rofl: seriously, in alternative to whine like pre school kids, test your theories prior to complaining. Shroud.. those trebs in spawn for which you linked- the can be removed with a balli faster than the trebs can fire, also the balli is safe from the trebs as the min range is effected by their alleviation. Mag clouding ebg. Very very simple counter.. the two whom are opposing simply take half Mags BL each and tier them and to rub salt into the wound siege out one backline tower and the keep (EWP in each) and simply hold for tier3. As many have mentioned.. 3 exits in every spawn. No point in whinning that your getting farmed when you dont seek out the counters. In RL and as with games, there is normally a counter so all you need do is use a little IQ