Rasimir.6239 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Healix.5819" said: > > The change was only meant to make it "easier" in the same way precursor crafting was - it's just an alternative. > The difference is in case of legendary crafting it really was an alternative. This isn't. It would be if the salvage kist were working as before (or if there were two choices for each salvage tier - one with autosalvaging upgrades and one with extract option), but that's _not_ what we've got. We _don't_ have a non-gemshop option of getting runes/sigils the previous way Have you tried the trading post? ;) Last time I checked, it didn't need any gems to buy stuff there, neither for legendary precursors nor for runes or sigils. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasimir.6239 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 > @"Despond.2174" said: > The intention was noble but the result just made everything more expensive and tedious. I think the right way would have been to have made sigils/runes salvageable to crafting components and leave it at that. You still extract runes/sigils to keep when you salvage an item and you have the added options of saving bag space to break it down again if you wish. Prices are crazy for some items that were always cheap. > > To have a convenience we added a restriction, my suggested way removes the restriction while still keep the added convenience of clearing space of runes/sigils. If you check the trading post, you will find that lucent motes are already priced similar to the vendor price of minor sigils and runes, with the occasional charm or symbol being additional income to whoever salvages regular green equipment (the kind that comes with a built-in upgrade). As such, the general public should gain at least as much coin from their drops as they did before the change (exchanging the gold from vendoring minor runes and sigils with the coin from trading motes, charms, and sigils). Of course it comes at a cost, since the gold no longer comes from thin air (aka npc vendors) but rather other players pockets, but that is in fact healthy for the overall market, and as such healthy for all of us who play and participate in the game economy. As someone earlier in the thread said, the change was two-fold, both to add convenience and value and stability to the player trading system (material and equipment trading via trading post). Cutting out half of the change unfortunately completely counteracts the second part of the change (that in the long term ensures that we don't drop mostly vendor trash). The downside is that some people (mainly those who need a lot of the crafting materials before having had time to accumulate them in everyday gameplay) have to pay a premium until the markets stabilize, but that's really not much different than people complaining about the rate of aquisition of legendary crafting materials because their rate of crafting is a lot higher than a comfortable material aquisition allows. Pretty much everything crafting-wise in this game can be rushed, be it legendary, ascended, or simply runes and sigils, but it always comes at a premium gold cost. Breaking up the systems to where everyone can just chose between participating in the trading system or easily grabbing what they want to solo way simply isn't healthy for the trading system, no matter if it used to work differently before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phs.6089 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 > @"Rasimir.6239" said: > > @"phs.6089" said: > > > @"Assic.2746" said: > > > I am strongly against increasing drop rates of anything after what happened to **Resonating Slivers**. You want ANet to increase drop rate because you currently need certain item. Once you have the item you will start deleting symbols from your inventory because it will turn into trash just like old runes. Terrible idea. > > > > There isn't much to do with resonate silver, while charms and symbols are a MUST to craft runes and sigils > Just as resonating slivers are a must to crafting guild hall decorations. They used to drop a lot less in the beginning, which caused a big outcry of them being too expensive and both leveling scribing and decorating guild halls shouldn't be that expensive ... but it was spreading the wealth to be had from selling slivers across the whole playerbase. > > Once ANet increased the rate of availability of resonating slivers however, they quickly went from being worthwhile drops to trash, that at most annoys people when they have to destroy yet another useless stack of the things (which makes them no better than minor runes and sigils used to be). That is why I said 'not much to do' how many players decorate guild hall? And how many use sigils and runs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 > @"Rasimir.6239" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"Healix.5819" said: > > > The change was only meant to make it "easier" in the same way precursor crafting was - it's just an alternative. > > The difference is in case of legendary crafting it really was an alternative. This isn't. It would be if the salvage kist were working as before (or if there were two choices for each salvage tier - one with autosalvaging upgrades and one with extract option), but that's _not_ what we've got. We _don't_ have a non-gemshop option of getting runes/sigils the previous way > Have you tried the trading post? ;) Last time I checked, it didn't need any gems to buy stuff there, neither for legendary precursors nor for runes or sigils. ...we were talking about salvaging/crafting changes (the original source, not the intermediary), so where did TP suddenly come from? Since you seemed not to understand, i will explain it more clearly: in case of precursors, there were two original sources (random drops, and equally random mystic forging). TP could possibly be considered an option, but it didn't generate any new precursors. What precursor crafting did, was to create an alternative - introduce a new option without removing any exiting ones. What rune crafting/salvaging change did was to _remove_ an option and introduce a new one in its place. It didn't offer any alternatives, because the old option it replaced is no longer there. _Unless you pay gems._ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yann.1946 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Rasimir.6239" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"Healix.5819" said: > > > > The change was only meant to make it "easier" in the same way precursor crafting was - it's just an alternative. > > > The difference is in case of legendary crafting it really was an alternative. This isn't. It would be if the salvage kist were working as before (or if there were two choices for each salvage tier - one with autosalvaging upgrades and one with extract option), but that's _not_ what we've got. We _don't_ have a non-gemshop option of getting runes/sigils the previous way > > Have you tried the trading post? ;) Last time I checked, it didn't need any gems to buy stuff there, neither for legendary precursors nor for runes or sigils. > ...we were talking about salvaging changes (the original source, not the intermediary), so where did TP suddenly come from? > I guess because if you want a sigil /rune directly from an exotic you haven't soul bound you could sell the exotic and buy the sigil g or sorta similar result Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 > @"yann.1946" said: > I guess because if you want a sigil /rune directly from an exotic you haven't soul bound you could sell the exotic and buy the sigil g or sorta similar result That's a very intuitive way of obtaining a rune you already had. [/sarcasm] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yann.1946 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"yann.1946" said: > > I guess because if you want a sigil /rune directly from an exotic you haven't soul bound you could sell the exotic and buy the sigil g or sorta similar result > That's a very intuitive way of obtaining a rune you already had. [/sarcasm] > > It does work. I agree it's unintuitive tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 > @"yann.1946" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"yann.1946" said: > > > I guess because if you want a sigil /rune directly from an exotic you haven't soul bound you could sell the exotic and buy the sigil g or sorta similar result > > That's a very intuitive way of obtaining a rune you already had. [/sarcasm] > > > > > > It does work. I agree it's unintuitive tho. Sure it works. It worked before too, though, and worked _better_. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yann.1946 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"yann.1946" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"yann.1946" said: > > > > I guess because if you want a sigil /rune directly from an exotic you haven't soul bound you could sell the exotic and buy the sigil g or sorta similar result > > > That's a very intuitive way of obtaining a rune you already had. [/sarcasm] > > > > > > > > > > It does work. I agree it's unintuitive tho. > Sure it works. It worked before too, though, and worked _better_. Did it work better? The update did solve the inventory clutter problem and spread the value of sigils/runes. I don't think before was universally better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 > @"yann.1946" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"yann.1946" said: > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > @"yann.1946" said: > > > > > I guess because if you want a sigil /rune directly from an exotic you haven't soul bound you could sell the exotic and buy the sigil g or sorta similar result > > > > That's a very intuitive way of obtaining a rune you already had. [/sarcasm] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It does work. I agree it's unintuitive tho. > > Sure it works. It worked before too, though, and worked _better_. > > Did it work better? > > The update did solve the inventory clutter problem and spread the value of sigils/runes. > > I don't think before was universally better. It could have solved inventory clutter without destroying old "extract" salvage. And as for spreading the value of sigils/runes... i don't think that increasing the value of those runes that costed a lot before was a change for the better. And trash is still trash. Not that it matters, because you're not getting those anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eloc Freidon.5692 Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 > @"Tanner Blackfeather.6509" said: > > @"Eloc Freidon.5692" said: > > > @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said: > > > Ack! I thought there was only one kind of mote: Lucent Mote > > > Can't find the others in the Wiki. > > > > We're calling them ALL motes, including charms and symbols. Not remembering all these redundant names every time I refer to them. > > That's a really confusing way to talk about them. I don't bother remembering the different ones, but at least separate "Motes" from "Symbols/Charms". I'm better off calling them rune and sigil parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Taxus.2053 Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 I haven't had a single charm or symbol drop for me yet (and not a huge number of motes either). I am only a casual player just going about my normal gameplay, but in the equivalent amount of time prior to the change I would have seen dozens (if not more) of runes and sigils drop just from my day-to-day salvaging. Effectively I have been prevented from crafting ANY runes or sigils since the change - unless I buy the components, in which case I might as well just buy the finished item (at least I can afford to do that, but new players will presumably struggle). This seems to me to be an unnecessarily radical change to the mechanics of obtaining runes and sigils, and I'd like to see the drop rates increased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miraude.2107 Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 > @"Mitch Taxus.2053" said: > I haven't had a single charm or symbol drop for me yet (and not a huge number of motes either). > I am only a casual player just going about my normal gameplay, but in the equivalent amount of time prior to the change I would have seen dozens (if not more) of runes and sigils drop just from my day-to-day salvaging. > Effectively I have been prevented from crafting ANY runes or sigils since the change - unless I buy the components, in which case I might as well just buy the finished item (at least I can afford to do that, but new players will presumably struggle). > This seems to me to be an unnecessarily radical change to the mechanics of obtaining runes and sigils, and I'd like to see the drop rates increased. Same here on the drops. There's only been two times I've actually seen any runes or sigils drop for me. 1st has been using the black lion salvage kits, second has been the karmic converter whenever there's a bag of runes or sigils to buy. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Karmic_Converter So while it's kinda nice that that item is seeing more use from me, I really hate this feeling of being held hostage trying to craft things and it being RNG unless I buy it from the TP. I bought the runic converter from the cash shop when it first came out and have played everyday doing map completion and leveling elite specs, I have yet to have gotten enough material from that to even make one rune or sigil. I had plans of working on ascended gear and getting more active with my guild that I could possibly finally see what a raid looks like. However the drop rate for the components is quite dismal. I want to save my gold up for gem conversion or anything new that gets added in game, not be shoehorned into an artificial gold drop that wasn't that well thought out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstealer.5978 Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 > @"yann.1946" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"yann.1946" said: > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > @"yann.1946" said: > > > > > I guess because if you want a sigil /rune directly from an exotic you haven't soul bound you could sell the exotic and buy the sigil g or sorta similar result > > > > That's a very intuitive way of obtaining a rune you already had. [/sarcasm] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It does work. I agree it's unintuitive tho. > > Sure it works. It worked before too, though, and worked _better_. > > Did it work better? > > The update did solve the inventory clutter problem and spread the value of sigils/runes. > > I don't think before was universally better. It did no such thing.. the only thing it did was increase the sale price of Runes and Sigils that were already sought after and priced accordingly. Pretty much everything else is still trash value.. as for inventory clutter that is just BS, my inventory is as full as it ever was, not with sigils but with trash motes and now spend more over all salvaging to get no charms or symbols, unless maybe the ones no one really needs.. we all know which ones are needed in game and they simply drop once in a blue moon .. maybe as well just run around LA all day and night shouting we're not worthy. Lets not forget either that ANET have screwed players over by way of the change of use of fed o matics and use their colourful words to try to cover up the misrepresentation of the items now ... shady business practice at best imo.. They don't even offer players the opportunity to be refunded.. yeah I tried that course of action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keenedge.9675 Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 I think it should be left the same. Plus, the new system allows for the addition of some sort of really good seals that require 10 or 20 of those items. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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