Some graphical comments

[coso.9173]

I know many people don't care about stuff like this, and prefer to talk about loot, or how to min max things, but I do care about mood, and about how the game presents itself.

If you do not care about graphics or weather, or immersion, then this is not the topic for you.

 

I've been playing the game for around 4 years or so, and I think the game presents a beautiful world, one of the most gorgeous in MMOs since its beginnings. Congrats to the devs on that.

But I feel there are some issues that are really showing that take back from that experience.

 

Frist of all the fog. I understand it's made to hide how things appear out of nowhere, but by now there has to be a better way to do it in 2019 that with a deep fog that covers anything far away. makes sense on some maps like Orr, but in sunny maps like queensdale, it makes no sense and looks pretty cheap. I hope any new maps find a better way to do it because the world would look much better without so much of that fog.

 

Second, this might be something pretty specific but still, it could be improved a lot. There is a day/night system, the nights are a bit too bright, but okay, i guess it's that way for easier playability. But what I don't understand is the complete lack of sunset/sunrise. The day/night system is barely noticeable at all. a beautiful sunset where the sky turns yellow/orange/red/pink would look awesome on this already beautiful game. many MMOs use this and it looks amazing, FFXIV, ESO and BDO to name a few. some sunset moments would make the whole day/ight cycle much more evident, since sometimes I'm not really sure what time of the day it is in some maps.

 

Third. a weather system. I've noticed some maps have some weather variations, like rain on the desert or things like that. I think it's a cool idea, but also it's barely noticeable. when it rains I haven't seen the sky change at all, only the actual rain effect on a non cloudy sky. Much could be improved on this already existing system too.

 

 

Like I say, i do care a lot about aesthetics, and I know I'm not the only one. I think these issues make GW2 relaly show its age and if improved it could gain back some terrain in the graphic department. :)

[starlinvf.1358]

Try to keep in mind this engine is stuck on DX9, and is circa 2008 in origin (arguably 2000 if you count the fact its still based on the GW1 engine). Its also built in an era of monolithic architecture, and spaghetti code they've been struggling to de-tangle to this very day. While I can agree with the sentiment, you have to be realistic with what it is your dealing with. Rendering Routines in graphics engines are among the hardest to deal with, because its one half of the game's Core Architecture, and can't easily be changed or upgraded without major overhauls or entirely gutting it from the inside out. This is why most MMOs never get major graphics upgrades in their life times, as its basically the kind of work you'd only normally be able to justify in a completely new game release. The few that have were nearly all just making it more extensible, letting it take advantage of some new API sets and optimizations. And in none of those cases where the upgrades substantial enough to be considered a next Gen engine.

 

At this point, theres no compelling reason to redo the graphics engine, unless its to move to a job based architecture (needed to actually take real advantage of DX12 or Vulkan), or to clean up their inefficient draw call overhead to something more batch oriented. Neither of those are trivial, and ultimately require the other half of the architecture (how they manage game data) to cooperate and package information, so the renderer can break up tasks easier.

 

Newer games had the benefit of having newer engines to use as baselines, or directly build out features they need without fear of backward compatibility. That accounts for a LOT more of the decision making then we give credit to, since its a huge cost in time, man power, and resources to develop. And half the things you mentioned as wish list features are just applications of dynamic lighting and volumetric effects.... 2 things the engine isn't known for handling well.

[coso.9173]

true, some things might be limitations of the engine. maybe they just can't render things any further away without compromising speed, and the fog has to stay, but there are also other things that are artistic choices. like the total lack of sunset and changing the sky for different weathers. changing the sky can be done since it's already done with the night/night system. so it should be able to handle a sunset and weather changes too.

[Biff.5312]

I don't actually see any 'fog'. Maybe my settings are too low. But it's probably more akin to haze. Sunny areas definitely get this.

[starlinvf.1358]

> @"coso.9173" said:

> true, some things might be limitations of the engine. maybe they just can't render things any further away without compromising speed, and the fog has to stay, but there are also other things that are artistic choices. like the total lack of sunset and changing the sky for different weathers. changing the sky can be done since it's already done with the night/night system. so it should be able to handle a sunset and weather changes too.

 

The irony of having a day/night cycle is that players eventually hate everything associated with it. I've seen half a dozen games have a good day/night cycle and lighting system in early beta, only to have it scaled back due to player complaints about its effects.

 

- Players don't like not being able to see things... which is why "night" in so many games is little more then a shift to cooler color temps and a different sky box. And if you're game uses dynamic environment lighting, the moon usually ends up becoming a second, dimmer Sun.

- Players don't like having trouble seeing..... which is why weather effects are heavily neutered in the foreground, and typically does fog in the back ground to limit distance. In games without UI markers for targets, enemies also tend to be silhouetted much more strongly to keep them visible.

- Solo Players hate any timers. When the rebuilt LA was launched, and the achievements for it revealed, the single BIGGEST complaint behind the difficulty of the new JP was the Karaka hunter achievement having a segment that can only be accessed during the night cycle. "I don't have the time to wait 1 hour for the night cycle, because [insert every excuse about time related complaints]".

 

 

We had these things early on in some form....but players complained enough that it eventually got scaled back to become inconsequential. The problem here is that people want these things to "feel" significant.... but not actually "be" significant to the game play. Drytop is a perfect example of this. The sand storm happens, but it doesn't actually affect how you play, or even how you travel.

[coso.9173]

FF XIV, ESO, BDO all have night/day systems with proper day night sunset and sunrises, and I don't see anyone complaining. it's true that BDO is a much newer game with a much more spectacular visual engine, but FF and ESO didn't come out much after GW2.

I do understand your point though, but I don't think anyone would complain about this, since it's mostly cosmetic and wouldn't affect the game in any way other than that.

[Phineas Drayke.6381]

People will always complain.

I'm with you on this. I hate it when nights are not real nights. My Skyrim and Fallout games are all heavily modded and the first mod I always install if available is a darker nights mod. I played BDO beta and loved the really black nights. The community didn't, complained and the nights were tuned down.

[DietPepsi.4371]

I agree wholly on the day-night cycles and lack of noticeable sunsets/rises. I think there is a whole lot of atmosphere that GW2 misses out on with it lacking a proper day-night cycle visually, as well as missing out of opportunities for cool scenarios using this. More noticeable whether would provide the exact same; opportunities for beautiful pictures, settings and interesting scenarios.

[coso.9173]

exactly! a cool sunset/sunrise is pretty much a change in the skybox graphic, and a more orange/yellow tint. both are things that are already in gw2 in other zones (like in some swamps) so it¿s not a limitation of the engine but an art decision, which is why it's weird to me. how aweosme would it be to be walking in queendale and then there is this beautiful sunset while you just go up a hill to enjoy it. :)

[joneirikb.7506]

Do miss proper night time etc, especially after having played Dragon's Dogma, where night was fantastic. But yeah, people complained because they couldn't see things well enough, so we lost the half dark nights we used to have at launch, and now we just have this slightly overcast "London weather" instead of night.

 

I don't like it, but I know it won't get changed, too many players complaining.

 

Similarly would like your other suggestions, weather etc is great in games that do them well (Zelda BotW for ex), but I've given up on ever seeing it in GW2. I'm sure someone would just complain that their fashion got ruined by the weather ;)

[Hashberry.4510]

Real night stinks, thank god they do not have it here.

[coso.9173]

why? just because it's too dark? there's ways to make it not so dark while it still looks like night. ESO, GW2, FFXIV have nighttime and you can still clearly see.