Wintermute.5408 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 > @Zenith.7301 said: > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > 7 mesmer becnhmarks. They do love their mesmers... > > > > Hurray for DPS though. Inb4 nerfs. > > They're condi and power variants of chrono, condi variant of mirage, and power mesmer. All of which are used builds. What build other than scourge or condi reaper is a necro build used in raids? > > You have some nerve to be complaining when you got an apex elite dps spec with utility and godly cleave, while the mesmer's mirage is just a garbage single target ramp up version that does 4k less DPS than you, doesn't cleave, and offers zero utility. > > Mesmer is the single class thus far without a competitive DPS build for a raid. Ok, if you want to take my shitty attempts at humor that seriously... 6 of those builds are effectively one and the same chrono buff bot with various degrees of shitty damage. Yet they found the time to test them all. Then there's mirage, combining middle of the road damage with non-existant survivability and being bugged up the ass. Yet there it is, tested. And then there's one necro build. 1. Not even consideration given to any form of power builds. "Oh, but power necros suck!" So does the majority of those 7 mesmer builds. Not even consideration given to Scourge support. "Oh, but Scourge support sucks!" So does Mirage DPS. Or support Herald. Yet there they are. Fuck, even for one benchmark they did bother testing they got gearing wrong. Quality effort from our meta overlords! And THOSE guys get to determine whether necro is taken or not into PVE groups. Guys that can't even be bothered to test necro to the degree they test their mains. Would they completely fail at that 1 benchmark they did, they would say "oh well, Scourge is unviable", and then entire PVE community would roll with it despite any evidence to the contrary. Awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vicious.5683 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 > @Zenith.7301 said: > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > 7 mesmer becnhmarks. They do love their mesmers... > > > > Hurray for DPS though. Inb4 nerfs. > > You have some nerve to be complaining when you got an apex elite dps spec with utility and godly cleave, while the mesmer's mirage is just a garbage single target ramp up version that does 4k less DPS than you, doesn't cleave, and offers zero utility. > > Mesmer is the single class thus far without a competitive DPS build for a raid. For a second, I thought you were talking about Power Reapers, but those have much less DPS than your mirage. And even less support and utility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vicious.5683 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 > @Substatic.6958 said: > So the best raid class, the best wpvp class, the best spvp class. > > Yeah, Arenanet is comming with a butcher's knife. It will be swift. The fuck are you talking about? Eles still have goddly dps in raids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exqq.7451 Posted October 5, 2017 Author Share Posted October 5, 2017 > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > @Zenith.7301 said: > > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > 7 mesmer becnhmarks. They do love their mesmers... > > > > > > Hurray for DPS though. Inb4 nerfs. > > > > They're condi and power variants of chrono, condi variant of mirage, and power mesmer. All of which are used builds. What build other than scourge or condi reaper is a necro build used in raids? > > > > You have some nerve to be complaining when you got an apex elite dps spec with utility and godly cleave, while the mesmer's mirage is just a garbage single target ramp up version that does 4k less DPS than you, doesn't cleave, and offers zero utility. > > > > Mesmer is the single class thus far without a competitive DPS build for a raid. > > Ok, if you want to take my kitten attempts at humor that seriously... > > 6 of those builds are effectively one and the same chrono buff bot with various degrees of kitten damage. Yet they found the time to test them all. > > Then there's mirage, combining middle of the road damage with non-existant survivability and being bugged up the kitten. Yet there it is, tested. > > And then there's one necro build. 1. Not even consideration given to any form of power builds. "Oh, but power necros suck!" So does the majority of those 7 mesmer builds. Not even consideration given to Scourge support. "Oh, but Scourge support sucks!" So does Mirage DPS. Or support Herald. Yet there they are. kitten, even for one benchmark they did bother testing they got gearing wrong. Quality effort from our meta overlords! And THOSE guys get to determine whether necro is taken or not into PVE groups. Guys that can't even be bothered to test necro to the degree they test their mains. Would they completely fail at that 1 benchmark they did, they would say "oh well, Scourge is unviable", and then entire PVE community would roll with it despite any evidence to the contrary. Awesome. So much this. They know the community looks to them as gospel so I feel they should definately keep that in mind. 4 listed thief specs even though only 1 is META(lulz) and they even post (solo) builds for thief. 8 Ele builds with 1 even as low as 27k. 5 Guard builds even as low as 33k. We should definately have at least a Condi Reaper listed. I would even go so far as to say we should have Power Scourge listed as I have seen posts with it at 31-34k which is MORE than viable. They basically shoehorn necro into one role because they hate it and the rest of the community follows like lemmings. And while barrier is not “wanted” how much easier would a raid be with 4 necro dps spamming barriers on the raid and with the healing and doing extremely competent dps. Meanwhile the community continues to think one shot glass Weaver is the only viable dps because it is “higher”. That is not their fault. But, either only provide the one recommended meta build and thats it, or provide all viable builds. Edit: I'll leave this here since deleting it would be a bit much. However, after reading a lot of the feedback (and taking into consideration how I was feeling when I wrote this) I was clearly a bit over the top. Thank you everyone that provided feedback and pointed out my shitcockery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LamaLeif.5381 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 > @Exqq.7451 said: > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > @Zenith.7301 said: > > > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > > 7 mesmer becnhmarks. They do love their mesmers... > > > > > > > > Hurray for DPS though. Inb4 nerfs. > > > > > > They're condi and power variants of chrono, condi variant of mirage, and power mesmer. All of which are used builds. What build other than scourge or condi reaper is a necro build used in raids? > > > > > > You have some nerve to be complaining when you got an apex elite dps spec with utility and godly cleave, while the mesmer's mirage is just a garbage single target ramp up version that does 4k less DPS than you, doesn't cleave, and offers zero utility. > > > > > > Mesmer is the single class thus far without a competitive DPS build for a raid. > > > > Ok, if you want to take my kitten attempts at humor that seriously... > > > > 6 of those builds are effectively one and the same chrono buff bot with various degrees of kitten damage. Yet they found the time to test them all. > > > > Then there's mirage, combining middle of the road damage with non-existant survivability and being bugged up the kitten. Yet there it is, tested. > > > > And then there's one necro build. 1. Not even consideration given to any form of power builds. "Oh, but power necros suck!" So does the majority of those 7 mesmer builds. Not even consideration given to Scourge support. "Oh, but Scourge support sucks!" So does Mirage DPS. Or support Herald. Yet there they are. kitten, even for one benchmark they did bother testing they got gearing wrong. Quality effort from our meta overlords! And THOSE guys get to determine whether necro is taken or not into PVE groups. Guys that can't even be bothered to test necro to the degree they test their mains. Would they completely fail at that 1 benchmark they did, they would say "oh well, Scourge is unviable", and then entire PVE community would roll with it despite any evidence to the contrary. Awesome. > > So much this. They know the community looks to them as gospel so I feel they should definately keep that in mind. > > 4 listed thief specs even though only 1 is META(lulz) and they even post (solo) builds for thief. > > 8 Ele builds with 1 even as low as 27k. > > 5 Guard builds even as low as 33k. > > We should definately have at least a Condi Reaper listed. I would even go so far as to say we should have Power Scourge listed as I have seen posts with it at 31-34k which is MORE than viable. They basically shoehorn necro into one role because they hate it and the rest of the community follows like lemmings. And while barrier is not “wanted” how much easier would a raid be with 4 necro dps spamming barriers on the raid and with the healing and doing extremely competent dps. Meanwhile the community continues to think one shot glass Weaver is the only viable dps because it is “higher”. That is not their fault. But, either only provide the one recommended meta build and thats it, or provide all viable builds. > > > > If you had read the info supplied with the builds you would know things, and knowing things would stop you from making yourself look clueless and hateful on the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoltreez.6435 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 > @Substatic.6958 said: > So the best raid class, the best wpvp class, the best spvp class. im still on the Necro forums right ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirPrizeBartSachs.4670 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 > @"Drarnor Kunoram.5180" said: > > @Exqq.7451 said: > > Interesting. Renegade runes recommended. Also, why does thief have like 5 different build benchmarks? From what I have been reading here Power Reaper and Power Scourge are around where the low end Thief benchmarks are. I'll never understand why people take these guys as gospel. Discuss. > > > > https://qtfy.eu/guildwars/benchmarks-path-of-fire/ > > > > Edit: Also, they tested Firebrand with Viper because the tester was too poor to get Grieving and does not have Legendary according to their reddit posting. > > I'd like to see them re-run that with Nightmare/Trapper, personally. I'm not sure the additional 100 condition damage +7% is worth the 25% duration loss on burns, torment, and poison (and 5% on bleeds). They did, actually. They compared Renegade to Nightmare/Trapper to Tormenting runes, and the difference between them were quite small. So yes they did give up 25% burn and torment duration for the +7% condition damage modifier for an overall small increase in dps. Here's a comment from one of the qT members in the reddit thread: >You overcap bleeding with the nightmare/trapper setup slightly and keeping up more than 2 shards on certain points is kinda overcap with 89.80% Condi Duration (full viper + sinister boots). Split phases or certain mechanics on same raid bosses bring you back to 3 viable shades ammo. You also gain an 7% modifier with the renegade rune and dont overcap bleeding anymore. The difference between the setups isnt that big like some people would think. Compared on most logs between the 3 viable setups (tormenting rune still doesnt work with the punishment heal) the damage difference was between 500dps. I used the shadow fiend cuz it's doing passive more dps than using the poison cloud active for an dmg increase. On most raid bosses you would take epidemic over shadow fiend for the cleave. :) I'll stick with Nightmare+Trapper since I run fractals as well, and the increased duration for other conditions (such as fear) would generally be more useful over 500 more dps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drarnor Kunoram.5180 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 But... you can't keep two shades up constantly, let alone three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexan.5930 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 this makes me very happy as now maybe the vast majority of people wont be spitting on necro's all the time. Wait until people realise that was can heal and might gen at the same time while still putting out power damage and then we might even have people looking for ps necro's (i can dream) i like how they have a disclaimer about these benchmarks being in a vacume and how it's not perfect and as long as people play their builds a lot is viable, but we all know no one reads that far. They only want speed, who cares about if people know the mechanics as long as they have a "meta" build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirPrizeBartSachs.4670 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 Yup, in their rotation video you can see the number of shades dips down to 1 occasionally, but never for long. It does assume there is a chrono giving permanent alacrity, so one constant shade would be a far more reasonable assumption for most people. That's a loss of 5% condition duration, and bleeding wouldn't even be capped anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexan.5930 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 > @Exqq.7451 said: > Interesting. Renegade runes recommended. Also, why does thief have like 5 different build benchmarks? From what I have been reading here Power Reaper and Power Scourge are around where the low end Thief benchmarks are. I'll never understand why people take these guys as gospel. Discuss. > > https://qtfy.eu/guildwars/benchmarks-path-of-fire/ > > Edit: Also, they tested Firebrand with Viper because the tester was too poor to get Grieving and does not have Legendary according to their reddit posting. i've done some theory crafting on the build website and for the most part berzerker or renegade is pretty close to each other. I would bet the power would push base dps a bit higher than ferocity unless you have fury all the time. The extra 2% condi dmg from the runes adds like .5% condition durration from passive traits. and yea people spit on power necro because you know, its a necro. But power scourge can do some pretty good damage especially in multi target situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exqq.7451 Posted October 5, 2017 Author Share Posted October 5, 2017 > @LamaLeif.5381 said: > > @Exqq.7451 said: > > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > > @Zenith.7301 said: > > > > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > > > 7 mesmer becnhmarks. They do love their mesmers... > > > > > > > > > > Hurray for DPS though. Inb4 nerfs. > > > > > > > > They're condi and power variants of chrono, condi variant of mirage, and power mesmer. All of which are used builds. What build other than scourge or condi reaper is a necro build used in raids? > > > > > > > > You have some nerve to be complaining when you got an apex elite dps spec with utility and godly cleave, while the mesmer's mirage is just a garbage single target ramp up version that does 4k less DPS than you, doesn't cleave, and offers zero utility. > > > > > > > > Mesmer is the single class thus far without a competitive DPS build for a raid. > > > > > > Ok, if you want to take my kitten attempts at humor that seriously... > > > > > > 6 of those builds are effectively one and the same chrono buff bot with various degrees of kitten damage. Yet they found the time to test them all. > > > > > > Then there's mirage, combining middle of the road damage with non-existant survivability and being bugged up the kitten. Yet there it is, tested. > > > > > > And then there's one necro build. 1. Not even consideration given to any form of power builds. "Oh, but power necros suck!" So does the majority of those 7 mesmer builds. Not even consideration given to Scourge support. "Oh, but Scourge support sucks!" So does Mirage DPS. Or support Herald. Yet there they are. kitten, even for one benchmark they did bother testing they got gearing wrong. Quality effort from our meta overlords! And THOSE guys get to determine whether necro is taken or not into PVE groups. Guys that can't even be bothered to test necro to the degree they test their mains. Would they completely fail at that 1 benchmark they did, they would say "oh well, Scourge is unviable", and then entire PVE community would roll with it despite any evidence to the contrary. Awesome. > > > > So much this. They know the community looks to them as gospel so I feel they should definately keep that in mind. > > > > 4 listed thief specs even though only 1 is META(lulz) and they even post (solo) builds for thief. > > > > 8 Ele builds with 1 even as low as 27k. > > > > 5 Guard builds even as low as 33k. > > > > We should definately have at least a Condi Reaper listed. I would even go so far as to say we should have Power Scourge listed as I have seen posts with it at 31-34k which is MORE than viable. They basically shoehorn necro into one role because they hate it and the rest of the community follows like lemmings. And while barrier is not “wanted” how much easier would a raid be with 4 necro dps spamming barriers on the raid and with the healing and doing extremely competent dps. Meanwhile the community continues to think one shot glass Weaver is the only viable dps because it is “higher”. That is not their fault. But, either only provide the one recommended meta build and thats it, or provide all viable builds. > > > > > > > > > > If you had read the info supplied with the builds you would know things, and knowing things would stop you from making yourself look clueless and hateful on the forum. Not sure how I look hateful but if I did, well, my bad. Secondly, could you point to which information you are talking about on the info supplied with the builds? I looked through [qT] site and all I could find was surface quality information and build links. If I missed something I would certainly take a look and better inform myself. Again, I was not saying any of what they give is incorrect, just that I feel it should be either: A... more comprehensive or B... only show the one META variant. Because, showing several variants for one class and only one variant for another could certainly lead members of the community to believe that a profession only has one viable build, when this is certainly not the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RabbitUp.8294 Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 > @Exqq.7451 said: > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > @Zenith.7301 said: > > > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > > 7 mesmer becnhmarks. They do love their mesmers... > > > > > > > > Hurray for DPS though. Inb4 nerfs. > > > > > > They're condi and power variants of chrono, condi variant of mirage, and power mesmer. All of which are used builds. What build other than scourge or condi reaper is a necro build used in raids? > > > > > > You have some nerve to be complaining when you got an apex elite dps spec with utility and godly cleave, while the mesmer's mirage is just a garbage single target ramp up version that does 4k less DPS than you, doesn't cleave, and offers zero utility. > > > > > > Mesmer is the single class thus far without a competitive DPS build for a raid. > > > > Ok, if you want to take my kitten attempts at humor that seriously... > > > > 6 of those builds are effectively one and the same chrono buff bot with various degrees of kitten damage. Yet they found the time to test them all. > > > > Then there's mirage, combining middle of the road damage with non-existant survivability and being bugged up the kitten. Yet there it is, tested. > > > > And then there's one necro build. 1. Not even consideration given to any form of power builds. "Oh, but power necros suck!" So does the majority of those 7 mesmer builds. Not even consideration given to Scourge support. "Oh, but Scourge support sucks!" So does Mirage DPS. Or support Herald. Yet there they are. kitten, even for one benchmark they did bother testing they got gearing wrong. Quality effort from our meta overlords! And THOSE guys get to determine whether necro is taken or not into PVE groups. Guys that can't even be bothered to test necro to the degree they test their mains. Would they completely fail at that 1 benchmark they did, they would say "oh well, Scourge is unviable", and then entire PVE community would roll with it despite any evidence to the contrary. Awesome. > > So much this. They know the community looks to them as gospel so I feel they should definately keep that in mind. > > 4 listed thief specs even though only 1 is META(lulz) and they even post (solo) builds for thief. > > 8 Ele builds with 1 even as low as 27k. > > 5 Guard builds even as low as 33k. > > We should definately have at least a Condi Reaper listed. I would even go so far as to say we should have Power Scourge listed as I have seen posts with it at 31-34k which is MORE than viable. They basically shoehorn necro into one role because they hate it and the rest of the community follows like lemmings. And while barrier is not “wanted” how much easier would a raid be with 4 necro dps spamming barriers on the raid and with the healing and doing extremely competent dps. Meanwhile the community continues to think one shot glass Weaver is the only viable dps because it is “higher”. That is not their fault. But, either only provide the one recommended meta build and thats it, or provide all viable builds. You could at least make an effort to understand why some otherwise similar builds are listed multiple times. Ele and Guardian have seperate big hitbox benchmarks. If another class had this discrepancy between hitbox sizes, they would be listed multiple times, too. DH at 33k is not low, and it's the only low hitbox benchmark on the table. The 27k Tempest benchmark is not listed as a viable build, but as a counterpart to the same build on big hitbox, so that people can know how the build performs on different bosses. The solo build for condiDD is only for benchmarking purposes, so that you don't need 4 other people to share venoms to if you want to test DD on your own. The chrono benchmarks are copypasted from previous benchmarks, and they are there as reference, since all 4 builds are used. You use just being vitriolic for no good reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exqq.7451 Posted October 6, 2017 Author Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @RabbitUp.8294 said: > > @Exqq.7451 said: > > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > > @Zenith.7301 said: > > > > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > > > 7 mesmer becnhmarks. They do love their mesmers... > > > > > > > > > > Hurray for DPS though. Inb4 nerfs. > > > > > > > > They're condi and power variants of chrono, condi variant of mirage, and power mesmer. All of which are used builds. What build other than scourge or condi reaper is a necro build used in raids? > > > > > > > > You have some nerve to be complaining when you got an apex elite dps spec with utility and godly cleave, while the mesmer's mirage is just a garbage single target ramp up version that does 4k less DPS than you, doesn't cleave, and offers zero utility. > > > > > > > > Mesmer is the single class thus far without a competitive DPS build for a raid. > > > > > > Ok, if you want to take my kitten attempts at humor that seriously... > > > > > > 6 of those builds are effectively one and the same chrono buff bot with various degrees of kitten damage. Yet they found the time to test them all. > > > > > > Then there's mirage, combining middle of the road damage with non-existant survivability and being bugged up the kitten. Yet there it is, tested. > > > > > > And then there's one necro build. 1. Not even consideration given to any form of power builds. "Oh, but power necros suck!" So does the majority of those 7 mesmer builds. Not even consideration given to Scourge support. "Oh, but Scourge support sucks!" So does Mirage DPS. Or support Herald. Yet there they are. kitten, even for one benchmark they did bother testing they got gearing wrong. Quality effort from our meta overlords! And THOSE guys get to determine whether necro is taken or not into PVE groups. Guys that can't even be bothered to test necro to the degree they test their mains. Would they completely fail at that 1 benchmark they did, they would say "oh well, Scourge is unviable", and then entire PVE community would roll with it despite any evidence to the contrary. Awesome. > > > > So much this. They know the community looks to them as gospel so I feel they should definately keep that in mind. > > > > 4 listed thief specs even though only 1 is META(lulz) and they even post (solo) builds for thief. > > > > 8 Ele builds with 1 even as low as 27k. > > > > 5 Guard builds even as low as 33k. > > > > We should definately have at least a Condi Reaper listed. I would even go so far as to say we should have Power Scourge listed as I have seen posts with it at 31-34k which is MORE than viable. They basically shoehorn necro into one role because they hate it and the rest of the community follows like lemmings. And while barrier is not “wanted” how much easier would a raid be with 4 necro dps spamming barriers on the raid and with the healing and doing extremely competent dps. Meanwhile the community continues to think one shot glass Weaver is the only viable dps because it is “higher”. That is not their fault. But, either only provide the one recommended meta build and thats it, or provide all viable builds. > > You could at least make an effort to understand why some otherwise similar builds are listed multiple times. > > Ele and Guardian have seperate big hitbox benchmarks. If another class had this discrepancy between hitbox sizes, they would be listed multiple times, too. > > DH at 33k is not low, and it's the only low hitbox benchmark on the table. The 27k Tempest benchmark is not listed as a viable build, but as a counterpart to the same build on big hitbox, so that people can know how the build performs on different bosses. > > The solo build for condiDD is only for benchmarking purposes, so that you don't need 4 other people to share venoms to if you want to test DD on your own. > > The chrono benchmarks are copypasted from previous benchmarks, and they are there as reference, since all 4 builds are used. > > You use just being vitriolic for no good reason. Yeah, I was. I appreciate the way you went through and explained that. I was clearly being a bit over the top and as my edited comment now shows, a bit full of shitcockery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xarallei.4279 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @Exqq.7451 said: Or support Herald. Yet there they are. > Support Herald isn't listed in the benchmarks at all. And while it is listed as a build the ONLY reason it's there is because it does play a niche role in Deimos (hand kiting) VERY well. It's only meta for that one fight and not effective for everything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldirtbeard.9834 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 > @Exqq.7451 said: > > @Substatic.6958 said: > > So the best raid class, the best wpvp class, the best spvp class. > > > > Yeah, Arenanet is comming with a butcher's knife. It will be swift. > > ***TODAY AT ANET HEADQUARTERS SECRET STAFFING BUNKER*** > {Staffing Leader} Team, welcome back from your weekend. I hope you all enjoy yourselves. > {Team} It was great! > {Staffing Leader} So we have a packed schedule today but none of that matters right now. We have something far more important to discuss as I'm sure most of you are aware. > {Team} Umm... What happened? > {Staffing Leader} As I am sure all of you have seen, [qT] posted their new benchmarks for the community. While I enjoy the community engagement this recent review by them brings to light an absolute failure on our part during the development of this content. Anyone know what I'm talking about? > {Team} Necromancer is posting high results. > {Staffing Leader} Who was responsible for this? > {Team} Jerry was responsible, Sir. > {Staffing Leader} Jerry, get your kitten AND GET OUT OF THE kitten BUILDING! > {Staffing Leader} Now, it isn't too late. Can we fix this? > {Team} YES, SIR! Are you implying that they're down one developer in balance leaving a team of only 2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldirtbeard.9834 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 > @Lalainnia.3598 said: > It's just personal bias really, each of the ppl that post the builds post what they feel is important or not while 2 of those thief builds are pretty meh they work for what its attached to. Like you stated though ppl shouldn't take everything as gospel large portion of the time ppl will use a suggested build and not use it to its full capacity to the point where something like power reaper or power scourge could surpass it. > > All around though its honestly good they do this if anyone remembers why the berserk meta was a thing in dungeons was because you would have like 3-4 ppl in a group with a bunch of pure toughness vit stats and no damage because that's what they used in open world and made them feel safe aka face tank stuff. It even happens in your basic pug group stuff today ppl go into raids with heavy toughness vit or some other non important stat thinking they can fulfill the role of "dps" just based on the class and not the gear. What's great now though is pretty much every single class has something they can play as dps now and pass fights at a healthy pace. Now they just need to work on breaking the double chrono druid and ps warrior set up lol! > > Also hooray for condi scourge being awesome dps Except for us Power Reapers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoM.8396 Posted October 15, 2017 Share Posted October 15, 2017 > @"Drarnor Kunoram.5180" said: > > @Exqq.7451 said: > > Interesting. Renegade runes recommended. Also, why does thief have like 5 different build benchmarks? From what I have been reading here Power Reaper and Power Scourge are around where the low end Thief benchmarks are. I'll never understand why people take these guys as gospel. Discuss. > > > > https://qtfy.eu/guildwars/benchmarks-path-of-fire/ > > > > Edit: Also, they tested Firebrand with Viper because the tester was too poor to get Grieving and does not have Legendary according to their reddit posting. > > I'd like to see them re-run that with Nightmare/Trapper, personally. I'm not sure the additional 100 condition damage +7% is worth the 25% duration loss on burns, torment, and poison (and 5% on bleeds). We ran this we just don't post every single recording to youtube and the site. If it was a better option then we would of posted those runes instead :+1: We test multiple runes and sigils against these builds. We do not pick the first set and go with it. You should join our discord if you haven't and discuss this with Moorbazan from qT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoM.8396 Posted October 15, 2017 Share Posted October 15, 2017 > @Exqq.7451 said: > > @LamaLeif.5381 said: > > > @Exqq.7451 said: > > > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > > > @Zenith.7301 said: > > > > > > @Wintermute.5408 said: > > > > > > 7 mesmer becnhmarks. They do love their mesmers... > > > > > > > > > > > > Hurray for DPS though. Inb4 nerfs. > > > > > > > > > > They're condi and power variants of chrono, condi variant of mirage, and power mesmer. All of which are used builds. What build other than scourge or condi reaper is a necro build used in raids? > > > > > > > > > > You have some nerve to be complaining when you got an apex elite dps spec with utility and godly cleave, while the mesmer's mirage is just a garbage single target ramp up version that does 4k less DPS than you, doesn't cleave, and offers zero utility. > > > > > > > > > > Mesmer is the single class thus far without a competitive DPS build for a raid. > > > > > > > > Ok, if you want to take my kitten attempts at humor that seriously... > > > > > > > > 6 of those builds are effectively one and the same chrono buff bot with various degrees of kitten damage. Yet they found the time to test them all. > > > > > > > > Then there's mirage, combining middle of the road damage with non-existant survivability and being bugged up the kitten. Yet there it is, tested. > > > > > > > > And then there's one necro build. 1. Not even consideration given to any form of power builds. "Oh, but power necros suck!" So does the majority of those 7 mesmer builds. Not even consideration given to Scourge support. "Oh, but Scourge support sucks!" So does Mirage DPS. Or support Herald. Yet there they are. kitten, even for one benchmark they did bother testing they got gearing wrong. Quality effort from our meta overlords! And THOSE guys get to determine whether necro is taken or not into PVE groups. Guys that can't even be bothered to test necro to the degree they test their mains. Would they completely fail at that 1 benchmark they did, they would say "oh well, Scourge is unviable", and then entire PVE community would roll with it despite any evidence to the contrary. Awesome. > > > > > > So much this. They know the community looks to them as gospel so I feel they should definately keep that in mind. > > > > > > 4 listed thief specs even though only 1 is META(lulz) and they even post (solo) builds for thief. > > > > > > 8 Ele builds with 1 even as low as 27k. > > > > > > 5 Guard builds even as low as 33k. > > > > > > We should definately have at least a Condi Reaper listed. I would even go so far as to say we should have Power Scourge listed as I have seen posts with it at 31-34k which is MORE than viable. They basically shoehorn necro into one role because they hate it and the rest of the community follows like lemmings. And while barrier is not “wanted” how much easier would a raid be with 4 necro dps spamming barriers on the raid and with the healing and doing extremely competent dps. Meanwhile the community continues to think one shot glass Weaver is the only viable dps because it is “higher”. That is not their fault. But, either only provide the one recommended meta build and thats it, or provide all viable builds. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you had read the info supplied with the builds you would know things, and knowing things would stop you from making yourself look clueless and hateful on the forum. > > Not sure how I look hateful but if I did, well, my bad. Secondly, could you point to which information you are talking about on the info supplied with the builds? I looked through [qT] site and all I could find was surface quality information and build links. If I missed something I would certainly take a look and better inform myself. > > Again, I was not saying any of what they give is incorrect, just that I feel it should be either: A... more comprehensive or B... only show the one META variant. Because, showing several variants for one class and only one variant for another could certainly lead members of the community to believe that a profession only has one viable build, when this is certainly not the case. The 27k Tempest build is posted because it's useful for fights such as Xera. The thief solo build is to show the difference between venoms and how much DPS they provide when you have a group vs solo. The other thief builds are made with love by Dealthy (thief enthusiast), that is why there is a D/D power deadeye build. Staff DD is there since before Condi thief and hasn't dropped low enough in DPS that we feel it needs to be retired. We have nothing against necro, we even ran a necro raid not too long ago just for fun and testing. It comes down to time and resources. No one has wanted to put in the resources and time to make a build for power necro yet because we know it's mediocre at best. Maybe sometime soon we'll get it done. I encourage you to join our discord and discuss this further in our necromancer theorycrafting channel. Moorbazan is our main necro number cruncher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoM.8396 Posted October 15, 2017 Share Posted October 15, 2017 > @Lexan.5930 said: > > @Exqq.7451 said: > > Interesting. Renegade runes recommended. Also, why does thief have like 5 different build benchmarks? From what I have been reading here Power Reaper and Power Scourge are around where the low end Thief benchmarks are. I'll never understand why people take these guys as gospel. Discuss. > > > > https://qtfy.eu/guildwars/benchmarks-path-of-fire/ > > > > Edit: Also, they tested Firebrand with Viper because the tester was too poor to get Grieving and does not have Legendary according to their reddit posting. > > i've done some theory crafting on the build website and for the most part berzerker or renegade is pretty close to each other. I would bet the power would push base dps a bit higher than ferocity unless you have fury all the time. The extra 2% condi dmg from the runes adds like .5% condition durration from passive traits. > > and yea people spit on power necro because you know, its a necro. But power scourge can do some pretty good damage especially in multi target situations. I advise you to not use gw2skills stat calculations. There are quite a few flaws with it. Your best option is to make a spreadsheet or use DEKeyz spreadsheet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now