thehipone.6812 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > The answer is usually rabid. Numbers here: > > > > > > Pieces of exotic, named rabid armor are usually about~~ 50 silver.~~ Edit: holy cow, they're down to the 30 silver range. Toss in undead or krait runes and you have a super-cheap gear option that will serve you well until you get vipers. > > Well, that test didn't use Sinister (which was the best condi damage set before Viper) or Carrion... Wouldn't call it much of a final answer. Did you even read the original question in this thread? It is in big bold letters **buy off the trading post**. No sinister. He also said he can't craft. You obviously didn't read the reddit thread either (or ctrl+F carrion), because the OP there (not me) has carrion in some follow-ups. It really depends on whether the profession benefits from power scaling or on-crit condi effects. He suggests only firebrand go for carrion because of the power scaling on guard skills and lack of crit-dependent condition traits. It can sometimes be a wash with rabid depending on the specific profession, build, and weapon choices, but that level of detail is too complex for a general, cross-profession answer. Personal opinion, it is super dumb to craft sinister exotic if ascended viper's is your goal. Too much gold spent on gear that you will throw away. > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > > @"Elva.6372" said: > > > > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > > > The answer is usually rabid. Numbers here: > > > > > > > > > > > > Pieces of exotic, named rabid armor are usually about~~ 50 silver.~~ Edit: holy cow, they're down to the 30 silver range. Toss in undead or krait runes and you have a super-cheap gear option that will serve you well until you get vipers. > > > > > > I recently went full Rabid on my Condi Scourge after struggling a bit to maximize some desired attributes...I am very pleased with the results...having more than 2k Condi Damage, high armor and the incidental 50% crit chance. > > > > > > It's counter intuitive for me as I never associated "precision" with condition builds, but somehow this armor set maximizes my damage without making me a glass cannon. > > > > Necro gets extra bonus from https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Target_the_Weak trait that converts precision into condition dmg. > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > Sinister also works. In fact, several parts of sinister armor/trinkets used to be part of meta builds > > > > Sinister does work and can be used for min/maxing with vipers, but sinister does not fill the "ridiculously cheap stand in while I work up to Viper's ascended" role like rabid does. 4.8 gold for heavy sinister chest vs. 31 silver for rabid (galrath). > > Well, there is truth in what you say, ofc, but the topic is "Best viper alternative?" No, the topic is best viper alternative to buy off TP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InsaneQR.7412 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 > @"Ensign.2189" said: > Scourge and Mirage benefit more from Rabid; Firebrand and Daredevil from Carrion. Renegade and Soulbeast I do not know in enough detail to judge between the two. Soulbeast benefits from carrion, they have a trait that converts vitality into expertise. Additionally you can bump up condi duration with the infamous nightmare-trapper rune combo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReaverKane.7598 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > > The answer is usually rabid. Numbers here: > > > > > > > > > Pieces of exotic, named rabid armor are usually about~~ 50 silver.~~ Edit: holy cow, they're down to the 30 silver range. Toss in undead or krait runes and you have a super-cheap gear option that will serve you well until you get vipers. > > > > Well, that test didn't use Sinister (which was the best condi damage set before Viper) or Carrion... Wouldn't call it much of a final answer. > > Did you even read the original question in this thread? It is in big bold letters **buy off the trading post**. No sinister. He also said he can't craft. > > You obviously didn't read the reddit thread either (or ctrl+F carrion), because the OP there (not me) has carrion in some follow-ups. It really depends on whether the profession benefits from power scaling or on-crit condi effects. He suggests only firebrand go for carrion because of the power scaling on guard skills and lack of crit-dependent condition traits. It can sometimes be a wash with rabid depending on the specific profession, build, and weapon choices, but that level of detail is too complex for a general, cross-profession answer. > > Personal opinion, it is super dumb to craft sinister exotic if ascended viper's is your goal. Too much gold spent on gear that you will throw away. > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > > > @"Elva.6372" said: > > > > > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > > > > The answer is usually rabid. Numbers here: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pieces of exotic, named rabid armor are usually about~~ 50 silver.~~ Edit: holy cow, they're down to the 30 silver range. Toss in undead or krait runes and you have a super-cheap gear option that will serve you well until you get vipers. > > > > > > > > I recently went full Rabid on my Condi Scourge after struggling a bit to maximize some desired attributes...I am very pleased with the results...having more than 2k Condi Damage, high armor and the incidental 50% crit chance. > > > > > > > > It's counter intuitive for me as I never associated "precision" with condition builds, but somehow this armor set maximizes my damage without making me a glass cannon. > > > > > > Necro gets extra bonus from https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Target_the_Weak trait that converts precision into condition dmg. > > > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > Sinister also works. In fact, several parts of sinister armor/trinkets used to be part of meta builds > > > > > > Sinister does work and can be used for min/maxing with vipers, but sinister does not fill the "ridiculously cheap stand in while I work up to Viper's ascended" role like rabid does. 4.8 gold for heavy sinister chest vs. 31 silver for rabid (galrath). > > > > Well, there is truth in what you say, ofc, but the topic is "Best viper alternative?" > > No, the topic is best viper alternative to buy off TP. 1) Well, the topic is best alternative. Op wants an alternative that he can buy, but that's not what it says in the title, and might not be what other people looking at this thread might want to find out. Other people seeking advice, but in different circumstances will look at this topic, and then find misleading information. Best alternative is certainly Sinister. 2) If i have to Ctrl+F for information on a Reddit thread because OP couldn't bother to add it to the OP, that's not really my problem. Of course i'm not going to bother Ctrl+F Carrion, because, first i don't need the answer, i know what the best alternatives are, and second, if it's not on the main post i'm assuming it doesn't exist, because it's reddit. 3) Sinister is the best alternative for people with only core game, or those with only PoF (although those can buy the recipes in WvW, as i'm not sure they can be bought int he Desert Area). Also if a person is low on gold and is willing to farm, Charged Ambrite is much faster to farm than Black Diamonds. And while Rabid might be dirt cheap, Sinister's is far superior, and if you're farming the materials, and given that you'll be only doing one piece a day at most, you'll take a week or two depending on what materials you already have. And if you're not the kind of person that sells everything right away, you'll probably have some spare Ambrite and Quartz if you played in DT at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucianDK.8615 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 I think the far worser thing is to aquire a full set of malign infusions. That is far more terrible than Ascended gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thehipone.6812 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > > > The answer is usually rabid. Numbers here: > > > > > > > > > > > > Pieces of exotic, named rabid armor are usually about~~ 50 silver.~~ Edit: holy cow, they're down to the 30 silver range. Toss in undead or krait runes and you have a super-cheap gear option that will serve you well until you get vipers. > > > > > > Well, that test didn't use Sinister (which was the best condi damage set before Viper) or Carrion... Wouldn't call it much of a final answer. > > > > Did you even read the original question in this thread? It is in big bold letters **buy off the trading post**. No sinister. He also said he can't craft. > > > > You obviously didn't read the reddit thread either (or ctrl+F carrion), because the OP there (not me) has carrion in some follow-ups. It really depends on whether the profession benefits from power scaling or on-crit condi effects. He suggests only firebrand go for carrion because of the power scaling on guard skills and lack of crit-dependent condition traits. It can sometimes be a wash with rabid depending on the specific profession, build, and weapon choices, but that level of detail is too complex for a general, cross-profession answer. > > > > Personal opinion, it is super dumb to craft sinister exotic if ascended viper's is your goal. Too much gold spent on gear that you will throw away. > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > > > > @"Elva.6372" said: > > > > > > @"thehipone.6812" said: > > > > > > The answer is usually rabid. Numbers here: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pieces of exotic, named rabid armor are usually about~~ 50 silver.~~ Edit: holy cow, they're down to the 30 silver range. Toss in undead or krait runes and you have a super-cheap gear option that will serve you well until you get vipers. > > > > > > > > > > I recently went full Rabid on my Condi Scourge after struggling a bit to maximize some desired attributes...I am very pleased with the results...having more than 2k Condi Damage, high armor and the incidental 50% crit chance. > > > > > > > > > > It's counter intuitive for me as I never associated "precision" with condition builds, but somehow this armor set maximizes my damage without making me a glass cannon. > > > > > > > > Necro gets extra bonus from https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Target_the_Weak trait that converts precision into condition dmg. > > > > > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > Sinister also works. In fact, several parts of sinister armor/trinkets used to be part of meta builds > > > > > > > > Sinister does work and can be used for min/maxing with vipers, but sinister does not fill the "ridiculously cheap stand in while I work up to Viper's ascended" role like rabid does. 4.8 gold for heavy sinister chest vs. 31 silver for rabid (galrath). > > > > > > Well, there is truth in what you say, ofc, but the topic is "Best viper alternative?" > > > > No, the topic is best viper alternative to buy off TP. > > 1) Well, the topic is best alternative. Op wants an alternative that he can buy, but that's not what it says in the title, and might not be what other people looking at this thread might want to find out. > Other people seeking advice, but in different circumstances will look at this topic, and then find misleading information. > Best alternative is certainly Sinister. > > 2) If i have to Ctrl+F for information on a Reddit thread because OP couldn't bother to add it to the OP, that's not really my problem. Of course i'm not going to bother Ctrl+F Carrion, because, first i don't need the answer, i know what the best alternatives are, and second, if it's not on the main post i'm assuming it doesn't exist, because it's reddit. > > 3) Sinister is the best alternative for people with only core game, or those with only PoF (although those can buy the recipes in WvW, as i'm not sure they can be bought int he Desert Area). > Also if a person is low on gold and is willing to farm, Charged Ambrite is much faster to farm than Black Diamonds. And while Rabid might be dirt cheap, Sinister's is far superior, and if you're farming the materials, and given that you'll be only doing one piece a day at most, you'll take a week or two depending on what materials you already have. And if you're not the kind of person that sells everything right away, you'll probably have some spare Ambrite and Quartz if you played in DT at all. Answering a question different to the one that was actually asked is far more misleading, thread derailing, and confusing. Please read next time, it makes for better forums. The complete question does not always fit in a title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blambidy.3216 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 I would hope you go for vipers later on to get. Since vipers are not hard to craft if you just farm auric basins meta. Before I got vipers I used the stat base. Power, precision, condition damage. I don’t know the name.... vipers are power, precision, expertise, condition damage. So In the mean time, that will get you till you craft vipers. If you don’t have crafting to 400 to get vipers. It’s cheap compared to getting to 500. Soulbeast would be huntsman, weaponsmith, leatherwork. Which is about 70 gold to get those 3 to 400. Daredevil condi would be weaponsmith, leatherworker which would be 50 gold to 400. Since daredevil only uses dagger, dagger. Scourge would be 70 gold for huntsman, artificiating, and tailoring. Work towards that, and farm auric basin. The others I don’t know too much on for builds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReaverKane.7598 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 > @"blambidy.3216" said: > I would hope you go for vipers later on to get. Since vipers are not hard to craft if you just farm auric basins meta. > > Before I got vipers I used the stat base. Power, precision, condition damage. I don’t know the name.... > > vipers are power, precision, expertise, condition damage. > > So In the mean time, that will get you till you craft vipers. > > If you don’t have crafting to 400 to get vipers. It’s cheap compared to getting to 500. > > Soulbeast would be huntsman, weaponsmith, leatherwork. Which is about 70 gold to get those 3 to 400. > > Daredevil condi would be weaponsmith, leatherworker which would be 50 gold to 400. Since daredevil only uses dagger, dagger. > > Scourge would be 70 gold for huntsman, artificiating, and tailoring. > > Work towards that, and farm auric basin. The others I don’t know too much on for builds. The name is Sinister... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucianDK.8615 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 Dont make the mistake of crafting Vipers, much less obnoxious to convert a baseline ascended to viper with an exotic viper insignia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opopanax.1803 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > @"blambidy.3216" said: > > I would hope you go for vipers later on to get. Since vipers are not hard to craft if you just farm auric basins meta. > > > > Before I got vipers I used the stat base. Power, precision, condition damage. I don’t know the name.... > > > > vipers are power, precision, expertise, condition damage. > > > > So In the mean time, that will get you till you craft vipers. > > > > If you don’t have crafting to 400 to get vipers. It’s cheap compared to getting to 500. > > > > Soulbeast would be huntsman, weaponsmith, leatherwork. Which is about 70 gold to get those 3 to 400. > > > > Daredevil condi would be weaponsmith, leatherworker which would be 50 gold to 400. Since daredevil only uses dagger, dagger. > > > > Scourge would be 70 gold for huntsman, artificiating, and tailoring. > > > > Work towards that, and farm auric basin. The others I don’t know too much on for builds. > The name is Sinister... Rampagers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReaverKane.7598 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 > @"Opopanax.1803" said: > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > @"blambidy.3216" said: > > > I would hope you go for vipers later on to get. Since vipers are not hard to craft if you just farm auric basins meta. > > > > > > Before I got vipers I used the stat base. Power, precision, condition damage. I don’t know the name.... > > > > > > vipers are power, precision, expertise, condition damage. > > > > > > So In the mean time, that will get you till you craft vipers. > > > > > > If you don’t have crafting to 400 to get vipers. It’s cheap compared to getting to 500. > > > > > > Soulbeast would be huntsman, weaponsmith, leatherwork. Which is about 70 gold to get those 3 to 400. > > > > > > Daredevil condi would be weaponsmith, leatherworker which would be 50 gold to 400. Since daredevil only uses dagger, dagger. > > > > > > Scourge would be 70 gold for huntsman, artificiating, and tailoring. > > > > > > Work towards that, and farm auric basin. The others I don’t know too much on for builds. > > The name is Sinister... > > Rampagers Rampager's is Precision main, not condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opopanax.1803 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 True, but the same stat combo. I think it's a better viper substitute because it will give you a better idea of power and condi working together since they are balanced. It represents the balance of vipers. In some cases, depending on class and build the high precision is even better as a primary. Rampages is also purchased on the trading post for super cheap, which the OP was also asking about. (Norgu, Aidin, Koss armors) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anchoku.8142 Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 Rabid has toughness so do not use it in group play unless you are the designated tank. Use carrion, rampager, sinister, or exotic viper if you are not the tank controlling mob position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etterwyn.5263 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > @"Opopanax.1803" said: > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > @"blambidy.3216" said: > > > > I would hope you go for vipers later on to get. Since vipers are not hard to craft if you just farm auric basins meta. > > > > > > > > Before I got vipers I used the stat base. Power, precision, condition damage. I don’t know the name.... > > > > > > > > vipers are power, precision, expertise, condition damage. > > > > > > > > So In the mean time, that will get you till you craft vipers. > > > > > > > > If you don’t have crafting to 400 to get vipers. It’s cheap compared to getting to 500. > > > > > > > > Soulbeast would be huntsman, weaponsmith, leatherwork. Which is about 70 gold to get those 3 to 400. > > > > > > > > Daredevil condi would be weaponsmith, leatherworker which would be 50 gold to 400. Since daredevil only uses dagger, dagger. > > > > > > > > Scourge would be 70 gold for huntsman, artificiating, and tailoring. > > > > > > > > Work towards that, and farm auric basin. The others I don’t know too much on for builds. > > > The name is Sinister... > > > > Rampagers > > Rampager's is Precision main, not condition. True, but Sinister is not base (tied to LS2) and can't be purchased, only crafted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashantara.8731 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"Ouija.1684" said: > > @"Ensign.2189" said: > > Which class? Carrion and Rabid are going to be very close in performance. > > Scourge > Mirage > Soulbeast > Firebrand > Renegade > **Daredevil** Daredevil is HoT, so you should have access to Viper's gear. Besides, Daredevil is best played in full Berserker's gear, not Viper's. P.S. This build shows you a non-Viper's alternative (see "Sinister variant") that should work for any profession (replace the two Viper's items with Grieving or Sinister, depending on how much Condition Damage is required): https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Firebrand_-_Condition_DPS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReaverKane.7598 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"Etterwyn.5263" said: > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > @"Opopanax.1803" said: > > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > @"blambidy.3216" said: > > > > > I would hope you go for vipers later on to get. Since vipers are not hard to craft if you just farm auric basins meta. > > > > > > > > > > Before I got vipers I used the stat base. Power, precision, condition damage. I don’t know the name.... > > > > > > > > > > vipers are power, precision, expertise, condition damage. > > > > > > > > > > So In the mean time, that will get you till you craft vipers. > > > > > > > > > > If you don’t have crafting to 400 to get vipers. It’s cheap compared to getting to 500. > > > > > > > > > > Soulbeast would be huntsman, weaponsmith, leatherwork. Which is about 70 gold to get those 3 to 400. > > > > > > > > > > Daredevil condi would be weaponsmith, leatherworker which would be 50 gold to 400. Since daredevil only uses dagger, dagger. > > > > > > > > > > Scourge would be 70 gold for huntsman, artificiating, and tailoring. > > > > > > > > > > Work towards that, and farm auric basin. The others I don’t know too much on for builds. > > > > The name is Sinister... > > > > > > Rampagers > > > > Rampager's is Precision main, not condition. > > True, but Sinister is not base (tied to LS2) and can't be purchased, only crafted. Well, i guess it's a matter of definitions, for me "base stat" for Viper is Sinister, since Viper is basically Sinister with Expertise added to it. Also LWS2 is tied to the core game, not an expansion. It's maps are not exclusive to unlocking LWS2, Free to Play people can get the stat, meaning it's part of the Core/Base game. So let's agree to disagree... Your definition of "Base" is more particular than mine, i guess. But, back on topic, Rampager's is not the best pick for condi builds in general (i can only think of a core engineer build that benefits from crit damage to do more condis, might be more, but still mostly niche). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opopanax.1803 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 Right, you keep talking about pure condi dmg builds, and for that, Rabid would be best that you can buy off the TP. For Hybrid dmg, rampagers is the closest thing you can buy off the tp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opopanax.1803 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > Well, i guess it's a matter of definitions, for me "base stat" for Viper is Sinister, since Viper is basically Sinister with Expertise added to it. Rampages only needs expertise added to it as well. > But, back on topic, Rampager's is not the best pick for condi builds in general (i can only think of a core engineer build that benefits from crit damage to do more condis, might be more, but still mostly niche). Disagree with this. Warrior, Engi, Ranger, Necro all benefit from crit proccing condos on their condition builds. I don't play ele, thief, or some of the others to know if they do or not. Guardians don't need precision for their burn builds, but that's the only one I know for sure, maybe mesmer too. In fact, Rabid is stronger if you are going pure condi damage because of the survivability it gives you, as well as some traits, food that convert toughness to condition stats. There was a good Reddit post on this, though somewhat incomplete. Very good read though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etterwyn.5263 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > @"Etterwyn.5263" said: > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > @"Opopanax.1803" said: > > > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > > @"blambidy.3216" said: > > > > > > I would hope you go for vipers later on to get. Since vipers are not hard to craft if you just farm auric basins meta. > > > > > > > > > > > > Before I got vipers I used the stat base. Power, precision, condition damage. I don’t know the name.... > > > > > > > > > > > > vipers are power, precision, expertise, condition damage. > > > > > > > > > > > > So In the mean time, that will get you till you craft vipers. > > > > > > > > > > > > If you don’t have crafting to 400 to get vipers. It’s cheap compared to getting to 500. > > > > > > > > > > > > Soulbeast would be huntsman, weaponsmith, leatherwork. Which is about 70 gold to get those 3 to 400. > > > > > > > > > > > > Daredevil condi would be weaponsmith, leatherworker which would be 50 gold to 400. Since daredevil only uses dagger, dagger. > > > > > > > > > > > > Scourge would be 70 gold for huntsman, artificiating, and tailoring. > > > > > > > > > > > > Work towards that, and farm auric basin. The others I don’t know too much on for builds. > > > > > The name is Sinister... > > > > > > > > Rampagers > > > > > > Rampager's is Precision main, not condition. > > > > True, but Sinister is not base (tied to LS2) and can't be purchased, only crafted. > > Well, i guess it's a matter of definitions, for me "base stat" for Viper is Sinister, since Viper is basically Sinister with Expertise added to it. > Also LWS2 is tied to the core game, not an expansion. It's maps are not exclusive to unlocking LWS2, Free to Play people can get the stat, meaning it's part of the Core/Base game. > So let's agree to disagree... Your definition of "Base" is more particular than mine, i guess. > > But, back on topic, Rampager's is not the best pick for condi builds in general (i can only think of a core engineer build that benefits from crit damage to do more condis, might be more, but still mostly niche). I was actually thinking about the ascended trinkets you get from LS2 as story rewards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReaverKane.7598 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 > @"Opopanax.1803" said: > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > Well, i guess it's a matter of definitions, for me "base stat" for Viper is Sinister, since Viper is basically Sinister with Expertise added to it. > Rampages only needs expertise added to it as well. > Not quite in the same way... Let's take a exotic Helm piece as an example: Rampager's has: +60 Precision +43 Power +43 Condition Damage Sinister's has: +60 Condition Damage +43 Power +43 Precision Viper's has: +51 Power +51 Condition Damage +28 Precision +28 Expertise If you transposed Rampager's to the same deal, you'd get: +51 PRECISION +51 Power **or** Condition Damage +28 Power **or** CD +28 Expertise Rampager's is a precision main stat, for it to be expanded, precision needs to be kept as main stat. (So something like Seraphs, but with power instead of healing) > > > But, back on topic, Rampager's is not the best pick for condi builds in general (i can only think of a core engineer build that benefits from crit damage to do more condis, might be more, but still mostly niche). > Disagree with this. Warrior, Engi, Ranger, Necro all benefit from crit proccing condos on their condition builds. I don't play ele, thief, or some of the others to know if they do or not. Guardians don't need precision for their burn builds, but that's the only one I know for sure, maybe mesmer too. Well, sure, to a point, Engineer has a trait that grants extra Condition damage to himself and allies, so he can make up for lower condi damage, basically the whole Firearms trait line can synergise pretty well, in just about any combination for a good crit based condi build. Also Incendiary powder has a 100% chance to inflict burning on crit. For Warrior, you could try the same, but Bloodlust has only a 33% chance on crit, and for the most part the trait line doesn't synergise towards more condi damage, but just crit damage (so works better with power builds), in fact outside berserker you'll be hard-pressed to get an effective condi warrior build. Ranger is just about the same thing... Sharpened Edges is only a 33% chance to inflict bleeding on crit, and while that trait like is a bit better towards condi damage, it doesn't make up for lower condi numbers. Necro, same deal... Basically while on engineer you get 100% crit chance easily, and you get added condi damage from traits, which allows for Incendiary powder to have 100% effectiveness (1 burn every 10s, because icd), all other builds would sacrifice pure condi damage for a 33% chance (even with 100% crit rate) to proc a condition. Which means, that's not a very good build. And you'd do better to use Sinister's, Carrion or Rabid for pure condi power and use the conditions afforded by weapon skills, instead of focusing on the 33% chance to get a crit to proc a stack of a condition. Even for today's standards the Engineer build isn't that great, but for a while it was a good option for a condi build on engineer. > > In fact, Rabid is stronger if you are going pure condi damage because of the survivability it gives you, as well as some traits, food that convert toughness to condition stats. There was a good Reddit post on this, though somewhat incomplete. Very good read though. > > You start talking about Rampagers and end with Rabid.... Coherent, yes. 1) There's only two Utility items that convert toughness to condition (Compact Quality Tuning Crystal and Corsair Tuning Crystal), the first one only converts 2% tough and 2% vit to condition damage, and it's only available through WvW's provisioner. The second is tied to Living world season 4, basically you can't get it without going to Istan. We're talking about people wanting alternative's to viper, so i don't think that people that can't build vipers gear will be that ready to go brave Istan. 2) On the other hand there's a a bunch of core items that convert either precision or Power to condition damage. 3) Survivability is a fallacious argument.... Open world shouldn't be threatening enough that you need it, and group content, especially nowadays, relies heavily on specialized builds, so if your role is condi damage people expect you to do condition damage, and that you rely on the supports for survivability. 4) Only Elementalist and Mesmer have traits that convert condition damage from toughness. Also you'll be lowering your overal damage output because you have lower power, compared to Sinister, Carrion or Viper's using Rabid. 5) I actually went ahead and skimmed that thread. For starters the initial results seem a bit skewed, not sure how reliable they are. And then he never did test Carrion, Sinisters or the majority of other Condition stats, and instead dismisses them entirely because of his own personal opinion. Also there's a issue with how reliable those tests are. For starters he doesn't explain what stats he's leaving on the weapons and accessories, and if you know anything about the game, weapons and trinkets have a way higher impact on your overal stats than armor. So depending on what he has there that can skew the results **a lot**. Mirage, the only class he tested with a trait that benefits condition damage from toughness, is the only class that actually is supposed to be bad with Rabid... That tells you how reliable those tests are. > @"Etterwyn.5263" said: > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > @"Etterwyn.5263" said: > > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > @"Opopanax.1803" said: > > > > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > > > @"blambidy.3216" said: > > > > > > > I would hope you go for vipers later on to get. Since vipers are not hard to craft if you just farm auric basins meta. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Before I got vipers I used the stat base. Power, precision, condition damage. I don’t know the name.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vipers are power, precision, expertise, condition damage. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So In the mean time, that will get you till you craft vipers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you don’t have crafting to 400 to get vipers. It’s cheap compared to getting to 500. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Soulbeast would be huntsman, weaponsmith, leatherwork. Which is about 70 gold to get those 3 to 400. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Daredevil condi would be weaponsmith, leatherworker which would be 50 gold to 400. Since daredevil only uses dagger, dagger. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Scourge would be 70 gold for huntsman, artificiating, and tailoring. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Work towards that, and farm auric basin. The others I don’t know too much on for builds. > > > > > > The name is Sinister... > > > > > > > > > > Rampagers > > > > > > > > Rampager's is Precision main, not condition. > > > > > > True, but Sinister is not base (tied to LS2) and can't be purchased, only crafted. > > > > Well, i guess it's a matter of definitions, for me "base stat" for Viper is Sinister, since Viper is basically Sinister with Expertise added to it. > > Also LWS2 is tied to the core game, not an expansion. It's maps are not exclusive to unlocking LWS2, Free to Play people can get the stat, meaning it's part of the Core/Base game. > > So let's agree to disagree... Your definition of "Base" is more particular than mine, i guess. > > > > But, back on topic, Rampager's is not the best pick for condi builds in general (i can only think of a core engineer build that benefits from crit damage to do more condis, might be more, but still mostly niche). > > I was actually thinking about the ascended trinkets you get from LS2 as story rewards. Sure, yeah those are tied to the story (which you can unlock btw) but you can get different Sinisters Trinkets in Fractals, and you can get the rest of the gear playing the maps. But yeah those trinkets in question are tied to LWS2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opopanax.1803 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 As you keep missing, the only gear that has all viper stats and is purchasable from the tp is Rampagers. Asa secondary choice there is rabid for pure Condi builds. You are just off point in continuing to bring up sinister when the op asked about buying stuff from the tp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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