BeepBoopBap.2840 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Removing quickness in favor of an extra strike that crits for like 700 and has a global ICD of 1/4 sec (I think) is just bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manpag.6421 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 They've given us 2 new sources of quickness though, so it's still bonus damage... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeepBoopBap.2840 Posted February 6, 2018 Author Share Posted February 6, 2018 > @"Manpag.6421" said: > They've given us 2 new sources of quickness though, so it's still bonus damage... Brutality will be a niche WvW zerging trait like Dismantle Fortifications was. The other source of quickness is Phase Traversal which was heavily nerfed (for now, Karl says it will be undone). It is also not a comparable source of quickness to old Impossible Odds (0 cast time and gives superspeed and bonus damage all in one). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manpag.6421 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 True, though I expect only the out-of-range bit of Phase Traversal will be reverted, not the whole change. Quickness will stay. IO still gives superspeed and now more bonus damage. Quickness is accessible for the bursts it was meant for, while Shiro has a slightly more sustainable skill for general bonus damage. I do see the downsides in losing quickness on tap, but since I rarely use it in favour of Jalis's Vengeful Hammers anyway, outside of gathering, I quite like the change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justine.6351 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Impossible odds needs one of 3, *Revert *Removal of ICD *ICD per unique target instead of global Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeepBoopBap.2840 Posted February 6, 2018 Author Share Posted February 6, 2018 > @"Manpag.6421" said: > True, though I expect only the out-of-range bit of Phase Traversal will be reverted, not the whole change. Quickness will stay. > > IO still gives superspeed and now more bonus damage. Quickness is accessible for the bursts it was meant for, while Shiro has a slightly more sustainable skill for general bonus damage. I do see the downsides in losing quickness on tap, but since I rarely use it in favour of Jalis's Vengeful Hammers anyway, outside of gathering, I quite like the change. How is quickness accessible for bursts? Having to cast and port with Phase Traversal is hardly easy access for burst. Having to weapon swap for quickness (sigil of agility already does this for me + works on legend swap) is also just as inconvenient and can kill you by bad rotation i.e. swapping weapons before legends may make you give up cleansing/energy sigil proc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arnitheking.8427 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 IO si a massive buff in pve, and a slight nerf in pvp (assuming you dont already have quickness, if you have quickness it's again, a massive buff), overall I like this change tbh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vena.4276 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Right now it just feels like Anet is deliberately forcing people to run inferior traits such as Song of the Mists just to obtain some access to quickness, which is a boon that Rev integrates seamlessly with; and buffing said traits just to make them seem more feasible when traits like Roiling Mists still exist. Le sigh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Red Arachnid.2493 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 From the PVE side, it is a minor buff against single targets. I ran a test on a golem, and while hammers peaked at about 24k, IO peaked at about 26k. I am certainly going to miss the on-demand quickness for WvW. A lot of people don't expect me to run sword, so that was one of my secret weapons in WvW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeepBoopBap.2840 Posted February 6, 2018 Author Share Posted February 6, 2018 I want to clarify I care 0 for any PvE balance I am speaking purely about WvW and PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArthurDent.9538 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Impossible odds change is good in theory as it lets pve power rev get its dps up a significant amount in raid scenarios without making the damage insane in pvp. The problem is it is just too weak in its current form. The damage proc is a very low amount and should be increased significantly so it results in an approximately 50% dps increase while active which is what quickness does. Additionally the icd is another problem in that it makes it much weaker in aoe scenarios. The Icd is probably a good thing as otherwise you can get some cheesy interactions like proccing it 7 times instantly if you pick up an ele icebow and use the 3 skill, however making the proc affect targets in a small radius aoe (kind of like the rift slash explosion) would be a good solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakubeC.3026 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 The change to Impossible Odds is just bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathok.2914 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"BeepBoopBap.2840" said: > > How is quickness accessible for bursts? Having to cast and port with Phase Traversal is hardly easy access for burst. Having to weapon swap for quickness (sigil of agility already does this for me + works on legend swap) is also just as inconvenient and can kill you by bad rotation i.e. swapping weapons before legends may make you give up cleansing/energy sigil proc. This. Please give us quickness on impossible odds again and tbh rev is gucci in pvp again. I don’t get why it had to be reworked anyways? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathok.2914 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 While this is a buff for pve it’s a nerf for pvp so just split the skill as you did with other skills and revert the changes for pvp/wvw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Skywalker.5674 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"BeepBoopBap.2840" said: > > @"Manpag.6421" said: > > True, though I expect only the out-of-range bit of Phase Traversal will be reverted, not the whole change. Quickness will stay. > > > > IO still gives superspeed and now more bonus damage. Quickness is accessible for the bursts it was meant for, while Shiro has a slightly more sustainable skill for general bonus damage. I do see the downsides in losing quickness on tap, but since I rarely use it in favour of Jalis's Vengeful Hammers anyway, outside of gathering, I quite like the change. > > How is quickness accessible for bursts? Having to cast and port with Phase Traversal is hardly easy access for burst. Having to weapon swap for quickness (sigil of agility already does this for me + works on legend swap) is also just as inconvenient and can kill you by bad rotation i.e. swapping weapons before legends may make you give up cleansing/energy sigil proc. It made skills channel faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fade to Black.7042 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Impossible odds change is very bad in pvp and in pve still very bad because power rev still have very low dps compared to condi renegade, will not be meta in raids. And IO made 50% skill faster too, i feel like a zombie now slow. Shiro is not an assassin stance now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Ketsu.4569 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 It's more of a side change than a real nerf. But the problem is a class which is struggling shouldn't be getting "sidegrades" so Rev still won't be meta. The best thing that happened to Rev this patch didn't actually happen to Rev but to condi builds. Condi mes and Scourge got pooped on, and that at least puts Rev in a slightly better spot. They definitely should have done more though. Kinda sad to see other classes that already have a viable meta build getting massive trait overhauls to underused specs and Rev getting only a few changes. Really contributes to the class-favoritism theory that Anet just doesn't like certain classes or can't figure out how to properly balance them so they intentionally let them sit in an obscured state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buran.3796 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said: > It's more of a side change than a real nerf. Imppossible Odds gave us quickness, which is way more poverful than swiftness to both chase and disengage. Quickness also made the auto attacks from sword an hammer way better than the crap which replaces the skill, and that doesn't even counts that Drop the Hammer or Phase Smash cast times were highly affected by IO, increasing the chance of success. The _**side change**_ brings nothing instead. Is a POS tool now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chungo.3169 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Something that is good and they destroy it, because this change? Someone complained at some time of IO? It is illogical, absurd and shameless. I hope you realize it and return it to your state before it's too late. Let's pray rip Shiro :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miles Smiles.8951 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 You can delete a scourge in 2 sec now tho, also remove all his stab and CC lock him. They will probably nerf or change "Brutality" anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasp Sabreblade.5421 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 has anyone tried IO with the mace or staff? on the mace does is double up on torment or on staff double up on blind or healing orb drops? What about IO with the shortbow now that is has a dmg increase? I am just curious since I forgot to try this last night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeepBoopBap.2840 Posted February 7, 2018 Author Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Miles Smiles.8951" said: > You can delete a scourge in 2 sec now tho, also remove all his stab and CC lock him. They will probably nerf or change "Brutality" anyways. True I was trying Brutality in ranked and I noticed I was deleting scourges and FBs. Idk IO change is I guess more bursty and removes our reliance on autos, but old IO auto spam was the tits at cleaving. New IO offers almost nothing for cleaving groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Skywalker.5674 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"BeepBoopBap.2840" said: > > @"Miles Smiles.8951" said: > > You can delete a scourge in 2 sec now tho, also remove all his stab and CC lock him. They will probably nerf or change "Brutality" anyways. > > True I was trying Brutality in ranked and I noticed I was deleting scourges and FBs. Idk IO change is I guess more bursty and removes our reliance on autos, but old IO auto spam was the kitten at cleaving. New IO offers almost nothing for cleaving groups. Screw groups then.I am happy for single target dps and I will starting for GS as the next expac weapon for rev so we can have a proper cleaving weapon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manpag.6421 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Buran.3796" said: > > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said: > > It's more of a side change than a real nerf. > > Imppossible Odds gave us quickness, which is way more poverful than swiftness to both chase and disengage. Impossible Odds used to give both quickness, which affects attack and action speed, and superspeed, which affects movement. Although it no longer grants quickness, it still grants superspeed so retains its utility as far as chasing and disengaging. In fact, it technically got _better_ at that because of the lowered energy drain, meaning you can run after/away for longer. > @"Rasp Sabreblade.5421" said: > has anyone tried IO with the mace or staff? on the mace does is double up on torment or on staff double up on blind or healing orb drops? What about IO with the shortbow now that is has a dmg increase? It doesn't; it's an extra hit from an attack skill, not a second auto-attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InsaneQR.7412 Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 > @"BeepBoopBap.2840" said: > Removing quickness in favor of an extra strike that crits for like 700 and has a global ICD of 1/4 sec (I think) is just bad. In PvE group content i.e fractals&raids you always have perma quickness so shiro actually got buffed for PvE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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