Vs Ranged?

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

> @"mulzi.8273" said:

> The ranger is the counter class of the necro, no doubt about it. But, why don't we mention a few other facts. For one, a condi mesmer will eat any ranger to death just as much, or more than a ranger will kill a scourge. For another point, when on my scourge, a ranger will win a majority of the time, however, i will win a bigger majority of the time over warrior/guard/engineerng/thief/power reaper/. A scourge is currently anti-melee. The only counter is range. To ask to become anti-range as well is borderline greedy.

>

> Let me put it this way: Let's say we give the scourge/necro an anti-range skill. If this is done, shouldn't we give every melee class some anti-scourge skills to compete with them in this current meta? Would only be fair, as these melee classes would lose the majority of 1v1 against a scourge.

 

Well, Mesmer/Chrono/Mirage have been the most broken 1 Vs 1 condi spec in the game for a LONG time. I would take fighting Scourge every day of the week over Mesmer. Mesmer counters pretty much everyone due to how poorly designed the game is and the fact that Anet seem too scared to actually have skill based gameplay. That doesnt change the fact that the class is full on hard countered by anyone that is ranged. Its not just Ranger that hard counters scourge.

 

Well, i would think of it more on the terms of give them the anti range when you RIGHTFULLY nerf their AoE of death they have around themselves that makes range killing the easiest method. This is something that Mesmer doesnt have. They dont have a weakness. That of course also needs to be heavily changed as well because mindlessly pressing buttons shouldnt mean you win a fight.

 

 

[mulzi.8273]

> @"ArmageddonAsh.6430" said:

> > @"mulzi.8273" said:

> > The ranger is the counter class of the necro, no doubt about it. But, why don't we mention a few other facts. For one, a condi mesmer will eat any ranger to death just as much, or more than a ranger will kill a scourge. For another point, when on my scourge, a ranger will win a majority of the time, however, i will win a bigger majority of the time over warrior/guard/engineerng/thief/power reaper/. A scourge is currently anti-melee. The only counter is range. To ask to become anti-range as well is borderline greedy.

> >

> > Let me put it this way: Let's say we give the scourge/necro an anti-range skill. If this is done, shouldn't we give every melee class some anti-scourge skills to compete with them in this current meta? Would only be fair, as these melee classes would lose the majority of 1v1 against a scourge.

>

> Well, Mesmer/Chrono/Mirage have been the most broken 1 Vs 1 condi spec in the game for a LONG time. I would take fighting Scourge every day of the week over Mesmer. Mesmer counters pretty much everyone due to how poorly designed the game is and the fact that Anet seem too scared to actually have skill based gameplay. That doesnt change the fact that the class is full on hard countered by anyone that is ranged. Its not just Ranger that hard counters scourge.

>

> Well, i would think of it more on the terms of give them the anti range when you RIGHTFULLY nerf their AoE of death they have around themselves that makes range killing the easiest method. This is something that Mesmer doesnt have. They dont have a weakness. That of course also needs to be heavily changed as well because mindlessly pressing buttons shouldnt mean you win a fight.

>

>

 

I agree. My post was to point out that scourge is already dominating melee in the same way range classes dominate scourge. Power reaper (which is my bread and butter) plays a bit differently. While SB/core ranger can be quite the challenge to a power reaper, I find them fun to fight against and usually a skillful fight. a fight against a druid is close to an auto-lost though (ty ancient seeds)

 

As for mesmer, I agree with everything you said. I wont comment much more on the mesmer, as I am bias and loathe the class, both to play against and to play. But I will say this about them: While i am confused on why anet would _buff_ confusion the last patch, I am even more perplexed on why Anet designed the Clones to have the ability to apply condi. Not to mention giving them evades and blocks. and if that isnt enough, lets give them clones/phantasms to screw up the weak tab-targetting system. Oh, and on the off chance all that defense isn't enough, lets give them as much stealth as thief. Almost forgot the portal and teleport as well. Thats one heck of a defense. Then factor in that they have confusion and torment, so you can't move and you cant use skills. Very wierd design decisions.

[JustDemons.4358]

There is simply to much hard-countering out in this game. soft counters would be ok. but if u have 1% chance of killing someone and rely on him to mess up its no balance. scoruge in melee is too strong and on the other hand necro cant do anything above 900 range. hard counters in competive games is always a sign of bad balance.

 

in my opinion the root lies in how pvp works. i dont have the same problems in pvp with range against me as a necro then. if a ranger or thief just dances around me and engage and disengage they lose the cap. or they clown around for so long that my teammates come and help me. in wvw open field they can jump around like they want. they dont "lose" .

 

the most important thing to enjoy wvw is to accept that there are counters and hard counters to your build. if u die to one of those u just can happily live on and dont have to bother and care anymore. try it :>

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

The PP in this game is simply put - Poorly designed. Too much build carrying bad players, Builds that are mindlessly easy to play with the best of everything. Anet decided that the quantity of player was better than the quality of player, the problem is this has only gotten worse since launch. I do think the game is reaching the pivot point. The point where the balance has gotten SO bad that it cant be salvaged. At this point, they WILL lose players if they balance the game around skill rather than build, but they will also lose players if they dont do anything about these face roll builds. The question is - which way will they go!?

 

The problem also is there are too many builds (condi mostly) that have little to no counter at all, Mesmer condi comes to mind. Too much condition burst, too much condition sustain, too much mobility and sustain. Makes them impossible to lock down. On many classes your only option is to run. The problem is knowing you're not running from a better player. You're running from a broken build that Anet has done very little to balance for years.

[Cyrin.1035]

I haven't played Necro enough to know, but would dodge rolling forward, spectral grasping the druid just after it comes out of stealth (and hopefully when it doesn't have stability), then freeze them and obliterate with reaper work?

[KrHome.1920]

> @"Cyrin.1035" said:

> I haven't played Necro enough to know, but would dodge rolling forward, spectral grasping the druid just after it comes out of stealth (and hopefully when it doesn't have stability), then freeze them and obliterate with reaper work?

Soulbeast has more than 10 seconds of direct damage invulnerability while dealing a 1200+ ranged amout of damage you could do PvE raids with. It's broken in open field, because way too forgiving.

 

But on the other hand if you take away his Stone Signet, he is a freekill even for Power Reapers. Just another example of bad balancing. It's a bit like full zerk warriors with a utility bar full of invulnerabilities and stun breaks. They have a huge window where they can go full "idiot mode" (like someone else said in another thread) and after that they are as dangerous as an ambient creature - but in a 1v1 you are usually already dead at this point.

 

TL;DR: We don't have a Reaper/Necro issue here.

 

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

> @"Cyrin.1035" said:

> I haven't played Necro enough to know, but would dodge rolling forward, spectral grasping the druid just after it comes out of stealth (and hopefully when it doesn't have stability), then freeze them and obliterate with reaper work?

 

That wont do much, huge cool down, just on my Soul beast i havce several skills to counter pulls such as evade backwards, stealth, kncokbacks and such that a single pull wont really do much. Plus being 1,00 Vs 1,500 range attacks kinda makes it weak. You need to be rather close for it to work imo. The further away, the easier it is to avoid.

 

> @"KrHome.1920" said:

> Soulbeast has more than 10 seconds of direct damage invulnerability while dealing a 1200+ ranged amout of damage you could do PvE raids with. It's broken in open field, because way too forgiving.

>

> But on the other hand if you take away his Stone Signet, he is a freekill even for Power Reapers. Just another example of bad balancing. It's a bit like full zerk warriors with a utility bar full of invulnerabilities and stun breaks. They have a huge window where they can go full "idiot mode" (like someone else said in another thread) and after that they are as dangerous as an ambient creature - but in a 1v1 you are usually already dead at this point.

>

> TL;DR: We don't have a Reaper/Necro issue here.

 

"free kill" Not a chance. I dont run Stone Signet at all and still waiting for my first Reaper death. Easy to kite, Easy to lock down. Plenty of stealth, mobility, blocks and such that even if they get in range to burst me, i will survive and as long as i have a cool down or 2, i will evade away, heal up and have stealth access ready. I have never felt the need to use Stone Signet against Reapers.