Renegade build for pvp (last season legend)

[Fumigene.5076]

I play a similar build (I use a defensive rune and if I expect to spend most of my time against mesmers/thieves I use Spirit Boon instead of Rapid Flow) and have a couple of questions.

 

1) How do you survive the inevitable focus fire, especially when your team does not care? And especially when there's a lot of CC flying at you?

 

2) In higher divisions, are there still regularly people who give up as soon as they see a renegade in their team?

While some are just shifting the blame to cover for their own shortcomings (I had no trouble fighting them in the next game), a number of them really seem to be resigned to a loss and play poorly due to that.

 

 

> @"Kain Francois.4328" said:

> > @"The Ace.9105" said:

> >Also the lifesteal elite on kalla triggers once when the short bow auto hits the target and once when the auto applies bleeding so you receive double lifesteal (~800) in 1/2 seconds aoe which gives you more sustain.

>

>

> Uhhhhhh????

>

> Someone verify this?

I can confirm it. And besides the sustain, the double-lifesteal from SB AA helps a lot in some matchups, since lifesteal damage is not affected by protection and stuff like that.

 

[The Ace.9105]

> @"Fumigene.5076" said:

> I play a similar build (I use a defensive rune and if I expect to spend most of my time against mesmers/thieves I use Spirit Boon instead of Rapid Flow) and have a couple of questions.

>

> 1) How do you survive the inevitable focus fire, especially when your team does not care? And especially when there's a lot of CC flying at you?

>

> 2) In higher divisions, are there still regularly people who give up as soon as they see a renegade in their team?

> While some are just shifting the blame to cover for their own shortcomings (I had no trouble fighting them in the next game), a number of them really seem to be resigned to a loss and play poorly due to that.

>

>

> > @"Kain Francois.4328" said:

> > > @"The Ace.9105" said:

> > >Also the lifesteal elite on kalla triggers once when the short bow auto hits the target and once when the auto applies bleeding so you receive double lifesteal (~800) in 1/2 seconds aoe which gives you more sustain.

> >

> >

> > Uhhhhhh????

> >

> > Someone verify this?

> I can confirm it. And besides the sustain, the double-lifesteal from SB AA helps a lot in some matchups, since lifesteal damage is not affected by protection and stuff like that.

>

 

1. Kiting a lot/leaving the point etc. The shiro dodge stunbreak is very useful with the extra 25 energy. When getting focused hard I try to ignore the damage and focus on surviving. Sometimes nothing can save you tho.

 

2. On higher divisions no not really. I haven't really gotten ppl going afk but sometimes some ppl blame the renegade. It was worse when I first started playing renegade but pretty soon ppl got used when they noticed that renegade wasn't that bad.

[Kain Francois.4328]

edit: verified that shattershot applies double life steal with soulcleave summit. Veeeery interesting...

[Fumigene.5076]

> @"The Ace.9105" said:

> > @"Fumigene.5076" said:

> > I play a similar build (I use a defensive rune and if I expect to spend most of my time against mesmers/thieves I use Spirit Boon instead of Rapid Flow) and have a couple of questions.

> >

> > 1) How do you survive the inevitable focus fire, especially when your team does not care? And especially when there's a lot of CC flying at you?

> >

> > 2) In higher divisions, are there still regularly people who give up as soon as they see a renegade in their team?

> > While some are just shifting the blame to cover for their own shortcomings (I had no trouble fighting them in the next game), a number of them really seem to be resigned to a loss and play poorly due to that.

> >

> >

> > > @"Kain Francois.4328" said:

> > > > @"The Ace.9105" said:

> > > >Also the lifesteal elite on kalla triggers once when the short bow auto hits the target and once when the auto applies bleeding so you receive double lifesteal (~800) in 1/2 seconds aoe which gives you more sustain.

> > >

> > >

> > > Uhhhhhh????

> > >

> > > Someone verify this?

> > I can confirm it. And besides the sustain, the double-lifesteal from SB AA helps a lot in some matchups, since lifesteal damage is not affected by protection and stuff like that.

> >

>

> 1. Kiting a lot/leaving the point etc. The shiro dodge stunbreak is very useful with the extra 25 energy. When getting focused hard I try to ignore the damage and focus on surviving. Sometimes nothing can save you tho.

>

> 2. On higher divisions no not really. I haven't really gotten ppl going afk but sometimes some ppl blame the renegade. It was worse when I first started playing renegade but pretty soon ppl got used when they noticed that renegade wasn't that bad.

 

Thanks.

 

1) That's what I (try to) do, so I guess I just need to get better.

2) So there's hope. That's a good news.

[Lonewolf Kai.3682]

> @"The Ace.9105" said:

> > @"narcx.3570" said:

> > > @"The Ace.9105" said:

> > > > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> > > > I gave it a try, and while Mad king is definitely the right rune for this build giving renegade some much needed sustain - it still suffers from the same problem all Renegade bow builds do. Bow would just be a whole lot better if it didn't have two dead-weight skills. The auto attack is nice and fast, and skill 4+5 have good synergistic use. But shortbow 2+3 are just useless skills. Weapons can get away with having one bad skill and still be viable, but having two garbage abilities really hurts and makes you feel artificially limited. I can see how it may be possible to do well with this build if you have the patience to really learn it, but I'd rather not.

> > >

> > > I agree with you. Skill 2 and 3 are pretty much useless in pvp and they need to be reworked.

> >

> > I think they should leave 7 shot alone... It's fine to have a skill shot, and if you use it from mid range it's gonna give 4-5 torment stacks pretty easily (+ traited procs and finishers). Maybe give it a pvp only energy cost reduction tho to make up for all seven never hitting tho... Make it cost like 5 energy or something.

> >

> > But yeah, they need to make sb2 track moving targets. Or just make it insta-gib like scepter skills do. It's not like the arrows from it are even projectile finishers.... It's kinda dumb. Maybe if they were finishers, it'd be okay. But they're not, so I dunno.

>

> The problem with 7 shot is that it's too slow in pvp and it needs a certain range to work. I've only hit the 7 shot once to a thief who ran away and just happened to port to the place where the 7 arrows meet. There's no skill involved in the skill and it's just pure luck if it really hits or not.

 

I personally find 7 shot my favorite Sb skill. Yes, I do think it needs help, mostly in the form of making the energy spent more worthwhile. But it does take skill to make the shot land. Think of it akin to placing a gtaoe on a moving target. You sometimes have to predict where the target is going to be at. Sure, there’s times I miss the shot because of this, but most of the time, I normally land 3-4 arrows and on rare occasions land all 7.

[narcx.3570]

> @"Fumigene.5076" said:

> 2) In higher divisions, are there still regularly people who give up as soon as they see a renegade in their team?

> While some are just shifting the blame to cover for their own shortcomings (I had no trouble fighting them in the next game), a number of them really seem to be resigned to a loss and play poorly due to that.

 

In Platinum, people don't give up out of the gate, but it certainly makes them start the game already a little on tilt...

 

When you see a Ren in the game you know he's either going to be a free kill/contribute nothing or he's going to be an insanely good player who can play whatever and win because they're that good at the game. Statistics are definitely on the side of the person being a mediocre player with a build that's doing them no favors, but, most people in plat are willing to see which it is and at least wait to see if the other team is competent or not.

 

Most people will give it till the first fight, and if you lose it and fail to regain momentum immediately, you can expect people to start giving up. Having a Renegade on the team doesn't really inspire people to push the game and turn it around (sorry, but it's true)--most would rather take the loss at that point and get into another match faster instead of wasting their time trying to stall out a lopsided/mismatched game.

 

That's not just renegade, but any teammate playing an off meta build. Especially if it's some hybrid thing trying to 1v1 on the sides unsuccessfully. People might push a little harder with a weak player if they're at least at the team fights trying to do damage or something and rotating correctly--But, even then, if you lose 2-3 scrums, it's gg.

[The Ace.9105]

The build is on metabattle now with some explanations about the build.

 

https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Renegade_-_Retribution_Kalla

[LolLookAtMyAP.8394]

After playing this it's actually not bad. Quite surprising at its effectiveness. You do need to kite in many situations, especially with Sage/Avatar amulet, so beware. One of the more fun builds I've tried, it's good to see people experimenting.