http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=086d2b-1521009657.jpg

>

> Firebrand will also remain supreme sadly. Sustain still way too good and still miles ahead in terms of healoutput to tempest for example.

 

totally agree. firebrand ist gonna be meta regardless... its way superior to other support classes.

[ArthurDent.9538]

> @"Toron.4856" said:

> > @"Patrick.2987" said:

> > > @"Blackjack.5621" said:

> > > hardcore sustain nerfs and overall nerfs to most classes and the most OP build gets hit with 15% ... kinda disappointed

> > > http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=086d2b-1521009657.jpg

> >

> > Firebrand will also remain supreme sadly. Sustain still way too good and still miles ahead in terms of healoutput to tempest for example.

>

> totally agree. firebrand ist gonna be meta regardless... its way superior to other support classes.

 

It is entirely feasible for it to not be worth taking any support at all. For instance healing means absolutely nothing if everyone is just getting one-shot. Don't think the game is quite there yet though.

[Crinn.7864]

> Elixir X: Reduced the duration of Tornado and Rampage transforms from 15 seconds to 10 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced the cooldown from 105 seconds to 75 seconds in PvP and WvW

> @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said:

> • Rampage: Reduced the cooldown from 180 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced transform duration from 15 seconds to 10 seconds.

> • Tornado: Reduced the cooldown from 150 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced the transform duration from 15 seconds to 10 seconds in PvP and WvW.

 

Did you forget about Lich Form?