sephiroth.4217 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Not sure if it's win trading and don't want to get in trouble for it. Situation 1: Playing the game, we are winning, someone DC's.... They come back but it's too late, we are losing... Someone in team chat mentions they shouldn't have come back for the sake of the team, the guy leaves again and someone (me) sends them gold with a thank you for their consideration. Situation 2: We lost the mid fight, the scourge says he's afk but never disconnects from the match and just sits in base... Someone offers him 25g to just leave the game completely and he does. Any of those examples win trading? Or is purely paying someone on the other team to throw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrilana.1396 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Trying to find a way around the rule? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CETheLucid.3964 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > Question about wintrading Don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odik.4587 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"sephiroth.4217" said: Even 5g would be too much for that necro None of those is wintrading but dumbness of people,simple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Happy birthday song. If you don’t reconnect back by time you sing that...log out for 15 minutes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suffish.4150 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Neither of those situations is wintrading and I would have no issue at all with anyone doing either in my games and I would do it myself if I cared enough about rating. Offering people gold to do the RIGHT THING is completely different to just paying people to save your rating. If someone wants to afk, that’s no problem at all as long as they dc. If they need some gold as encouragement to dc then by all means go ahead and pay them. It is not match manipulation regardless of what anet may believe on this matter because someone is deliberately losing your game and costing you a whole hour of your day (if you are high rating) to get back to where you would have been if you won the match. It is the exact same situation with the first scenario. Someone is going to cost you an entire hour of your day (assuming you care about rating, again) when you should absolutely not lose rating for that game and paying someone so that you get what you deserve and do not get put in a totally unfair situation is fine in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilli.2976 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 They already fixed it, their solution was move the whole PvP team to PvE/WvW where the money is. I don't give a kitten anymore about PvP just farm your chest when the season is over go PvE/WvW where the development team is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMW.2951 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"Chilli.2976" said: > They already fixed it, their solution was move the whole PvP team to PvE/WvW where the money is. I don't give a kitten anymore about PvP just farm your chest when the season is over go PvE/WvW where the development team is. Yup the balance is ruined for sPvP and my buddy and I are just going to get our last chest for the first time next season and start playing WvW where we don't have to worry about "teamwork" to rotate properly and stand on a point. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrilana.1396 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 While those options technically are not win trading, you have to think of how it will look from Anet’s side. It would very much look like you were involved and it wouldn’t surprise me if players who were actual win trading did just that to “hide” it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinnel.4369 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"Chilli.2976" said: > They already fixed it, their solution was move the whole PvP team to PvE/WvW where the money is. I don't give a kitten anymore about PvP just farm your chest when the season is over go PvE/WvW where the development team is. They're not in WvW either. PvE and BLTC drive this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArenaNet Staff Ben Phongluangtham.1065 Posted April 30, 2018 ArenaNet Staff Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > Not sure if it's win trading and don't want to get in trouble for it. > > Situation 1: Playing the game, we are winning, someone DC's.... They come back but it's too late, we are losing... Someone in team chat mentions they shouldn't have come back for the sake of the team, the guy leaves again and someone (me) sends them gold with a thank you for their consideration. > > Situation 2: We lost the mid fight, the scourge says he's afk but never disconnects from the match and just sits in base... Someone offers him 25g to just leave the game completely and he does. > > Any of those examples win trading? Or is purely paying someone on the other team to throw? Don't do either of these scenarios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acandis.3250 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > Not sure if it's win trading and don't want to get in trouble for it. > > > > Situation 1: Playing the game, we are winning, someone DC's.... They come back but it's too late, we are losing... Someone in team chat mentions they shouldn't have come back for the sake of the team, the guy leaves again and someone (me) sends them gold with a thank you for their consideration. > > > > Situation 2: We lost the mid fight, the scourge says he's afk but never disconnects from the match and just sits in base... Someone offers him 25g to just leave the game completely and he does. > > > > Any of those examples win trading? Or is purely paying someone on the other team to throw? > > Don't do either of these scenarios. This answer is a bit too absolute for the complex scenarios that these situations paint. Back in the day (before loss-forgiven system existed) in high-rated matches, it was customary to honor an AFK or a DC, by simply having 1 person AFK in base until the enemy AFK came back/re-connected. That's just good sportsmanship. Of course, you can argue that this "honorable" behavior isn't necessary since statistically DCs are gonna happen to pretty much everyone and in the long-run the points one gains from an enemy DC and the points one loses for ally DC should net to zero. That being said, as soon as the loss-forgiven system was implemented, all of this was thrown out the window. You introduced a system in which "win-trading" can thrive--and do so with virtually no risk. By having the option for 4 out of 5 players to not lose rating if someone takes the hit, you've invited abusive behavior to be part of the game. That being said, I rarely see the cries for "omg you sux pls DC so we don't lose point" in high rated games. It is mostly when I'm smurfing in gold or lower that I see this behavior. Anyways, the point I'm trying to make is this: **If you don't want people to abuse the system, just remove it entirely.** It shouldn't exist. Yea, losing because you had a DC feelsbadman, but you are just as likely to win as many games because of enemy DC as well. Removing loss-forgiven won't remove win-trading entirely but I am certain that it will remove A LOT of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardid.7203 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 The moment you, in game, pay someone for an specific behavior, you are conditioning the entire balance of the game. Maybe it can be acceptable as a negotiation outside the match, or as a previously agreed rule, but in the moment it is just manipulation of the situation, which can go wrong in both ways, and which doesn't help to keep the game's transparency. I don't get it, sorry. Is really that terrible to lose sometimes? I prefer my wins clean and clear, and don't fear losing when the rules are fair. Fun is more important than winning, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voltaicbore.8012 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Yeah I wouldn't call either of those "win trading" per se, but I feel like both scenarios are the very foundation of win trading and therefore should be avoided. I wouldn't even call either scenario "match manipulation", as the teammates' refusal to play arguably did _all_ the manipulating already. All the payers are doing is attempting to prevent rating loss from a match that a teammate has unfairly all but guaranteed to result in a loss. That being said, the very fact that players are willing to pay and be paid for changing their behavior in spvp _is_ the problem itself. Any incentive to intentionally change a match (outside of sincere competition) can only lead to more clear-cut forms of win trading and match manipulation, I fear. But more importantly, Ben has spoken: > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > Don't do either of these scenarios. Maybe not the most comprehensive answer, but a very clear one nonetheless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrubySzymek.1362 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > Not sure if it's win trading and don't want to get in trouble for it. > > > > Situation 1: Playing the game, we are winning, someone DC's.... They come back but it's too late, we are losing... Someone in team chat mentions they shouldn't have come back for the sake of the team, the guy leaves again and someone (me) sends them gold with a thank you for their consideration. > > > > Situation 2: We lost the mid fight, the scourge says he's afk but never disconnects from the match and just sits in base... Someone offers him 25g to just leave the game completely and he does. > > > > Any of those examples win trading? Or is purely paying someone on the other team to throw? > > Don't do either of these scenarios. Cool but one of recent celeb wintraders you perma dishonoured is already doing the same on new account so what's the point of not doing so if someone wants easy money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dreddo.9865 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 If there was a more advanced system of evaluating players' performance such incidents would occur less often. Ok I can't blame the guy who disconnected the internet isn't a perfect thing but for the necro if there was a system evaluating his performance and would punish him with -30 rank points for low team contribution, I am sure he would have thought it twice to afk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted April 30, 2018 Author Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > Not sure if it's win trading and don't want to get in trouble for it. > > > > Situation 1: Playing the game, we are winning, someone DC's.... They come back but it's too late, we are losing... Someone in team chat mentions they shouldn't have come back for the sake of the team, the guy leaves again and someone (me) sends them gold with a thank you for their consideration. > > > > Situation 2: We lost the mid fight, the scourge says he's afk but never disconnects from the match and just sits in base... Someone offers him 25g to just leave the game completely and he does. > > > > Any of those examples win trading? Or is purely paying someone on the other team to throw? > > Don't do either of these scenarios. good thing I asked because that was very helpful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best.3479 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > Not sure if it's win trading and don't want to get in trouble for it. > > > > Situation 1: Playing the game, we are winning, someone DC's.... They come back but it's too late, we are losing... Someone in team chat mentions they shouldn't have come back for the sake of the team, the guy leaves again and someone (me) sends them gold with a thank you for their consideration. > > > > Situation 2: We lost the mid fight, the scourge says he's afk but never disconnects from the match and just sits in base... Someone offers him 25g to just leave the game completely and he does. > > > > Any of those examples win trading? Or is purely paying someone on the other team to throw? > > Don't do either of these scenarios. Yup, both of these scenarios mean you're playing PvP. Which of course is the opposite that Anet wants you to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicariuz.1605 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > Not sure if it's win trading and don't want to get in trouble for it. > > > > Situation 1: Playing the game, we are winning, someone DC's.... They come back but it's too late, we are losing... Someone in team chat mentions they shouldn't have come back for the sake of the team, the guy leaves again and someone (me) sends them gold with a thank you for their consideration. > > > > Situation 2: We lost the mid fight, the scourge says he's afk but never disconnects from the match and just sits in base... Someone offers him 25g to just leave the game completely and he does. > > > > Any of those examples win trading? Or is purely paying someone on the other team to throw? > > Don't do either of these scenarios. Yeah just suck up the massive loss in rating/time? Hopefully you understand that a -20 to -25 because of either scenario is at least half an hour of wasted time AND/OR more losses with your arbitrary MM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonstarmac.4603 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 Best thing to do in case of scenario 1: nothing, scenario 2: report as being inactive and move along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother.1504 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 I really want to like gw2 spvp but this type of forum post illustrates how much of a mess the mode is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrilana.1396 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"Vicariuz.1605" said: > > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > > > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > > Not sure if it's win trading and don't want to get in trouble for it. > > > > > > Situation 1: Playing the game, we are winning, someone DC's.... They come back but it's too late, we are losing... Someone in team chat mentions they shouldn't have come back for the sake of the team, the guy leaves again and someone (me) sends them gold with a thank you for their consideration. > > > > > > Situation 2: We lost the mid fight, the scourge says he's afk but never disconnects from the match and just sits in base... Someone offers him 25g to just leave the game completely and he does. > > > > > > Any of those examples win trading? Or is purely paying someone on the other team to throw? > > > > Don't do either of these scenarios. > > Yeah just suck up the massive loss in rating/time? Hopefully you understand that a -20 to -25 because of either scenario is at least half an hour of wasted time AND/OR more losses with your arbitrary MM. Both of the examples that the OP gave can give the appearance of win trading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicariuz.1605 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > @"Vicariuz.1605" said: > > > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > > > > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > > > Not sure if it's win trading and don't want to get in trouble for it. > > > > > > > > Situation 1: Playing the game, we are winning, someone DC's.... They come back but it's too late, we are losing... Someone in team chat mentions they shouldn't have come back for the sake of the team, the guy leaves again and someone (me) sends them gold with a thank you for their consideration. > > > > > > > > Situation 2: We lost the mid fight, the scourge says he's afk but never disconnects from the match and just sits in base... Someone offers him 25g to just leave the game completely and he does. > > > > > > > > Any of those examples win trading? Or is purely paying someone on the other team to throw? > > > > > > Don't do either of these scenarios. > > > > Yeah just suck up the massive loss in rating/time? Hopefully you understand that a -20 to -25 because of either scenario is at least half an hour of wasted time AND/OR more losses with your arbitrary MM. > > Both of the examples that the OP gave can give the appearance of win trading. Obviously........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
praqtos.9035 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 i dont get why u would pay them ? granted i dont do much ranked pvp so dunno if being 4 ppl losing is affecting ur rating less than being 5 ppl losing. but the paying part is just beyond me xD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilman.1532 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 And the rolling dumpster fire continues to roll down Mount Trashmore.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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