Suggestion: Rework the loot system

[Danikat.8537]

> @"Rasimir.6239" said:

> > @"Cherdakuru.5841" said:

> > I think casuals will be happy to have different rewards every week (they can be still based on rng but with much higher chances)

> Actually a sizeable group of players play this game precisely because you can play it at your own schedule, instead of having to rush and put in hours because the reward you are after will be gone next week. Putting rewards on a rotating schedule will do nothing for those players, and may in fact turn as many (if not more) of them off the game as it will lure in others.

 

That's what I was going to say. From a purely selfish perspective I'm against this idea because for me it simply translates to regularly missing out on opportunities to get rewards. If they're tradable then I can at least buy them from other people...but that's not really fun at all. If not then I've just missed out and that is even less fun. (That's the kind of thing which can very quickly send the message that this game is not for casual players - it's for people who can schedule their life around the game - and then those casual players quit to find something more accommodating, which is a big problem in games like GW2 which are built for and marketed to casual players.)

 

Yes I know you said they could repeat but "sorry you missed it, in 52 weeks it'll come around again" isn't exactly appealing. Especially if it did repeat on a regular schedule like that, so that specific rewards is always available at the same time of year - if it's a regular commitment which stops me logging in - Christmas and New Year for example - that just means I repeatedly miss out on any chance to get it. I had enough of that with the festival hats in GW1 (with the added fun of some people telling me I obviously didn't care about the game and didn't deserve to call myself a fan because I wasn't able to log in on one specific day each year).

 

And with repeating rewards you also run into the problem of 'fatigue' for people who can log in most of the time. We're already seeing a bit of this with Wintersday - people who got all the rewards they wanted in previous years and can get any new items they want with minimal effort this year so they've got very little incentive to play the festival at all. And if your solution is that these rewards will be as insanely hard as you've suggested - so only about 1% can do it at first - then we're right back to grinding it hoping to 'earn' the drop.

 

Basically the way I see it this has a lot of the same downsides as the current system and none of the benefits, except maybe for the minority of a minority who are capable of completing these "really difficult hardcore my keyboard is breaking hard" challenges AND dislike RNG enough that they'd prefer the super-hard challenge to a random drop.

[Zaklex.6308]

> @"Cherdakuru.5841" said:

> > @"Gehenna.3625" said:

> > > @"Cherdakuru.5841" said:

> > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said:

> > > > > @"Cherdakuru.5841" said:

> > > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said:

> > > > > > > @"Cherdakuru.5841" said:

> > > > > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said:

> > > > > > > > > @"Cherdakuru.5841" said:

> > > > > > > > > Challenges > RNG

> > > > > > > > > Change my mind

> > > > > > > > Not everyone is up to the challenge and as this game caters mostly to casuals, catering to challenge seekers will kill this game. That's why I feel for this game your proposition fails. Having said that there is more than challenge and RNG. There is also grind or repetition that is not based on RNG like this game has plenty of already. The solution may lie in having people work for it rather than it being subject to RNG.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I'm not a big fan of RNG in general because it's not about challenge and it's not about working towards a goal but just being lucky. There is a saying that goes like this: _stupidity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results_

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > My view is that RNG is closely related to this saying. Make of that what you will.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I think casuals will be happy to have different rewards every week (they can be still based on rng but with much higher chances)

> > > > > > > And challenges that involve common actions are not so hard either

> > > > > > > And if we put super rare items behind super hard content i think for casual it is the same as what they are doing now, in terms that they won't get it for long

> > > > > > > But if we put it behind super hard content wall, at least they will know that they can guranteed get that one day

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think this is just about what you want the way you want it. If you put things behind a "super hard content wall" it will only be achieved by the super few. That's not a sensible thing to do.

> > > > > > Besides, I don't think that you are suggesting putting super rare items behind a "super hard content wall" because that will automatically mean they will never get it. I can see how it serves your purposes but I have no reason to believe it serves the greater community.

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Please say how many people have Chak Egg Sac right now?

> > > > > I think having <1% chance to get the thing is more then an argument to people not having the item.

> > > > > Actually i'm pretty sure more people can get those super rare items if you put it behind the VERY HARD wall.

> > > > > That also means that the price will drop eventually, and those that can't complete it at least will be able to buy it.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > You're sure, I'm not. So why would you be more right than me?

> > > >

> > > > Besides, have you ever considered that ArenaNet actually wants some super rare items in the game and that making it more readily available would be contrary to their goals?

> > >

> > > I made some research and i have an experience in different games, that's probably why?

> > I also have experience in different games and have done research as well. However, I have not seen enough facts to support that this would be a good idea.

> > > They do it only so players keep playing their game because of illusionary chance to get that item.

> > A small chance is not an illusory chance. Extremely unlikely sure, but it's not an illusion because there is an actual chance and some people have been lucky, but yes this why they do it, so it meets their goal of keeping certain people playing (not everybody cares enough about chac eggs after all). And that's my point.. it serves a purpose. This is not your purpose but running a game isn't about individual needs but group needs and overall goals.

> > > If i wanted to play lottery i would buy it in the nearest shop, and still it would be better then spending months on that super-rare item.

> > > Even financially.

> > Well playing the lottery probably has a smaller chance of winning and it costs money every time you participate. The interesting thing though is that you say playing the lottery is better, even financially and yet you play GW2 and not the lottery. Something is not adding up here...

> >

> >

>

> I'm not playing GW2 anymore actually. Because of those reasons and because there are already games on the market that do it right. But i don't want GW2 to die.

~snip~

 

I have a suggestion for you, you seem to enjoy playing other games that you PERSONALLY think are doing it right(this is your PERSONAL opinion and not fact). The millions of us that still play GW2 think that the way ArenaNet does things is the right way(that is our PERSONAL opinions). This game is not anywhere close to be dead or on it's deathbed and it doesn't need to be changed to match other games that are in an entirely different genre. Unless you're comparing GW2 to another MMORPG then most of your suggestions are moot.

 

 

[Cherdakuru.5841]

> @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > @"Rasimir.6239" said:

> > > @"Cherdakuru.5841" said:

> > > I think casuals will be happy to have different rewards every week (they can be still based on rng but with much higher chances)

> > Actually a sizeable group of players play this game precisely because you can play it at your own schedule, instead of having to rush and put in hours because the reward you are after will be gone next week. Putting rewards on a rotating schedule will do nothing for those players, and may in fact turn as many (if not more) of them off the game as it will lure in others.

>

> That's what I was going to say. From a purely selfish perspective I'm against this idea because for me it simply translates to regularly missing out on opportunities to get rewards. If they're tradable then I can at least buy them from other people...but that's not really fun at all. If not then I've just missed out and that is even less fun. (That's the kind of thing which can very quickly send the message that this game is not for casual players - it's for people who can schedule their life around the game - and then those casual players quit to find something more accommodating, which is a big problem in games like GW2 which are built for and marketed to casual players.)

>

> Yes I know you said they could repeat but "sorry you missed it, in 52 weeks it'll come around again" isn't exactly appealing. Especially if it did repeat on a regular schedule like that, so that specific rewards is always available at the same time of year - if it's a regular commitment which stops me logging in - Christmas and New Year for example - that just means I repeatedly miss out on any chance to get it. I had enough of that with the festival hats in GW1 (with the added fun of some people telling me I obviously didn't care about the game and didn't deserve to call myself a fan because I wasn't able to log in on one specific day each year).

>

> And with repeating rewards you also run into the problem of 'fatigue' for people who can log in most of the time. We're already seeing a bit of this with Wintersday - people who got all the rewards they wanted in previous years and can get any new items they want with minimal effort this year so they've got very little incentive to play the festival at all. And if your solution is that these rewards will be as insanely hard as you've suggested - so only about 1% can do it at first - then we're right back to grinding it hoping to 'earn' the drop.

>

> Basically the way I see it this has a lot of the same downsides as the current system and none of the benefits, except maybe for the minority of a minority who are capable of completing these "really difficult hardcore my keyboard is breaking hard" challenges AND dislike RNG enough that they'd prefer the super-hard challenge to a random drop.

 

Forget all i've said, i'll try to write it again.

Function of this thread is to theorize about ways to rework common mmo loot tables formula.

Or maybe to theorize about changing it in minor or major way.

Context: Lootboxes were removed. So their contents must be acquirable in some way.

My suggestion:

Remove <0.1 % drops from encounters and make them available through content, that requires a lot of challenge. It doesn't need to be more hard versions of boss battles.

Weekly rotation of goods from black lion chests, for people who love RNG

Maybe rotation of stuff that sometimes is put there stealthily and by surprise

All those goods also can be obtainable in the Gemstore, with more high price point, but you get exactly what you want (like all colors from that pallete)

Deviant bosses, which spawns instead of normal version and give achievement for the group who managed to defeat it

 

 

 

[Cherdakuru.5841]

Just let's try to imagine what if

I will be happy to hear your suggestions

[Rasimir.6239]

> @"Cherdakuru.5841" said:

> Just let's try to imagine what if

> I will be happy to hear your suggestions

Your suggestions all boil down to making the game less accessible to those to who play the game as entertainment, spending a few hours here and there whenever it suits their everyday lives, and more rewarding to those who play the game as a major part of their life, sinking lots of hours into it and being able to spend time in game on demand.

 

Personally I prefer the predictability of general GW2. If I meet an event I know what it's about and what rewards might come off it. I have a realistic idea of what I need to do (and who I need to play with) to see the event to success, and what rewards might come out of it. Trading definite but ultra rare rewards for not-quite-as rare but connected to a special random event I might never come across does nothing for me but make those ultra rare rewards even more unpredictable. Camping and grinding bosses for the random chance of spawning the special version to give achievements (and then even have the right people there to succeed in the special event) likewise isn't what I consider fun in this game, but rather turns me off .

 

"Content that requires a lot of challenge" is another point that I don't see succeed. No pve content is challenging enough to really pose a challenge. It's scripted, and a sizeable group of people will have it on farm pretty soon and be bored, while the rest will simply be shut out from said content due to limitations often out of their control (be it time restraints, disabilities, or simply lousy internet connection). This doesn't make the game more appealing to a wider playerbase but rather less appealing to many that like to play now.