Inventories still full of runes/sigils, accessibility of different builds and rift between players

[zencow.3651]

> @"Cristalyan.5728" said:

> > @"zencow.3651" said:

> > Even with legendary sigil swap update and the rune/sigil rework, just carrying around the following set for maximal power DPS performance in fractals/dungeons etc takes a significant amount if inventory slot, then you also have condi/support and roaming builds for WvW that benefits from runes and sigils. A non-comprehensive list of common gear for PvE that can help reach DPS benchmarks and others that are advised or REQUESTED FOR by between different WvW guilds as 'Guild Builds' include:

> >

> > PVE:

> > Main Damage Sigils:

> > Superior Sigil of the Night, Impact, Force, Air

> >

> > Niche Slaying Sigils (most relevant to least):

> > Superior Sigil of Serpent Slaying (CM 99), Mad Scientists (CM 100)

> >

> > Superior Sigil of Demon Slaying (Volcanic), Sorrow (Underground), Elemental Slaying (Underground), Grawl Slaying (Volcanic), Icebrood Slaying (Snowblind)

> > ... the other 7 dungeon slaying sigils

> >

> > WVW:

> > Support/Roaming:

> > Superior Sigil of Concentration, Water, Transferrence

> > Superior Rune of Durability, Leadership, Monk, Antitoxin

> >

> > Roaming:

> > Superior Sigil of Energy, Cleansing, Malice, Doom, Nullification, Absorption, Severance

> > Superior Rune of the Adventurer, Exuberance

> >

> > Zerg DPS:

> > Superior Sigil of Frenzy, Bloodlust, Corruption

> > Superior Rune of Strength,Wurm

> >

> > Your favorite personal/profession niches:

> > , for me as an Ele main it's Superior Rune of Evasion, Balthazar

> >

> >

> Sorry, but if you need the corresponding sigil for one dungeon in order to clear that dungeon, or if you need a certain anti-monster sigil to clear a fractal, then either you have a problem with the play or you are an absolute mix-maxer.

>

> You say you play Ele? In this case a much simpler solution can be to ask Anet to nerf the Ele in such a way it cannot play more than one role (support or DPS dealer). In this way you will have only one set of runes - in the armor and one set of sigils - in the weapons. The space problem is solved.

>

> You can store the siglls in your bank - at least for WvW. I cannot imagine you want to change your role every 1-2 minutes and you cannot go to the spawn-point (or to the keep) to access your bank and to change the runes/sigils.

 

Sorry, I don't find this helpful at all.

Let me state it one more time. My. Bank. Is. FUUUUULLLL.

And bank slots taken up by runes and sigils (which WILL DECLINE IN VALUE) is not being taken up by x250 units of TP invested goods THAT WILL GO UP IN PRICE.

[zencow.3651]

> @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > @"zencow.3651" said:

> > Maybe I am looking at this wrong but wouldn't greater accessibility to different builds facilitate player exploration and create better quality players to close the 'rift' between the so-called casuals and elitists?

> It would help with the first one, definitely. The second one, however... i doubt that. For the most part that rift is caused by differences of opinion and playing style, not by skill and access to meta gear.

>

>

 

Bias towards a play style is influenced by the accessibility of other play styles though. The common attitude is that if my build is easy to use and is working fine in open-world (and a much larger helping of 'it's making me more gold/hr than fractals/raids/wvw could') then why bother try anything else when it's just inconveniencing yourself?

 

Aversion towards being told what to do/how to play is also partly due to having to also change your builds up to suit what the GROUP wants and this is true in fractals/raids/wvw group settings.

[Airdive.2613]

> @"zencow.3651" said:

 

> Sorry, I don't find this helpful at all.

> Let me state it one more time. My. Bank. Is. FUUUUULLLL.

> And bank slots taken up by runes and sigils (which WILL DECLINE IN VALUE) is not being taken up by x250 units of TP invested goods THAT WILL GO UP IN PRICE.

 

Well, sell runes and sigils now while they're expensive and buy them back cheaper at a later date?

It really seems like you're trying hard to find a problem where there's none.

[polarbear.2497]

> @"Astralporing.1957" said:

The gain in kill times you get is in the end smaller than the time you use on switching them.

>

 

This is all you need to know... great point.

 

 

[Astralporing.1957]

> @"zencow.3651" said:

> > @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > > @"zencow.3651" said:

> > > Maybe I am looking at this wrong but wouldn't greater accessibility to different builds facilitate player exploration and create better quality players to close the 'rift' between the so-called casuals and elitists?

> > It would help with the first one, definitely. The second one, however... i doubt that. For the most part that rift is caused by differences of opinion and playing style, not by skill and access to meta gear.

> >

> >

>

> Bias towards a play style is influenced by the accessibility of other play styles though. The common attitude is that if my build is easy to use and is working fine in open-world (and a much larger helping of 'it's making me more gold/hr than fractals/raids/wvw could') then why bother try anything else when it's just inconveniencing yourself?

>

> Aversion towards being told what to do/how to play is also partly due to having to also change your builds up to suit what the GROUP wants and this is true in fractals/raids/wvw group settings.

 

That rift was also present in gw1, where switching your build was as easy as selecting a different build template. Many people still preferred to play what they enjoyed, even if it was not efficient. And the main rift was not because players of one group couldn't switch builds easily (because they very much could), but due to both groups not being able to understand the way of thinking of the other group.

Simply put, both groups played for fun, but "fun" meant for them completely different things.

 

In gw2 that's still equally true.

 

So yes, easy access to build swithcing would definitely make the game more enjoyable to people that use different builds, like to experiment or min-max for the specific content. I doubt however it would mean anything for the rift between "casuals" and "elitists".

[zencow.3651]

> @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> That rift was also present in gw1, where switching your build was as easy as selecting a different build template. Many people still preferred to play what they enjoyed, even if it was not efficient. And the main rift was not because players of one group couldn't switch builds easily (because they very much could), but due to both groups not being able to understand the way of thinking of the other group.

> Simply put, both groups played for fun, but "fun" meant for them completely different things.

>

> In gw2 that's still equally true.

>

> So yes, easy access to build switching would definitely make the game more enjoyable to people that use different builds, like to experiment or min-max for the specific content. I doubt however it would mean anything for the rift between "casuals" and "elitists".

 

The difference is, with a build template system it felt less jarring when told what to run because the presence of sharable build templates already communicates to players that it's a valid mode of cooperation rather than something 'forced on'. Being referred to builds by having to tab to other websites can be very jarring and having gear and traits pointed/typed out can feel demeaning as it becomes seen as a more unnatural way to play as it isn't even supported by an ingame system. There will always be a percentage of people who would never want to step foot into group play regardless and a percentage of elitist who would never accept casuals into their fold, we can't change that. But we CAN facilitate that kind of interaction between those who fall within the continuum.

 

On the main topic though, ultimately, the flexibility of builds is something most people desire in the end-game and the suggestions are in line with Anet's philosophy of horizontal progression whether it helps bored open-world farmers look into ways to get value out of legendaries (apart from selling them ofc) or not.

[zencow.3651]

> @"Airdive.2613" said:

> > @"zencow.3651" said:

>

> > Sorry, I don't find this helpful at all.

> > Let me state it one more time. My. Bank. Is. FUUUUULLLL.

> > And bank slots taken up by runes and sigils (which WILL DECLINE IN VALUE) is not being taken up by x250 units of TP invested goods THAT WILL GO UP IN PRICE.

>

> Well, sell runes and sigils now while they're expensive and buy them back cheaper at a later date?

> It really seems like you're trying hard to find a problem where there's none.

 

It wasn't a serious response as was what I was what I replied to, and what I am replying, and what this reply is as it adds nothing meaningful to the discussion.

[xenon.3264]

first world problem.

[XenoSpyro.1780]

> @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> [Air] can now be safely replaced by any slaying sigil, because the base +3% upgrade is still better

Would you say the same for high crit / slow weapon setups?

[Astralporing.1957]

> @"XenoSpyro.1780" said:

> > @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > [Air] can now be safely replaced by any slaying sigil, because the base +3% upgrade is still better

> Would you say the same for high crit / slow weapon setups?

 

For any dps builds, yes. Not sure about builds with low base dps, but those aren't likely to be running dps sigils anyway.

[Anchoku.8142]

For perspective, at one time, I carried or wore 11 different (full) sets of equipment on my old main. That's a lot of bag space. I salvaged any sets that performed poorly or that a balance patch had nerfed and made more.

 

It is normal for me to have At least 2 full sets for every character not used as a mule, which is one of every profession.

[zencow.3651]

> @"XenoSpyro.1780" said:

> > @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > [Air] can now be safely replaced by any slaying sigil, because the base +3% upgrade is still better

> Would you say the same for high crit / slow weapon setups?

 

> @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > @"XenoSpyro.1780" said:

> > > @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > > [Air] can now be safely replaced by any slaying sigil, because the base +3% upgrade is still better

> > Would you say the same for high crit / slow weapon setups?

>

> For any dps builds, yes. Not sure about builds with low base dps, but those aren't likely to be running dps sigils anyway.

 

IIRC think the margin around >5k DPS is when you should stop using Air, but it's still useful for my semi- and three-quarter healing power tempest builds.