Alatar.7364 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"DeceiverX.8361" said: > it can reset via Improv (and SwEq) Improvisation has a 20s ICD so Swindlers Equilibrium doesn't help recharge it unless you're not running Trickery which is literally impossible in PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vincent III.1286 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > One of the most notirous things I find about thieves is they're able to stall a point for more than 10 sec through evasion spam, notably dagger storm with it's 4¼s evade frame which is the longest evasion frame in game, can't be punished outside of shocking aura, is limted to ele outside of rune of the surging, which nobody runs either. It's light countered by line of warding as that could interrupt, but is difficult and specific in itself. Those classes outside of guardian and ele can't do anything about DS which is kitten busted. A thief is not a node holder and shouldn't be by default when it's the best rotational roamer in the game. I've seen some few games decided by last minute prevention or by just simply being there first to contest cetra point. At the very least dagger storm should fall in the same category as elixir s. > > > > The game already denies points when Thief stealth, now you're suggesting that points should also be denied when they evade. If that would be the case, any profession using evades, stealth, block, invul, etc. should also be denied points. If that would be the rule, then it should be applied to every profession using such tactic and not exclusive to one profession. There's already too many handicaps placed on the Thief. > > WOW > I actually have to agree with Vin this time. And i acatually have to agree 100%. Dude are you okay? What happened? How did this happen? Am I going crazy? It's always been you man. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loboling.5293 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 We could nerf daggerstorm, but you know... Mirage and Soulbeast. Seriously though, I'd reduce the damage by about 20-25% and call it a day. The skill is amazing now, can be used to reflect, and can't be countered by unblockables. (for the duration) I think that aspect needs to stay. So I'm against lowering the duration. It's a stall tactic, a counterpressure skill and thieves need it in this meta imo. But people bringing up improv, not sure about it, but make a separate thread please. Daggerstorm might only do a bit too much damage, but the skill is doing what its designed for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenAce.3067 Posted February 13, 2019 Author Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of not preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Safandula.8723 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day > > Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. LOL mate, there is big difference on invul and evade :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vincent III.1286 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day > > Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. Here's an honest question: If the Thief is as great as you are making them to be, why aren't we seeing more of them in a team? Why do you even need other professions if you can rotate and cap then keep the node as a Thief easily? My point is, you're having a tunnel vision towards the Thief rather than looking at the team composition that allowed the Thief to do his job effectively and efficiently. Nerfing the Thief will not change the fact that your team comp might be trash. EDIT: typos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenAce.3067 Posted February 13, 2019 Author Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day > > > > Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. > > Here's an honest question: If the Thief is as great as you are making them to be, why aren't we seeing more of them in a team? Why do you even need other professions if you can rotate and cap then keep the node as a Thief easily? > > My point is, you're having a tunnel vision towards the Thief rather than looking at the team composition that allowed the Thief to do his job effectively and efficiently. > > Nerfing the Thief will not change the fact that your team comp might be trash. > > EDIT: typos You're missing out the point near completly. As I was refering multiple times picture a scenario where there are even circumstances where match is about to end. one team has 2 nodes (say x&y) another 1. There is none on x node, their thief was on y, barely reaches x in time and holds it through uninteractable evades. Or another scenario more common, such as spawn nodes like skyhammer or cannon, you've wiped x/4 they're on spawn in 5s thief able to stall that point inb4 they regroup. DS is near as invuln as you tend to use that before you get condi pressured. only few circumstances where you can punish that is through shocking aura which is quite limited to none and line of warding (support FB) which is difficult to land. Retal is even less negligible in 1v1. You do see nearly 1 thief in ladder ranked and ofc in high lvl play atleast 1 and they can all abuse that last second ditch if they know how to rotate somewhat well, doesn't require high mechanical understanding. Meta has been high momentum rotational basis so ofc thief sees play. And finally why should thief have the luxury to stall a point when it's the fastest thing moving compared to other rotational +1 specs like rev holo, guard, mirage (to some extent) which either can be cc'd off the point or burn invulns which costs them that node anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day > > > > > > Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. > > > > Here's an honest question: If the Thief is as great as you are making them to be, why aren't we seeing more of them in a team? Why do you even need other professions if you can rotate and cap then keep the node as a Thief easily? > > > > My point is, you're having a tunnel vision towards the Thief rather than looking at the team composition that allowed the Thief to do his job effectively and efficiently. > > > > Nerfing the Thief will not change the fact that your team comp might be trash. > > > > EDIT: typos > > You're missing out the point near completly. As I was refering multiple times picture a scenario where there are even circumstances where match is about to end. one team has 2 nodes (say x&y) another 1. There is none on x node, their thief was on y, barely reaches x in time and holds it through uninteractable evades. Or another scenario more common, such as spawn nodes like skyhammer or cannon, you've wiped x/4 they're on spawn in 5s thief able to stall that point inb4 they regroup. DS is near as invuln as you tend to use that before you get condi pressured. only few circumstances where you can punish that is through shocking aura which is quite limited to none and line of warding (support FB) which is difficult to land. Retal is even less negligible in 1v1. > > You do see nearly 1 thief in ladder ranked and ofc in high lvl play atleast 1 and they can all abuse that last second ditch if they know how to rotate somewhat well, doesn't require high mechanical understanding. Meta has been high momentum rotational basis so ofc thief sees play. And finally why should thief have the luxury to stall a point when it's the fastest thing moving compared to other rotational +1 specs like rev holo, guard, mirage (to some extent) which either can be cc'd off the point or burn invulns which costs them that node anyway. Wow! U realize every class u listed is far better at holding a node than thief. One skill used in one way to hold a node doesn’t compare to the fact that everything else about almost all classes make them better than thief for holding a node. Man the things people whine about is getting ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Redline.5379 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"SevenAce.3067" said: dude i rly think you are over esaggarating. this could srsly happen in rly low ranked bronze game. I played against a lot of thieves. and none of them including myself could hold alone the node just thanks to evades and 4 sec DS spam. That is simply impossible. MIrage will wipe you out moment you run out of evades. Guradian will interupt your DS if you hit the dome and he can hold you inside of that circle i hate you cant dodge out of. Ele will cleanse all condi you can get from DS + combo field and you wont deal as much dmg either since they have plenty of evades as well and also DS interrupting skill i forgot its name sry. War can block you out. Ranger will survive it thanks to boons holo will be invul any solid player can and will outplay evade spaming thief. And when thief runs out of evades they will kill him. Scenarios you depict are fantasy at best. Not possible in high lvl pvp. And not even in mid lvl pvp such as Gold to Plat this whole thread is becoming a huge troll hole and you either dont see it or you want it to be that way. just really think of it for a moment. It is one skill and yes even tho it has 4s evade it is not that bad you couldnt handle it. There are far more worse skills you shoud be afraid of when it comes to thief such as stealth on dodge and DJ and shadowstep and anything connected to DE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vincent III.1286 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day > > > > > > Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. > > > > Here's an honest question: If the Thief is as great as you are making them to be, why aren't we seeing more of them in a team? Why do you even need other professions if you can rotate and cap then keep the node as a Thief easily? > > > > My point is, you're having a tunnel vision towards the Thief rather than looking at the team composition that allowed the Thief to do his job effectively and efficiently. > > > > Nerfing the Thief will not change the fact that your team comp might be trash. > > > > EDIT: typos > > You're missing out the point near completly. As I was refering multiple times picture a scenario where there are even circumstances where match is about to end. one team has 2 nodes (say x&y) another 1. There is none on x node, their thief was on y, barely reaches x in time and holds it through uninteractable evades. Or another scenario more common, such as spawn nodes like skyhammer or cannon, you've wiped x/4 they're on spawn in 5s thief able to stall that point inb4 they regroup. DS is near as invuln as you tend to use that before you get condi pressured. only few circumstances where you can punish that is through shocking aura which is quite limited to none and line of warding (support FB) which is difficult to land. Retal is even less negligible in 1v1. > If there is none on node X, then where are the Thieves? Why only one Thief from node Y who rushed to that node X to cap it? If Thief is great at rotation, then the other team must have a Thief that could have prevented the decap. Instead, you paint a rather far-fetched scenario where the other team is lacking this great and powerful Thief in their roster. Then complain about the Thief who did his job, rather than complaining about the trash team comp of the losing team for not having the godly Thief in the first place. Do you see my point? In PvP, good team comp with good communication always wins over trash team comp with zero team communication. It doesn't really matter what profession you pick. > You do see nearly 1 thief in ladder ranked and ofc in high lvl play atleast 1 and they can all abuse that last second ditch if they know how to rotate somewhat well, doesn't require high mechanical understanding. Meta has been high momentum rotational basis so ofc thief sees play. And finally why should thief have the luxury to stall a point when it's the fastest thing moving compared to other rotational +1 specs like rev holo, guard, mirage (to some extent) which either can be cc'd off the point or burn invulns which costs them that node anyway. Again, this proves that you're having tunnel visions towards the Thief without looking at the big picture on what lead to that very specific scenario and circumstances. If what your claim is true, then there should be more Thieves in the ranking ladder, but why only 1? Either Thief is great and godly or they are not. If the Thieves are great and godly, we would see more Thief in the top ranks. It wouldn't make sense not to pick a great and godly profession with almost unlimited access to evades -- according to you. However, we see only 1 Thief which proves that this profession is not great and godly at all. Sorry but the facts are proving your argument wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenAce.3067 Posted February 14, 2019 Author Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day > > > > > > > > Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. > > > > > > Here's an honest question: If the Thief is as great as you are making them to be, why aren't we seeing more of them in a team? Why do you even need other professions if you can rotate and cap then keep the node as a Thief easily? > > > > > > My point is, you're having a tunnel vision towards the Thief rather than looking at the team composition that allowed the Thief to do his job effectively and efficiently. > > > > > > Nerfing the Thief will not change the fact that your team comp might be trash. > > > > > > EDIT: typos > > > > You're missing out the point near completly. As I was refering multiple times picture a scenario where there are even circumstances where match is about to end. one team has 2 nodes (say x&y) another 1. There is none on x node, their thief was on y, barely reaches x in time and holds it through uninteractable evades. Or another scenario more common, such as spawn nodes like skyhammer or cannon, you've wiped x/4 they're on spawn in 5s thief able to stall that point inb4 they regroup. DS is near as invuln as you tend to use that before you get condi pressured. only few circumstances where you can punish that is through shocking aura which is quite limited to none and line of warding (support FB) which is difficult to land. Retal is even less negligible in 1v1. > > > > You do see nearly 1 thief in ladder ranked and ofc in high lvl play atleast 1 and they can all abuse that last second ditch if they know how to rotate somewhat well, doesn't require high mechanical understanding. Meta has been high momentum rotational basis so ofc thief sees play. And finally why should thief have the luxury to stall a point when it's the fastest thing moving compared to other rotational +1 specs like rev holo, guard, mirage (to some extent) which either can be cc'd off the point or burn invulns which costs them that node anyway. > > Wow! U realize every class u listed is far better at holding a node than thief. One skill used in one way to hold a node doesn’t compare to the fact that everything else about almost all classes make them better than thief for holding a node. Man the things people whine about is getting ridiculous. I wasn't refering to thief holding a node in general like that should be obvious. But the possibility for them to interrupt tick and stall another x spec, regardless of rotational or dueslist, in a limited / crucial interval without getting sort of counterplay mostly due to DS, those 10s might dictate the conclusion of a game. All it takes is 5s off the node or invulns and the node is neutral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenAce.3067 Posted February 14, 2019 Author Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day > > > > > > > > Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. > > > > > > Here's an honest question: If the Thief is as great as you are making them to be, why aren't we seeing more of them in a team? Why do you even need other professions if you can rotate and cap then keep the node as a Thief easily? > > > > > > My point is, you're having a tunnel vision towards the Thief rather than looking at the team composition that allowed the Thief to do his job effectively and efficiently. > > > > > > Nerfing the Thief will not change the fact that your team comp might be trash. > > > > > > EDIT: typos > > > > You're missing out the point near completly. As I was refering multiple times picture a scenario where there are even circumstances where match is about to end. one team has 2 nodes (say x&y) another 1. There is none on x node, their thief was on y, barely reaches x in time and holds it through uninteractable evades. Or another scenario more common, such as spawn nodes like skyhammer or cannon, you've wiped x/4 they're on spawn in 5s thief able to stall that point inb4 they regroup. DS is near as invuln as you tend to use that before you get condi pressured. only few circumstances where you can punish that is through shocking aura which is quite limited to none and line of warding (support FB) which is difficult to land. Retal is even less negligible in 1v1. > > > > If there is none on node X, then where are the Thieves? Why only one Thief from node Y who rushed to that node X to cap it? If Thief is great at rotation, then the other team must have a Thief that could have prevented the decap. Instead, you paint a rather far-fetched scenario where the other team is lacking this great and powerful Thief in their roster. Then complain about the Thief who did his job, rather than complaining about the trash team comp of the losing team for not having the godly Thief in the first place. Do you see my point? > > In PvP, good team comp with good communication always wins over trash team comp with zero team communication. It doesn't really matter what profession you pick. > > > You do see nearly 1 thief in ladder ranked and ofc in high lvl play atleast 1 and they can all abuse that last second ditch if they know how to rotate somewhat well, doesn't require high mechanical understanding. Meta has been high momentum rotational basis so ofc thief sees play. And finally why should thief have the luxury to stall a point when it's the fastest thing moving compared to other rotational +1 specs like rev holo, guard, mirage (to some extent) which either can be cc'd off the point or burn invulns which costs them that node anyway. > > Again, this proves that you're having tunnel visions towards the Thief without looking at the big picture on what lead to that very specific scenario and circumstances. > > If what your claim is true, then there should be more Thieves in the ranking ladder, but why only 1? Either Thief is great and godly or they are not. If the Thieves are great and godly, we would see more Thief in the top ranks. It wouldn't make sense not to pick a great and godly profession with almost unlimited access to evades -- according to you. However, we see only 1 Thief which proves that this profession is not great and godly at all. > > Sorry but the facts are proving your argument wrong. You're looking balantly ignorant backing those statement mate, those aren't facts those are claimed by your view which seems more like delusional sentimentality. Neither I say they have unlimited access to evades but enough to avoid dmg for say ~ 10s which is majority backed by DS. Why shouldn't DS hinder capture point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenAce.3067 Posted February 14, 2019 Author Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > dude i rly think you are over esaggarating. this could srsly happen in rly low ranked bronze game. I played against a lot of thieves. and none of them including myself could hold alone the node just thanks to evades and 4 sec DS spam. That is simply impossible. MIrage will wipe you out moment you run out of evades. > Guradian will interupt your DS if you hit the dome and he can hold you inside of that circle i hate you cant dodge out of. Ele will cleanse all condi you can get from DS + combo field and you wont deal as much dmg either since they have plenty of evades as well and also DS interrupting skill i forgot its name sry. War can block you out. Ranger will survive it thanks to boons holo will be invul any solid player can and will outplay evade spaming thief. And when thief runs out of evades they will kill him. > Scenarios you depict are fantasy at best. Not possible in high lvl pvp. And not even in mid lvl pvp such as Gold to Plat this whole thread is becoming a huge troll hole and you either dont see it or you want it to be that way. just really think of it for a moment. It is one skill and yes even tho it has 4s evade it is not that bad you couldnt handle it. There are far more worse skills you shoud be afraid of when it comes to thief such as stealth on dodge and DJ and shadowstep and anything connected to DE > You're balantly blind to the discussion mate. it's not about the actual duration of DS, nor it's dmg but more so that it should have an additional drawback to prevent / lose capture point tick in a 1vx scenario like invulns because it's the longest evade frame that doubled from the secondmost. I've had 2 cases this season were that was the decideding factor and seen severals where 1 skill was the deciding factor at the last min mark. I'd suggest you quit horsing with those delusional rank suggestions. Just to clarify I'm plat2 not that I give a dam-. What is this a childish foreplay like were measuring penis size? Get real and read the fucking OP before you comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yannir.4132 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > cetra I'm sorry but I have to. It's "et cetera", not "cetra". "Etc" can be used as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yannir.4132 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > You're missing out the point near completly. As I was refering multiple times picture a scenario where there are even circumstances where match is about to end. one team has 2 nodes (say x&y) another 1. There is none on x node, their thief was on y, barely reaches x in time and holds it through uninteractable evades. Or another scenario more common, such as spawn nodes like skyhammer or cannon, you've wiped x/4 they're on spawn in 5s thief able to stall that point inb4 they regroup. DS is near as invuln as you tend to use that before you get condi pressured. only few circumstances where you can punish that is through shocking aura which is quite limited to none and line of warding (support FB) which is difficult to land. Retal is even less negligible in 1v1. As for the topic. I don't see how a Thief holding the point for even 10 seconds is relevant when you can have a good Boonbeast on the node holding it indefinitely. Even if they lose the node, they have enough pressure to take it back within a reasonable time frame. Especially if we're talking 1v1, the thief is dead after his 10 seconds of glory is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenAce.3067 Posted February 14, 2019 Author Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"Yannir.4132" said: > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > cetra > > I'm sorry but I have to. It's "et cetera", not "cetra". "Etc" can be used as well. Dude, excuse me? At times I can't be bothered. As for the followed comments, in certain occasions every seconds matter, having someone to stall out a node for a few couple of seconds is quite relevant if say another of their team takes over that node like slb, more so if say say thier team was on spawn and absolutely needs to commit to that point, every tick matters in those occasions. 5 seconds and the point is neutral. And here's my proposal; make DS prevent capture-point contribution like invulns, that'll make them think twice before using it in a preventative scenario, cause lets be real here they'll use it before you get your chance to fully spike them. Those 2 extra seconds is very relevant again, as like for my example I was 1 tick off close from being neutral hence that is midly tilting not having any counterplay interactiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yannir.4132 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 As long as it's an evade and not a true invuln, it will remain as it is. If you change it to not provide cap point contribution, it will also become a true invuln and thus, prevent conditions already on the thief from ticking. It's either one, and there really is no middle ground. Otherwise people will start to question whether dodging/other evade skills shouldn't do that as well. It's a question of what we expect out of game mechanics, not the balance of 1 skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenAce.3067 Posted February 14, 2019 Author Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"Yannir.4132" said: > As long as it's an evade and not a true invuln, it will remain as it is. If you change it to not provide cap point contribution, it will also become a true invuln and thus, prevent conditions already on the thief from ticking. It's either one, and there really is no middle ground. Otherwise people will start to question whether dodging/other evade skills shouldn't do that as well. It's a question of what we expect out of game mechanics, not the balance of 1 skill. Well that's the thing I wouldn't mind or care much if they changed it to invuln, ~~altho I'm sure they could perhaps find a manual solution in coding to compensate for it, even as an evade, why is that? Because it's more different than most as due to it's duration, it's on average 4 evades in 1, twice as much as the secondmost lengthy evade, instant reflexes (2s, trait) or shadow assault (2s, not so relevant underwater). Nothing really comes close to it's duration. You can use agility and / or shadowstep for cleanse, it's slightly longer than the longest invuln.~~ Like said I would rather have it as invuln even if it's duration is same, might cause some riot on the other hand. You do see some occasions on ATs where a thief was preventative on skyhammer with DS until his team was grouped up, can't remember which. I made a thread topic regarding moa once when it got changed to signet of humility so that it would show it's signet icon opon casting to telegraph. This is vastly different, I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 Well theres not a lot of sindrener like players running around so wait out ds than stomp the theif and take node,prob solved :) if he’s smart he’ll run after he ds runs out if non of his friends arrive to help and if they do and ur still solo u we’re going to prob lose it anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yannir.4132 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 You see, I don't think it's about coding or such. I'm sure it's possible. It's about player expectations. When you see a skill that blocks or evades attacks, you expect that you'll be able to use them on node without losing ticks. If you insert an anomaly, for example into Dagger Storm, it introduces doubt and confusion because a mechanic that was once clear cut isn't anymore. It would be easy for players like you and me that have hundreds/thousands of hours in the game to dismiss those doubts. It's not as clear for that 15-year-old starting this game for the first time tomorrow. Or for a player coming back from a year-long break. Bottom line is that Invulnerabilities prevent capture point contribution, evades and blocks don't. Length has nothing to do with it either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenAce.3067 Posted February 14, 2019 Author Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"Yannir.4132" said: > You see, I don't think it's about coding or such. I'm sure it's possible. It's about player expectations. > When you see a skill that blocks or evades attacks, you expect that you'll be able to use them on node without losing ticks. If you insert an anomaly, for example into Dagger Storm, it introduces doubt and confusion because a mechanic that was once clear cut isn't anymore. > It would be easy for players like you and me that have hundreds/thousands of hours in the game to dismiss those doubts. It's not as clear for that 15-year-old starting this game for the first time tomorrow. Or for a player coming back from a year-long break. > Bottom line is that Invulnerabilities prevent capture point contribution, evades and blocks don't. Length has nothing to do with it either. Honestly I'd say it's up for debate (I do contradict myself a bit here). But I don't think that's a good enough reason to not have an exception for DS. Length... shouldn't be dismissed easily as it's very distinctive, nothing comes close to it's duration. Retal and lines positioning in teamfight is of slightly more significance of course. It may require some form of adjustment inbetween. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yannir.4132 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > @"Yannir.4132" said: > > You see, I don't think it's about coding or such. I'm sure it's possible. It's about player expectations. > > When you see a skill that blocks or evades attacks, you expect that you'll be able to use them on node without losing ticks. If you insert an anomaly, for example into Dagger Storm, it introduces doubt and confusion because a mechanic that was once clear cut isn't anymore. > > It would be easy for players like you and me that have hundreds/thousands of hours in the game to dismiss those doubts. It's not as clear for that 15-year-old starting this game for the first time tomorrow. Or for a player coming back from a year-long break. > > Bottom line is that Invulnerabilities prevent capture point contribution, evades and blocks don't. Length has nothing to do with it either. > > Honestly I'd say it's up for debate (I do contradict myself a bit here). But I don't think that's a good enough reason to not have an exception for DS. Length... shouldn't be dismissed easily as it's very distinctive, nothing comes close to it's duration. Retal and lines positioning in teamfight is of slightly more significance of course. It may require some form of adjustment inbetween. IMO, the first step to take would be to reduce Dagger Storms duration. Maybe stop Improvisation from resetting Elite skills. Then see if it's still too strong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vincent III.1286 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day > > > > > > > > > > Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. > > > > > > > > Here's an honest question: If the Thief is as great as you are making them to be, why aren't we seeing more of them in a team? Why do you even need other professions if you can rotate and cap then keep the node as a Thief easily? > > > > > > > > My point is, you're having a tunnel vision towards the Thief rather than looking at the team composition that allowed the Thief to do his job effectively and efficiently. > > > > > > > > Nerfing the Thief will not change the fact that your team comp might be trash. > > > > > > > > EDIT: typos > > > > > > You're missing out the point near completly. As I was refering multiple times picture a scenario where there are even circumstances where match is about to end. one team has 2 nodes (say x&y) another 1. There is none on x node, their thief was on y, barely reaches x in time and holds it through uninteractable evades. Or another scenario more common, such as spawn nodes like skyhammer or cannon, you've wiped x/4 they're on spawn in 5s thief able to stall that point inb4 they regroup. DS is near as invuln as you tend to use that before you get condi pressured. only few circumstances where you can punish that is through shocking aura which is quite limited to none and line of warding (support FB) which is difficult to land. Retal is even less negligible in 1v1. > > > > > > > If there is none on node X, then where are the Thieves? Why only one Thief from node Y who rushed to that node X to cap it? If Thief is great at rotation, then the other team must have a Thief that could have prevented the decap. Instead, you paint a rather far-fetched scenario where the other team is lacking this great and powerful Thief in their roster. Then complain about the Thief who did his job, rather than complaining about the trash team comp of the losing team for not having the godly Thief in the first place. Do you see my point? > > > > In PvP, good team comp with good communication always wins over trash team comp with zero team communication. It doesn't really matter what profession you pick. > > > > > You do see nearly 1 thief in ladder ranked and ofc in high lvl play atleast 1 and they can all abuse that last second ditch if they know how to rotate somewhat well, doesn't require high mechanical understanding. Meta has been high momentum rotational basis so ofc thief sees play. And finally why should thief have the luxury to stall a point when it's the fastest thing moving compared to other rotational +1 specs like rev holo, guard, mirage (to some extent) which either can be cc'd off the point or burn invulns which costs them that node anyway. > > > > Again, this proves that you're having tunnel visions towards the Thief without looking at the big picture on what lead to that very specific scenario and circumstances. > > > > If what your claim is true, then there should be more Thieves in the ranking ladder, but why only 1? Either Thief is great and godly or they are not. If the Thieves are great and godly, we would see more Thief in the top ranks. It wouldn't make sense not to pick a great and godly profession with almost unlimited access to evades -- according to you. However, we see only 1 Thief which proves that this profession is not great and godly at all. > > > > Sorry but the facts are proving your argument wrong. > > You're looking balantly ignorant backing those statement mate, those aren't facts those are claimed by your view which seems more like delusional sentimentality. Neither I say they have unlimited access to evades but enough to avoid dmg for say ~ 10s which is majority backed by DS. Why shouldn't DS hinder capture point? Hey, you've been exaggerating all these time, why cant I? You claim that the Thief is so good at rotation and keeping a node, yet we only see 1 Thief in ranking and not all team take a Thief. If anyone is delusional, it's you. Daggerstorm is not nearly as broken as Renewed Focus. What you want will never happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > > > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > > > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > > > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day > > > > > > > > > > > > Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. > > > > > > > > > > Here's an honest question: If the Thief is as great as you are making them to be, why aren't we seeing more of them in a team? Why do you even need other professions if you can rotate and cap then keep the node as a Thief easily? > > > > > > > > > > My point is, you're having a tunnel vision towards the Thief rather than looking at the team composition that allowed the Thief to do his job effectively and efficiently. > > > > > > > > > > Nerfing the Thief will not change the fact that your team comp might be trash. > > > > > > > > > > EDIT: typos > > > > > > > > You're missing out the point near completly. As I was refering multiple times picture a scenario where there are even circumstances where match is about to end. one team has 2 nodes (say x&y) another 1. There is none on x node, their thief was on y, barely reaches x in time and holds it through uninteractable evades. Or another scenario more common, such as spawn nodes like skyhammer or cannon, you've wiped x/4 they're on spawn in 5s thief able to stall that point inb4 they regroup. DS is near as invuln as you tend to use that before you get condi pressured. only few circumstances where you can punish that is through shocking aura which is quite limited to none and line of warding (support FB) which is difficult to land. Retal is even less negligible in 1v1. > > > > > > > > > > If there is none on node X, then where are the Thieves? Why only one Thief from node Y who rushed to that node X to cap it? If Thief is great at rotation, then the other team must have a Thief that could have prevented the decap. Instead, you paint a rather far-fetched scenario where the other team is lacking this great and powerful Thief in their roster. Then complain about the Thief who did his job, rather than complaining about the trash team comp of the losing team for not having the godly Thief in the first place. Do you see my point? > > > > > > In PvP, good team comp with good communication always wins over trash team comp with zero team communication. It doesn't really matter what profession you pick. > > > > > > > You do see nearly 1 thief in ladder ranked and ofc in high lvl play atleast 1 and they can all abuse that last second ditch if they know how to rotate somewhat well, doesn't require high mechanical understanding. Meta has been high momentum rotational basis so ofc thief sees play. And finally why should thief have the luxury to stall a point when it's the fastest thing moving compared to other rotational +1 specs like rev holo, guard, mirage (to some extent) which either can be cc'd off the point or burn invulns which costs them that node anyway. > > > > > > Again, this proves that you're having tunnel visions towards the Thief without looking at the big picture on what lead to that very specific scenario and circumstances. > > > > > > If what your claim is true, then there should be more Thieves in the ranking ladder, but why only 1? Either Thief is great and godly or they are not. If the Thieves are great and godly, we would see more Thief in the top ranks. It wouldn't make sense not to pick a great and godly profession with almost unlimited access to evades -- according to you. However, we see only 1 Thief which proves that this profession is not great and godly at all. > > > > > > Sorry but the facts are proving your argument wrong. > > > > You're looking balantly ignorant backing those statement mate, those aren't facts those are claimed by your view which seems more like delusional sentimentality. Neither I say they have unlimited access to evades but enough to avoid dmg for say ~ 10s which is majority backed by DS. Why shouldn't DS hinder capture point? > > Hey, you've been exaggerating all these time, why cant I? > > You claim that the Thief is so good at rotation and keeping a node, yet we only see 1 Thief in ranking and not all team take a Thief. If anyone is delusional, it's you. > > Daggerstorm is not nearly as broken as Renewed Focus. What you want will never happen. Shhhhh man don’t draw attention to my RF pls lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vincent III.1286 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said: > > > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > > > > @"Jack Redline.5379" said: > > > > > > > > > @"SevenAce.3067" said: > > > > > > > > DS isnt that powerful nor unstopable that it could decide the game 10 out of 10 times. DS is at best casted when you need to finish up those few downed/near death opponents or when you are almost dead and you need to save ur life from death. As far as i can see what you write here you are Bronze at best so please dont cry and simply git gud. You as a thief have enogh life to withstant DS with 2 dodges. Which i beleive is standard amount of dodges for all classes not to mention all the other skills that block evade etc. There is kitten ton of other BS in this game that needs to be dealt with and DS is certainly not one of them. Good day > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dude, I'm not complaining about it's dmg nor evade aspect but it's ridiculousness of preventing capture point due to it's evade uptime as *the fastest rotational class* in close match circumstances. 4¼s (none-interactive play in most cases) to stall the point from ticking that can be followed up with more evades due to thiefs general high evade kit, is instant can be used along with agility and shadowstep, can be reset by improvisation with rng from steal afterwards is over the top busted. Make it invul, I couldn't care less, it's basically that, when momentum is at peak in meta nowdays and those 10-15s could end up match deciding factor which I've seen happen. DS is the main root of the problem. Anything that goes beyond 2s evade frame and is accessed by a class with additional layers of evades is not cool, more so when this class is first to port on point. While DS may require additional respond in a 1v1 on node and if a core guard or mes uses renew / distort which fully ends in thiefs favor of the node. > > > > > > > > > > > > Here's an honest question: If the Thief is as great as you are making them to be, why aren't we seeing more of them in a team? Why do you even need other professions if you can rotate and cap then keep the node as a Thief easily? > > > > > > > > > > > > My point is, you're having a tunnel vision towards the Thief rather than looking at the team composition that allowed the Thief to do his job effectively and efficiently. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nerfing the Thief will not change the fact that your team comp might be trash. > > > > > > > > > > > > EDIT: typos > > > > > > > > > > You're missing out the point near completly. As I was refering multiple times picture a scenario where there are even circumstances where match is about to end. one team has 2 nodes (say x&y) another 1. There is none on x node, their thief was on y, barely reaches x in time and holds it through uninteractable evades. Or another scenario more common, such as spawn nodes like skyhammer or cannon, you've wiped x/4 they're on spawn in 5s thief able to stall that point inb4 they regroup. DS is near as invuln as you tend to use that before you get condi pressured. only few circumstances where you can punish that is through shocking aura which is quite limited to none and line of warding (support FB) which is difficult to land. Retal is even less negligible in 1v1. > > > > > > > > > > > > > If there is none on node X, then where are the Thieves? Why only one Thief from node Y who rushed to that node X to cap it? If Thief is great at rotation, then the other team must have a Thief that could have prevented the decap. Instead, you paint a rather far-fetched scenario where the other team is lacking this great and powerful Thief in their roster. Then complain about the Thief who did his job, rather than complaining about the trash team comp of the losing team for not having the godly Thief in the first place. Do you see my point? > > > > > > > > In PvP, good team comp with good communication always wins over trash team comp with zero team communication. It doesn't really matter what profession you pick. > > > > > > > > > You do see nearly 1 thief in ladder ranked and ofc in high lvl play atleast 1 and they can all abuse that last second ditch if they know how to rotate somewhat well, doesn't require high mechanical understanding. Meta has been high momentum rotational basis so ofc thief sees play. And finally why should thief have the luxury to stall a point when it's the fastest thing moving compared to other rotational +1 specs like rev holo, guard, mirage (to some extent) which either can be cc'd off the point or burn invulns which costs them that node anyway. > > > > > > > > Again, this proves that you're having tunnel visions towards the Thief without looking at the big picture on what lead to that very specific scenario and circumstances. > > > > > > > > If what your claim is true, then there should be more Thieves in the ranking ladder, but why only 1? Either Thief is great and godly or they are not. If the Thieves are great and godly, we would see more Thief in the top ranks. It wouldn't make sense not to pick a great and godly profession with almost unlimited access to evades -- according to you. However, we see only 1 Thief which proves that this profession is not great and godly at all. > > > > > > > > Sorry but the facts are proving your argument wrong. > > > > > > You're looking balantly ignorant backing those statement mate, those aren't facts those are claimed by your view which seems more like delusional sentimentality. Neither I say they have unlimited access to evades but enough to avoid dmg for say ~ 10s which is majority backed by DS. Why shouldn't DS hinder capture point? > > > > Hey, you've been exaggerating all these time, why cant I? > > > > You claim that the Thief is so good at rotation and keeping a node, yet we only see 1 Thief in ranking and not all team take a Thief. If anyone is delusional, it's you. > > > > Daggerstorm is not nearly as broken as Renewed Focus. What you want will never happen. > > Shhhhh man don’t draw attention to my RF pls lol lol, to stop the bus I have to throw something under it. 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