Staff desperately needs an overhaul

[Snowjob.7245]

I would like to see...

 

Staff 1 - Increase range to 600

 

Staff 2 - Auto explode. No cd increase.

 

Staff 3 - Is fine

 

Staff 4 - Instant cast. Less might but longer duration.

 

Staff 5 - Heals allies that pass through it.

[starlinvf.1358]

> @"CptAurellian.9537" said:

> > @"Blue.1207" said:

> > I would enjoy seeing this weapon be reworked into something more aggressive in terms of game play.

> Staff urgently needs a rework, but I don't think a total conversion from a supportive weapon into an offensive one is the right way. Give #1 some profile, since after the nerf it is a weak melee tickle that could just as well be removed and no one would notice. Rework #2 into a proper healing tool that also gives some relevant boon, give non-trash boons to #3. #4 can probably be left as it is apart from giving it slightly increased might duration (12-15 s baseline would be better) and #5 should do something for allies when they pass through it.

>

>

 

> @"Dedicant.6820" said:

> I think the staff should be changed into a proper support weapon, not a condi/damage one. Keep it in line with the original concept of the weapon but bring it up in regards to the level of power necessary for current GW2 content. Either refine the skills by adding healing, relevant boon(s) and perhaps even condition cleansing or rework the skills to something more interesting and useful.

>

> The auto attack is just woefully underwhelming right now, using 2 feels clunky, swiftness is useful sometimes but... well eh most of the time, I love the animation on 4 but it doesn't really ever feel worth it, and 5 is just the worst imo. Something needs to change and I'd rather not just get a slight buff that finds a middle ground between the old 600 range and current 300. There's a few good suggestions for awesome reworks on this thread and a lot on an older thread, really wish anet would consider their options here especially with all the reworks coming. Just my opinion as someone who keeps picking it up because I like the concept of staff Guardian but who also keeps putting it back down when I realise just how meh it is again.

>

> Here is my proposed rework.

>

> 1- Should heal with more range either a larger cone or aoe around the caster, even something like [Light of Judgement](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Light_of_Judgment "Light of Judgement") or [Pillar of Light](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Pillar_of_Light "Pillar of Light")

> 2- Add a blast finisher to the explosion, make ground targeted

> 3- Symbol of Resistance/Purification - cleanse x conditions and apply resistance every interval

> 4- Buff the healing and/or might generation and range and provide an indicator for allies on the range of the ability, kind of like tome 4

> 5- [Judgement ](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Judgment_(skill) "Judgement ") This except on target or ground target and without blast (or could leave the blast finisher on this skill instead of having it on 2)

 

The issue here is that the Guardian is an insanely powerful support class to begin with, and the majority of that comes from traits and utilities. Core guard has shouts, reflects, cleanse, and the now-reworked weapons have decent utility..... and all of that is focused in its utility slots. This frees the Guardian's weapons to be offensive, defense, or supportive with a level of independence from its utilities that are practically unheard of with the other classes. (Except Ranger.... but only because its skills are pretty poor to begin with, and don't synergize well no matter how hard you try.)

 

With so much of its Support power manifested in its Utilities alone, its hard to really justify an even stronger support tool that the utilities don't already cover, or would further their already absurd performance.

 

Lets look at what the weapons and utility groups do.

 

Hammer- Group CC (which makes it good for Point control or otherwise low mobility fights)

Mace/Shield - Group defense

Sword/Focus - Personal offense

Torch - Condi

Great Sword - Mobility melee

Scepter - Ranged (Punish static targets)

Long bow - Ranged (vs higher mobility)

Axe - Condi

Staff - "Support"

 

Shouts - Group support

Consecrations - Area control

Meditation - Personal Support

Signets - Passive buffs (and with the POF trait update, now offers significant group bonuses)

Spirit weapons - Now useful as Ranged support

 

 

Looking at the Staff specifically,

1 - Never had much in the way of coherent design, other then being a vehicle for VoJ procs.

2 - The orb is too slow and awkward to use with this game's combat pace. Scepter 1 kind of has the same problem, but works around it by how spammy it is.

3 - Is only really used for swiftness upkeep. This isn't really bad overall, but since the rest of the weapon lacks general utility, a lot of people look to this one skill as something the other skills can learn from.

4 - Only really good as an opening might stack, due to the rooting. Which is kind of the Healing function feels counter intuitive here, because regrouping mid fight is dangerous, and the healing isn't strong enough to compensate for that.

5 - Lines are made to cut off enemy escape. Its not a bad skill. But its logic seems to demand synergy with another weapon, and that doesn't seem apparent given how you can't camp staff since weapons are the only way Guardians can deal with combat.

 

As for what to change.

 

Empower should function like "Wash the Pain Away", where the effect reaches further out with each tick. This way stacked groups get the maximum effect with 4 ticks, while those further out can still benefit. This change can justify increasing the radius to 1200 max, going 300/600/900/1200, and leaves a lot of wiggle room for balance concerning healing output, rooting, and additional trait features.

 

The only mandatory change I could suggest for Symbol of Swiftness is to adopt the Temporal Curtain mechanic where it gives the max swiftness on the first application, but doesn't stack it higher on subsequent applications. This is mostly a QOL change for WvW, where swiftness chaining is about the only practical use it has, aside from tagging enemies into combat. I would also consider looking into adding a trait that will help it complement opening charges, rather then just stacking swiftness prior to moving. Say reducing the effect of movement impairing conditions every pulse (applied as a 1-sec buff), and sharing this effect with Inspiring Reinforcement (which honestly, that skill should have had from the beginning). Combined, this has a theme creating a pathway for PvP/WvW groups to push forward, making it a choice to commit to the path, with counter play by the enemy by using it as a tell. Multiple Guardians can stagger symbols, while Revs can create a long one on their own. General utility for the guardian, but a substantial gain for the Revenant in all modes.

 

Orb of Light needs a change to make a function better with an Ammo system. 1 Charge to fire, which flips the skill to Detonate orb, and a second charge to Detonate if desired. This gives more options for improving it via Staff traits with faster recharge times, or carrying an extra charge, and still have cool down timer on the main skill as a balance vector. I would also change it to use Line based Ground targeting, improving control, and falling more inline with its role as Support instead of offense.

 

Lastly, the Wave of Wrath needs its purpose rethought. As of right now, its only design coherence is general tagging of enemies at point blank, and seemed to have stemmed from an early concept of Staff being Guardian's "chase' weapon. While this would had been a good opportunity for a movement chain.... Ranger proved this mechanic doesn't work, due to problems with latency and the server loop. To address this, Orb needs to be refocused into the tagging role (which the ammo suggestion helps address), and the Auto attack redesigned entirely to give it a longer reach, but shorter arc and fewer targets. ~~While this may sound like going back to the original specs, adding the ability to track targets instead of directly in front of the Guardian addresses the issues the Arc existed for in the first place. Next is doing line of sight checks, because the range nerf only came about due to it being able to bypass obstructions in WvW. Targeting also gives the weapon the ability to attack at elevation.... though at 600 range, I doubt it will reach ~~

 

On second thought, I have a better idea. What about making it a slightly wide projectile like a smaller version of ScorchRazor, and combine it with the "Strike behind target" feature of Puncture shot. Allowing the projectile to strike a target, and firing a melee ranged arc that hits up to 3 or 5 targets in total facing the direction of the projectile path. Effectively a displaced melee cleave on impact. Everything else about damage, fire rate and range would just be a matter of tweaking numbers from that point.

[Dedicant.6820]

>

> Empower should function like "Wash the Pain Away", where the effect reaches further out with each tick. This way stacked groups get the maximum effect with 4 ticks, while those further out can still benefit. This change can justify increasing the radius to 1200 max, going 300/600/900/1200, and leaves a lot of wiggle room for balance concerning healing output, rooting, and additional trait features.

>

> The only mandatory change I could suggest for Symbol of Swiftness is to adopt the Temporal Curtain mechanic where it gives the max swiftness on the first application, but doesn't stack it higher on subsequent applications. This is mostly a QOL change for WvW, where swiftness chaining is about the only practical use it has, aside from tagging enemies into combat. I would also consider looking into adding a trait that will help it complement opening charges, rather then just stacking swiftness prior to moving. Say reducing the effect of movement impairing conditions every pulse (applied as a 1-sec buff), and sharing this effect with Inspiring Reinforcement (which honestly, that skill should have had from the beginning). Combined, this has a theme creating a pathway for PvP/WvW groups to push forward, making it a choice to commit to the path, with counter play by the enemy by using it as a tell. Multiple Guardians can stagger symbols, while Revs can create a long one on their own. General utility for the guardian, but a substantial gain for the Revenant in all modes.

>

> Orb of Light needs a change to make a function better with an Ammo system. 1 Charge to fire, which flips the skill to Detonate orb, and a second charge to Detonate if desired. This gives more options for improving it via Staff traits with faster recharge times, or carrying an extra charge, and still have cool down timer on the main skill as a balance vector. I would also change it to use Line based Ground targeting, improving control, and falling more inline with its role as Support instead of offense.

>

> Lastly, the Wave of Wrath needs its purpose rethought. As of right now, its only design coherence is general tagging of enemies at point blank, and seemed to have stemmed from an early concept of Staff being Guardian's "chase' weapon. While this would had been a good opportunity for a movement chain.... Ranger proved this mechanic doesn't work, due to problems with latency and the server loop. To address this, Orb needs to be refocused into the tagging role (which the ammo suggestion helps address), and the Auto attack redesigned entirely to give it a longer reach, but shorter arc and fewer targets. ~~While this may sound like going back to the original specs, adding the ability to track targets instead of directly in front of the Guardian addresses the issues the Arc existed for in the first place. Next is doing line of sight checks, because the range nerf only came about due to it being able to bypass obstructions in WvW. Targeting also gives the weapon the ability to attack at elevation.... though at 600 range, I doubt it will reach ~~

>

> On second thought, I have a better idea. What about making it a slightly wide projectile like a smaller version of ScorchRazor, and combine it with the "Strike behind target" feature of Puncture shot. Allowing the projectile to strike a target, and firing a melee ranged arc that hits up to 3 or 5 targets in total facing the direction of the projectile path. Effectively a displaced melee cleave on impact. Everything else about damage, fire rate and range would just be a matter of tweaking numbers from that point.

 

I do kind of agree that my idea is a tad overtuned considering what Guardian (especially Firebrand Guardian) can bring with utilities, it was mostly for fun theorising what could happen to staff if it ever was buffed/reworked, I don't really expect anet to change that much, however I do still think staff needs a bit of tuning or reworking to find a decent place with the rest of the weapons available to Guardian.

 

1 most importantly needs changed, I really think adding healing or a boon to it's current form with a small range inc or a full rework of this skill is necessary. If they really want it to be a damage only skill perhaps it could apply vuln like the new trident 1.

 

2 could mostly use QOL changes to stop it bugging into the ground and missing targets, it's slow and awkward. I like the idea of ammo on it but I don't understand do you mean 2 orbs or 1 orb can explode twice?

 

I like your idea for 4 a lot it would make the skill a lot more usable in more situations, I still think a range indicator for allies would be helpful here esp if there is a range increase.

 

I was thinking recently after you mentioned Temporal Curtain, keeping 5 the way it is but moving the swiftness over to this skill for allies who run through it and allowing the symbol to pulse something else, just a thought.

 

Also I think it would make sense for if any new support mechanics are added to the staff, some should only be available when staff is traited so you have to invest in it to get the full support power of the weapon.

[Yannir.4132]

I remember posting several suggestions about staff reworks in the old forums. Can't be bothered to try anymore. Just a faint glimmer of hope that one day ANet will listen.

[CptAurellian.9537]

> @"starlinvf.1358" said:

> With so much of its Support power manifested in its Utilities alone, its hard to really justify an even stronger support tool that the utilities don't already cover, or would further their already absurd performance.

That may (or not, I don't really care) be true for WvW, but it isn't in case in PvE. All the support a guard can throw around is pitiful compared to a chrono or, now to a lesser extent, a druid. There, a properly working support staff would be a boon to anyone trying to fill a support role, although it still might not be enough.

[Lalainnia.3598]

> @"CptAurellian.9537" said:

> > @"starlinvf.1358" said:

> > With so much of its Support power manifested in its Utilities alone, its hard to really justify an even stronger support tool that the utilities don't already cover, or would further their already absurd performance.

> That may (or not, I don't really care) be true for WvW, but it isn't in case in PvE. All the support a guard can throw around is pitiful compared to a chrono or, now to a lesser extent, a druid. There, a properly working support staff would be a boon to anyone trying to fill a support role, although it still might not be enough.

 

25 stacks of might, perma quickness, perma regen, perma Prot, better Stability, Better aegis, Better healing and cleansing especially since druid healing nerf, Resistance when required higher dps compared to druid if that even really matters. The main things support firebrand are missing in a pve instanced setting would be better fury and vigor upkeep compared to the options they have. The main difference between them and Chrono are alacrity and CC chronos also have a better pull with focus 4 compared to firebrand tome1 skill 3. Main differences between Druid and Firebrand are Spirits, Empowerment, Spotter, better fury uptime and Elites with Natures Spirit or Entangle.

 

As for staff on Druid the 1 skill and 2 are equivalent to guards writ and battle presence traits if even. 3 on staff is an evade and heal which heals for about 100 hp more compared to 2 on guardian staff but has a longer cd excluding cd reduction trait even with the trait its the same. 4 on druid staff is an immobilize and movement impeding cleanse for allies which can be comparable to guardian staff 5 although druid 4 will see more practical use vs non weak or special mobs. Druid Staff 5 is projectile destruction that u can drop and forget comparable to nothing on staff but similar to guards shield while guards requires u to channel its mobile.

 

I could go on about the differences for each elite spec But the real thing is Firebrand is not in a bad position as Support for Pve. They are an outright better healer compared to druid the main defining difference between druid and firebrand is that druid has more offensive unique buffs and with the spirit changes from a while back its opened up room for any of the 3 other main healers to take a second druids spot and provide there special buffs/utility or simply more overall healing then whatever a druid can push out. If the argument is made about you only need 1 druid anyway good for that person and that group they should just scrap the druid at that point and take a condi soulbeast with spirits.

 

 

[CptAurellian.9537]

I know the differences between the classes well enough, since I play all three. The very basic fact remains: for PvE, offensive buffs are the ones that matter. Defensive ones like stability, resistance etc. are nice to have, but not much more. Also, raw healing potential is rarely that important. Looking at the big picture, a PvE support FB is strong in areas that aren't really needed, but rather weak or redundant with regard to the stuff you want to have in a group. That's not a good spot.

[Lalainnia.3598]

So what you really want is firebrand offensive unique buffs that will put them in a dominate spot for pve? Or just offensive supportive nerfs to druid so firebrand can 2 for 2 replace them? Because more over all healing to staff sure won't accomplish that.

[CptAurellian.9537]

You get me wrong in pretty much every aspect. Unique buffs are one of the worst thing that happen to this game's balance and there is no need for FB to be a 1:1 replacement for druid. The replacement thing anyway cannot be tackled by looking at just one class, since we effectively have teams of supporters that compete: chrono/druid or FB/renegade, with the latter currently inferior by a big margin due to wide gaps in their capabilities. Fury, for example, is such a gap and a FB staff rework could be an option to address it. Just throwing more heals at staff is certainly not a good option and you may notice that I advocated for support, not heals.

 

From a PvE point of view, there is no single reason why the guardian, as a support archetype, should not have a proper support weapon. May that make it OP in PvD? Possibly, but that's what skill splits are there fore.

[Kain Francois.4328]

Literally all they need to do to fix Staff is make it apply a modest heal on autoattack. Maybe extend might on Empower, add a base heal to Glyph of Swiftness. Boom, the weapon has a purpose now.

[Lalainnia.3598]

Staff on guardian is a proper support weapon lol. Fury can be addressed you simply swap scepter for sword lose out on might gain though. 2 on guard stuff gives light aura im not sure exactly what kinda of boon you would want on a low cd skill shot heal? 1 skill on guardian staff can't have healing attached to it as it would make firebrand more powerful and fall into the more healing not needed category. The only thing that could possible gain something is staff 5 when allies walk through it even then what would it be alacrity a damage boost of some kind lol. Its just like cc Firebrand can trade utility to out perform druid for cc. What your stating is that it really all comes back around to offensive buffs which is where the real problem lies not Staff for guardian.

 

The only way and its well known by all that a Firebrand Tempest or Herald/Renegade would surpass a druid in a top notch instanced pve setting is if they had something comparable to Spirits Empowerment and Spotter. Changing staff to make it some sort of overpowered support weapon won't change anything it already has boons and utility.

[starlinvf.1358]

> @"Dedicant.6820" said:

> >

> > Empower should function like "Wash the Pain Away", where the effect reaches further out with each tick. This way stacked groups get the maximum effect with 4 ticks, while those further out can still benefit. This change can justify increasing the radius to 1200 max, going 300/600/900/1200, and leaves a lot of wiggle room for balance concerning healing output, rooting, and additional trait features.

> >

> > The only mandatory change I could suggest for Symbol of Swiftness is to adopt the Temporal Curtain mechanic where it gives the max swiftness on the first application, but doesn't stack it higher on subsequent applications. This is mostly a QOL change for WvW, where swiftness chaining is about the only practical use it has, aside from tagging enemies into combat. I would also consider looking into adding a trait that will help it complement opening charges, rather then just stacking swiftness prior to moving. Say reducing the effect of movement impairing conditions every pulse (applied as a 1-sec buff), and sharing this effect with Inspiring Reinforcement (which honestly, that skill should have had from the beginning). Combined, this has a theme creating a pathway for PvP/WvW groups to push forward, making it a choice to commit to the path, with counter play by the enemy by using it as a tell. Multiple Guardians can stagger symbols, while Revs can create a long one on their own. General utility for the guardian, but a substantial gain for the Revenant in all modes.

> >

> > Orb of Light needs a change to make a function better with an Ammo system. 1 Charge to fire, which flips the skill to Detonate orb, and a second charge to Detonate if desired. This gives more options for improving it via Staff traits with faster recharge times, or carrying an extra charge, and still have cool down timer on the main skill as a balance vector. I would also change it to use Line based Ground targeting, improving control, and falling more inline with its role as Support instead of offense.

> >

> > Lastly, the Wave of Wrath needs its purpose rethought. As of right now, its only design coherence is general tagging of enemies at point blank, and seemed to have stemmed from an early concept of Staff being Guardian's "chase' weapon. While this would had been a good opportunity for a movement chain.... Ranger proved this mechanic doesn't work, due to problems with latency and the server loop. To address this, Orb needs to be refocused into the tagging role (which the ammo suggestion helps address), and the Auto attack redesigned entirely to give it a longer reach, but shorter arc and fewer targets. ~~While this may sound like going back to the original specs, adding the ability to track targets instead of directly in front of the Guardian addresses the issues the Arc existed for in the first place. Next is doing line of sight checks, because the range nerf only came about due to it being able to bypass obstructions in WvW. Targeting also gives the weapon the ability to attack at elevation.... though at 600 range, I doubt it will reach ~~

> >

> > On second thought, I have a better idea. What about making it a slightly wide projectile like a smaller version of ScorchRazor, and combine it with the "Strike behind target" feature of Puncture shot. Allowing the projectile to strike a target, and firing a melee ranged arc that hits up to 3 or 5 targets in total facing the direction of the projectile path. Effectively a displaced melee cleave on impact. Everything else about damage, fire rate and range would just be a matter of tweaking numbers from that point.

>

> I do kind of agree that my idea is a tad overtuned considering what Guardian (especially Firebrand Guardian) can bring with utilities, it was mostly for fun theorising what could happen to staff if it ever was buffed/reworked, I don't really expect anet to change that much, however I do still think staff needs a bit of tuning or reworking to find a decent place with the rest of the weapons available to Guardian.

>

> 1 most importantly needs changed, I really think adding healing or a boon to it's current form with a small range inc or a full rework of this skill is necessary. If they really want it to be a damage only skill perhaps it could apply vuln like the new trident 1.

>

> 2 could mostly use QOL changes to stop it bugging into the ground and missing targets, it's slow and awkward. I like the idea of ammo on it but I don't understand do you mean 2 orbs or 1 orb can explode twice?

>

> I like your idea for 4 a lot it would make the skill a lot more usable in more situations, I still think a range indicator for allies would be helpful here esp if there is a range increase.

>

> I was thinking recently after you mentioned Temporal Curtain, keeping 5 the way it is but moving the swiftness over to this skill for allies who run through it and allowing the symbol to pulse something else, just a thought.

>

> Also I think it would make sense for if any new support mechanics are added to the staff, some should only be available when staff is traited so you have to invest in it to get the full support power of the weapon.

 

The idea behind 2 is to have both effects (casting and detonation) to share the same ammo pool. Theres some mechanical weirdness due to it being a flip skill- however, the intent is add cadence to the how the Orb works if you want to use the detonate skill, and has less firing error if you want to use orbs back to back instead of detonating. In the current version of the skill, if you detonate, it costs you extra cool down before you can use the orb again. With the change to ammo, this is preserved for the most part. But the real meat of it comes into play when you start playing with numbers. Having Orb on a 3 second cool down, with an ammo count of 2, and recharge of 5, and TLL of 3 seconds, it creates a situation where if you detonated, you have to wait 3 seconds before you can use the orb again. If you don't detonate, you can fire a second orb immediately after the first one expires. With this, you can detonate for a burst of effect, or send 2 orbs in different directions for more coverage. This feeds back into what I said earlier about using the Orb for tagging, as its ability to pierce can drive through a line of allies and enemy alike.

 

Or we could forego an internal cool down timer, and just use the recharge rate to mediate its use, and manage its spam potential. An ammo count of 3 with a recharge of 5 allows the first orb to detonate, but follow up orbs at max fire rate won't have that option unless the guard eases up to stock 2 charges. You can also drop the charge cost on Detonate, and up the recharge to 8, set the ammo count to 2, and put a 3 sec cool down on Orb to allow 9 seconds worth of Orb pressure where the Guardian can detonate at any time.

 

As for the other responses, you have to understand that Guardian is so heavily loaded on Utility skills and Traits as a whole, that putting too much capability into the Staff compounds their power even more then it does now. Thats why Staff 1 shouldn't have boons or conditions, because VoJ has over half a dozen traits related to its passive too give this, and baseline gives burning damage every 5 hits. Staff 5 shouldn't be used for allied movement, because wards are explicitly designed to block enemy movement..... its the only staff skill in the current meta that the guardian would ever consciously want to use mid-fight for control. You don't want to stack too much external utility into a Control skill, because it ends up creating a weighted conflict on its use.

 

I'm also leery about giving the Symbol anything else combat/boon related, because its already pretty flexible when you take Justice and Symbol traits into account. Out of combat its movement support for a group. In combat its AOE tagging, which in WvW is used to put things into combat and get damage credit, because Ward is too powerful to waste on that, and 1 and 2 don't have reach. If orb was faster, then its reach is improved enough- though its probably not enough for a fleeing enemy. Which is why I suggested 1 be reworked into a displaced pseudo-melee attack, because a support tool shouldn't be wasting cool downs just to get tag credit.... and thats exactly what Staff lands up doing when Wave of Wrath can only reach random downs without breaking off from the front line.

 

 

Guardian is a Class where its support functions are dished out enmass.....so much so, that staff doesn't need AOE buffs on Auto when all of other skills can be made distinctly useful.

[Dedicant.6820]

>

> Guardian is a Class where its support functions are dished out enmass.....so much so, that staff doesn't need AOE buffs on Auto when all of other skills can be made distinctly useful.

 

I still think that the staff needs more than just QOL updates on 2 and an actual auto attack to fix it being commonly considered the worst weapon available to Guardians (in pve especially) with multiple threads like this popping up on the forum now and then. Before the auto nerf its identity was the "loot stick" and I'm glad they tried to move it away from this and more towards filling a supportive role, it was somewhat successful a change but imo it still needs some kind of push towards being accepted as viable. When you constantly hear that it's only good for empower/explode 2 and move back to your main weapon set maybe the other skills do need looked at. When you look at it say during a boss fight and not pvp, the only place people want support in pve. I only drop the symbol to proc symbol traits which you could do on any other weapon and get their valuable boons whereas swiftness isn't that much use here but since only mace, hammer and staff are really supportive weapons overall you must toss up the choice between them. Line of warding is only useful if you know the mob/boss is going to actually move, if they don't it's a useless skill that can't be used to damage breakbars. etc etc. This is my perspective when I'm asking for adjustments and I would assume a lot of other people who have been posting.

 

Also people are constantly drawing comparisons to the trident which yes is underwater so quite different due to the limited weapons etc but still it is Guardian's underwater supportive weapon and it heals and applies vulnerability on auto, cleanses conditions on it's detonatable orb 2, pulses stability on its symbol and has CC that doesn't require the target to move over something. All of this while having access to all the same traits and almost all the same utility skills. Even before the rework of underwater weapons it was often described as a better version of staff in some ways.

[Etterwyn.5263]

> @"Dedicant.6820" said:

> >

> > Guardian is a Class where its support functions are dished out enmass.....so much so, that staff doesn't need AOE buffs on Auto when all of other skills can be made distinctly useful.

>

> I still think that the staff needs more than just QOL updates on 2 and an actual auto attack to fix it being commonly considered the worst weapon available to Guardians (in pve especially) with multiple threads like this popping up on the forum now and then. Before the auto nerf its identity was the "loot stick" and I'm glad they tried to move it away from this and more towards filling a supportive role, it was somewhat successful a change but imo it still needs some kind of push towards being accepted as viable. When you constantly hear that it's only good for empower/explode 2 and move back to your main weapon set maybe the other skills do need looked at. When you look at it say during a boss fight and not pvp, the only place people want support in pve. I only drop the symbol to proc symbol traits which you could do on any other weapon and get their valuable boons whereas swiftness isn't that much use here but since only mace, hammer and staff are really supportive weapons overall you must toss up the choice between them. Line of warding is only useful if you know the mob/boss is going to actually move, if they don't it's a useless skill that can't be used to damage breakbars. etc etc. This is my perspective when I'm asking for adjustments and I would assume a lot of other people who have been posting.

>

> Also people are constantly drawing comparisons to the trident which yes is underwater so quite different due to the limited weapons etc but still it is Guardian's underwater supportive weapon and it heals and applies vulnerability on auto, cleanses conditions on it's detonatable orb 2, pulses stability on its symbol and has CC that doesn't require the target to move over something. All of this while having access to all the same traits and almost all the same utility skills. Even before the rework of underwater weapons it was often described as a better version of staff in some ways.

 

Staff is _still_ the lootstick, but you just have to get a little closer. I have no problems tagging with it and if I can't close the gap in time on foot I just lay down a symbol ahead of me or use JI. All I really had to do was retrain my brain to get used to the reduced range.

[pelle ossa.9705]

i will completely rework empower and make a new skill more focused on healing and giving resistance or protection to allies (a skill that allow you to move)... then maybe increase a bit the dmg of the symbol, orb of light a blast and another rework to autoattack... i will say something like a wave with a "small cone" but an higher range.

[Tongku.5326]

Staff was not good as a weapon to begin with. It was a half decent utility for some specs depending on their role in the groups. I think most of the changes done to staff have been bad and it just kept going downhill instead of up.

 

The change to wave of wrath needs to be reverted at bare minimum, reverted + buffed somehow to be actually useful and on par with today's game and other choices.

 

Staff 2, the orb, they just never got it right. It eitehr needs to do a lot more, for example clear 1 condi and/or cc stack per ally it passes through / detonates on, or get a blast finisher, or just be flat out way more powerful, as in, 3-4 times of what it does now.

 

Staff 3. The symbol is just barely functioning for zerg swiftness, its duration is too low. As a symbol its base damage is too low. Way too low if it is to function as an offensive ability, if its to stay utility only the swiftness duration needs to be seriously increased and it needs to have a much higher heal base.

 

Staff 4 was kinda OK, but nowadays the whole rooting thing and with so many other might sources around, it has become pointless to have.

 

Staff 5, the line is OK but it needs eitehr have a reduced CD or upped duration to bring it more on par with current gameplay, either would work out.