Eclipse.2905 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 If a reaper have all self-buffs and deals slightly lesser dps and can tank. I know the dps is lower, but other class needs a support to buff them right? Doesn't that means their final DPS is divided by 2? Since they need 2 players What IF you just replace the whole team with all reapers? That means you remove all other tank and support class right? It's like you dont need no support or tank. Just pure DPS for the whole team. Imagine a 10 player party needs maybe a tank and 2 supports, that would mean you get 3 more DPSer right? Please correct me if I'm wrong, noob here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 > @"Eclipse.2905" said: > If a reaper have all self-buffs and deals slightly lesser dps and can tank. > You don't deal slightly less dps. You deal a ton of less dps. > @"Eclipse.2905" said: > I know the dps is lower, but other class needs a support to buff them right? Doesn't that means their final DPS is divided by 2? Since they need 2 players > No, boons adds close to 60% damage or more to classes. Not having access to might, fury, alacrity and quickness will reduce your damage significantly. As such, since those boons are mostly not covered by reaper, support classes would still be needed. > @"Eclipse.2905" said: > What IF you just replace the whole team with all reapers? That means you remove all other tank and support class right? > You replace the tank and dps at best. > @"Eclipse.2905" said: > It's like you dont need no support or tank. Just pure DPS for the whole team. > > Imagine a 10 player party needs maybe a tank and 2 supports, that would mean you get 3 more DPSer right? > > Please correct me if I'm wrong, noob here. Banner warriors are also a support, they increase the teams overall output. Normal raid teams are setup with: 2 chronos for quickness and alacrity 1 druid for might/fury 1 off healer (if needed) 1 banner slave 5 dps At best you will gain 1 additional slot from losing the off healer. While at the same time having worse dps on reapers than best in slot dps for that fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddicus.6128 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 I think focusing on DPS is a fool's errand. Lots of people do it, but they're missing the big picture. Would they seriously look at the DPS of the druid? I doubt it. My reaper doesn't do great DPS (3-4K). But, he smashes down multiple breakbars quickly, and strips boons as fast as most enemies can cast them, including in fractals with one of the boon-adding instabilities. What is the value of that to a party? Measured in DPS, it's zero. But, is it really zero? How valuable is that 1-5 second "stun" when the Molten Berserker (fractal: molten boss) can't do anything? And yes, DPS meters catch most of the damage done by conditions. But, conditions are far more valuable than just the DPS they deliver. How can you put a DPS value on chilling a boss? At best, maybe you can measure the drop in the boss'es DPS on the party. When someone tells me I don't have enough DPS, I tell him he's an idiot and then ignore him. Anybody that stupid isn't worth my time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 > @"Daddicus.6128" said: > I think focusing on DPS is a fool's errand. Lots of people do it, but they're missing the big picture. Would they seriously look at the DPS of the druid? I doubt it. > > My reaper doesn't do great DPS (3-4K). But, he smashes down multiple breakbars quickly, and strips boons as fast as most enemies can cast them, including in fractals with one of the boon-adding instabilities. What is the value of that to a party? Measured in DPS, it's zero. But, is it really zero? How valuable is that 1-5 second "stun" when the Molten Berserker (fractal: molten boss) can't do anything? > > And yes, DPS meters catch most of the damage done by conditions. But, conditions are far more valuable than just the DPS they deliver. How can you put a DPS value on chilling a boss? At best, maybe you can measure the drop in the boss'es DPS on the party. > > When someone tells me I don't have enough DPS, I tell him he's an idiot and then ignore him. Anybody that stupid isn't worth my time. You can put a dps value on chilling a boss very easily: if the breakbar is gone, that's all that is needed. Your 3k dps is approximately where a heal druid in fractals sits at or a heal druid in raids. That Dragonhunter who is playing decently will pull an initial 40-50k burst and then drop to around 20k dps in fractals. He is literally doing the damage of 5-6 times of what you are doing. Also Reaper can hit similar numbers as power build in fractals (where conditions are disadvantageous due to the short duration of fights). I've made a post about this in the Player Healping Players forums 2 weeks ago. People do not realize what a huge damage difference exists between a well rounded boon providing setup with good builds which are played correctly, and the run of the mill "I am playing what I feel like but have never optimized" setup. It's worlds apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eclipse.2905 Posted April 9, 2019 Author Share Posted April 9, 2019 >> @Cyninja.2954 said: > Normal raid teams are setup with: > 2 chronos for quickness and alacrity > 1 druid for might/fury > 1 off healer (if needed) > 1 banner slave > 5 dps > > At best you will gain 1 additional slot from losing the off healer. While at the same time having worse dps on reapers than best in slot dps for that fight. From what I've found, I think reaper's current dps is actually 29k full self-buff....I think Daddicus was talking about per hit. It's like 5 dps of 45k = 225k 10 reaper of 29k = 290k Isnt full team repear better then? Oh yeahh for the self-buffs, I thought reaper now can get perma quickness and max might + max vulnerability? And traits already gave 83% crit too. Btw.....how do I reply to someone's comment? Newb here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 > @"Eclipse.2905" said: > From what I've found, I think reaper's current dps is actually 29k full self-buff....I think Daddicus was talking about per hit. > I can only respond to what some one says. If he is talking about dps, then I have to assume it's dps he talks about. Single hits are meaningless, even more when they are 3k. > It's like 5 dps of 45k = 225k There is no 5 dps of 45k. dps stands for damage per second. The assumption is that all damage is already factored into that number. > @"Eclipse.2905" said: > 10 reaper of 29k = 290k > > Isnt full team repaer better then? > Have you checked other classes benchmarks? Most top tier dps are at 35-37k on golem. Also realize that those Reaper benchmarks are WITH class buffs like banners, druid spirits, all damage boons, etc. Again, you will not replace the support classes (and chronos are support as well as tanks in regular setups). I have made reference to the most used meta up top. > @"Eclipse.2905" said: > Oh yeahh for the self-buffs, I thought reaper now can get perma quickness and max might + max vulnerability? And traits already gave 83% crit too. > Reaper has perma quickness in shroud or if splashing in Boon Duration. If you can remain in permanent shroud, you would be able to put out great damage yes. As mentioned: Reaper can put out some nice damage in fractals, especially with bonus stats which can make it hit 100% crit. > @"Eclipse.2905" said: > Btw.....how do I reply to someone's comment? Newb here... There is a quote button in the top line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eclipse.2905 Posted April 9, 2019 Author Share Posted April 9, 2019 > @"Cyninja.2954" said: Thanks for teaching me how to quote! As for the 29k-30k dps it's actually solo. I saw 2 videos in Youtube, one of got [bATS] at the title I think. Another was "Power Reaper 30718" Both of the video they did 30k benchmark by only self buffing from what it looks like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 > @"Eclipse.2905" said: > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > Thanks for teaching me how to quote! > > As for the 29k-30k dps it's actually solo. > > I saw 2 videos in Youtube, one of got [bATS] at the title I think. Another was "Power Reaper 30718" > > Both of the video they did 30k benchmark by only self buffing from what it looks like. That's the video and no it's not solo. Look at the boons and class buffs in the bottom. He has: - 25 Might - alacrity - quickness - fury - warrior banners - druid buffs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eclipse.2905 Posted April 9, 2019 Author Share Posted April 9, 2019 > @"Cyninja.2954" said: Ohhh I see! Thanks for correcting me! Well....I guess now my only justification to play Reaper is because I like it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 > @"Eclipse.2905" said: > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > Ohhh I see! Thanks for correcting me! > > Well....I guess now my only justification to play Reaper is because I like it... Reaper is fine in fractals as dps (and I've seen good reapers top dps charts). You'll even be fine in raids since many people do not play their classes perfectly (or even good for that matter). The only hurdle would be to get into raid groups initially but if you can play your class and outperform other dps in raid training groups I doubt that people will kick you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phs.6089 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Other classes have self buffs too. Reapers is below then any other DPS by 3-4k damage on paper. But in fractals it does good mainly because it doesn't need babysitting from healer as any other glass cannon. Some raids bosses have phrases well before boss is below 50%, hence reapers DPS looks not good. If you have time check tube on Teapots Power Reaper raiding, lots of info on those. E,g Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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