Firseal.4716 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 I know ANet feels that mesmers should shatter. Apparently it is all we are expected to do, because for some reason sustain mesmers were the expressed target of this nerf we are looking at. Still, logged in, gave it a go, tried to make a build that at least fit my two primary goals in playing the game -was effective and that I enjoyed playing. Except that phantasms are now pretty much worthless. Except three of the four sources of might on my character are now gone. Except that my healing skill doesn't actually heal me to even a third of what it used to. Yes, apparently my mesmer was public enemy number one, ripe for a nerf, because I fought at range and I used phantasms, and I was sparing with the shatters. But I never reduced myself to primarily auto attacking, which apparently is what ANet claims me and mesmers like me were doing when instead we were playing ranged harriers who knew how to split aggro from our targets and dance around them as they died. Can't split aggro anymore. Phantasms are dead and clones don't have the DPS. I hit something, it comes straight for me right through the attack of the (inefficient) clones. Can't sustain, and don't hit as hard because building might was part of the problem. Can't take a hit anymore, because my healing signet, which used to be useful, is now predicated towards shatter mesmers. Like everything else, because sustain mesmers are the issue that ANet wanted to solve for whatever byzantine reason. Oh no, sorry. Because apparently a handful of mesmers under observation weren't living up to the potential ANet wanted them to have. Or, more simply, because we were too busy playing the game in an enjoyable way, and a few of us were lazy, and this was the pretext to excise an entire playstyle. Not a build group, but an entire playstyle. For a profession that is supposed to be a choice between shatter or sustain, the solution to a 'we don't like how the less skilled sustain mesmers are acting' seems to be to remove the choice. (Which really should be interesting for warriors down the road.) I can get past the lack of might, though it certainly seems like an odd choice when they are trying to promote power mesmers over condition mesmers. I could get past the fact phantasms are in the woodchipper of history, eventually. But the scrapping of the only decent sustain heal is the third strike. My mesmer is effectively worthless. Can anyone explain why this was necessary (because, honestly, if we are avoiding stagnation of skill in lower ranks there are a lot of professions that needed attention before mesmer), or why sustain playstyle has to be destroyed? Surely there had to be an easier way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llethander.3972 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Basically the same reason engi turrets are dead. At least phantasms still do something; their damage is a one-time per use thing but I find it to be worthwhile. Being able to get out 3 clones, pop two more phantasms, shatter the clones, and have 2 more clones appear once the phantasms have completed their attacks is kinda nice and refreshing. That said, I will miss the old Phantasm playstyle. I absolutely loved getting out 3 phantasms and camping on them while using my own weapon skills. I don't really know why this needed such a drastic rework. Have Mesmer players been asking for a change to how clones and phantasms work? Yeah, many of us have for a long time. I don't think this is what any of us really had in mind, though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanhelin.3480 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Firseal.4716" said: > Can anyone explain why this was necessary (because, honestly, if we are avoiding stagnation of skill in lower ranks there are a lot of professions that needed attention before mesmer), or why sustain playstyle has to be destroyed? Surely there had to be an easier way. They didn't destroy the sustain playstyle, although they said so (actually they buffed it, whether by intent or not, idk, one basically only needs to be in combat with slotted signet of illusions and the sigil's clones kill everything), the big change is: now you have to equip and skill for condition. This also affects e.g. me, because I played a power build before and never collected all necessesary items for an alternative condition build - it's what I do now. Before the patch we could summon the phants, now we have to simply not shatter our clones. Phantasmal Force as we knew it is gone, so no downside when illusions are renewed. Spamming phants also is possible. Axe clones do pretty good single target condi-damage and staff clones multi target one. Condi Mirage Axe/x, Staff is the way to go for sustain Mesmers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyroatheist.9031 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Firseal.4716" said: > Except that phantasms are now pretty much worthless. citation needed > @"Firseal.4716" said: >Except three of the four sources of might on my character are now gone. What. The only sources of might they removed were shattered strength and the might on gs autoattacks. If you were using the gs trait your build was bad. If you were using shattered strength in a "sustain" build, your build was bad. > @"Firseal.4716" said: >Except that my healing skill doesn't actually heal me to even a third of what it used to. What. The only changes to heals were buffs. If you're not healing as much as you used to, you're playing wrong. > @"Firseal.4716" said: > Can anyone explain why this was necessary (because, honestly, if we are avoiding stagnation of skill in lower ranks there are a lot of professions that needed attention before mesmer), or why sustain playstyle has to be destroyed? Sure thing. The playstyle you call the "sustain playstyle" was never healthy for the game. These builds fell into a couple of broad categories: 1. Single target raid builds. These builds put up 3 phantasms and did almost nothing for the rest of the fight. They were 1-trick-ponies, but if you only needed to dps a single target, they were ridiculously braindead. This is unhealthy and shouldn't exist. 2. Bad builds. Every other use of a build where you attempt to stack up phantasms was bad. If you used phantasm stacking builds outside of single target raid/fractal situations, you were using a bad build. Targets die too quickly to make it worthwhile to stack phantasms, making it bad. The reason this change is positive for mesmer addresses both 1 and 2. 1 was too efficient and threw off balance in the rest of the game because it was the single most favorable situation for phantasm skills. This situation produced orders of magnitude higher returns than any other case, forcing them to balance the skills around this particular use. That balancing then produced the effect of 2: all other uses of phantasms was bad. If you weren't stacking 3 phantasms on a single target, your build was bad if it relied on phantasms because their damage output was balanced around that extreme single target stacking case. Now that you can't do that, Anet can balance around 1 common use case: summon phantasm, does damage, despawns. The target set or game scenario doesn't matter anymore, it's the same general use case. This means that Anet can actually balance the phantasm skills and our other weapon skills without having to keep nerfing things because if you stack 3 phantasms on a single target it'll do broken damage. Does it remove a variety of builds from the game? Yeah, it does. However, as I just went over, the only builds it removes are either the braindead raid builds or bad builds. Going from your post, I'm guessing you were using bad builds, so it would behoove you to learn the new skills and figure out how to use them effectively. I guarantee it'll be better than whatever you were running before. Edit: And before you respond with something along the lines of "but it worked for me", I can hammer nails using a brick and a rubber mallet. That doesn't mean I **should** hammer nails that way and I shouldn't get mad if someone comes along, takes away my brick and rubber mallet, and gives me a hammer instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carighan.6758 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Pyroatheist.9031" said: > Edit: And before you respond with something along the lines of "but it worked for me", I can hammer nails using a brick and a rubber mallet. That doesn't mean I **should** hammer nails that way and I shouldn't get mad if someone comes along, takes away my brick and rubber mallet, and gives me a hammer instead. Thanks for giving me this analogy, Pyro. Most which I wanted to use were from Demotivator posters and they are probably reportable on this forum. :tongue: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doam.8305 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Pyroatheist.9031" said: > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > Except that phantasms are now pretty much worthless. > > citation needed > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > >Except three of the four sources of might on my character are now gone. > > What. The only sources of might they removed were shattered strength and the might on gs autoattacks. If you were using the gs trait your build was bad. If you were using shattered strength in a "sustain" build, your build was bad. > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > >Except that my healing skill doesn't actually heal me to even a third of what it used to. > > What. The only changes to heals were buffs. If you're not healing as much as you used to, you're playing wrong. > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > Can anyone explain why this was necessary (because, honestly, if we are avoiding stagnation of skill in lower ranks there are a lot of professions that needed attention before mesmer), or why sustain playstyle has to be destroyed? > > Sure thing. The playstyle you call the "sustain playstyle" was never healthy for the game. These builds fell into a couple of broad categories: > > 1. Single target raid builds. These builds put up 3 phantasms and did almost nothing for the rest of the fight. They were 1-trick-ponies, but if you only needed to dps a single target, they were ridiculously braindead. This is unhealthy and shouldn't exist. > 2. Bad builds. Every other use of a build where you attempt to stack up phantasms was bad. If you used phantasm stacking builds outside of single target raid/fractal situations, you were using a bad build. Targets die too quickly to make it worthwhile to stack phantasms, making it bad. > > The reason this change is positive for mesmer addresses both 1 and 2. 1 was too efficient and threw off balance in the rest of the game because it was the single most favorable situation for phantasm skills. This situation produced orders of magnitude higher returns than any other case, forcing them to balance the skills around this particular use. That balancing then produced the effect of 2: all other uses of phantasms was bad. If you weren't stacking 3 phantasms on a single target, your build was bad if it relied on phantasms because their damage output was balanced around that extreme single target stacking case. Now that you can't do that, Anet can balance around 1 common use case: summon phantasm, does damage, despawns. The target set or game scenario doesn't matter anymore, it's the same general use case. This means that Anet can actually balance the phantasm skills and our other weapon skills without having to keep nerfing things because if you stack 3 phantasms on a single target it'll do broken damage. > > Does it remove a variety of builds from the game? Yeah, it does. However, as I just went over, the only builds it removes are either the braindead raid builds or bad builds. Going from your post, I'm guessing you were using bad builds, so it would behoove you to learn the new skills and figure out how to use them effectively. I guarantee it'll be better than whatever you were running before. > > Edit: And before you respond with something along the lines of "but it worked for me", I can hammer nails using a brick and a rubber mallet. That doesn't mean I **should** hammer nails that way and I shouldn't get mad if someone comes along, takes away my brick and rubber mallet, and gives me a hammer instead. > @"Pyroatheist.9031" said: > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > Except that phantasms are now pretty much worthless. > > citation needed > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > >Except three of the four sources of might on my character are now gone. > > What. The only sources of might they removed were shattered strength and the might on gs autoattacks. If you were using the gs trait your build was bad. If you were using shattered strength in a "sustain" build, your build was bad. > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > >Except that my healing skill doesn't actually heal me to even a third of what it used to. > > What. The only changes to heals were buffs. If you're not healing as much as you used to, you're playing wrong. > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > Can anyone explain why this was necessary (because, honestly, if we are avoiding stagnation of skill in lower ranks there are a lot of professions that needed attention before mesmer), or why sustain playstyle has to be destroyed? > > Sure thing. The playstyle you call the "sustain playstyle" was never healthy for the game. These builds fell into a couple of broad categories: > > 1. Single target raid builds. These builds put up 3 phantasms and did almost nothing for the rest of the fight. They were 1-trick-ponies, but if you only needed to dps a single target, they were ridiculously braindead. This is unhealthy and shouldn't exist. > 2. Bad builds. Every other use of a build where you attempt to stack up phantasms was bad. If you used phantasm stacking builds outside of single target raid/fractal situations, you were using a bad build. Targets die too quickly to make it worthwhile to stack phantasms, making it bad. > > The reason this change is positive for mesmer addresses both 1 and 2. 1 was too efficient and threw off balance in the rest of the game because it was the single most favorable situation for phantasm skills. This situation produced orders of magnitude higher returns than any other case, forcing them to balance the skills around this particular use. That balancing then produced the effect of 2: all other uses of phantasms was bad. If you weren't stacking 3 phantasms on a single target, your build was bad if it relied on phantasms because their damage output was balanced around that extreme single target stacking case. Now that you can't do that, Anet can balance around 1 common use case: summon phantasm, does damage, despawns. The target set or game scenario doesn't matter anymore, it's the same general use case. This means that Anet can actually balance the phantasm skills and our other weapon skills without having to keep nerfing things because if you stack 3 phantasms on a single target it'll do broken damage. > > Does it remove a variety of builds from the game? Yeah, it does. However, as I just went over, the only builds it removes are either the braindead raid builds or bad builds. Going from your post, I'm guessing you were using bad builds, so it would behoove you to learn the new skills and figure out how to use them effectively. I guarantee it'll be better than whatever you were running before. > > Edit: And before you respond with something along the lines of "but it worked for me", I can hammer nails using a brick and a rubber mallet. That doesn't mean I **should** hammer nails that way and I shouldn't get mad if someone comes along, takes away my brick and rubber mallet, and gives me a hammer instead. How can healing possibly be buffed when its not getting a boost from clones on the floor but rather your healing power. Healing power is more effective for power builds but for condi builds your healing less because your not really getting the boost you used to have and yes there are condi builds that use prefix's that lack power. Also raiders are a small fraction of the player base and thus people don't care that raiding had issues with phantasms in addition nor do they care about bad builds. Good or bad it was their own build that they decided to use the entire argument about bad builds stinks of elitism. So neither of those can be taken seriously when taken into account the play-style of the base. What's more reasonable is they wanted to cut down on mesmer dependency in the game by shifting people around as I know many people who've already made plans to drop mesmer rather than regear on confusion changes alone their just waiting to see if things change in the wave of the usual post-patch fixes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hlord.5940 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 It would have been better if anet reduce the cooldown for some of the phantasm and the casting time too, most of the the skills are: you press a button and it activated but for mesmer you have to actually cast it, ie wait for a sec then the phantasm pop up and we have to wait for it to attack again, I wouldn't mind it if it's like necro where you can pre cast your minion but anet had change the phantasm in to a one time thing now and doing mumbo jumbo during a pvp/wvw fight is really dangerous, hell even when i recharge the mantra as a guardian is sill not safe. Also I still don't understand why chronophantasm sill has daze, after i tried it, it feel so slow and doesn't have a good synergy with shatter except with staff phantasm and greatsword phantasm with imagine burden but it just so bad if you want to shatter afterward, what is it? anet try to promote "phantasm" build or some thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levetty.1279 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Doam.8305" said: > Also raiders are a small fraction of the player base and thus people don't care that raiding had issues with phantasms in addition nor do they care about bad builds. Good or bad it was their own build that they decided to use the entire argument about bad builds stinks of elitism. So neither of those can be taken seriously when taken into account the play-style of the base. What's more reasonable is they wanted to cut down on mesmer dependency in the game by shifting people around as I know many people who've already made plans to drop mesmer rather than regear on confusion changes alone their just waiting to see if things change in the wave of the usual post-patch fixes. What? His point was that Phantasms had to be balanced around the theoretical ability to have 3 up at once, something that was only really possible on Raid bosses. Now they don't have to be and can be balanced like actual skills and thus the mechanics and the builds have gotten better across all game modes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OriOri.8724 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 I disagree with you OP. Mesmer sustain got buffed pretty nicely with this patch, you just need to adjust your build for it. Our ability to pump out clones went even higher than it already was, which pairs not only with RI but also with the new signet of the ether. We got a ridiculous new dmg reduction trait that can stack to 25% damage reduction, and sounds like it stacks with prot (not sure on that though). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace al Thor.6745 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"OriOri.8724" said: > I disagree with you OP. Mesmer sustain got buffed pretty nicely with this patch, you just need to adjust your build for it. Our ability to pump out clones went even higher than it already was, which pairs not only with RI but also with the new signet of the ether. We got a ridiculous new dmg reduction trait that can stack to 25% damage reduction, and sounds like it stacks with prot (not sure on that though). Exactly. I’m currently bouncing ideas around using SoE myself. I’m thinking dueling, illusions, and mirage. But that’s clone on dodge, clone on stealth, run the new signet so that a clone every 10 seconds on top of mirages insane clone production. The amount of clones you’d be able to produce would be unreal. I’m also considering a Chrono build using dueling and inspiration so then I would get healed per clone summoned and shattered which could be good too. The only problem I have is I wish healing prism was 20 percent instead of 13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zekvich.6701 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 I mainly play solo and challenge myself with things or do low end group content for now and the changes haven't really effected me negatively at all from what i've played using power chrono with some boonshare (still gearing for it, only at 15% duration). I found phantasms would usually need to be shattered for defence, the mob died too quickly or they didn't stay alive long enough to keep them out anyway so they never felt too good to use, they was mainly for soaking damage for me and clones i've always seen as pretty useless until mirage happened in pve, in pvp they feel very useful. I do miss having the ability to summon a phantasm to solo a mob though or keep it away from me whilst i'm killing some others as clones are far too squishy to do this with for me. So for me it's only really effected quality of life things out of combat which is a shame but i'm now hoping for the next elite to bring back phantasms in some form, here's hoping for splitting your mesmer into X number versions of itself and having to control multiple characters at once without relying on AI for it. oh and the sword phantasm sucks for me right now, it seems like it never wants to hit its target with the actual main damaging part of its attack :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyroatheist.9031 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > @"Doam.8305" said: > > Also raiders are a small fraction of the player base and thus people don't care that raiding had issues with phantasms in addition nor do they care about bad builds. Good or bad it was their own build that they decided to use the entire argument about bad builds stinks of elitism. So neither of those can be taken seriously when taken into account the play-style of the base. What's more reasonable is they wanted to cut down on mesmer dependency in the game by shifting people around as I know many people who've already made plans to drop mesmer rather than regear on confusion changes alone their just waiting to see if things change in the wave of the usual post-patch fixes. > > What? His point was that Phantasms had to be balanced around the theoretical ability to have 3 up at once, something that was only really possible on Raid bosses. Now they don't have to be and can be balanced like actual skills and thus the mechanics and the builds have gotten better across all game modes. Glad somebody actually read that rant... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyroatheist.9031 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Doam.8305" said: > > @"Pyroatheist.9031" said: > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > > Except that phantasms are now pretty much worthless. > > > > citation needed > > > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > >Except three of the four sources of might on my character are now gone. > > > > What. The only sources of might they removed were shattered strength and the might on gs autoattacks. If you were using the gs trait your build was bad. If you were using shattered strength in a "sustain" build, your build was bad. > > > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > >Except that my healing skill doesn't actually heal me to even a third of what it used to. > > > > What. The only changes to heals were buffs. If you're not healing as much as you used to, you're playing wrong. > > > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > > Can anyone explain why this was necessary (because, honestly, if we are avoiding stagnation of skill in lower ranks there are a lot of professions that needed attention before mesmer), or why sustain playstyle has to be destroyed? > > > > Sure thing. The playstyle you call the "sustain playstyle" was never healthy for the game. These builds fell into a couple of broad categories: > > > > 1. Single target raid builds. These builds put up 3 phantasms and did almost nothing for the rest of the fight. They were 1-trick-ponies, but if you only needed to dps a single target, they were ridiculously braindead. This is unhealthy and shouldn't exist. > > 2. Bad builds. Every other use of a build where you attempt to stack up phantasms was bad. If you used phantasm stacking builds outside of single target raid/fractal situations, you were using a bad build. Targets die too quickly to make it worthwhile to stack phantasms, making it bad. > > > > The reason this change is positive for mesmer addresses both 1 and 2. 1 was too efficient and threw off balance in the rest of the game because it was the single most favorable situation for phantasm skills. This situation produced orders of magnitude higher returns than any other case, forcing them to balance the skills around this particular use. That balancing then produced the effect of 2: all other uses of phantasms was bad. If you weren't stacking 3 phantasms on a single target, your build was bad if it relied on phantasms because their damage output was balanced around that extreme single target stacking case. Now that you can't do that, Anet can balance around 1 common use case: summon phantasm, does damage, despawns. The target set or game scenario doesn't matter anymore, it's the same general use case. This means that Anet can actually balance the phantasm skills and our other weapon skills without having to keep nerfing things because if you stack 3 phantasms on a single target it'll do broken damage. > > > > Does it remove a variety of builds from the game? Yeah, it does. However, as I just went over, the only builds it removes are either the braindead raid builds or bad builds. Going from your post, I'm guessing you were using bad builds, so it would behoove you to learn the new skills and figure out how to use them effectively. I guarantee it'll be better than whatever you were running before. > > > > Edit: And before you respond with something along the lines of "but it worked for me", I can hammer nails using a brick and a rubber mallet. That doesn't mean I **should** hammer nails that way and I shouldn't get mad if someone comes along, takes away my brick and rubber mallet, and gives me a hammer instead. > > > @"Pyroatheist.9031" said: > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > > Except that phantasms are now pretty much worthless. > > > > citation needed > > > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > >Except three of the four sources of might on my character are now gone. > > > > What. The only sources of might they removed were shattered strength and the might on gs autoattacks. If you were using the gs trait your build was bad. If you were using shattered strength in a "sustain" build, your build was bad. > > > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > >Except that my healing skill doesn't actually heal me to even a third of what it used to. > > > > What. The only changes to heals were buffs. If you're not healing as much as you used to, you're playing wrong. > > > > > @"Firseal.4716" said: > > > Can anyone explain why this was necessary (because, honestly, if we are avoiding stagnation of skill in lower ranks there are a lot of professions that needed attention before mesmer), or why sustain playstyle has to be destroyed? > > > > Sure thing. The playstyle you call the "sustain playstyle" was never healthy for the game. These builds fell into a couple of broad categories: > > > > 1. Single target raid builds. These builds put up 3 phantasms and did almost nothing for the rest of the fight. They were 1-trick-ponies, but if you only needed to dps a single target, they were ridiculously braindead. This is unhealthy and shouldn't exist. > > 2. Bad builds. Every other use of a build where you attempt to stack up phantasms was bad. If you used phantasm stacking builds outside of single target raid/fractal situations, you were using a bad build. Targets die too quickly to make it worthwhile to stack phantasms, making it bad. > > > > The reason this change is positive for mesmer addresses both 1 and 2. 1 was too efficient and threw off balance in the rest of the game because it was the single most favorable situation for phantasm skills. This situation produced orders of magnitude higher returns than any other case, forcing them to balance the skills around this particular use. That balancing then produced the effect of 2: all other uses of phantasms was bad. If you weren't stacking 3 phantasms on a single target, your build was bad if it relied on phantasms because their damage output was balanced around that extreme single target stacking case. Now that you can't do that, Anet can balance around 1 common use case: summon phantasm, does damage, despawns. The target set or game scenario doesn't matter anymore, it's the same general use case. This means that Anet can actually balance the phantasm skills and our other weapon skills without having to keep nerfing things because if you stack 3 phantasms on a single target it'll do broken damage. > > > > Does it remove a variety of builds from the game? Yeah, it does. However, as I just went over, the only builds it removes are either the braindead raid builds or bad builds. Going from your post, I'm guessing you were using bad builds, so it would behoove you to learn the new skills and figure out how to use them effectively. I guarantee it'll be better than whatever you were running before. > > > > Edit: And before you respond with something along the lines of "but it worked for me", I can hammer nails using a brick and a rubber mallet. That doesn't mean I **should** hammer nails that way and I shouldn't get mad if someone comes along, takes away my brick and rubber mallet, and gives me a hammer instead. > > How can healing possibly be buffed when its not getting a boost from clones on the floor but rather your healing power. Healing power is more effective for power builds but for condi builds your healing less because your not really getting the boost you used to have and yes there are condi builds that use prefix's that lack power. In a build with zero additional power you'll end up with a minimum of 130 extra healing needs power from the new trait. However that's incredibly minimal compared to the changes they made to the signet. If you're complaining about losing a possible 170 healing power in some very particular builds, you're wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeoLegend.5132 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 OP has no idea of what hes talking about. Thats a NICE step up for Power Mesmers! 1. We couldn't use any clone skill after 3rd phantasm now we can 2. We couldn't shatter, now we can 3. We couldn't Swordblock, or had to untarget to shield block... now we CAN 4. We didn't have enough damage to help the phantasms, now Sword got buffed Damm People are getting 32,k benchmarks on TESTING POWER BUILDS, most of them isn't even using CSplit, so its not even optimal yet. Stop crying about sutain because NOW you can actually USE your block weapon skills and utility ones too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenndevis.8327 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Anet hates the passive playstyle (for a reason unknown to me.) They coulda made them into a more active playstyle by making them do 1 attack but they shoulda reduced their cooldowns by a lot so we can spam them. Either lower the cooldown & keep them as they were damage/utility wise or keep their cooldown but severely increase their impact/damage/utility. Both ways woulda been fine but anet kept their cooldowns the same & only gave them ma very minor buff so it ended up in a huge nerf for builds that depended on phantasms. If anet really wantedthem to be on a long ish cooldown they shoulda buffed them by a lot more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmageddonAsh.6430 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Levetty.1279" said: > What? His point was that Phantasms had to be balanced around the theoretical ability to have 3 up at once, something that was only really possible on Raid bosses. Now they don't have to be and can be balanced like actual skills and thus the mechanics and the builds have gotten better across all game modes. Well, this is wrong. You could have 3 up in PvE, Dungeons, Raids, WvW, You COULD have 3 up anywhere. I myself had easily had 2 some times 3 up in WvW (roaming) of course not for long but still had them up lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace al Thor.6745 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"ArmageddonAsh.6430" said: > > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > What? His point was that Phantasms had to be balanced around the theoretical ability to have 3 up at once, something that was only really possible on Raid bosses. Now they don't have to be and can be balanced like actual skills and thus the mechanics and the builds have gotten better across all game modes. > > Well, this is wrong. You could have 3 up in PvE, Dungeons, Raids, WvW, You COULD have 3 up anywhere. I myself had easily had 2 some times 3 up in WvW (roaming) of course not for long but still had them up lol > > Sure you could have them in PvE but mobs die so quickly it’s rare not to mention in open world PvE you could run around with no armor, no weapons, and only use the 6-0 skills and still be able to kill mobs. Dungeons- Yes, but again dungeons are easy mode and mobs die quickly. Raids- already been discussed at length. WvW- Anet has stated, multiple times, that roaming/dueling is not a supported game mode. Sooo yeah can’t count that either. Even if it were you can’t sustain three phantasm. There too much AoE going around unless you’re just capping camps and not fighting which is another matter entirely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyroatheist.9031 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"ArmageddonAsh.6430" said: > > @"Levetty.1279" said: > > What? His point was that Phantasms had to be balanced around the theoretical ability to have 3 up at once, something that was only really possible on Raid bosses. Now they don't have to be and can be balanced like actual skills and thus the mechanics and the builds have gotten better across all game modes. > > Well, this is wrong. You could have 3 up in PvE, Dungeons, Raids, WvW, You COULD have 3 up anywhere. I myself had easily had 2 some times 3 up in WvW (roaming) of course not for long but still had them up lol > > If you ever had 3 up in dungeons, your party was awful and had zero dps. If you ever had 3 up in WvW, you were fighting some level 20 300 ap heroes. If you ever had 3 up in open world PvE, you're doing basically zero damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmageddonAsh.6430 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Pyroatheist.9031" said: > If you ever had 3 up in dungeons, your party was awful and had zero dps. If you ever had 3 up in WvW, you were fighting some level 20 300 ap heroes. If you ever had 3 up in open world PvE, you're doing basically zero damage. It can take 2-3seconds to get 3 up. I never said they were all needed to be weapon based ;) Plus, several of them you just want to kite people away from its only really the melee only ones that would easily be killed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now