Mantras feel bad to use in PvE

[Refia Montes.3205]

The changes months ago was well appreciated in opening up its use in PvE. It is usable but currently, it feels really bad to use whenever you expend all charges accidentally. Firebrand doesn't really have this problem since FB has three charges of it at a time. I propose the change of making it so it you still regain charges even though your Mantra is currently uncharged. Whether this would be baseline or as a trait, it would be well appreciated to have in PvE, as using up the second charge currently today makes it almost useless for the rest of the fight.

[OriOri.8724]

Still regain charges even though your mantra is currently uncharged? I'm so confused, you do realize that the ammo charges do slowly recharge as long as you only use 1 at a time, right?

[Refia Montes.3205]

> @"OriOri.8724" said:

> Still regain charges even though your mantra is currently uncharged? I'm so confused, you do realize that the ammo charges do slowly recharge as long as you only use 1 at a time, right?

 

yes. They regain charges while you have one charge, but if you expend everything you have to charge the mantra again to gain charges. That's the only way you can use Power Spike again for example. My proposed change is to make it so that it you can still regain charges even though you don't recharge the mantra like for example having Mantra of Pain for example in your bar, after 10 seconds it would return to Power Spike after 10 seconds passively ( but with one charge only)

[Pyroatheist.9031]

> @"Refia Montes.3205" said:

> > @"OriOri.8724" said:

> > Still regain charges even though your mantra is currently uncharged? I'm so confused, you do realize that the ammo charges do slowly recharge as long as you only use 1 at a time, right?

>

> yes. They regain charges while you have one charge, but if you expend everything you have to charge the mantra again to gain charges. That's the only way you can use Power Spike again for example. My proposed change is to make it so that it you can still regain charges even though you don't recharge the mantra like for example having Mantra of Pain for example in your bar, after 10 seconds it would return to Power Spike after 10 seconds passively ( but with one charge only)

 

It's...not really that hard to just not fat-finger your keys and spend both charges. It's also not like any fight is just continual and unending action; pretty much every fight in the game will have a second or so for you to charge it back up.

[Refia Montes.3205]

> @"Pyroatheist.9031" said:

> > @"Refia Montes.3205" said:

> > > @"OriOri.8724" said:

> > > Still regain charges even though your mantra is currently uncharged? I'm so confused, you do realize that the ammo charges do slowly recharge as long as you only use 1 at a time, right?

> >

> > yes. They regain charges while you have one charge, but if you expend everything you have to charge the mantra again to gain charges. That's the only way you can use Power Spike again for example. My proposed change is to make it so that it you can still regain charges even though you don't recharge the mantra like for example having Mantra of Pain for example in your bar, after 10 seconds it would return to Power Spike after 10 seconds passively ( but with one charge only)

>

> It's...not really that hard to just not fat-finger your keys and spend both charges. It's also not like any fight is just continual and unending action; pretty much every fight in the game will have a second or so for you to charge it back up.

 

true, it's mostly an l2p issue at its end. But... they just feel bad and wouldn't mind a QoL change for them.

[OriOri.8724]

> @"Refia Montes.3205" said:

> > @"Pyroatheist.9031" said:

> > > @"Refia Montes.3205" said:

> > > > @"OriOri.8724" said:

> > > > Still regain charges even though your mantra is currently uncharged? I'm so confused, you do realize that the ammo charges do slowly recharge as long as you only use 1 at a time, right?

> > >

> > > yes. They regain charges while you have one charge, but if you expend everything you have to charge the mantra again to gain charges. That's the only way you can use Power Spike again for example. My proposed change is to make it so that it you can still regain charges even though you don't recharge the mantra like for example having Mantra of Pain for example in your bar, after 10 seconds it would return to Power Spike after 10 seconds passively ( but with one charge only)

> >

> > It's...not really that hard to just not fat-finger your keys and spend both charges. It's also not like any fight is just continual and unending action; pretty much every fight in the game will have a second or so for you to charge it back up.

>

> true, it's mostly an l2p issue at its end. But... they just feel bad and wouldn't mind a QoL change for them.

 

I just want a third charge on some of them. Doesn't even have to be a more powerful charge like FB, but a third charge would be nice on stuff like MoP or the healing mantra.

[Zenith.7301]

Mantras feel bad to use in PvE because they are undertuned, not because you fat finger them.

 

Mantra of pain is pathetic, it doesn't even do more damage than an autoattack, and it's clear the reason for that is the wretched PvP balancing always strangling this game's PvE.

 

Mantra of Distraction does such pitiful breakbar damage. Mesmer has horrendous breakbar damage outside moa signet/well or chrono.

 

Diversion and dazes from mesmer in particular should get a PvE only change where their breakbar damage contribution is significantly improved. It's disgraceful that the class all about interrupts is one of the worst at it unless you blow a 3 minute cooldown elite.

[Refia Montes.3205]

> @"Zenith.7301" said:

> Mantras feel bad to use in PvE because they are undertuned, not because you fat finger them.

>

> Mantra of pain is pathetic, it doesn't even do more damage than an autoattack, and it's clear the reason for that is the wretched PvP balancing always strangling this game's PvE.

>

> Mantra of Distraction does such pitiful breakbar damage. Mesmer has horrendous breakbar damage outside moa signet/well or chrono.

>

> Diversion and dazes from mesmer in particular should get a PvE only change where their breakbar damage contribution is significantly improved. It's disgraceful that the class all about interrupts is one of the worst at it unless you blow a 3 minute cooldown elite.

 

Mantra of Pain actually deals more overall dps than WoC on the Phantasm Chrono build and as for the others, yep they're pretty bad in that regard.

[Pyroatheist.9031]

> @"Refia Montes.3205" said:

> > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > Mantras feel bad to use in PvE because they are undertuned, not because you fat finger them.

> >

> > Mantra of pain is pathetic, it doesn't even do more damage than an autoattack, and it's clear the reason for that is the wretched PvP balancing always strangling this game's PvE.

> >

> > Mantra of Distraction does such pitiful breakbar damage. Mesmer has horrendous breakbar damage outside moa signet/well or chrono.

> >

> > Diversion and dazes from mesmer in particular should get a PvE only change where their breakbar damage contribution is significantly improved. It's disgraceful that the class all about interrupts is one of the worst at it unless you blow a 3 minute cooldown elite.

>

> Mantra of Pain actually deals more overall dps than WoC on the Phantasm Chrono build and as for the others, yep they're pretty bad in that regard.

 

That's more a reflection on WoC being an utter waste of database memory and less a reflection on MoP being good.

[Refia Montes.3205]

> @"Pyroatheist.9031" said:

> > @"Refia Montes.3205" said:

> > > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > > Mantras feel bad to use in PvE because they are undertuned, not because you fat finger them.

> > >

> > > Mantra of pain is pathetic, it doesn't even do more damage than an autoattack, and it's clear the reason for that is the wretched PvP balancing always strangling this game's PvE.

> > >

> > > Mantra of Distraction does such pitiful breakbar damage. Mesmer has horrendous breakbar damage outside moa signet/well or chrono.

> > >

> > > Diversion and dazes from mesmer in particular should get a PvE only change where their breakbar damage contribution is significantly improved. It's disgraceful that the class all about interrupts is one of the worst at it unless you blow a 3 minute cooldown elite.

> >

> > Mantra of Pain actually deals more overall dps than WoC on the Phantasm Chrono build and as for the others, yep they're pretty bad in that regard.

>

> That's more a reflection on WoC being an utter waste of database memory and less a reflection on MoP being good.

 

Actually comparatively, out of all the instant cast skills Power Spike is actually the strongest of the bunch (or even with Primordial Stance).

[RabbitUp.8294]

Please, no third charge, it would be a nerf to my mantra healer build.

 

The QoL change I would like to see is new icons. I can never tell the mantras apart when they are not charged. I have memorised their order in the skill table, but if you showed me their icons out of context, I could only identify the heal, because it's blue, and the daze, because it wears a mask.

 

> @"Pyroatheist.9031" said:

> > @"Refia Montes.3205" said:

> > > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > > Mantras feel bad to use in PvE because they are undertuned, not because you fat finger them.

> > >

> > > Mantra of pain is pathetic, it doesn't even do more damage than an autoattack, and it's clear the reason for that is the wretched PvP balancing always strangling this game's PvE.

> > >

> > > Mantra of Distraction does such pitiful breakbar damage. Mesmer has horrendous breakbar damage outside moa signet/well or chrono.

> > >

> > > Diversion and dazes from mesmer in particular should get a PvE only change where their breakbar damage contribution is significantly improved. It's disgraceful that the class all about interrupts is one of the worst at it unless you blow a 3 minute cooldown elite.

> >

> > Mantra of Pain actually deals more overall dps than WoC on the Phantasm Chrono build and as for the others, yep they're pretty bad in that regard.

>

> That's more a reflection on WoC being an utter waste of database memory and less a reflection on MoP being good.

 

It's not just WoC, though, it's not like mesmer has any other damaging utilities apart from the 2 phantasms the build already uses.

[climhazzard.5897]

For me Mantras feel terrible to use period. It's to much for me to keep track of whether or not I've charged them.

[Pyroatheist.9031]

> @"RabbitUp.8294" said:

> Please, no third charge, it would be a nerf to my mantra healer build.

>

> The QoL change I would like to see is new icons. I can never tell the mantras apart when they are not charged. I have memorised their order in the skill table, but if you showed me their icons out of context, I could only identify the heal, because it's blue, and the daze, because it wears a mask.

>

> > @"Pyroatheist.9031" said:

> > > @"Refia Montes.3205" said:

> > > > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > > > Mantras feel bad to use in PvE because they are undertuned, not because you fat finger them.

> > > >

> > > > Mantra of pain is pathetic, it doesn't even do more damage than an autoattack, and it's clear the reason for that is the wretched PvP balancing always strangling this game's PvE.

> > > >

> > > > Mantra of Distraction does such pitiful breakbar damage. Mesmer has horrendous breakbar damage outside moa signet/well or chrono.

> > > >

> > > > Diversion and dazes from mesmer in particular should get a PvE only change where their breakbar damage contribution is significantly improved. It's disgraceful that the class all about interrupts is one of the worst at it unless you blow a 3 minute cooldown elite.

> > >

> > > Mantra of Pain actually deals more overall dps than WoC on the Phantasm Chrono build and as for the others, yep they're pretty bad in that regard.

> >

> > That's more a reflection on WoC being an utter waste of database memory and less a reflection on MoP being good.

>

> It's not just WoC, though, it's not like mesmer has any other damaging utilities apart from the 2 phantasms the build already uses.

 

Well yes, but most mesmer utilities do a thing particularly effectively. WoC is only effective at being worthless.

[RabbitUp.8294]

> @"Pyroatheist.9031" said:

> > @"RabbitUp.8294" said:

> > Please, no third charge, it would be a nerf to my mantra healer build.

> >

> > The QoL change I would like to see is new icons. I can never tell the mantras apart when they are not charged. I have memorised their order in the skill table, but if you showed me their icons out of context, I could only identify the heal, because it's blue, and the daze, because it wears a mask.

> >

> > > @"Pyroatheist.9031" said:

> > > > @"Refia Montes.3205" said:

> > > > > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > > > > Mantras feel bad to use in PvE because they are undertuned, not because you fat finger them.

> > > > >

> > > > > Mantra of pain is pathetic, it doesn't even do more damage than an autoattack, and it's clear the reason for that is the wretched PvP balancing always strangling this game's PvE.

> > > > >

> > > > > Mantra of Distraction does such pitiful breakbar damage. Mesmer has horrendous breakbar damage outside moa signet/well or chrono.

> > > > >

> > > > > Diversion and dazes from mesmer in particular should get a PvE only change where their breakbar damage contribution is significantly improved. It's disgraceful that the class all about interrupts is one of the worst at it unless you blow a 3 minute cooldown elite.

> > > >

> > > > Mantra of Pain actually deals more overall dps than WoC on the Phantasm Chrono build and as for the others, yep they're pretty bad in that regard.

> > >

> > > That's more a reflection on WoC being an utter waste of database memory and less a reflection on MoP being good.

> >

> > It's not just WoC, though, it's not like mesmer has any other damaging utilities apart from the 2 phantasms the build already uses.

>

> Well yes, but most mesmer utilities do a thing particularly effectively. WoC is only effective at being worthless.

 

Eh, it's not *that* bad. For pve at least, its damage is very close to DH's Procession of Blades, a bit less, but it's on a shorter cooldown, is ranged and has bigger radius. Mantra of Pain is good for its instant cast and burst, but WoC is still better at cleaving and the damage is more front-loaded.

 

I wouldn't mind if some of the final pulse damage was distributed to the first pulses, of course, but it's not as terrible as you make it out to be. At least it's not Light's Judgment, which is legitimately only good for trolling.