What types for runes should I use for a condi shortbow rev?

[crazyhusky.2985]

For PVE/Fractal/Raids what would be good for condi Rev now? I don't think Snowcrows has updated it yet.

 

I just use shortbow, So something with Torment, Bleeds, I guess burning will help.

I have had a look at a few, but i am really not sure what to use now.

 

- [Nightmare](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_the_Nightmare "Nightmare") (nice condi duration and condi damage, but 10% fear thing is kinda pointless)

- [Tormenting](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Tormenting "Tormenting") (increased duration of torment since condi rev deals a lot of it)

- [Krait](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_the_Krait "Krait") (for bleeding and elite thing)

- [bealfire](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_the_Baelfire "Bealfire") (seems like a mixed burning, power and condi duration set but it could work)

- [balthazar](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Balthazar "Balthazar") (straight up burning)

- [Afflicted](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_the_Afflicted "Afflicted") (it can make use of the poison)

- [Renegade](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_the_Renegade "Renegade") or [berserker](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_the_Berserker "Berserker") For some other stats with flat condi 5% or 7% condi damage

 

What can you guys suggest?

[Dace.8173]

You're likely better off with Renegade or Berserker since shortbow has different conditions that it applies.

[Madara.7435]

it feels weird somehow that after a patch when stuff like gear or skills change people INSTANTLY look at sites like snowcrows telling them what to do instead of thinking themselves and trying stuff out. But thats how things go nowadays. All the more I am happy to see that someone is at least trying to have some conversation.

anyway, I agree Renegade runes are most likely the strongest of those you described here since it pushes all condis, but if you want to specifically look to push one condi it should always be burning because it deals by far the most dmg of all condis. and you have alot of burn with shortbow (spiritcrush, scorchrazor, sevenshot as combofinisher for spiritcrush/soulcleave) so for that i would prefer balthazar runes. baelfire can work aswell, depends on your stat choice as it can push condiduration alot.

[Eros.6801]

Has anyone tested out tormenting rune in open world, stories, events (after the fix ofc) ?, i have the idea of using marshal + tormenting but this build aren't cheap at all so im curious how well that setup or any kind of condi gear with tormenting perform ?

 

I know that ppl say anything work in pve, i won't argue with that but i just like off-meta build so before i blow load of golds into this draft build i just want to hear you guys opinion first hand. As for why tormenting is because that healing 171 HP but i don't know if this has an interval cooldown or not.

[theodor.3480]

Tested tormenting on condi mirage and it has no icd. So with a well timed burst you ca go from zero to 100% in a few secs flat. Mostly it depends on how fast you can apply torment on target/targets.

[Awn.1327]

Nightmare offers the highest overall stat budget of the things I want: condi dam & condi duration, so I go with that. All other combinations I tried/considered, I end up with less condi damage if I want to maintain 80% condi duration (which gets me 100% condi duration for bleeds & torment).

[crazyhusky.2985]

> @"Madara.7435" said:

> it feels weird somehow that after a patch when stuff like gear or skills change people INSTANTLY look at sites like snowcrows telling them what to do instead of thinking themselves and trying stuff out. But thats how things go nowadays. All the more I am happy to see that someone is at least trying to have some conversation.

> anyway, I agree Renegade runes are most likely the strongest of those you described here since it pushes all condis, but if you want to specifically look to push one condi it should always be burning because it deals by far the most dmg of all condis. and you have alot of burn with shortbow (spiritcrush, scorchrazor, sevenshot as combofinisher for spiritcrush/soulcleave) so for that i would prefer balthazar runes. baelfire can work aswell, depends on your stat choice as it can push condiduration alot.

 

I don't typically use snowcrows as set thing. I normally use them as a rough guide and then build from them, not use their builds 100%, just as a rough idea of gear what I should be using. Point in case Condi FB, i'd say use Baelfire, Flame Legion or Balthazar Runes instead of Renegade Runes since you'll pretty much just be burning everything.

In the case of Condi Rev where it does various forms of conditions, it's confusing as to what runes you should use, because most runes stick to one thing, But with Condi Shortbow you have 3 different main condi you're using at once, half your bow inflicts bleed, the other half inflicts burning, and both do it while you inflicting torment. So there isn't really a rune for this.

 

Friends and Guildies have suggested a burning rune due to fire is the strong condi. So Baelfire, Flame Legion or Balthazar Runes...

Baelfire gives extra condi duration, and burn duration but no actual condi damage, but it gives you power.

Balthazar gives condi damage but no condi duration except for fire.

This becomes Condi damage VS condi duration. I don't know what one I would pick?

 

These stats are without food.

 

Bealfire

1005 condi damage, 55% condi duration base, 2347 Power.

Burning +30% duration (85%), Poison +50% duration(100%), Torment +20% (75%)

 

balthazar

1189 condi damage, 34% condi duration base, 2172 Power.

Burning +50% duration(84%), Poison +50% duration(84%), Torment +20% duration(54%),

 

Also i looked at Renegade, Zerker runes and Nightmare Runes

Renegade gives you 1268 Condi damage, Zerker gives 1245 Condi damage, both are stonger than balthazar and Bealfire but no condi durations.

 

Nightmare gives you the best of both fire runes 1189 condi damage, 54% condi duration base, 2172 Power.

So everthing has +50% or over condi duration, but if your going for fire then your missing out 30% extra burning duration.

 

What would you guys go for?

[crazyhusky.2985]

> @"Awn.1327" said:

> Nightmare offers the highest overall stat budget of the things I want: condi dam & condi duration, so I go with that. All other combinations I tried/considered, I end up with less condi damage if I want to maintain 80% condi duration (which gets me 100% condi duration for bleeds & torment).

 

Nightmare is one that i think works too.

It gives a nice condi duration and condi damage. (stats without food - 1189 condi damage, 54% condi duration base, 2172 Power.)

that 2nd trait SUCKS though, **Arena-Net SHOULD change it to torment,** or something else then it'll be perfect,

because Fear is only used on by nerco, so other classes can't benefit it from that trait.

 

What build are you using for your rev to get Bleeding that high?

[Dace.8173]

> @"Madara.7435" said:

> it feels weird somehow that after a patch when stuff like gear or skills change people INSTANTLY look at sites like snowcrows telling them what to do instead of thinking themselves and trying stuff out. But thats how things go nowadays. All the more I am happy to see that someone is at least trying to have some conversation.

> anyway, I agree Renegade runes are most likely the strongest of those you described here since it pushes all condis, but if you want to specifically look to push one condi it should always be burning because it deals by far the most dmg of all condis. and you have alot of burn with shortbow (spiritcrush, scorchrazor, sevenshot as combofinisher for spiritcrush/soulcleave) so for that i would prefer balthazar runes. baelfire can work aswell, depends on your stat choice as it can push condiduration alot.

 

Yeah, I get how weird it is to go to snowcrows to pick new runes and sigils.

 

> @"crazyhusky.2985" said:

> > @"Madara.7435" said:

> > it feels weird somehow that after a patch when stuff like gear or skills change people INSTANTLY look at sites like snowcrows telling them what to do instead of thinking themselves and trying stuff out. But thats how things go nowadays. All the more I am happy to see that someone is at least trying to have some conversation.

> > anyway, I agree Renegade runes are most likely the strongest of those you described here since it pushes all condis, but if you want to specifically look to push one condi it should always be burning because it deals by far the most dmg of all condis. and you have alot of burn with shortbow (spiritcrush, scorchrazor, sevenshot as combofinisher for spiritcrush/soulcleave) so for that i would prefer balthazar runes. baelfire can work aswell, depends on your stat choice as it can push condiduration alot.

>

> I don't typically use snowcrows as set thing. I normally use them as a rough guide and then build from them, not use their builds 100%, just as a rough idea of gear what I should be using. Point in case Condi FB, i'd say use Baelfire, Flame Legion or Balthazar Runes instead of Renegade Runes since you'll pretty much just be burning everything.

> In the case of Condi Rev where it does various forms of conditions, it's confusing as to what runes you should use, because most runes stick to one thing, But with Condi Shortbow you have 3 different main condi you're using at once, half your bow inflicts bleed, the other half inflicts burning, and both do it while you inflicting torment. So there isn't really a rune for this.

>

> Friends and Guildies have suggested a burning rune due to fire is the strong condi. So Baelfire, Flame Legion or Balthazar Runes...

> Baelfire gives extra condi duration, and burn duration but no actual condi damage, but it gives you power.

> Balthazar gives condi damage but no condi duration except for fire.

> This becomes Condi damage VS condi duration. I don't know what one I would pick?

>

> These stats are without food.

>

> Bealfire

> 1005 condi damage, 55% condi duration base, 2347 Power.

> Burning +30% duration (85%), Poison +50% duration(100%), Torment +20% (75%)

>

> balthazar

> 1189 condi damage, 34% condi duration base, 2172 Power.

> Burning +50% duration(84%), Poison +50% duration(84%), Torment +20% duration(54%),

>

> Also i looked at Renegade, Zerker runes and Nightmare Runes

> Renegade gives you 1268 Condi damage, Zerker gives 1245 Condi damage, both are stonger than balthazar and Bealfire but no condi durations.

>

> Nightmare gives you the best of both fire runes 1189 condi damage, 54% condi duration base, 2172 Power.

> So everthing has +50% or over condi duration, but if your going for fire then your missing out 30% extra burning duration.

>

> What would you guys go for?

 

I would still go Renegade or Berserker. They improve the entire shortbow and not just one aspect of it. I would only focus on one condition type if you were actually intending to make use of different weapons. However, a singular focus on shortbow would benefit from a more broad condi bonus.

[Awn.1327]

> @"crazyhusky.2985" said:

> What build are you using for your rev to get Bleeding that high?

 

remember that blood fury gives +25% bleed duration (when you have fury)

 

corruption: bottom mid top, invocation: top bottom mid/bottom, kalla: mid mid mid

full viper, 6 nightmare runes, 9 x expertise infusion, rest condi damage, sigil of malice + bursting, tuning icicles + rare veggie pizza

 

 

[narcx.3570]

> @"crazyhusky.2985" said:

> For PVE/Fractal/Raids what would be good for condi Rev now? I don't think Snowcrows has updated it yet.

>

 

Snowrows *is* updated... It's Full Viper, 6/6 Nightmare, full dmg infusions, full condi proc sigils.

 

And then if you're running a vindication build for huge hitbox, it's 6/6 Baelfire, but the rest the same.

[Ertrak.9506]

> @"crazyhusky.2985" said:

> > @"Madara.7435" said:

> > it feels weird somehow that after a patch when stuff like gear or skills change people INSTANTLY look at sites like snowcrows telling them what to do instead of thinking themselves and trying stuff out. But thats how things go nowadays. All the more I am happy to see that someone is at least trying to have some conversation.

> > anyway, I agree Renegade runes are most likely the strongest of those you described here since it pushes all condis, but if you want to specifically look to push one condi it should always be burning because it deals by far the most dmg of all condis. and you have alot of burn with shortbow (spiritcrush, scorchrazor, sevenshot as combofinisher for spiritcrush/soulcleave) so for that i would prefer balthazar runes. baelfire can work aswell, depends on your stat choice as it can push condiduration alot.

>

> I don't typically use snowcrows as set thing. I normally use them as a rough guide and then build from them, not use their builds 100%, just as a rough idea of gear what I should be using. Point in case Condi FB, i'd say use Baelfire, Flame Legion or Balthazar Runes instead of Renegade Runes since you'll pretty much just be burning everything.

> In the case of Condi Rev where it does various forms of conditions, it's confusing as to what runes you should use, because most runes stick to one thing, But with Condi Shortbow you have 3 different main condi you're using at once, half your bow inflicts bleed, the other half inflicts burning, and both do it while you inflicting torment. So there isn't really a rune for this.

>

> Friends and Guildies have suggested a burning rune due to fire is the strong condi. So Baelfire, Flame Legion or Balthazar Runes...

> Baelfire gives extra condi duration, and burn duration but no actual condi damage, but it gives you power.

> Balthazar gives condi damage but no condi duration except for fire.

> This becomes Condi damage VS condi duration. I don't know what one I would pick?

>

> These stats are without food.

>

> Bealfire

> 1005 condi damage, 55% condi duration base, 2347 Power.

> Burning +30% duration (85%), Poison +50% duration(100%), Torment +20% (75%)

>

> balthazar

> 1189 condi damage, 34% condi duration base, 2172 Power.

> Burning +50% duration(84%), Poison +50% duration(84%), Torment +20% duration(54%),

>

> Also i looked at Renegade, Zerker runes and Nightmare Runes

> Renegade gives you 1268 Condi damage, Zerker gives 1245 Condi damage, both are stonger than balthazar and Bealfire but no condi durations.

>

> Nightmare gives you the best of both fire runes 1189 condi damage, 54% condi duration base, 2172 Power.

> So everthing has +50% or over condi duration, but if your going for fire then your missing out 30% extra burning duration.

>

> What would you guys go for?

 

Nightmare is best if you're running the Lasting Legacy rotation. The difference between nightmare and baelfire runes primarily comes from the power vs condition damage stat bonuses on the runes. I believe that, when torment actually procs in PvE the 1.5x multiplier exacerbates the condition damage differential that outweighs the burning duration from Baelfire runes. On a large hitbox however with the Vindication rotation, you get more burning output and less torment output (losing one UA for an additional CB). If u can consistently make all the hits from CB actually do damage and inflict its burning, baelfire becomes better (hence why its better than nightmare on large hitboxes). Dhuum is the only exception to this, in which LL rotation with nightmare is better.

 

Worth mentioning: on golem, torment is ~38% of the total damage output compared to the ~21% of burning.

[Zaraki.5784]

Elementalist maybe?

[Madara.7435]

> @"Ertrak.9506" said:

> Worth mentioning: on golem, torment is ~38% of the total damage output compared to the ~21% of burning.

 

Thanks for the headsup! I guess I was wrong, but I am not someone putting hours into golem stuff. Anyway, Torment itself is already strongly pushed by Yearning Empowerment. Made a build myself after gw2skills updated to achieve 100% condi duration on burn, torment, bleed and poison and that needs nightmare runes. Dont know if this is the setup with the most dmg though.