Can we get a ranged condi weapon for vanilla revenant?

[Tazdingo.7213]

Just like the title says. What are you guys' opinions on that? Would it make renegade redundant or create some build diversity?

I always felt like anet was trying to cut corners by releasing the shortbow that can only be used with the new elite spec. Even before renegade came out I always had moments when I used some builds where I thought, " Man, wish I had a ranged condi weapon right now." For the power side we have the hammer. Would it hurt to have a condi one before we get more elite specs?

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

You could always have the Shortbow, i mean that has worked out SO well Lol

[ZeftheWicked.3076]

I have a different idea - ofc knowing a-net fat chance that will happen in core spec (no new money there).

 

Offhand dagger that will have the ability to hook & pull at range.

Since rev is basically a melee character, instead of bending it backwards to do what it's not meant to be, better to have a skill that can pull enemy to you, like Dragon Hunter's spear of justice.

 

Second skill could be a fear or a knockback, to make it the perfect engage/disengage weapon.

[Lahmia.2193]

Sad truth is that there will likely be no new weapons available to core professions, only via new elite specs. Which makes me sad indeed. Here's hoping they unbind the weapons from elite specs.

[Obtena.7952]

> @"Tazdingo.7213" said:

> Just like the title says. What are you guys' opinions on that? Would it make renegade redundant or create some build diversity?

> I always felt like anet was trying to cut corners by releasing the shortbow that can only be used with the new elite spec. Even before renegade came out I always had moments when I used some builds where I thought, " Man, wish I had a ranged condi weapon right now." For the power side we have the hammer. Would it hurt to have a condi one before we get more elite specs?

 

It was a frequent ask when the class was first released, but Anet hasn't made more weapons available to classes ever; they are simply added through elite specs.

[Tazdingo.7213]

> @"ArmageddonAsh.6430" said:

> You could always have the Shortbow, i mean that has worked out SO well Lol

 

Lol

> @"Lahmia.2193" said:

> Sad truth is that there will likely be no new weapons available to core professions, only via new elite specs. Which makes me sad indeed. Here's hoping they unbind the weapons from elite specs.

 

Yeah, I'm sure all these suggestions and feedbacks fall on deaf ears when it comes to the revenant. It would be nice to hear what are some of anet's plans with the revenant at the very least.. Unbinding does sound interesting but I can already foresee all the balance problems.

[Flauvious.6195]

> @"Lahmia.2193" said:

> Sad truth is that there will likely be no new weapons available to core professions, only via new elite specs. Which makes me sad indeed. Here's hoping they unbind the weapons from elite specs.

 

This sucks because while most professions already got every weapon that "makes sense" for them to use on base, rev was rushed and unfinished and originally made as a no weapon swap class, so they gave us few weapons like engi and ele. But after realizing we don't have nearly as many tools as those classes we, they gave rev weapon swap but didn't go back and add in additional weapons to match other classes. Rev has by far the least total weapon skills.

 

They should at least add a few of the things that would make sense for a warrior class to use; like how are you going to tell me a necromancer can use a main hand axe but melee warrior rev can't? We should at least get main hand axe, maybe as a ranged condi weapon, and greatsword as a 2h power weapon so power rev can wep swap between gs and sw/sw and actually do some dps.

[Lahmia.2193]

> @"Flauvious.6195" said:

> They should at least add a few of the things that would make sense for a warrior class to use; like how are you going to tell me a necromancer can use a main hand axe but melee warrior rev can't? We should at least get main hand axe, maybe as a ranged condi weapon, and greatsword as a 2h power weapon so power rev can wep swap between gs and sw/sw and actually do some dps.

 

I feel you buddy. I'm still miffed that they didn't make melee staff as revenants main power weapon.

[Mahou.3924]

The first thought that crossed my mind after the question: https://thehypnobirthingmidwivesofbristol.files.wordpress.com/2015/07/computer-says-no.png. Though I have nothing against Revenants :smile:

[Ronin.9376]

side topic I think revs needa greatsword next expansion :P

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

> @"Tazdingo.7213" said:

> Yeah, I'm sure all these suggestions and feedbacks fall on deaf ears when it comes to the revenant. It would be nice to hear what are some of anet's plans with the revenant at the very least.. Unbinding does sound interesting but I can already foresee all the balance problems.

 

Its EVERY profession. Its not as if Revenant are being treated differently. Unless i have issed where the other classes all got new core profession weapons and revenant didnt? Nope. Didnt think so.

 

 

[Flauvious.6195]

> @"ArmageddonAsh.6430" said:

> > @"Tazdingo.7213" said:

> > Yeah, I'm sure all these suggestions and feedbacks fall on deaf ears when it comes to the revenant. It would be nice to hear what are some of anet's plans with the revenant at the very least.. Unbinding does sound interesting but I can already foresee all the balance problems.

>

> Its EVERY profession. Its not as if Revenant are being treated differently. Unless i have issed where the other classes all got new core profession weapons and revenant didnt? Nope. Didnt think so.

>

>

 

No but mesmer gets a massive overhaul on all it's skills like every other year despite the game pretty much revolving around that class, I think there is some favoritism there..

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

> @"Flauvious.6195" said:

> No but mesmer gets a massive overhaul on all it's skills like every other year despite the game pretty much revolving around that class, I think there is some favoritism there..

 

No. I would say there is some serious bias on your side. Too be fair the Phantasm system NEEDED to be changed, it should have been like it is now from the very start. Makes balancing them so much easier, actually weakens them as well in several areas like condition removal and boon removal (iDisenchanter) which itself is now as typical of what Anet does is broken itself, will get nerfed to being not used soon enough.

 

Phantams were near useless for too much of the content in the game. It needed to be changed. Reveant doesnt have that outside of the really crappy Renegade Legend skills, which will get fixed. In the end but seeing as how it took Anet like 5 years to finally fix Phantasms and clones. Dont hold your breathe of it being any time soon.

 

Other than the MUCH needed change to Phantasms, what are these other massive overhauls they have experienced?

 

[Rym.1469]

Revenant's weapon balance is borked ever since we've found out that the class didn't work great without weapon swap. Number of avalible weapons was dictated by the fact that the profession was meant to have only one set at time, not two. And ArenaNet didn't care enough to respond to it with more weapons.

 

Adding new weapons to expand the customization of the class is a topic that's as old as Revenant and continues to be one of the best solutions to make our choices better. I could link you threads from second beta weekend when I asked for condition range weapon (and back then there was some dev communication on the class), but I think they're gone with the old forums. However, it seems like Revenant isn't and won't be lucky enough to ever see a light on this subject.

[narcx.3570]

> @"Tazdingo.7213" said:

> Just like the title says. What are you guys' opinions on that? Would it make renegade redundant or create some build diversity?

> I always felt like anet was trying to cut corners by releasing the shortbow that can only be used with the new elite spec. Even before renegade came out I always had moments when I used some builds where I thought, " Man, wish I had a ranged condi weapon right now." For the power side we have the hammer. Would it hurt to have a condi one before we get more elite specs?

 

Why do you need this...? Every single condi utility available without Renegade requires you to be in melee range, so there's no synergy. Most condi ranged weapons are also in the 900 range category, which isn't even that much more ranged than mace 2/3, axe 5, and Banish Enchantment spam if you really, really, really need a condi poke.

[Rasp Sabreblade.5421]

Just take the spear and add it as a land weapon.

[Klypto.1703]

I like the idea of like double daggers being a 1200 ranged weapons for condi on rev. Plus it would be a place to get poison damage other once every third hit with a mace lol. Would make that poison trait worth something. Or either like double daggers could be hybrid set that does differently based on your range from the target like scales from power to condition damage depending upon range.

[Caligrafers Blade.3871]

> @"narcx.3570" said:

> > @"Tazdingo.7213" said:

> > Just like the title says. What are you guys' opinions on that? Would it make renegade redundant or create some build diversity?

> > I always felt like anet was trying to cut corners by releasing the shortbow that can only be used with the new elite spec. Even before renegade came out I always had moments when I used some builds where I thought, " Man, wish I had a ranged condi weapon right now." For the power side we have the hammer. Would it hurt to have a condi one before we get more elite specs?

>

> Why do you need this...? Every single condi utility available without Renegade requires you to be in melee range, so there's no synergy. Most condi ranged weapons are also in the 900 range category, which isn't even that much more ranged than mace 2/3, axe 5, and Banish Enchantment spam if you really, really, really need a condi poke.

 

 

Actually, I'm with Tazdingo.7213 on this. I could really do with a ranged condi attack on skill 1 without energy consumption. It would make so much sense for them to just make axe a main-hand ranged condi weapon. While I love the hammer and its crazy 5-target attacks, especially in WvW, , I could really do with an at least 3-target ranged axe to pair with my shield. Right now, I have to equip/unequip weapons before entering a particular situation, and it sucks.

[Buran.3796]

> @"narcx.3570" said:

 

> Why do you need this...? Every single condi utility available without Renegade requires you to be in melee range, so there's no synergy. Most condi ranged weapons are also in the 900 range category, which isn't even that much more ranged than mace 2/3, axe 5, and Banish Enchantment spam if you really, really, really need a condi poke.

 

Condi Thief, Ranger or Mesmer can easily poke to death condi Rev at range, which has potato mobility and delivers almost no pressure at range. You can also put Scourge in the list, due they start hitting at 1200 range and if they play well condi Rev can fall destroyed well before reaching mele range.

 

But I disagree about providing a new condi weapon: that's what was supposed to be the shortbow task; once they failed with this weapon and butchered the block in the sword there's no point about thinking in to make condi Rev a competitive build, just won't work.

[narcx.3570]

> @"Buran.3796" said:

> > @"narcx.3570" said:

>

> > Why do you need this...? Every single condi utility available without Renegade requires you to be in melee range, so there's no synergy. Most condi ranged weapons are also in the 900 range category, which isn't even that much more ranged than mace 2/3, axe 5, and Banish Enchantment spam if you really, really, really need a condi poke.

>

> Condi Thief, Ranger or Mesmer can easily poke to death condi Rev at range, which has potato mobility and delivers almost no pressure at range. You can also put Scourge in the list, due they start hitting at 1200 range and if they play well condi Rev can fall destroyed well before reaching mele range.

>

> But I disagree about providing a new condi weapon: that's what was supposed to be the shortbow task; once they failed with this weapon and butchered the block in the sword there's no point about thinking in to make condi Rev a competitive build, just won't work.

 

As you said, all of what you describe would not be helped with the addition of another ranged condi weapon. Best case scenario, you can shoot them with your new condi weapon while they can also shoot you, plus use all their utilities, plus cleanse/transfer conditions... You'd still get annihilated because all of those classes have tools that are meant to be used from ranged and are better at dealing with condi's than you are in a trade-for-trade auto attacking shootout.

 

What condi rev's really need is better gap closers... Axe 4 is a joke outside of PvE since it is such a slow, obvious telegraph that needs to actually hit in order to proc the shadow step. The only people getting hit by axe four from anywhere beyond point-blank range are either bad (you'd of killed them anyways) or didn't know it was unblockable since they never fight revs (you're never going to hit them with it again after that first time.)

 

I think putting i-frames onto Unyielding Anguish would be a step in the right direction and not too OP given it's high's energy cost, reasonable range, and the PvP nerfs to Abyssal Chill.

 

That or some sort of projectile destruction to cover you while they get into range. Maybe moving Dome of the Mists out of a never used trait line and into Mallyx could help a lot in this area as well. Or have searing fissure destroy (burn up) projectiles crossing it... Even giving Temporal Rift projectile destruction would help somewhat.

[Caligrafers Blade.3871]

> @"narcx.3570" said:

 

> As you said, all of what you describe would not be helped with the addition of another ranged condi weapon. Best case scenario, you can shoot them with your new condi weapon while they can also shoot you, plus use all their utilities, plus cleanse/transfer conditions... You'd still get annihilated because all of those classes have tools that are meant to be used from ranged and are better at dealing with condi's than you are in a trade-for-trade auto attacking shootout.

 

I was thinking of a condi range weapon more for a zerg build than a 1-on1 face off. But if we were to consider the latter, you will have to eventually get into melee range to apply effective condi. However, it would nice to add to that pressure early, applying condi from range itself even before we go in. Yes, the other professions have crazy range and will start hitting us before we reach, but that is the case anyway. That's why the hammer is still great.

 

> @"narcx.3570" said:

 

> That or some sort of projectile destruction to cover you while they get into range. Maybe moving Dome of the Mists out of a never used trait line and into Mallyx could help a lot in this area as well. Or have searing fissure destroy (burn up) projectiles crossing it... Even giving Temporal Rift projectile destruction would help somewhat.

 

And this is where I totally agree with you on more projectile blocks/destructs. We really need buffs on the axe and shield as well. Heck, make shield 4 Dome of the Mists!

 

 

 

 

[Exalted Quality.8534]

I just had a thought (this may have been suggested before?) How about give Revs different effects for weapon skills based on the legend they are attuned to? No specific ideas yet, but this would make me much less salty about weapon skills costing energy and having cooldowns.