Majy.6792

> @"Dantheman.3589" said:

> > @"Majy.6792" said:

> > > @"Vallun.2071" said:

> > > A while ago I made a video to help new players or PvErs get into PvP. Recently I updated the guide and made it text format.

> > >

> > > https://guildjen.com/2020/07/25/beginners-guide-to-gw2-pvp/

> >

> > Great guide. Kind of a silly question but how do you make fast turns without "Use either mouse button to change direction"? Only reason I don't use free camera is because character movement is slow and clumsy for me without that option checked.

>

> That would probably be about face, which you use to automatically turn the other direction. This is very important for more precise movements like reaction based spell usage or kiting. It is also very important for the thief class which is heavily dodge based and let you use the “roll skills” in the direction you want without the risk of losing movement efficiency and all you need to use this is bind a key to the command.

> Free camera is actually better so that you can see what’s going on around you also, so I would recommend you experiment with it. You don’t have to take it until you fully figure out how to use it and also possibly when you get all you keybinds and settings under control

I'm talking more just turning in general. With the "use mouse button" setting I can make quick turns just by holding my mouse, but turns are very slow with that off and you can't use that and free camera. I'm sure I'm missing something obvious but yea, with free camera on I can only make these big wide turns and it's hard to be precise with movement.

> @"Vallun.2071" said:

> A while ago I made a video to help new players or PvErs get into PvP. Recently I updated the guide and made it text format.

>

> https://guildjen.com/2020/07/25/beginners-guide-to-gw2-pvp/

Great guide. Kind of a silly question but how do you make fast turns without "Use either mouse button to change direction"? Only reason I don't use free camera is because character movement is slow and clumsy for me without that option checked.

> @"Tinkerer.2167" said:

> > @"Majy.6792" said:

> > > @"Asum.4960" said:

> > > > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > > > > @"Asum.4960" said:

> > > > > > @"Vancho.8750" said:

> > > > > > > @"Asum.4960" said:

> > > > > > > While I do agree that Necro needs some weapon based mobility so not every build ever relies on Flesh Wurm + Spectral Walk just to somewhat imitate the baseline mobility of everything else (still with the caveat of needing to be set up), this is way too much.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > As compensation for the Shroud health bar I'd much rather get some duration blocks and invulns in the kit, rather than teleports and stealth all over the place.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In general though I don't understand why Anet struggles so much with Necro all these years, when they have shown with Holosmith and Mallyx/Corruption that they can make Reaper and Scourge concepts work better, if not bound by their silly idea of what Necro is supposed to be.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You can't design a profession to be completely defenseless and immobile, and still have it be good without being way overbearing in some other aspect, like Scourge absolutely relying on overbearing AoE spam - or being utterly useless.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Just give it some slight scaling defenses and mobility already and then balance it around the same tools everybody else but Necro has, rather than just loading up shroud mechanics with the majority of Necro's power, and then going back and forth from overbaring to useless over and over again. It's faulty design.

> > > > > > I don't think most necro weapons need mobility since most of them are ranged.

> > > > > > Maybe Greatsword needs a little dash on death spiral like 300 or 450 range one , I know that Grasping darkness is supposed to be the gap closer skill but it bugs out constantly, and maybe little bit bigger radius on gravedigger(but that just wishfull thinking).

> > > > > > Maybe daggers can get movement ability but they are kinda weird since they are melee but also ranged.

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > It's less so about gap closers for me than about escapes. There is a reason most Necro builds are stuck with Wurm and Walk, since when you get jumped as Necro there are just no tools to escape and very few to make yourself properly unattractive as target.

> > > > > I think core Shroud since the damage nerfs is about the only thing that makes people think twice about running a train over Necro since launch, except maybe PoF launch state Scourge by merits of sheer AoE pressure, but that's not a healthy was of doing things.

> > > > >

> > > > > Most Necro weapons feel incredibly clunky to me to defend yourself with, especially melee and against multiple targets (except for maybe spamming Staff Marks and then that's it), yet there aren't really any tools to get out of situations like that aside from having a Flesh Wurm setup somewhere - or godlike kiting to try to never get into them in the first place.

> > > > > That's the biggest problem with necro to me, it's combination of lack of escapes, lack of scaling defenses and lack of point blank AoE pressure (outside of Shroud) make it just so incredibly easy to run into the ground without a chance.

> > > > >

> > > > > Plenty other professions have ranged weapons with escape tools, or at the very least a melee set to swap to for mobility/mitigation, or at the very very least, massive AoE pressure (and being supported by active defense in the Utility slots). Necro only has the binary Shroud which is either on or off, and most problematically has the same counter as if it weren't there - just keep running the Nec over like a train and CC. Same with Lich.

> > > > >

> > > > > The answer to everything a profession can do shouldn't be the same, to just pile on, otherwise it's fairly unengaging both to play and play against, at least imo.

> > > >

> > > > Necro is a attractive target to teams because they hit hard and have very high in fight sustain, a oh kitten reliable escape is not there for a reason, only having a preplanned escape makes more sense balance wise.

> > >

> > > Necro is an attractive target because it doesn't have escapes/scaling mitigation.

> > >

> > > If you focus the Ranger they can zoom away, block, stealth, immob and run etc.

> > > If you focus the Engie they can invuln, stealth, zoom away, etc.

> > > If you focus the Guard they can break focus with invuln at least, Stab/blocks to cover escapes

> > > If you focus the Thief they can stealth and port away and will on the other side of the map pressuring a point before you know if they even really disengaged

> > > If you focus Rev they can block, damage convert, have evade tools

> > > If you focus Mes they can stealth blink, spam so many visual clutter clones you might prefer to jam a spike up your eyes over keeping to play

> > > If you focus War they can block, damage convert, zoom away

> > > If you focus Ele they can spam so many evades and invulns you might as well go make a sandwich

> > > If you focus Necro, they are dead and you outnumber the enemy.

> > >

> > > That's the main difference. Not Necro's hitting way harder than other professions or having more in fight sustain, which isn't true.

> > >

> > > Besides, I'm not arguing to just load up Necro with escape tools and leaving it as is. I specifically said to introduce a small number of which one may have access to one at a time for any given build, so they can then take power out of Shroud and reevaluate the Shroud - non Shroud balance and gameplay feel, so it's less Necro On, Necro Off, and engaging to play and fight both times, without having to be overbearing or antifun to be viable despite it's design shortcomings.

> >

> > Definitely. Necro has at most 2 escapes they can take, and one (walk) isn't really an escape because if you are in a position where you can't use terrain to your advantage it doesn't do you any good. Wurm only goes on cd when used, meaning you have minimally 30 seconds before you get any kind of escape after using it. Every other class -- and I mean EVERY other class -- has a mobility escape on short cd. Some have multiple. Try catching a warrior who wants to run away, maybe ranger can keep up, no one else. Necro can not only not escape, but they can not pursue. They can't pursue and have low sustain unless shroud is stacked, meaning it's very easy to disengage and come back to them and kill them. The damage a necro does (which let's be fair is less than several other classes even as reaper) is not nearly enough to warrant the near complete lack of mobility. There's a reason why the best necros are all playing holo right now.

>

> mobility doesn't always mean good and there's usually tradeoffs. with necro what would you trade?

>

> ranger, warrior, thief, ele, mes have decent mobility but no where close to necro team fight potential and necro is still over them in team fight meta which tells you something about just having mobility. there's one class that doesn't have insane mobility (without a target) and that's guardian, but they don't have team fight presence either , look where they are in the meta.

>

> the only reason thief is in the meta is due to roaming/decapping/+1 because of that mobility and that's it, that's a big role in conquest though so while it's annoying you can almost never 1v1 or team fight effectively outside of picking and prodding it still has a firm position in the meta. in fact necro beats out most classes for team fight presence, this is without mobility, giving it mobility would arguably make it better than nade holo and it's completely busted, i speak mostly obviously on reaper but core necro is good against specific comps too.

>

> would you want necro to just be a roamer / decapper / +1 spec with that added mobility? you have to have a tradeoff for being probably the biggest oppressive team fighter in the game atm, the one class that has both atm is nade holo (and even then even nade holo doesn't have as much in team-fight sustain as necro by far) and with the holo leap nerf now you have to somewhat think when to use the leap because it has important mobility reduction condi removal tied to it w/ zephyr trait instead of mindlessly spam it even though it's still busted the nerf didn't change much.

I'm not saying necro is terribly weak but outside of shroud they get demolished quickly because they lack any kind of defensive measures past a very brief fear or two. You can't even think about entering a team fight unless you have some life force built up, and even with shroud a single holo or ranger can push you out of a team fight rather quickly if they hard focus you. I think necro does a lot of things well, but nothing great. The problem is that other classes do some things great, even if they might do other things poorly. That gives them more specialized utility which necro generally lacks. I don't have the solution, it probably requires a large mechanic or ability overhaul, such as re-working shroud entirely. As it stands, necro is generally a tier 2 pick in every category. I actually think necro in both pvp and pve is lacking in the same way... can hold its own but will never be your best pick.

> @"Asum.4960" said:

> > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > > @"Asum.4960" said:

> > > > @"Vancho.8750" said:

> > > > > @"Asum.4960" said:

> > > > > While I do agree that Necro needs some weapon based mobility so not every build ever relies on Flesh Wurm + Spectral Walk just to somewhat imitate the baseline mobility of everything else (still with the caveat of needing to be set up), this is way too much.

> > > > >

> > > > > As compensation for the Shroud health bar I'd much rather get some duration blocks and invulns in the kit, rather than teleports and stealth all over the place.

> > > > >

> > > > > In general though I don't understand why Anet struggles so much with Necro all these years, when they have shown with Holosmith and Mallyx/Corruption that they can make Reaper and Scourge concepts work better, if not bound by their silly idea of what Necro is supposed to be.

> > > > >

> > > > > You can't design a profession to be completely defenseless and immobile, and still have it be good without being way overbearing in some other aspect, like Scourge absolutely relying on overbearing AoE spam - or being utterly useless.

> > > > >

> > > > > Just give it some slight scaling defenses and mobility already and then balance it around the same tools everybody else but Necro has, rather than just loading up shroud mechanics with the majority of Necro's power, and then going back and forth from overbaring to useless over and over again. It's faulty design.

> > > > I don't think most necro weapons need mobility since most of them are ranged.

> > > > Maybe Greatsword needs a little dash on death spiral like 300 or 450 range one , I know that Grasping darkness is supposed to be the gap closer skill but it bugs out constantly, and maybe little bit bigger radius on gravedigger(but that just wishfull thinking).

> > > > Maybe daggers can get movement ability but they are kinda weird since they are melee but also ranged.

> > > >

> > >

> > > It's less so about gap closers for me than about escapes. There is a reason most Necro builds are stuck with Wurm and Walk, since when you get jumped as Necro there are just no tools to escape and very few to make yourself properly unattractive as target.

> > > I think core Shroud since the damage nerfs is about the only thing that makes people think twice about running a train over Necro since launch, except maybe PoF launch state Scourge by merits of sheer AoE pressure, but that's not a healthy was of doing things.

> > >

> > > Most Necro weapons feel incredibly clunky to me to defend yourself with, especially melee and against multiple targets (except for maybe spamming Staff Marks and then that's it), yet there aren't really any tools to get out of situations like that aside from having a Flesh Wurm setup somewhere - or godlike kiting to try to never get into them in the first place.

> > > That's the biggest problem with necro to me, it's combination of lack of escapes, lack of scaling defenses and lack of point blank AoE pressure (outside of Shroud) make it just so incredibly easy to run into the ground without a chance.

> > >

> > > Plenty other professions have ranged weapons with escape tools, or at the very least a melee set to swap to for mobility/mitigation, or at the very very least, massive AoE pressure (and being supported by active defense in the Utility slots). Necro only has the binary Shroud which is either on or off, and most problematically has the same counter as if it weren't there - just keep running the Nec over like a train and CC. Same with Lich.

> > >

> > > The answer to everything a profession can do shouldn't be the same, to just pile on, otherwise it's fairly unengaging both to play and play against, at least imo.

> >

> > Necro is a attractive target to teams because they hit hard and have very high in fight sustain, a oh kitten reliable escape is not there for a reason, only having a preplanned escape makes more sense balance wise.

>

> Necro is an attractive target because it doesn't have escapes/scaling mitigation.

>

> If you focus the Ranger they can zoom away, block, stealth, immob and run etc.

> If you focus the Engie they can invuln, stealth, zoom away, etc.

> If you focus the Guard they can break focus with invuln at least, Stab/blocks to cover escapes

> If you focus the Thief they can stealth and port away and will on the other side of the map pressuring a point before you know if they even really disengaged

> If you focus Rev they can block, damage convert, have evade tools

> If you focus Mes they can stealth blink, spam so many visual clutter clones you might prefer to jam a spike up your eyes over keeping to play

> If you focus War they can block, damage convert, zoom away

> If you focus Ele they can spam so many evades and invulns you might as well go make a sandwich

> If you focus Necro, they are dead and you outnumber the enemy.

>

> That's the main difference. Not Necro's hitting way harder than other professions or having more in fight sustain, which isn't true.

>

> Besides, I'm not arguing to just load up Necro with escape tools and leaving it as is. I specifically said to introduce a small number of which one may have access to one at a time for any given build, so they can then take power out of Shroud and reevaluate the Shroud - non Shroud balance and gameplay feel, so it's less Necro On, Necro Off, and engaging to play and fight both times, without having to be overbearing or antifun to be viable despite it's design shortcomings.

Definitely. Necro has at most 2 escapes they can take, and one (walk) isn't really an escape because if you are in a position where you can't use terrain to your advantage it doesn't do you any good. Wurm only goes on cd when used, meaning you have minimally 30 seconds before you get any kind of escape after using it. Every other class -- and I mean EVERY other class -- has a mobility escape on short cd. Some have multiple. Try catching a warrior who wants to run away, maybe ranger can keep up, no one else. Necro can not only not escape, but they can not pursue. They can't pursue and have low sustain unless shroud is stacked, meaning it's very easy to disengage and come back to them and kill them. The damage a necro does (which let's be fair is less than several other classes even as reaper) is not nearly enough to warrant the near complete lack of mobility. There's a reason why the best necros are all playing holo right now.

Going to play my last game(s) Saturday morning/early afternoon ET for the season, playing til I lose. Anyone want to duo? 1568 current mmr. Mail me or reply here.

Bumping, mail me or reply here if interested.

Way too easy to use it at an inopportune time, really doesn't guarantee you anything on any 5v5 map because it's very slow and easy to LoS. Makes you incredibly vulnerable to being targeted. Crazy long CD. Stability is easily corrupted. It's one of the easiest abilities in the game to notice when it has been used and when it wears off so reflects, blocks, immunity etc. are very easy to time to counter the damage.

I don't think it's the most gracefully designed elite, but as others have said if you think it's OP that probably says more about your skill than anything else.

Nope nevermind I see a couple back now, probably just fell off bc they're so bad they still lose games even with hacking.

Noticed a few very obvious hackers who were on the leaderboards nowhere in sight anymore. Wondering if Anet is silently doing justice, like Batman.

The forum is dead and of course lfg is dead. Would love to find a duo partner around my skill level and people to play tourney's with somewhat regularly, but have been striking out.

Ignore this post

> @"DonNee.5128" said:

> if you got bumped out of the top 250 you won't get in if others lose

> what happened here is that few people got higher rating than you and then lost again - but that does not bring you up again it will still keep thier spot

> sometimes you can see that the player at #250 has about 10 less rating than #249

Interesting, does that remain true for rewards? Like if someone has a lower rating than me at the end of season but they're "fresh" on the leaderboard, do they get the rewards and I would not?

Earlier today at 1517 MMR I was rank 246. Right now rank 237 has 1517 but I'm no longer on the board at all. What causes getting pushed off the board altogether despite having the games played and MMR, and does it stop happening at a certain MMR?

You ever find someone to play with / still looking?

> @"Kuma.1503" said:

> I've been noticing game quality steadily declining ever since the Feb, 25 patch drop.

>

> It was fun initially, but that was largely due to the increased playerbase. Everyone wanted to at least test out the new changes. Time carried on, Anet nerfed a few builds and classes into the ground causing some players to quit (Scrapper, Mesmer). Others quit because of the slower pace. Others, because of the prevalence of Condis and AoE spam. ~~Others because Immob ranger is the most infuriating thing to fight in this game~~.

>

> Point being, the playerbase dwindles, matchmaking becomes worse.

>

> I had a very annoying series of losses just two nights ago because Anet matched me and my duo with the same 3 players (one of which was a bot) vs the same 5 players who were clearly above our team (and bot's) skill level.

>

> No one likes one sided matches. It's frustrating when you lose 50/500 and unsatisfying when you win 500/50.

>

I've learned pvp in this game has a meta game which is knowing when to queue. Got a bot or a hacker in a game? Very clear sign to stop playing. Even if in the game you play it works to your advantage, the next game you may be on the opposite side of things. I also stop queueing when it feels like games are way too lopsided. I find my win rate is overall better & I have more fun when I'm playing games that feel close or at least like both teams had decent players. The worst is when you wind up 5 games in a row with players who are not bots but may as well be, against top 250 players.

Gotta know when to just stop and come back to it. Helps the sanity. This is also how I ultimately was able to stop myself from ping ponging between 1300 and 1500 and actually break into plat. Having played against enough top players I knew my skill level was on par with many of them, but if you're solo queue and playing during bouts of bots/afks/bad matchmaking, you're just playing a game of roulette and the house is NOT in your favor.

You probably played at a favorable time. Some times of the day are easier, some are fairer. The population of players is low so you tend to run into the same players over and over again. When you went through placement you probably were playing a time favorable to your actual skill level, and that may have been true thereafter. When you tanked you probably played at a time either with much better players coming through or where matchmaking was super wonky because of few active players on.

> @"Khalisto.5780" said:

> > @"Majy.6792" said:

> > Hackers and afks are ruining my life. Literally been 1 game from plat 4 times in the last week and all 4 times either had a hacker or an afk or both ruin it for me. In my last game which was 20m ago, 1 win from plat, I had a ranger who afk'd because he thought our thief was hacking.

>

> There's one more thing, duoq, you're already high enough to be matched with top 50 duo which will ruin your game unless rng gods put you in their team

Yea I'm well aware of this. I've played (and won) against plenty of top 20 players. But inevitably have hit losing streaks where it feels like my team are half bots. I stopped playing after that loss because usually something like that happening is a sign of game quality about to deteriorate rapidly. Try again tomorrow.

> @"aelska.4609" said:

> What you are complaining about is accurate. But it is not the problem, it is the consequence.

> Player base has never been so small for thousands reasons (balance, toxicity, rewards, team q vs solo, ...). It would take unreasonable amount of time for the matchmaker to find enough players of the same ranking for both teams.

> So it ends up in 2 high elo players facing 2 others, with less experienced players all around. It is frustrating for both sides: high elo will get frustrated by the mistakes low elo people make, while low elo people will either be annoyed by toxicity of high elo people, or annoyed to get farmed by the other team's good players. Unfortunately, there is no solution for that besides fixing the root of the problem, which anet refuses to do.

Removing duo queue is probably the only thing they can realistically do. This will allow more precise splitting of player ability levels.

Hackers and afks are ruining my life. Literally been 1 game from plat 4 times in the last week and all 4 times either had a hacker or an afk or both ruin it for me. In my last game which was 20m ago, 1 win from plat, I had a ranger who afk'd because he thought our thief was hacking.

> @"Shiyo.3578" said:

> > @"Majy.6792" said:

> > There's also no real difference in ranked between 1450 and 1800 US. Skill of the top 3 players is the same as anyone at the top of gold as far as I see. I've seen plenty of gold players who are way better than people I've played against in the top 20. The games feel exactly the same and at 1450+ you start getting queued against top players all the time so that makes sense. Duo queue kind of breaks the pvp game in general, but the state of ranks in ranked is silly.

>

> The first part is untrue but the 2nd is 100% accurate. NA1450 is nothing but rank1 duos over and over gate keeping most people from plat.

I didn't mean it as a rule. I've played against the top players, I think at least all of the top 20 at this point, and have had more or similar trouble with plenty of people way lower. I'd bet anything most people in top 20 wouldn't be top 20 if they were solo queueing. Having two very good players in a game where you might only get matched against good players is powerful.

> @"Shiyo.3578" said:

> > @"Tayga.3192" said:

> > Guild Wars 2 matchmaking is balanced around 50% winrate.

> >

> > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/PvP_Matchmaking_Algorithm

>

> When I was nearing Plat2 it put me against the #1 on the leaderboard with another legendary duo he queued with. I was with all golds and lost 0-500. I lost 29 points

> Next match I win and gain 12 points.

> You think this made me want to keep playing? Nope, I stopped.

>

> At 50% win rate, if I keep playing, I'll eventually drop down to gold. For most people, playing will make them drop down to gold. 50% win rate ensures nearly everyone is stuck in gold.

> That means the matchmaker does not function with the current ranking/division system.

At least you're plat 2. I literally can't climb into plat without beating multiple teams of top 20 duos, and often I get put with all golds against them. Around 1450 it starts matching you with and against top players regularly, but if you don't get a good streak of "with" then you wind up "against" and often against means you don't have any top players on your team, usually all golds, maybe someone in the 150-250 bracket.

There's also no real difference in ranked between 1450 and 1800 US. Skill of the top 3 players is the same as anyone at the top of gold as far as I see. I've seen plenty of gold players who are way better than people I've played against in the top 20. The games feel exactly the same and at 1450+ you start getting queued against top players all the time so that makes sense. Duo queue kind of breaks the pvp game in general, but the state of ranks in ranked is silly.

>> 50/50 is literally the main indicator of perfect placement. I'm sorry you thought this was an arguable opinion.

You can keep a top 10 player 50/50 at bronze with the right algorithm. You didn't even read what I wrote, why are you bothering to post? Cool guy.

> @"Brimstone Jack.3462" said:

> If your win/loss rate is about 50/50, +/- 5-10, matchmaking is working as intended. Get better.

I don't think that's really an indicator of a good system though. Nobody can carry in a 5 person game at a certain level alone, so the matchmaking system is really important in terms of getting people to their appropriate skill level. If the system just says "everybody needs to be 50/50", then from wherever you place it's just going to ping pong you forever by forcibly placing you with shittier players in the hopes you lose because you have been winning too much. And frankly, this may be how it actually works, and why pvp is so streaky and so many people report going on 10-15 game win streaks follows by 10-15 game loss streaks. I've actually NEVER had a time period that feels 50/50 like "oh yea, I'm at my level", it's always win or loss trains. I've won many games against top 10 players, and many 1v1's against them, but I ping pong between 1350 and 1500 back and forth. Win streaks inevitably get broken, more often than not by bots or an afk, and then the loss streak begins where all of a sudden the players I'm matched with are of a totally different caliber.

I don't know how the matchmaking system works, but it's definitely not a good system. All the top players are forced to duo to remain at the top, that alone says a lot about how fair it is to an individual player.

Removing duo queue would be a good start. Top players duo together, and since match making is uneven this results in a lot of games with 2 excellent players up against a team of average to bad players which creates very lopsided games regularly.