Remove Reward PiPs for losing

[Ithilwen.1529]

**The reward for the losing team is more-or-less payment for participating. It's not rewarding failure, It's making playing worthwhile.** Professional sports in the real world also have payment for participation.

 

The loss of pips was one of the things that made the first several seasons as toxic as they were. *If there is no reward for losing,(participating,) people simply won't play.* That's doubly true when PuGs face pre-mades.

 

In practice, objectivist thinking ( such as "pure" competition ) falls on it's face. It was this kind of thinking that produced the "competitive" matchmaking and win streak bonuses in the early seasons.

[rwolf.9571]

With a dwindling pvp population. I'd probably stop playing ranked at that point. And I'm sure pvp needs even less population.

[Vendetta.2496]

fully support the OP on this.

[Eddbopkins.2630]

Isnt there a pvp reward track system u get just by playing pvp? The dungon tracks and the map tracks?

I lose alot, and i think the pip syatem should only be for winners. You win you get pip reward track points. Simple and will always promote the best out of people in everygame.

[Master Ketsu.4569]

PiP farmers generally only exist in extremely low elo but it's still annoying.

 

I've heard crazy rumors that over 95% of the playerbase is actually bronze and down there it's just PvE players farming each other. You only don't see it because most people have the sense to check off "Show badge" if they aren't at least gold.

 

 

 

[Juidodin.5829]

> @Aza.2105 said:

> So what happens if you are the players who have a losing streak, where they get 5 losses in a row. A single match is around 12mins and the match queue is 3mins average.

 

5 ? lol more like 15:1 thanks to matchmaker.. tbh I don't even care anymore. I accepted that this buggy crap put me into a certain pool where I will be paired with noobs, loser, and beginner in 90% of the time. luckily it doesn't take long to see if the team sucks, then I go afk watching my shows and don't think twice about it. I'm not playing pvp to carry 4 obstacles all the time. so thank you anet for your useless pvp matchmaker and let me farm my losing afk pips in peace. and no, it's not just in the low divs.. after my 10 ranked matches I usually start in gold 1 or platin 3 and cause matchmaker I normally end the season in silver 3 or bronze 1.

 

[Jojo.6140]

Without the people you might call "PvE-farmers", this gamemode would be even more deserted than it currently is. If anything, they should up the rewards to lure more people in.

[Reaper Alim.4176]

> @BlaqueFyre.5678 said:

> If I was on a loss streak I would do whatever it takes to ensure I win, pretty simple, there are Reward tracks that progress without PiPs and silver given without PiPs those are reward enough for losing, losses should never be rewarded with PiPs.

>

> And Unranked shouldn’t get PiPs either since PiPs are tied to League, it should promote healthy gameplay by making people improve and to fight for their wins/rewards.

>

> Participation award in the form of PiPs should never be given out.

 

I feel the same way as you. However we are the minority. That has this thought pattern in this game. So just do what I do, point and laugh at them. And don't give them any salt. Because feeding these types of players salt just verifies them.

https://imgur.com/lLQEWho

[maxwelgm.4315]

If anything, PiPs should be increased to attract more crowd from the other modes. Winner takes all works fine if you have a large population, but here? That depends on whether or not you want to actually get matches or half-hour queues with the same people every time.

 

I'm on plat myself and only in this for the pips, they are pretty good gold while also having fun. If they take away pips for losing I'm definitely not gonna be able to keep up the constant pace of rewards and will surely leave. I can only assume many players think like this for Anet to even consider giving pips for losses.

 

The other issue is that players are awarded for top stats and such as well, and when losing with top stats it would not only be gravely disappointing not to get pips but also very unfair. The system is okay as it is because if you only lose, it is going to take the whole season just to get close to the last repeatable tier, whereas by winning you get there within 2-3 days and everyone wants the more efficient path (i.e winning). The reasons for salty players and trolls are largely unrelated to giving rewards on a loss. Do not think for a moment these players would not get out of their way to ruin your day, even if this was their one and only reward.

[Seth.8906]

If you lose reward only top score Player?

[maddoctor.2738]

> @Aza.2105 said:

> So what happens if you are the players who have a losing streak, where they get 5 losses in a row. A single match is around 12mins and the match queue is 3mins average. So that's well over a hour of wasted time playing a game were you get nothing from. It would never work. It would make the pvp population smaller than it is now.

>

 

Keep pip rewards for being top player so even if your team is losing, you will do everything you can to at least get top score in one category to get some pips.

[Crystal Black.8190]

> @Dropdown.7460 said:

> Alternatively, instead of using punishment, encourage people to play better: add pip gains for getting closer to 500. The team that wins gets full pips, but the losing team gets more pip rewards based on how close their score was compared to the other team. 28 to 500? 3 pips like normal. 489 to 500? 7 or 8 pips.

>

> Competition doesn't have to mean toxic and it certainly doesn't have to mean all or nothing. The best way to get people to play their best is to offer incentive.

 

That is already the case. You get bonus pips for a close lost match. I dunno how close it needs to be but it happens.

 

 

> @Ithilwen.1529 said:

> **The reward for the losing team is more-or-less payment for participating. It's not rewarding failure, It's making playing worthwhile.** Professional sports in the real world also have payment for participation.

>

> The loss of pips was one of the things that made the first several seasons as toxic as they were. *If there is no reward for losing,(participating,) people simply won't play.* That's doubly true when PuGs face pre-mades.

>

> In practice, objectivist thinking ( such as "pure" competition ) falls on it's face. It was this kind of thinking that produced the "competitive" matchmaking and win streak bonuses in the early seasons.

 

I agree with you here. Not giving pips for losing will just be like the early seasons and lead to more toxic behavior.

It might help to give out a smaller number for unranked games. Like 1 for losing, 3 for winning. So if you are not interested in ranked you can get rewards without forcing someone for it in ranked.

[Zaxares.5419]

As others have said, the problem with removing pips for losing is that it would create a mass exodus of players from the season. The harsh truth is that the vast majority of competitors are there only for their Ascended Shards and tickets. If they can no longer reliably obtain them, they will just shrug and go do something else. And then, welcome back to the Team Queue-era of PvP where you could sit in queue waiting for upwards of 30 minutes (and depending on the time you play, I've heard that Platinum/Legendary players could sometimes go for nearly an hour!) for a single match.

 

If that's really how you think a fun way of spending an afternoon or evening of GW2 should be, spending 2 - 3 hours to maybe only play 3 matches, then sure, go right ahead.

[Malafaia.8903]

> @Juidodin.5829 said:

> > @Aza.2105 said:

> > So what happens if you are the players who have a losing streak, where they get 5 losses in a row. A single match is around 12mins and the match queue is 3mins average.

>

> 5 ? lol more like 15:1 thanks to matchmaker.. tbh I don't even care anymore. I accepted that this buggy crap put me into a certain pool where I will be paired with noobs, loser, and beginner in 90% of the time. luckily it doesn't take long to see if the team sucks, then I go afk watching my shows and don't think twice about it. I'm not playing pvp to carry 4 obstacles all the time. so thank you anet for your useless pvp matchmaker and let me farm my losing afk pips in peace. and no, it's not just in the low divs.. after my 10 ranked matches I usually start in gold 1 or platin 3 and cause matchmaker I normally end the season in silver 3 or bronze 1.

>

 

If you got placed in gold 1 or plat 3 and end up on bronze 1 i'm sorry to tell you: you're the one being carried by placement.

But i'll take it as a "make up story" with heavy doses of salt.

[Sismis.5390]

> @Zaxares.5419 said:

> And then, welcome back to the Team Queue-era of PvP where you could sit in queue waiting for upwards of 30 minutes (and depending on the time you play, I've heard that Platinum/Legendary players could sometimes go for nearly an hour!) for a single match.

>

For info it took from 2 hours and more,but cause that we demanded that we can quene outside of mists.Instead to be afk in the mists doing nothing and talking crap to each other in mist chat or other depending on what as going on.

The reason people are toxic and bad behavior or game play has nothing to do with rewards.End of the days its players ego - personality - psychology that has nothing to do with rewards system.As i wrote some days ago some people after they ego gets a nudge,they go all the way out just to ruin somebody's day.So long there is no real punishment said persons develop rotten and continues with it.And its spreading like plaque currently in pvp scene.That is just simple psychology like in real life we have to get proper punishment for those and it will stop over time.

 

Example of punishment what could be useful is after reporting player with evidence that he gets banned from season.Then we could see in near future an improvement to the toxicity that is going on.

[Imperadordf.2687]

Removing PiPs from losing would certainly make people want to win, and if they lose, they'll flame teammates because they lost. Simple psychology. I think PiPs should be given to the best players or good players of the team, like 1 pip if you did 100K damage, 2 pips for 200k, 1 pips for 4 revives or things like that. That would make people try to play better. No participation, no PiPs. Removing the pips from losing would punish the good players that lost the game.