Suggestion: Changes to PiP & Participation Distribution

[X T D.6458]

I have some ideas I want to throw out there. I have never been a fan of rewarding pips based on server war score and placement during a skirmish. I have always preferred to see it based on individual participation and accomplishment rather then server performance which can be out of your hands, and has many problems associated with it.

 

You can be playing just as hard as the other 2 servers, but if your server has a coverage gap and cannot score enough points it is not fair that you should not be rewarded with the same amount of pips, and thus take longer to earn rewards, its like adding insult to injury. Here is my idea to replace it: If your participation is t3 you get (3) pips, t4-5 (4) pips, t6 (5) pips. The other pips will still only be rewarded if you have at least t3 participation. The point is to encourage active playing and not reward players who can take advantage of coverage gaps.

 

I am also not crazy about the outnumbered bonus. The concept is fine, the problem is that instead of encouraging people to play on outnumbered maps, players are sometimes so obsessed with keeping that bonus that they will not even make callouts, or will simply just afk in maps. It is discouraging people from wanting to play together. This just promotes really bad gameplay, and a bad environment. One idea would be to remove this bonus and instead to increase the pips you get from the Commitment bonus to 3. This way every player can earn extra pips each week if they finish Wood tier.

 

Repairing/Damaging structures also should not contribute to participation. It should stop decay but not contribute, or at the very least contribute once during each period. You will often see players wasting supply constantly repairing walls that are being trebbed, or players (some running 3rd party programs, autoclickers, etc) using siege literally for hours straight. This is most visible in SMC.

 

Also the celebration bonus from Celebration/Birthday booster give 10% bonus to PVP reward track gain....but not WvW...

[Baldrick.8967]

It's a lot harder to get tier 6 participation if the map is dead (ish), than in a zerg, where you hit tier 6 in one fight by tagging a few people.

 

Or if you're scouting, for example.

 

So, your idea promotes zerg play, as that is by far the fastest way to reach tier 6 and stay on it. You're basically saying 'join a zerg for more points'

 

I'd like to see more participation awarded for flipping sentries and camps and towers and a lot less for a kill- on a quiet map it can take 30 minutes to get to tier 3, as you might run into enemies that prevent you from flipping and you are outnumbered and cannot get a kill or two to boost your score.

 

It's easy to fix outnumbered- just make it not count inside structures or spawn points.

 

Commitment bonus could go up by one each week, so first week you gain 1, second two, then 3 as a maximum, and you lose all three if you miss a wood week.

 

Repairing/damaging structures is fine, just needs a cap on it - so if there is no damage at the end of the treb shot, then no participation is awarded. Repairing walls is fine the way it is- some people will always waste supply that way, no need to penalise everyone.

[Vavume.8065]

> @"X T D.6458" said:

> You can be playing just as hard as the other 2 servers, but if your server is outnumbered and cannot score enough points it is not fair that you should not be rewarded with the same amount of pips, and thus take longer to earn rewards, its like adding insult to injury.

 

This is incorrect, you can be 3rd place earn MORE pips than the first place server if you are outnumbered, which ironically is what I consider unfair...

 

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

Balancing pips/participation is tricky for all sorts of reasons. The fact is that no matter how well ANet does with it, there are going to be loopholes that we'll all learn and some of us will push to maximize reward for the least effort. However, since WvW rewards are generally slowly acquired compared to PvP and PvE, the folks who play WvW the most seem to do it because it's fun. So sure, I'd love to see it become more fair, but since that's not theoretically possible, I prefer that it's simpler for folks who already contribute to their world's success.

 

Or put another way, I'm willing to allow for the possibility of free riders taking advantage, as long as the most dedicated WvWers are able to keep earning while doing the right thing(s).

****

 

 

> @"X T D.6458" said:

> I have never been a fan of rewarding pips based on server war score and placement during a skirmish. I have always preferred to see it based on individual participation and accomplishment rather then server performance which can be out of your hands, and has many problems associated with it.

 

Many players have long asked that "winning" be meaningful in WvW. Current the difference between top score and bottom score is... two pips. Individual participation is worth... well, all your pips: if you don't participate, you stop being able to earn any pips at all (after a grace period). In addition, commitment (which is entirely individual) grants an extra pip.

 

That seems a fair compromise under the circumstances.

 

> @"X T D.6458" said:

> If your participation is t3 you get (3) pips, t4-5 (4) pips, t6 (5) pips.

This would mean that the most active WvWers will cap sooner.

 

> I am also not crazy about the outnumbered bonus. The concept is fine, the problem is that instead of encouraging people to play on outnumbered maps, players are sometimes so obsessed with keeping that bonus that they will not even make callouts, or will simply just afk in maps. It is discouraging people from wanting to play together. This just promotes really bad gameplay, and a bad environment. One idea would be to remove this bonus and instead to increase the pips you get from the Commitment bonus to 3. This way every player can earn extra pips each week if they finish Wood tier.

Lots of players have long asked that fighting-while-outnumbered include better rewards, since it's more difficult. It also evens out the "more bags/hour" that overwhelming numbers can sometimes provide.

While it's true that some people don't make call outs, it's hard to say if that's substantially meaningful. My perception is lots of the people who don't call out in /team are the same people who don't tick siege, don't call out in /map when there's a free cap, etc. That is, 'outnumbered' isn't increasing the number of selfish people; it just makes a few of them easier to spot.

 

 

> Repairing/Damaging structures also should not contribute to participation. It should stop decay but not contribute, or at the very least contribute once during each period. You will often see players wasting supply constantly repairing walls that are being trebbed, or players (some running 3rd party programs, autoclickers, etc) using siege literally for hours straight. This is most visible in SMC.

It could be toned down, sure. But repairing is a critical function. In the days before pips, people used to avoid it because you don't get bags for staying behind the zerg to repair. It's a time-consuming job.

 

In fact, I'd love to see participation decay stopped by ticking siege (if there was a way to do that only if siege was below 25 minutes remaining). That's also a critical function that gets short shrift because there's no reward for it.

 

 

 

>

> Also the celebration bonus from Celebration/Birthday booster give 10% bonus to PVP reward track gain....but not WvW...

Yeah, this one is a mystery. They should fix it, although it applies to WvW reward track, not pips.

[Mylerian.9176]

I like it the way it is. No change is needed. The only change that should be happening in WvW is Balancing classes, and servers. That's my two cents.

 

[Ubi.4136]

> @"Mylerian.9176" said:

> I like it the way it is. No change is needed. The only change that should be happening in WvW is Balancing classes, and servers. That's my two cents.

>

 

I agree.

[X T D.6458]

> @"Vavume.8065" said:

> > @"X T D.6458" said:

> > You can be playing just as hard as the other 2 servers, but if your server is outnumbered and cannot score enough points it is not fair that you should not be rewarded with the same amount of pips, and thus take longer to earn rewards, its like adding insult to injury.

>

> This is incorrect, you can be 3rd place earn MORE pips than the first place server if you are outnumbered, which ironically is what I consider unfair...

>

 

I meant outnumbered as in coverage gaps, which could affect scores. Not outnumbered the effect and pips bonus. I will change the wording though.

[Rasp Sabreblade.5421]

we need a way to run out the pips for bonuses without clogging up the maps.

 

Maybe a lobby for each server color which has the mystic toilet and crafting areas plus the wvw vendors. go here first then into and out of maps.

I also remember Anet talking about a way to just hit a collect all button or something for the pips so ppl aren't afk'ing for rewards

[X T D.6458]

> @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said:

> we need a way to run out the pips for bonuses without clogging up the maps.

>

> Maybe a lobby for each server color which has the mystic toilet and crafting areas plus the wvw vendors. go here first then into and out of maps.

> I also remember Anet talking about a way to just hit a collect all button or something for the pips so ppl aren't afk'ing for rewards

 

I believe the devs mentioned that they are working on this, at least the part about running out your pips. The cashing out option would be greatly abused, because people would just quickly get participation, cash out, and this way get all future rewards without actually having earned them. I would like to see a lobby instance for each server in place of OS.

[Rasp Sabreblade.5421]

> @"X T D.6458" said:

> > @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said:

> > we need a way to run out the pips for bonuses without clogging up the maps.

> >

> > Maybe a lobby for each server color which has the mystic toilet and crafting areas plus the wvw vendors. go here first then into and out of maps.

> > I also remember Anet talking about a way to just hit a collect all button or something for the pips so ppl aren't afk'ing for rewards

>

> I believe the devs mentioned that they are working on this, at least the part about running out your pips.

 

I would like a lobby that had all this stuff in it and maybe they could add an arena for some 5v5 with the ppl on your server. just for screwing around waiting for pips to bleed out

[X T D.6458]

> @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said:

> > @"X T D.6458" said:

> > > @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said:

> > > we need a way to run out the pips for bonuses without clogging up the maps.

> > >

> > > Maybe a lobby for each server color which has the mystic toilet and crafting areas plus the wvw vendors. go here first then into and out of maps.

> > > I also remember Anet talking about a way to just hit a collect all button or something for the pips so ppl aren't afk'ing for rewards

> >

> > I believe the devs mentioned that they are working on this, at least the part about running out your pips.

>

> I would like a lobby that had all this stuff in it and maybe they could add an arena for some 5v5 with the ppl on your server. just for screwing around waiting for pips to bleed out

 

Yea this request and suggestion has been made before. I would like to see a 1v1 arena, plus practice golems/npcs etc where people can test out builds/stats etc like in the PvP lobby but without the PvP stat restrictions. A lobby would at least give people something to do while waiting out their pips, and not take up spots in a map. They would still be able to see team chat and callouts, so they could jump back into a map if they wanted to help.

[Klipso.8653]

> @"X T D.6458" said:

> > @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said:

> > we need a way to run out the pips for bonuses without clogging up the maps.

> >

> > Maybe a lobby for each server color which has the mystic toilet and crafting areas plus the wvw vendors. go here first then into and out of maps.

> > I also remember Anet talking about a way to just hit a collect all button or something for the pips so ppl aren't afk'ing for rewards

>

> I believe the devs mentioned that they are working on this, at least the part about running out your pips. The cashing out option would be greatly abused, because people would just quickly get participation, cash out, and this way get all future rewards without actually having earned them. I would like to see a lobby instance for each server in place of OS.

 

It's a lazy excuse though, all they need to do is make the players participation drain to 0 when they cash out, and restrict all participation gain on the account for 30 minutes

[X T D.6458]

> @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > @"X T D.6458" said:

> > > @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said:

> > > we need a way to run out the pips for bonuses without clogging up the maps.

> > >

> > > Maybe a lobby for each server color which has the mystic toilet and crafting areas plus the wvw vendors. go here first then into and out of maps.

> > > I also remember Anet talking about a way to just hit a collect all button or something for the pips so ppl aren't afk'ing for rewards

> >

> > I believe the devs mentioned that they are working on this, at least the part about running out your pips. The cashing out option would be greatly abused, because people would just quickly get participation, cash out, and this way get all future rewards without actually having earned them. I would like to see a lobby instance for each server in place of OS.

>

> It's a lazy excuse though, all they need to do is make the players participation drain to 0 when they cash out, and restrict all participation gain on the account for 30 minutes

 

Yea but what if you dc, or have to restart client/computer? That would be a pretty heavy punishment.

[Rasp Sabreblade.5421]

> @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > @"X T D.6458" said:

> > > @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said:

> > > we need a way to run out the pips for bonuses without clogging up the maps.

> > >

> > > Maybe a lobby for each server color which has the mystic toilet and crafting areas plus the wvw vendors. go here first then into and out of maps.

> > > I also remember Anet talking about a way to just hit a collect all button or something for the pips so ppl aren't afk'ing for rewards

> >

> > I believe the devs mentioned that they are working on this, at least the part about running out your pips. The cashing out option would be greatly abused, because people would just quickly get participation, cash out, and this way get all future rewards without actually having earned them. I would like to see a lobby instance for each server in place of OS.

>

> It's a lazy excuse though, all they need to do is make the players participation drain to 0 when they cash out, and restrict all participation gain on the account for 30 minutes

 

Anet said there where some issues with just letting ppl cash out, but they didn't elaborate on what the issue was.

 

[Klipso.8653]

> @"X T D.6458" said:

 

> Yea but what if you dc, or have to restart client/computer? That would be a pretty heavy punishment.

 

Cashing out would be something you walk up to an NPC and collect, not automatic.

 

> @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said:

 

> Anet said there where some issues with just letting ppl cash out, but they didn't elaborate on what the issue was.

>

 

Their issue was that there was no way to know how many pips should be awarded because you could go from +3 to +1 based on server performance, or become outnumbered.

 

It's too easy just to make server placement only worth 1 regardless, and outnumbered not count at all in the cash out

[Kovu.7560]

So OP's suggestions for adjusting pip rewards are:

* **Grant more pips based on individual play** rather than the server's placement.

* Grant more pips for a higher tier of participation.

* **Ditch or reduce the potency of the outnumbered bonus.**

* Increase the pips granted by the commitment bonus.

* Repairing should not contribute to participation.

* **Celebration/birthday booster to grant a bonus to wvw reward track gain equal to its bonus to pvp reward track gain.**

 

I agree with the bolded. To clarify, I feel a server's placement in the skirmish should contribute to pip gain. You should get _something_ for being in the lead. I do, however feel that individual contribution should also play a role. I'm not sure how one would go about measuring this, perhaps participation should be reworked to measure this. Currently its too easy to increase participation, particularly in zerg play.

 

One way the one could go about it is reward pips based on how much the player participates in every 5 minute skirmish, resetting the participation bar on each tick but lowering the floor to allow for _some_ pip rewards at low tier participation, granting an extra pip or two if the user participates a lot in that 5 minute tick. That would kill afk farming. (Of coruse they'd need to modify the reward track numbers, but that's a different beast.)

 

I hate the commitment bonus. I've only not had it twice since they introduced the pip mechanic and that's because I was on vacation from work and away from the game. To be punished the following week for not being present the previous week is a stupid mechanic.

 

I have suggested in the past that they rework the pips rewarded based on a player's rank. +0 pips for rank 1-999, +1 pip for rank 1000+. People at rank 5k+ literally doubling granted pips on non-outnumbered maps compared to people who are newer to the game/gamemode is kind of silly, unfair and discouraging to the newer player.

 

I don't see an issue with repairing contributing to participation. Even if they don't get participation for repairing, they'll still get it for the defend event. There's no way around that and we shouldn't be discouraging defensive contribution.

 

I agree on the other points. Good thread.

 

~ Kovu

[X T D.6458]

> @"Kovu.7560" said:

> So OP's suggestions for adjusting pip rewards are:

> * **Grant more pips based on individual play** rather than the server's placement.

> * Grant more pips for a higher tier of participation.

> * **Ditch or reduce the potency of the outnumbered bonus.**

> * Increase the pips granted by the commitment bonus.

> * Repairing should not contribute to participation.

> * **Celebration/birthday booster to grant a bonus to wvw reward track gain equal to its bonus to pvp reward track gain.**

>

> I agree with the bolded. To clarify, I feel a server's placement in the skirmish should contribute to pip gain. You should get _something_ for being in the lead. I do, however feel that individual contribution should also play a role. I'm not sure how one would go about measuring this, perhaps participation should be reworked to measure this. Currently its too easy to increase participation, particularly in zerg play.

>

> One way the one could go about it is reward pips based on how much the player participates in every 5 minute skirmish, resetting the participation bar on each tick but lowering the floor to allow for _some_ pip rewards at low tier participation, granting an extra pip or two if the user participates a lot in that 5 minute tick. That would kill afk farming. (Of coruse they'd need to modify the reward track numbers, but that's a different beast.)

>

> I hate the commitment bonus. I've only not had it twice since they introduced the pip mechanic and that's because I was on vacation from work and away from the game. To be punished the following week for not being present the previous week is a stupid mechanic.

>

> I have suggested in the past that they rework the pips rewarded based on a player's rank. +0 pips for rank 1-999, +1 pip for rank 1000+. People at rank 5k+ literally doubling granted pips on non-outnumbered maps compared to people who are newer to the game/gamemode is kind of silly, unfair and discouraging to the newer player.

>

> I don't see an issue with repairing contributing to participation. Even if they don't get participation for repairing, they'll still get it for the defend event. There's no way around that and we shouldn't be discouraging defensive contribution.

>

> I agree on the other points. Good thread.

>

> ~ Kovu

 

Thanks for the feedback. More pips for a higher tier in participation is mainly to encourage people to remain active, but to also ensure that everyone can earn the same points from this bonus regardless of whether or not their server is having a coverage gap during the time they are playing. So basically if your server is in 2nd/3rd place you can still earn the full 5 pips by playing. I think this would be a good incentive for a server that is losing or has a coverage gap. This would also negatively impact afk'ing.

 

I really like the commitment bonus because it encourage people to actually play in WvW for at least a small amount of time to earn that extra pip each week, and also for staying on a server. I believe this should be increased to further encourage more participation and server loyalty, in place of the outnumbered bonus.

 

I am not against the concept of the outnumbered bonus. I just really do not like how it is affecting peoples behavior. My personal opinion is that it is discouraging team play, and I really do not like that. I agree about it either being reduced, or replaced.

 

The repairing contribution is a tricky one. I have spent my fair share of time on repairs, so I understand the importance of people wanting to be rewarded for it. I don't have an issue with it stopping decay. Defend events have a 3 minute timer, so I didn't include those. What really bothers me is seeing people constantly waste supply so they can keep up participation, its abusing the system in my opinion. I would love a better option though.

[Rasp Sabreblade.5421]

I myself would much rather roam, have small group fights and take objectives vs. large zerg fights. However, I get way more points and loot from zerg fights even if I die, vs. roaming and defending. I know Anet tried to fix the roaming and scouting this, by allowing commanders to throw participation their way. Does anyone even use this or does this even exist anymore?

 

I know this doesn't really pertain to the pip system, but there has been a lot of discussion about zergs - so I will interject this.

Anet should change the commander tags system to something like this:

100g for lieutenant tag - yellow only - up to 6 in party

200g for general (think military, not basic) tag (100g to upgrade from lieutenant) - adds white or red tag color - up to 12 in party

300g for commander (100g to upgrade from general) - adds remaining tag colors - up to current number in party.

 

Maybe, the lower 2 tiers can only be used in WvW, whereas the commander tag can be used in PvE also. Also, you have the mentor (apple) tag for PvE.

 

yes you will get adds because of the tags, but I think it will be much easier to organize who is doing what when the tag colors receive some type of designation, like a drop down menu of what you are doing. People can mouse over the tag and it will give you a 1-2 word description of your main purpose for displaying your tag. I don't think ppl should be allowed to type in their own stuff - could end up being abused.

[Kamara.4187]

Are you kidding me? like defenders already get way too little credit and perks compared to zergers. 9 times out of 10 its your defenders that make the callouts that save objectives along with keeping seige up. Apply what this thread is asking for to hills or the garri and then tell me that's a good idea....

[X T D.6458]

> @"Kamara.4187" said:

> Are you kidding me? like defenders already get way too little credit and perks compared to zergers. 9 times out of 10 its your defenders that make the callouts that save objectives along with keeping seige up. Apply what this thread is asking for to hills or the garri and then tell me that's a good idea....

 

Do you really think people scout and defend objectives just so they can get participation for repairs? Do you think people would leave walls down and unrepaired if not for participation? A lot of my playtime is spent scouting, doing solo/small team stuff, I am well aware of the importance. What I am frustrated with, is constantly seeing people waste supply to boost their participation, this is borderline abuse of the system and promotes extremely selfish behavior. If you don't believe me go to SMC anytime your server owns it.

[X T D.6458]

> @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said:

> I myself would much rather roam, have small group fights and take objectives vs. large zerg fights. However, I get way more points and loot from zerg fights even if I die, vs. roaming and defending. I know Anet tried to fix the roaming and scouting this, by allowing commanders to throw participation their way. Does anyone even use this or does this even exist anymore?

>

> I know this doesn't really pertain to the pip system, but there has been a lot of discussion about zergs - so I will interject this.

> Anet should change the commander tags system to something like this:

> 100g for lieutenant tag - yellow only - up to 6 in party

> 200g for general (think military, not basic) tag (100g to upgrade from lieutenant) - adds white or red tag color - up to 12 in party

> 300g for commander (100g to upgrade from general) - adds remaining tag colors - up to current number in party.

>

> Maybe, the lower 2 tiers can only be used in WvW, whereas the commander tag can be used in PvE also. Also, you have the mentor (apple) tag for PvE.

>

> yes you will get adds because of the tags, but I think it will be much easier to organize who is doing what when the tag colors receive some type of designation, like a drop down menu of what you are doing. People can mouse over the tag and it will give you a 1-2 word description of your main purpose for displaying your tag. I don't think ppl should be allowed to type in their own stuff - could end up being abused.

 

Zerging will always yield more because it is faster, and you have the potential of doing more and encountering more players at a time. A lot of my play time is spent scouting, doing solo/small team stuff so I understand that it is a little slower and more dependent on capturing objectives. You need at least 5 people in a squad to unlock a shared participation slot, so its not always possible for some. But scouts should always be encouraged to join it. When my guild has raids, we always give scouts shared participation and send them loot bags at the end of the night.

 

I think an in game description for tags would be an interesting idea. Being able to choose from a drop down menu would be useful. We could have options for Scout, Havoc, etc

[Rasp Sabreblade.5421]

I think some ppl do. remember the issue with the rune capping. where you could get pips just from moving on and off the ruin. I think Mighty Teapot did a video about how easy it was to cheese it. So yes, some ppl will do the least amount of work for the easiest gain. This is where the real issue is, and for Anet to fix this is almost near impossible. So for ppl to stand and actually defend an area - you loose pips and get zero reward (loot drops and such) and thus this is what really promotes the pirate ship meta.

[X T D.6458]

> @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said:

> I think some ppl do. remember the issue with the rune capping. where you could get pips just from moving on and off the ruin. I think Mighty Teapot did a video about how easy it was to cheese it. So yes, some ppl will do the least amount of work for the easiest gain. This is where the real issue is, and for Anet to fix this is almost near impossible. So for ppl to stand and actually defend an area - you loose pips and get zero reward (loot drops and such) and thus this is what really promotes the pirate ship meta.

 

I don't want actual defenders and scouts losing out, but I am really annoyed with the abuse going on by those selfish people that are just there to waste supply to farm points. One other idea would be to increase the amount of time before each decay to say 7 minutes and also increase the amount of participation points that it gives you each time per period. This way, you would only stop decay and get points every 7 minutes. But to compensate you would get more points and have a longer decay period.

[Kamara.4187]

> @"X T D.6458" said:

> > @"Kamara.4187" said:

> > Are you kidding me? like defenders already get way too little credit and perks compared to zergers. 9 times out of 10 its your defenders that make the callouts that save objectives along with keeping seige up. Apply what this thread is asking for to hills or the garri and then tell me that's a good idea....

>

> Do you really think people scout and defend objectives just so they can get participation for repairs? Do you think people would leave walls down and unrepaired if not for participation? A lot of my playtime is spent scouting, doing solo/small team stuff, I am well aware of the importance. What I am frustrated with, is constantly seeing people waste supply to boost their participation, this is borderline abuse of the system and promotes extremely selfish behavior. If you don't believe me go to SMC anytime your server owns it.

 

In that respect I can't disagree with you, but I really don't want to see defenders take any kicks to the jaw. Yes I've seen supply being burned at smc before. Pretty sure we were being trolled when it happened. Yes it ticked us all off but we have no tools in place to deal with that kind of abuse when ppl can just roll a toon on another account, on a different server. So how can we stop them without hurting actual defenders?

[X T D.6458]

> @"Kamara.4187" said:

> > @"X T D.6458" said:

> > > @"Kamara.4187" said:

> > > Are you kidding me? like defenders already get way too little credit and perks compared to zergers. 9 times out of 10 its your defenders that make the callouts that save objectives along with keeping seige up. Apply what this thread is asking for to hills or the garri and then tell me that's a good idea....

> >

> > Do you really think people scout and defend objectives just so they can get participation for repairs? Do you think people would leave walls down and unrepaired if not for participation? A lot of my playtime is spent scouting, doing solo/small team stuff, I am well aware of the importance. What I am frustrated with, is constantly seeing people waste supply to boost their participation, this is borderline abuse of the system and promotes extremely selfish behavior. If you don't believe me go to SMC anytime your server owns it.

>

> In that respect I can't disagree with you, but I really don't want to see defenders take any kicks to the jaw. Yes I've seen supply being burned at smc before. Pretty sure we were being trolled when it happened. Yes it ticked us all off but we have no tools in place to deal with that kind of abuse when ppl can just roll a toon on another account, on a different server. So how can we stop them without hurting actual defenders?

 

I never want to discourage scouting, defending, and small team play. I do it a lot, I know the challenges and the importance. In the past, people would burn supply to troll, the problem now is that people are being rewarded for it. I see this constantly, I think we all have. People will constantly waste supply to earn participation points. On reset night I was watching the same people doing this for hours, they didn't do anything else on the map, just constantly wasting supply.

 

What I think would be a good idea is too increase the decay timer from repairing to say 7 minutes. And also giving more participation points up front, instead of per repair. This way people can stop decay and earn points when you repair, but not given additional points until the 7 minute cycle is up.

So say you start repairing a wall, it will delay your participation decay by 7 minutes and add for example half a bar of participations points, but you would not get more points the more you repair until that timer is over. It would be kind of like diminishing returns.