Ariurotl.3718 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 to save the Venom trait stuck in the Shadow Arts tree where it synergizes with absolutely nothing and nobody will ever take it. Just think of it shivering in that tree, cold and alone, forgotten for so many years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vincent III.1286 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 > @"Ariurotl.3718" said: > to save the Venom trait stuck in the Shadow Arts tree where it synergizes with absolutely nothing and nobody will ever take it. > > Just think of it shivering in that tree, cold and alone, forgotten for so many years. It wasn't alone and forgotten for many years. It was with Venom Aura for a very long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Eh... Where would you pit it? Deadly arts is general damage. And traps so far. Critical Strikes is for critical hits. Trickery is boons, initiative, and steal adjustment. Acrobatics is mostly thieves evasion and mobility. Shadow arts is sustainability which leeching venoms do. They're nice when you use venoms with some healing power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vincent III.1286 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > Eh... Where would you pit it? Deadly arts is general damage. And traps so far. > > Critical Strikes is for critical hits. > > Trickery is boons, initiative, and steal adjustment. > > Acrobatics is mostly thieves evasion and mobility. > > Shadow arts is sustainability which leeching venoms do. They're nice when you use venoms with some healing power. It could just become baseline. All venom will leech and have reduced CD. There is really no reason to have this trait taking up a trait slot. Removing this can free up a slot for a better trait like, for example, Evasive Shadow: Shadowstep now has evade frame. Evade: 1/4s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > > Eh... Where would you pit it? Deadly arts is general damage. And traps so far. > > > > Critical Strikes is for critical hits. > > > > Trickery is boons, initiative, and steal adjustment. > > > > Acrobatics is mostly thieves evasion and mobility. > > > > Shadow arts is sustainability which leeching venoms do. They're nice when you use venoms with some healing power. > > It could just become baseline. All venom will leech and have reduced CD. There is really no reason to have this trait taking up a trait slot. > > Removing this can free up a slot for a better trait like, for example, Evasive Shadow: Shadowstep now has evade frame. Evade: 1/4s. Then we get to an excessive power creep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vincent III.1286 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > > > Eh... Where would you pit it? Deadly arts is general damage. And traps so far. > > > > > > Critical Strikes is for critical hits. > > > > > > Trickery is boons, initiative, and steal adjustment. > > > > > > Acrobatics is mostly thieves evasion and mobility. > > > > > > Shadow arts is sustainability which leeching venoms do. They're nice when you use venoms with some healing power. > > > > It could just become baseline. All venom will leech and have reduced CD. There is really no reason to have this trait taking up a trait slot. > > > > Removing this can free up a slot for a better trait like, for example, Evasive Shadow: Shadowstep now has evade frame. Evade: 1/4s. > > Then we get to an excessive power creep. Having more options doesn't necessarily mean a power creep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > > > > Eh... Where would you pit it? Deadly arts is general damage. And traps so far. > > > > > > > > Critical Strikes is for critical hits. > > > > > > > > Trickery is boons, initiative, and steal adjustment. > > > > > > > > Acrobatics is mostly thieves evasion and mobility. > > > > > > > > Shadow arts is sustainability which leeching venoms do. They're nice when you use venoms with some healing power. > > > > > > It could just become baseline. All venom will leech and have reduced CD. There is really no reason to have this trait taking up a trait slot. > > > > > > Removing this can free up a slot for a better trait like, for example, Evasive Shadow: Shadowstep now has evade frame. Evade: 1/4s. > > > > Then we get to an excessive power creep. > > Having more options doesn't necessarily mean a power creep. It is when you get a bonus venom that heals you and others for a pretty decent amount for activating a venom on a class that has a trait that can immediately reset a random set of utilities depending on your hot bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vincent III.1286 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > > > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > > > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > > > > > Eh... Where would you pit it? Deadly arts is general damage. And traps so far. > > > > > > > > > > Critical Strikes is for critical hits. > > > > > > > > > > Trickery is boons, initiative, and steal adjustment. > > > > > > > > > > Acrobatics is mostly thieves evasion and mobility. > > > > > > > > > > Shadow arts is sustainability which leeching venoms do. They're nice when you use venoms with some healing power. > > > > > > > > It could just become baseline. All venom will leech and have reduced CD. There is really no reason to have this trait taking up a trait slot. > > > > > > > > Removing this can free up a slot for a better trait like, for example, Evasive Shadow: Shadowstep now has evade frame. Evade: 1/4s. > > > > > > Then we get to an excessive power creep. > > > > Having more options doesn't necessarily mean a power creep. > > It is when you get a bonus venom that heals you and others for a pretty decent amount for activating a venom on a class that has a trait that can immediately reset a random set of utilities depending on your hot bar. No difference than picking the trait now (which I do by the way when I don't need Hidden Thief). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draxynnic.3719 Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > Eh... Where would you pit it? Deadly arts is general damage. And traps so far. > > Critical Strikes is for critical hits. > > Trickery is boons, initiative, and steal adjustment. > > Acrobatics is mostly thieves evasion and mobility. > > Shadow arts is sustainability which leeching venoms do. They're nice when you use venoms with some healing power. I think the big issue is that pretty much the entire rest of the Shadow Arts tree is based off stealth, which doesn't synergise with a venom build at all. In fact, if you want to go full venoms, it's hard to get anything out of the other Shadow Arts traits at all. (Any stealth utility you might take would be a venom you can't take, and Leeching Venoms clashes with Hidden Thief, so your only other options to get stealth and make use of the Shadow Arts stealth traits are taking dagger/pistol, X/dagger, and/or Last Refuge.) I could easily see it being put in Deadly Arts. DA is the poison-oriented traitline, so to me, a trait which buffs utility skills oriented towards applying poison to your weapons (and, incidentally, increasing the damage you deal with those envenomed weapons) seems entirely in flavour. It could potentially trade places with Revealed Training, which would fit with the stealth-oriented nature of Shadow Arts. (Yes, I realise that Revealed Training is about doing more damage when you're _no longer_ stealthed, but the most common reason for a thief to have Revealed is that they've just come out of stealth). The main problem there is that, without further reorganisation of traits, it makes Panic Strike the only Deadly Arts master trait that doesn't rely on taking a specific family of utility skills. I think a weaker argument could be made for Trickery, since Trickery already has some degree of team support and Leeching Venoms would add to that. Hard to say what it might replace there, though. Potentially it could be buffed to grandmaster status and replace Bewildering Ambush, or even remain at master level and replace Pressure Striking: both are fairly rarely taken traits, and the builds that do take them probably wouldn't complain about losing them in exchange for better venoms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kallist.5917 Posted October 5, 2018 Share Posted October 5, 2018 > @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said: > Eh... Where would you pit it? Deadly arts is general damage. And traps so far. > > Critical Strikes is for critical hits. > > Trickery is boons, initiative, and steal adjustment. > > Acrobatics is mostly thieves evasion and mobility. > > Shadow arts is sustainability which leeching venoms do. They're nice when you use venoms with some healing power. Deadly arts is overwhelmingly Condition focused though. There are 8 out of the 12 traits being mainly focused on Condition use. But With that, I would prefer it stay where it is, due to deadly arts already having a few hard choices to pick from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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