GW 2 Devs/Playerbase Twitter Discussion

[Belorn.2659]

> @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

 

Imagine a store clerk in a time before internet where they yell to a customer: "I am happy your son died from cancer".

 

What would happen? Would the manager go and say "I respect your view. One of that boys friend said mean things, and her son did not do enough to control his friends", or would the manager let the clerk go for being offensive.

[Greyraven.4258]

No one is quitting

Most folks who are taking JP side really don't play this game they are on this tread for the drama

There are no Right Wing Trolls on map chat are just the same type of people in GG that tried to create the problem they are complaining about

People who say mean things in game are dealt with swiftly.

The outrage is mock

Arenanet did nothing wrong.

[Shadowmoon.7986]

I think the big qurstion now is should companies hired activists. I think this is a great case study. Plenty of employees have been fired and hired, little to no fanfare, for example Robert H. JP was an activist, cleary about female representation in game development. This means she was heavily biased, she was a hammer and all problems appeared as nails. In her case the nail is sexism. That why even after getting fired, she ran to her allies and continued to beat the sexism drum. This only makes things worse. As we can see it just further polarize the player base.

Did anet make the right long term call. I beleive with the election of trump and the rise of intellectual dark web the social tide is turning. I feel Anet made the right call, and should work hard yo not hire activists. Their biases are too great.

[Loli Ruri.8307]

> @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

> > She was offended too. So was he. Because accountability is a sick age we live in. Amazing right?

>

> Yeah well if everyone was accountable for making others offended on the internet, we'd all be in jail now. But I guess in this case only the devs got the short straw. As I said, congratulations people (you know who you are), your outcry was heard by the mighty Mo, you don't need to be offended anymore.

Don't worry, the UK is working on that. lol

[inubasiri.8745]

> @"Belorn.2659" said:

> > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

>

> Imagine a store clerk in a time before internet where they yell to a customer: "I am happy your son died from cancer".

>

> What would happen? Would the manager go and say "I respect your view. One of that boys friend said mean things, and her son did not do enough to control his friends".

 

Yeah now imagine an off clock store clerk doing that in front of their own house. Which is closer to what happened than what you pointed out.

[inubasiri.8745]

> @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

> > > She was offended too. So was he. Because accountability is a sick age we live in. Amazing right?

> >

> > Yeah well if everyone was accountable for making others offended on the internet, we'd all be in jail now. But I guess in this case only the devs got the short straw. As I said, congratulations people (you know who you are), your outcry was heard by the mighty Mo, you don't need to be offended anymore.

> Don't worry, the UK is working on that. lol

 

Great so now you agree with me?

[TheGrimReaper.9510]

> @"Felipe.1807" said:

> Its true, but i wonder how this gonna effect Anet...i mean, i believe that there a lot of devs who share the same views of Jessica and probably are pissed at the both the company and the community...as Trahearne would say, "This wont end well".

 

Eh maybe but I think that many also know that acting like this is the last thing you should do as a professional. Pissing off your consumer base, specially for an MMO is suicide and I think with this whole situation, even those that agree with them, will just keep quiet.

 

It's okay if they have a different opinion but then again, this hardly was about opinions. It was about 2 writers not accepting feedback and turning into a sexism topic to paint a consumer black for no good reason.

 

All in all, I'm not very concerned just yet but we'll see.

[Loli Ruri.8307]

> @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > > Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

> > > > She was offended too. So was he. Because accountability is a sick age we live in. Amazing right?

> > >

> > > Yeah well if everyone was accountable for making others offended on the internet, we'd all be in jail now. But I guess in this case only the devs got the short straw. As I said, congratulations people (you know who you are), your outcry was heard by the mighty Mo, you don't need to be offended anymore.

> > Don't worry, the UK is working on that. lol

>

> Great so now you agree with me?

It's not a good idea for law to be punishing people based upon feelings. Because the law should be objective, not subjective. However in this case, we can look at objective and see clearly what was wrong.

[TheGrimReaper.9510]

> @"Bit Risky.9018" said:

> Congrats, ANet. kitten loves you now. You must be so proud.

> The community is now a toxic hellhole because you capitulated ASAP to a lynch mob.

>

> The narrative has been set, good luck changing it.

 

Wow, did you even try to read the whole situation?

The guy who gave feedback wasn't at all attacking her. He never insulted her, he ONLY made arguments regarding the writing and her post about the difference between writing for different genres. He even said "sorry if it offended you" ffs.

 

But I guess that guy is just a sexist prick right? They deserved to be fired. You do not act like a 5 year old when someone gives you feedback on your work no matter how long you are in the business. You don't need to be a professional video game writer to know when something is poorly written.

[Loosmaster.8263]

> @"Ajaxx.3157" said:

> Anyone who is quitting GW2 can you please send your Mystic Coins, T3 T6 mats to Ajaxx.3157

>

> Thanks.

 

This, especially if he becomes "Incumbered". I'll take the left overs.

[inubasiri.8745]

> @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > > > Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

> > > > > She was offended too. So was he. Because accountability is a sick age we live in. Amazing right?

> > > >

> > > > Yeah well if everyone was accountable for making others offended on the internet, we'd all be in jail now. But I guess in this case only the devs got the short straw. As I said, congratulations people (you know who you are), your outcry was heard by the mighty Mo, you don't need to be offended anymore.

> > > Don't worry, the UK is working on that. lol

> >

> > Great so now you agree with me?

> It's not a good idea for law to be punishing people based upon feelings. Because the law should be objective, not subjective. However in this case, we can look at objective and see clearly what was wrong.

 

But that's precisely the point. Was what they did illegal? If not why are they getting fired for it? Because it hurt someone's feelings which is why they made a reddit thread about it and other people went there and agreed with it. You have to self-censor yourself if you want to keep your job, then?

[alaskasnowgirl.6047]

> @"Felipe.1807" said:

> > @"TheGrimReaper.9510" said:

> > Well it sucks the situation happened but I think they deserved it.

> > It was non vitriolic, constructive criticism and they turned it into a gendered issue.

> > Gud guy Mike. I imagine it still isn't easy firing those you work with.

>

> Its true, but i wonder how this gonna effect Anet...i mean, i believe that there a lot of devs who share the same views of Jessica and probably are pissed at the both the company and the community...as Trahearne would say, "This wont end well".

 

If they are angry with the community (who, as their customers, pay their salary) and angry with their company for firing someone who was rude, sexist, and racist towards both customers and non-customers alike, then maybe they shouldn't work for a company that doesn't tolerate bigotry. Kudos to ANET for taking action!

[Komodo.7058]

I've played since launch, though I didn't always have the time because of various problems in life. But guild wars 2 has been a home away from home, even when I was at my most depressed or exhausted, in the way other games weren't. But now I feel distanced from it.

 

I've had to measure my expectations with games for a long time. Ever since I was a kid, if I was a girl playing games there was just this sudden tension I'd bring into the experience without meaning to. Sometimes that was just guys being awkward because they don't know how to interact with girls, that was fine. Sometimes it was outright abusive. I always had to be a little bit on edge, and if I ever tried to defend myself things would just get worse. Block & Walk was a fine bandaid solution, but the real problem resulting in the behavior scared and worried me.

 

I was in college at a nearby game school when gamergate happened, and I'd already known it was bad, but it showed me how a moral panic around "SJWs" was growing and how young men were lagging behind the cultures around them, and how that disconnect was brewing unrest between gamers, but also between gamers and devs. For that and for how busy and complicated and ugly my adult life was getting, I felt more and more detached from all games. So I thought it would be easy to write this event and this game off like I've had to so many others. But it's not!

 

What hurts isn't so much that JP got punitive measures. It's something I can understand. But Arenanet's words that "these devs do not speak for us at all" unfortunately implicate her frustrations with having her job explained to her by many men over the course of her career, which were ultimately correct even if her behavior wasn't. There are so many people that are not actually angry about her tone, but her message, in a way that lacks any curiosity or empathy for what the experiences of other people are like. There is a real hostility against women and women who speak about their experiences that feels validated here, by the way Arenanet handled itself. To suggest misogynistic anxieties about "sexist c**** playing the gender card" have absolutely nothing to do with this is naive, too naive for a game director I'm supposed to put my faith in.

 

If you haven't been through it, it might be impossible to make it sound sensible to you. I appreciate that it seems bizarre and you don't have to agree. But whether you do or not, the impact of this tension of being a woman in these environments is very real, and now we're all feeling it again. O'Brien's actions only escalated a problem that was already there. There is a rift between game development and game audiences, and that tension is only going to continue into further breaking points down the line. Arenanet has to do better.

 

Specifically, I wish O'Brien had taken the time to think about who else are included in the group of people he "makes the game for," and how he could have mediated himself. Because now it's not just about JP, other players now have to breathe this atmosphere he's created.

[Ronorra.1530]

I have been critical of Arenanets actions before, but gotta give credit where credits due... Thank you Mike for swiftly taking action and not sugarcoating it. It is very appreciated in these times...

 

To all that keep defending Price... what if the genders were swapped and Price was a grumpy male telling a partnered female content creator to fuck off? Exactly. So much for equality I guess eh?

[Loli Ruri.8307]

> @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > > > > Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

> > > > > > She was offended too. So was he. Because accountability is a sick age we live in. Amazing right?

> > > > >

> > > > > Yeah well if everyone was accountable for making others offended on the internet, we'd all be in jail now. But I guess in this case only the devs got the short straw. As I said, congratulations people (you know who you are), your outcry was heard by the mighty Mo, you don't need to be offended anymore.

> > > > Don't worry, the UK is working on that. lol

> > >

> > > Great so now you agree with me?

> > It's not a good idea for law to be punishing people based upon feelings. Because the law should be objective, not subjective. However in this case, we can look at objective and see clearly what was wrong.

>

> But that's precisely the point. Was what they did illegal? If not why are they getting fired for it? Because it hurt someone's feelings which is why they made a reddit thread about it and other people went there and agreed with it. You have to self-censor yourself if you want to keep your job, then?

I mentioned the UK trying to outlaw hurt feelings. You are now talking about employment. I saw a woman get fired from her job for simply saying "I'm going to the land of aids." She was heading to Africa... Tell me now, how is such a comment like that, although kinda funny, a good thing to say when your name is attached to a company?

[inubasiri.8745]

> @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > > > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > > > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > > > > > Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

> > > > > > > She was offended too. So was he. Because accountability is a sick age we live in. Amazing right?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Yeah well if everyone was accountable for making others offended on the internet, we'd all be in jail now. But I guess in this case only the devs got the short straw. As I said, congratulations people (you know who you are), your outcry was heard by the mighty Mo, you don't need to be offended anymore.

> > > > > Don't worry, the UK is working on that. lol

> > > >

> > > > Great so now you agree with me?

> > > It's not a good idea for law to be punishing people based upon feelings. Because the law should be objective, not subjective. However in this case, we can look at objective and see clearly what was wrong.

> >

> > But that's precisely the point. Was what they did illegal? If not why are they getting fired for it? Because it hurt someone's feelings which is why they made a reddit thread about it and other people went there and agreed with it. You have to self-censor yourself if you want to keep your job, then?

> I mentioned the UK trying to outlaw hurt feelings. You are now talking about employment. I saw a woman get fired from her job for simply saying "I'm going to the land of aids." She was heading to Africa... Tell me now, how is such a comment like that, although kinda funny, a good thing to say when your name is attached to a company?

 

You are right. But here's several problems: 1) Your personal social media account will always be linked to the company, so you have to self-censor if you want to keep your job; 2) Unlike those devs, nobody else had any stakes in the convo, basically you could say anything you wanted with impunity. And whether or not they get penalized depends on the feelings and amount of outrage of those who read it. If it wasn't reddited I doubt anyone would notice; 3) The people who saw that had all the rights to outrage, because anyone has it, but it just means it's the extension of political correctness filled society we live in today (regardless of which trope it actually falls to), also the stakes have to be considered - you can have a real person fired over being offended which is fine if the person represents something during working hours, but not so at home; 4) It was mainly a show of not understanding the other side repeatedly while having to add that one extra reply that just made it even worse on both sides.

[Dragon.4032]

> @"Mike O Brien.4613" said:

> Recently two of our employees failed to uphold our standards of communicating with players. Their attacks on the community were unacceptable. As a result, they’re no longer with the company.

>

> I want to be clear that the statements they made do not reflect the views of ArenaNet at all. As a company we always strive to have a collaborative relationship with the Guild Wars community. We value your input. We make this game for you.

>

> Mo

 

You have done poorly by firing the two employees who had contributed into making this game possible. It was rash, inappropriate and one sided. Clearly ArenaNet failed to take in considerations whatever that might have been upsetting for Jessica in her work environment. The consequence of this insensitive decision will likely come to affect the game community. I didn't respect your manner in handling this situation.

[Loli Ruri.8307]

> @"Dragon.4032" said:

> > @"Mike O Brien.4613" said:

> > Recently two of our employees failed to uphold our standards of communicating with players. Their attacks on the community were unacceptable. As a result, they’re no longer with the company.

> >

> > I want to be clear that the statements they made do not reflect the views of ArenaNet at all. As a company we always strive to have a collaborative relationship with the Guild Wars community. We value your input. We make this game for you.

> >

> > Mo

>

> You have done poorly by firing the two employees who had contributed into making this game possible. It was rash, inappropriate and one sided. Clearly ArenaNet failed to take in considerations whatever that might have been upsetting for Jessica in her work environment. The consequence of this insensitive decision will likely come to affect the game community. I didn't respect your manner in handling this situation.

There are others to replace 'em. Welcome to game development.

[Zedek.8932]

I think that at least Peter not from one day to the other unemployed.

I've seen too many similar situations and they all ended surprisingly well (apart from losing a long-time income of course).

 

For example, a colleague betrayed the company by taking returns that were not from customers and took the money.

He's been suspended and later of course fired, but he received a good employment reference letter. Why? Because going "Company X ruined Ys life over XX Euros" or such things is even worse PR.

 

The other guy yelled at the big boss that automatication takes his job (he's been the goods inward office clerk).

Talking shit to the big boss he had to leave the company - but receives pay until 01.01.2019.

 

Same with our previous dear Mrs. Kaiser. Received further 6 months of pay after being removed.

 

I know these are totally random things, but all happend in the last 5 years in my branch alone.

 

For Peter at least, it's a bit odd:

For such a long-time employee, at least to German law, you can't simply fire him like that for such a minor thing (and yes, a private Twitter that is barely and only after some research linked to the company is not a reason for any sane court to rule in favour of the employer, at least in Europe). Firing someone (or force him or her into retirement) is getting more and more difficult if you reach 10+ years of employment. I also don't think that Peter's references are not good enough to find a job in the industry. Also, the video game industry as very fast-living. If you look how well id Software did with DooM. Then the people left id, created studio over studio. In LoL, developers come, developers go. Everyone seem to know each other. Also "not with the company anymore" is very vague as well. One former supervisor of me was "not with the company" but ended up in another place (from operative business to some headquarter office job).

 

I just can't imagine Mr. O'Brien said: "Clear your desk in 10 minutes" and gets him a literal buttkick. There is more to it. But to keep the mob happy, they have to disguise and keep it as low as possible. aNet and Mr. Fries would not like to start a fire again that is finally dying.

 

My two cents with a pint of life experience.

Excelsior.

[Ephemiel.5694]

> @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

> > She was offended too. So was he. Because accountability is a sick age we live in. Amazing right?

>

> Yeah well if everyone was accountable for making others offended on the internet, we'd all be in jail now. But I guess in this case only the devs got the short straw. As I said, congratulations people (you know who you are), your outcry was heard by the mighty Mo, you don't need to be offended anymore.

 

You're acting like she's an innocent princess.

[Nabuko Darayon.9645]

> @"alaskasnowgirl.6047" said:

> > @"Nabuko Darayon.9645" said:

> > I will be closely watching the aftermath of this decision MO.

> >

> > If ANet decides to turn their company into a more totalitarian way to accommodate the new rising spirit in the world I will be leaving this game as well.

> >

> > By aftermath, I mean you just created a new precedent on how to get a dev fired so start expecting major provocations by trolls towards your devs that are active on twitter. And trust me they will abuse it.

>

> If you support the actions of the dev and don't believe she should have been fired, when people have been fired for much less from other companies, have fun finding a game that tolerates that sort of behavior as what she exhibited towards a prominent streamer. I for one, want a game where people don't just "pretend to like" the players, where we are respected when we give polite feedback. I am glad GW2 cares about its players. A lot of people including myself were going to leave/not purchase anything if action WASN'T taken, and I wager I've spent more time/money on the game than a lot of people. Thanks again MO for taking action.

 

> @"alaskasnowgirl.6047" said:

> > @"Nabuko Darayon.9645" said:

> > I will be closely watching the aftermath of this decision MO.

> >

> > If ANet decides to turn their company into a more totalitarian way to accommodate the new rising spirit in the world I will be leaving this game as well.

> >

> > By aftermath, I mean you just created a new precedent on how to get a dev fired so start expecting major provocations by trolls towards your devs that are active on twitter. And trust me they will abuse it.

>

> If you support the actions of the dev and don't believe she should have been fired, when people have been fired for much less from other companies, have fun finding a game that tolerates that sort of behavior as what she exhibited towards a prominent streamer. I for one, want a game where people don't just "pretend to like" the players, where we are respected when we give polite feedback. I am glad GW2 cares about its players. A lot of people including myself were going to leave/not purchase anything if action WASN'T taken, and I wager I've spent more time/money on the game than a lot of people. Thanks again MO for taking action.

 

I have an issue with them letting Peter Fries go. He was a family. And if you think that I plan on staying within this game after what they did to their family member you’re dead wrong. The only think left is a farewell note and I’m done.

 

 

[alaskasnowgirl.6047]

> @"Komodo.7058" said:

> I've played since launch, though I didn't always have the time because of various problems in life. But guild wars 2 has been a home away from home, even when I was at my most depressed or exhausted, in the way other games weren't. But now I feel distanced from it.

>

> I've had to measure my expectations with games for a long time. Ever since I was a kid, if I was a girl playing games there was just this sudden tension I'd bring into the experience without meaning to. Sometimes that was just guys being awkward because they don't know how to interact with girls, that was fine. Sometimes it was outright abusive. I always had to be a little bit on edge, and if I ever tried to defend myself things would just get worse. Block & Walk was a fine bandaid solution, but the real problem resulting in the behavior scared and worried me.

>

> I was in college at a nearby game school when kitten happened, and I'd already known it was bad, but it showed me how a moral panic around "kitten" was growing and how young men were lagging behind the cultures around them, and how that disconnect was brewing unrest between gamers, but also between gamers and devs. For that and for how busy and complicated and ugly my adult life was getting, I felt more and more detached from all games. So I thought it would be easy to write this event and this game off like I've had to so many others. But it's not!

>

> What hurts isn't so much that JP got punitive measures. It's something I can understand. But Arenanet's words that "these devs do not speak for us at all" unfortunately implicate her frustrations with having her job explained to her by many men over the course of her career, which were ultimately correct even if her behavior wasn't. There are so many people that are not actually angry about her tone, but her message, in a way that lacks any curiosity or empathy for what the experiences of other people are like. There is a real hostility against women and women who speak about their experiences that feels validated here, by the way Arenanet handled itself. To suggest misogynistic anxieties about "sexist c**** playing the gender card" have absolutely nothing to do with this is naive, too naive for a game director I'm supposed to put my faith in.

>

> If you haven't been through it, it might be impossible to make it sound sensible to you. I appreciate that it seems bizarre and you don't have to agree. But whether you do or not, the impact of this tension of being a woman in these environments is very real, and now we're all feeling it again. O'Brien's actions only escalated a problem that was already there. There is a rift between game development and game audiences, and that tension is only going to continue into further breaking points down the line. Arenanet has to do better.

>

> Specifically, I wish O'Brien had taken the time to think about who else are included in the group of people he "makes the game for," and how he could have mediated himself. Because now it's not just about JP, other players now have to breathe this atmosphere he's created.

 

I am also a woman. I have been playing the game for about 4 years now, and several thousand hours playing. I've raided, done more fractals than I can count, and lots more! I've often been the only woman in my groups, not because of some sort of exclusion, but because I don't know a lot of other women as into hard-core raiding and willing to devote 5-6 hours a week at least to clearing content.

I have never, ever, in my experience of guild wars 2 or any other game been the victim of any sexism whatsoever. I feel like a lot of people are looking for things to INTERPRET as sexism, but I like to give people the benefit of the doubt. If someone thinks my dps isn't great, they are probably looking at the numbers on their dps reader. If someone is searching for things to possibly interpret as "sexist" then I'm sure they will find them. But the reality is, I, and countless other women who play this amazing game, do not feel victimized at all by any of this. In fact, I was one of the prominent female voices asking for JP to be held accountable.

As far as the "these devs do not speak for us all" thing that seemed to upset you, that was not about being a woman in gaming at all! That was saying that ANET appreciates customer feedback. The context of that was very clearly that the people who were rude to customers and said they didn't care or like customers or weren't interested in their feedback didn't represent the company.

I hope that helps explain it. No need to be upset.

[Loukious.7346]

> @"Komodo.7058" said:

> I've played since launch, though I didn't always have the time because of various problems in life. But guild wars 2 has been a home away from home, even when I was at my most depressed or exhausted, in the way other games weren't. But now I feel distanced from it.

>

> I've had to measure my expectations with games for a long time. Ever since I was a kid, if I was a girl playing games there was just this sudden tension I'd bring into the experience without meaning to. Sometimes that was just guys being awkward because they don't know how to interact with girls, that was fine. Sometimes it was outright abusive. I always had to be a little bit on edge, and if I ever tried to defend myself things would just get worse. Block & Walk was a fine bandaid solution, but the real problem resulting in the behavior scared and worried me.

>

> I was in college at a nearby game school when kitten happened, and I'd already known it was bad, but it showed me how a moral panic around "kitten" was growing and how young men were lagging behind the cultures around them, and how that disconnect was brewing unrest between gamers, but also between gamers and devs. For that and for how busy and complicated and ugly my adult life was getting, I felt more and more detached from all games. So I thought it would be easy to write this event and this game off like I've had to so many others. But it's not!

>

> What hurts isn't so much that JP got punitive measures. It's something I can understand. But Arenanet's words that "these devs do not speak for us at all" unfortunately implicate her frustrations with having her job explained to her by many men over the course of her career, which were ultimately correct even if her behavior wasn't. There are so many people that are not actually angry about her tone, but her message, in a way that lacks any curiosity or empathy for what the experiences of other people are like. There is a real hostility against women and women who speak about their experiences that feels validated here, by the way Arenanet handled itself. To suggest misogynistic anxieties about "sexist c**** playing the gender card" have absolutely nothing to do with this is naive, too naive for a game director I'm supposed to put my faith in.

>

> If you haven't been through it, it might be impossible to make it sound sensible to you. I appreciate that it seems bizarre and you don't have to agree. But whether you do or not, the impact of this tension of being a woman in these environments is very real, and now we're all feeling it again. O'Brien's actions only escalated a problem that was already there. There is a rift between game development and game audiences, and that tension is only going to continue into further breaking points down the line. Arenanet has to do better.

>

> Specifically, I wish O'Brien had taken the time to think about who else are included in the group of people he "makes the game for," and how he could have mediated himself. Because now it's not just about JP, other players now have to breathe this atmosphere he's created.

 

So you feel that because a woman was not verbally abused, but given a well thought out criticism and her response instead of saying "not really in the mood for this" and leaving it there. Instead she goes on a rampage of verbally abusing a male gamer (not only a customer, but content creator) and others (both male and female) because they are pointing out her lack of being a decent human being.

 

You also pretty much said that when MO said "they don't speak us" that he was somehow saying "hey it's ok to talk shit at female Devs?" No. What he is saying is that no matter WHO you are that talking down to ANY person will not be welcomed as an employee of ANet. Also you have to look at the history of this woman. She seems to be unhinged (literally), any time anyone offers criticism she automatically makes it about sex.

 

If this was blatant sexism of the original tweet, that started this firestorm, to be him saying "oh you don't know what you're talking about" I'd be all for calling for her to be re-hired. Instead the young man offered a differing opinion on her publicly open twitter page of an AMA she did. He might of missed it (the AMA) and was reading it for the first time and as he read it he felt his opinion had merit. Instead of being an adult and saying to him "Hey I can see your point but it's not how we are working on our narrative" instead she attacked him, made it into a sex issue and then attacked others that pointed out she was being a shit bag.

 

Now her recent interviews show how mentally deranged she is. She made it seem like the tweet that started all this (between her and D) was some long sexist tirade. Instead of a person that honestly loves the game and wanted to just converse with a person that he admired (as proven through clips taken from his Twitch stream)

[inubasiri.8745]

> @"Ephemiel.5694" said:

> > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

> > > She was offended too. So was he. Because accountability is a sick age we live in. Amazing right?

> >

> > Yeah well if everyone was accountable for making others offended on the internet, we'd all be in jail now. But I guess in this case only the devs got the short straw. As I said, congratulations people (you know who you are), your outcry was heard by the mighty Mo, you don't need to be offended anymore.

>

> You're acting like she's an innocent princess.

 

As long as she's doing her job, I don't give a damn. What is this corporation supposed to be? Democracy in the ancient Athens, when people could vote to exile someone each year?

[DiabolicalHamSandwich.8756]

> @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > > > @"Loli Ruri.8307" said:

> > > > > > > @"inubasiri.8745" said:

> > > > > > > Congratulations, some of you have just had 2 actual people fired. I hope it was worth being offended on the internet. Sick age we're living in.

> > > > > > She was offended too. So was he. Because accountability is a sick age we live in. Amazing right?

> > > > >

> > > > > Yeah well if everyone was accountable for making others offended on the internet, we'd all be in jail now. But I guess in this case only the devs got the short straw. As I said, congratulations people (you know who you are), your outcry was heard by the mighty Mo, you don't need to be offended anymore.

> > > > Don't worry, the UK is working on that. lol

> > >

> > > Great so now you agree with me?

> > It's not a good idea for law to be punishing people based upon feelings. Because the law should be objective, not subjective. However in this case, we can look at objective and see clearly what was wrong.

>

> But that's precisely the point. Was what they did illegal? If not why are they getting fired for it? Because it hurt someone's feelings which is why they made a reddit thread about it and other people went there and agreed with it. You have to self-censor yourself if you want to keep your job, then?

 

Illegal? I understand who you are replying to, and what they said, but the situation still had nothing to do with actual law. They were employees acting like asses. More so Price since from what I saw of the other guy, crap was tame. I don't know if you know how businesses work, but normally you don't want employees attacking your fans/customers unprovoked. Also censor yourself? no. Just don't act like an ass for no reason in this case. Unless the person is naturally an ass, then yes, self-censor.