ZeftheWicked.3076

Let's see:

1. Hm.....that is a pretty interesting change. Ability to get shroud flash procs faster and jump back into shroud before 10s deathclock (i had to:>) at the expense of being exposed longer if you burn your charges too fast. It would defo require some testing but sounds promising.

**provided scourge is not part of this change** - getting sand shroud x3 in a row would be beyond busted

2. Nah. Pointless. Classes that live off such tricks (mesmers, guardians, soulbeasts, spellbreakers) have whole phletora of such defensese that chained together make them godly. For a necro having one single invulni woudn't change much. He'd just get bursted 2s later. And probs eat nasty nerfs for getting it. I believe better way to handle this is to give necro anti-crit trait like elementalit's stone heart as someone suggested here.

3. Hm... sounds bit too weak and too favorable for not making any real plays. Weak because shroud gets stomped to 0 **very often** and nowhere does it say that the blow that puts you out of it will be 12k damage deadeye shot. It might as well be a 100 dmg poison tick. In a heat of battle where necro gets focused (like always...) there's really no skill based way to ensure which blow deals away with your shroud and gets stopped by such a trait.

And 1/2s invulni is both too good (invulni) and too weak (1/2s) as a reward for basically losing your shroud.

This whole thing got my brain thinking into making following trait:

Spectral Ward:

When shrouded, reduce damage taken from each source by 100 +toughness coefficient.

Leaving shroud below life force threshold will give you 5s crit immunity. Treshhold - 25% life force.

_Provided leaving means you leave it of your own accord and not it being depleted to 0 by enemy attack or life force degeneration._

Combined with shroud being on charges this could lead to some either powerful anti-burst windows (shroud flashing) or prolonged shroud entries for anti-condi defense (the reduction part vs any source, especially if combined with death magic's condi damage reductions).

> @"Brujeria.7536" said:

> Simply add / tweak a few (Grandmaster) traits that can get the job done:

>

> * Unholy Sanctuary - Activate Shroud when taking a lethal blow while above the Lifeforce treshold + Shroud now uses an ammo system. 3 Charges, 3 sec cooldown

>between uses, 12 seconds recharge per charge (Recharge also works during shroud)

How would that ammo system work vs life force amount gathered? (like each charge refilling life force to full, or not affecting that at all?)

> * Putrid defense - now also causes poison to foes hitting you while you have protection

Sounds neat. I don't understand why a-net, who made necro literally the only profession without some sort of invulnerability/0 damage taken skill is refusing to give us better access to "hedgehog skills" that would give us windows of hard counter damage to unwise attackers.

> * Corruptors Fervor : take reduced damage and condition damage for each condition on the foe that damagaes you: 3% per unique condition.

Bad idea. In competitive modes guardians are a thing (often in packs) and quick mass condi cleanses are abundant. Making your defense rely on enemy not cleansing the condies you applied is a very risky deal.

> * Parasitic Contagion: Now heals for a flat amount for each condition applied (150) (per stack), 5% of your condition damage heals you

Too op, given many other good sources of healing we already have and can use in conjunction. What this traits needs is healing through shroud. Currently it can't and it leads to it being completely useless for core and reaper while diamonds for scourge.

> * Weakening Shroud: Add - enfeeble now causes slow. Causing weakness also slows your target (ICD per Target)

I like this idea a lot. Getting jumped in spvp as a necro is basically a law of physics by now, and any condi to help you reduce their damage is worth it's weight in gold. Being the absolute master of conditions, it surprises me to no end why he isn't given any acess to slow on core and reaper (especially core, since reaper at least has quickness!).

> * Last Rites: Remove the stopped bleeding out part and replace with: When you go down lifeforce erupts from you, healing and reviving nearby allies including yourself

That would reward bad gameplay (getting downed). Sides current last rights is great for ressing people left and right. I don't particularly see any big issue with this trait as is, it's one of the better necro minors if you ask me.

> * Unholy Martyr: add when you draw a condition from an ally gain health. When you transfer an condition to an enemy steal health.

I would like a version where drawing conditions off allies on shroud enter gives you lifeforce then consuming them on shroud exit gives you health. Or in reverse, their call.

> * Spiteful Spirit: add - when removing or corrupting a boon you deal damage and cause AOE blind

No feelings about this one.

> * Rework all minion traits like they do with weapon traits (Give them an additional benefit that is not tied to minions)

Interesting idea.

+1 to stone heart effect (crits not working vs shrouded necro).

I'd like to see Unholy Sanctuary get this effect. To balance it it could be at expense of higher lf degen (+1% per second) or shorter shroud for scourge (-1 or -2 seconds), since scourges are pretty disgusting with barrier sharing.

Ty bro! (that Dark Defiance functionality was actually my idea posted on forums some months ago, har har!).

And as i said - in it's own specialized role - passive damage mitigation, Death Magic is indeed good.

Problem is other lines have their own sustain tools that also work, while providing meaningful benefits in other areas of gameplay which Death Magic doesn't.

For example, Blood magic, which is the reverse twin brother of Death Magic (tons of healing, some damage mitigation), also has strong party play options and mobility traits. Both of these very viable and impactful.

Shrouded removal - yeah it needs a boost. Also agreed about unholy sanctuary. Atm this skill is a joke- traited signet of vampirism is 3x more poweful with it's passive and it works all the time, not just in shroud.

> @"Laila Lightness.8742" said:

> Yeah but also not entirely> @"Iozeph.5617" said:

> > > @"RedShark.9548" said:

> > > Wont ever happen, how is anet supposed to sell xpacs, when the especs bring no improvements

> >

> > If we're to take Anet at their word, Elite specs were never intended to be hands-down better than core specs. They were intended to offer something to the professions -a method of play, or a new weapon, which they hadn't had access to before then. I don't see why there isn't room for both to exist here.

> >

> > Some players will want to keep to a certain core-based theme, others are going to continue to want for whatever is shiniest and newest at the time. At the utter least this sort of change would bring back some much needed build diversity, but that's just my opinion. I'd love to see what others have to say.

>

> Take a look on war power dmg core war is more preffered over spellbreaker. Condi its berserker but dont say core spec dont compete with especs for some proffesions has terrible especs. Even core guard is accepted.

Yes, but it's not a rule, more like exception to it. Most cores fall behind elites. Even if their dps is tied (and that's not a frequent occurrance) elites win out with wastly superior utility and fixing a core's crucial weakness while introducing a much less dangerous one of their own, or straight up lacking any clear weaknesses (hi soulbeast and holosmiths).

In WvW core guard is certainly in no way competitve with a firebrand, just as scourge is meta, while on core necro you're just being hipster. Core Mesmer may be able to do 30k dps, but it's chronomacers ppl want, not core mesmers.

Firstly you must decide what you want to do with it. The key reason Death Magic sucks is that every other line has at least two major specializations at which they are very effective:

a) spite - power damage + healing (especially with reaper's blighter's boon)

b) curses - everything condi (damage, removal, boon corruption, healing off condies) + crtical strike chance

c) blood magic - healing, ressing, party utility, mobility

d) soul reaping - all rounder with focus on life force generation and shroud boosts. Crit builds boosts, condi boosts (dhuumfire + fear of death), defense boosts (foot in the grave, extra life force + incoming healing).

All of those are their **major** strengths, either by having multiple traits for a given aspect, or one, but powerful, build defining (like parasitic contagion). Death Magic on the other hand only majors in one thing - passive damage mitigation, especially in shroud. Anything else it tries to do is too weak to be of real consequence. Talking of condi damage from death nova, healing from unholy sanctuary or power boost from deadly strength. All far too weak to give Death Magic a second role.

So to "fix" Death Magic we first need to ask:

**what should it major in, asides damage reduction?**

One thing i can say about last set of balance changes is that Terrormancer is finally back in business, ty a-net for making him viable again in spvp :)

The spectral ring is awesome - such a simple change yet so much impact! No longer a niche chokepoint usage skill, spectral ring has a ton of uses and plays. Excellent change.

Fear of Death is what sealed the deal for terrormancer's return. The full 100% fear duration and life force generation allow to get some life force on a condi build (infamous achilles' heel for condi necros) and provides build diversity - with maxed fear duration outta the box, one can choose to ignore condition duration in favor of other stats for more diverse builds, like bruiser-y terror mancer that does less damage but has more sustain for more decap oriented build, rather then do-or-die pure damage machine.

Discussions ™ lead to nothing being agreed upon and solutions coming to a century near you!

He straight up proposed a solution and yes or no vote - i like his approach!

> @"starlinvf.1358" said:

-snip-

Balance **does** sell. Sure it's perfect version where no changes can occure is slow death, but that's like talking about heatwaves when standing on North Pole. RIght here and now, we're in a place where one profession cannot do end game content without it's elite specs (necro) while another can't do with it (scrapper). In a place where we have a handful of viable tanks and healers that can do their job well, but due to mesmer's and druid's overloaded kits they don't get the time of the day in pugs.

Ofc we can say that it's a player mentality and community issue, but you can' only blame ppl so much, when there are huge, glaring differences in how the meta pick performs vs the rest of the pack. Just looking how much and how easily chronomancer can apply 2 extremely important yet scarce boons (quickness and alacrity) for his entire party makes it very obvious why he's the only tank in meta. Not to mention party-wipe saving distortions.

On topic of elites vs core there are quite a few cow sized issues.

* Core necro's dps being around 1/2 of other core professions?

* Thief having 2 elite specs, yet no role other then pure dps?

* Mesmer elites being plain overloaded and without much counterplay (mirage) or competition (chrono)?

* Defensive spellbreaker having damage on pair if not surpassing Berserker's?

* Holosmith being completely busted when compared to core engi?

* Soulbeast being essentially a Ranger upgrade, rather then a separate playstyle, with own strengths, but also weaknesses when compared to core?

..to name but a few off top of my head. Balancing this elite vs core discrepancy will do a game huge favour, and enage players much deeper. Anyone can pick a chronomancer and learn it over time. But do you play GW2 to do what they tell you to do, or to play your own way? Also there is always the "underdog" push. People want to play offmeta professions and roles and **look classy** doing so, as long as they got good grip on their character, and it's upcoming challenge. If your game can deliver that then you're in for some big $$.

Full counter's damage nerf was well deserved. There's hardly any skill involved if you just go mid catpure point and press it in the aoe spam there.

However I'm not blind to the fact that in a 1v1 scenario there's actually some skill involved and getting a full counter off in a duel should be rewarded far better then 0 risk 100% braindead pressing it in a zerg.

Proposed change:

Full counter damage - 100% of PvE damage **spread** between all targets affected, but no lower then 20% of PvE damage. You hit 5 targets with it? Each gets 1/5 of the PvE damage. You got it off in a 1v1 duel? They receive full PvE damage from the skill.

Funny how the guy asks "if **you** want it", but player's rush to answer why a-net won't...

This is **the work** that is needed to set the game's balance right, and propel the game itself into a bright future.

A true balance is needed to shake up games's fossilized meta, like the infamous "chrono +druid, no necro!" in raids.

This lack of balance between especs and core specs is already causing massive damage to game. Both it's fun factor (cores not welcomed in raids or high end competitive) and image (**almost** not P2W) suffer because of the issue.

Proper balancing of core specs vs elites **will boost the sales!** Not via sudden hype boost but by people staying and word of mouth. Just look at League of Legends! They aren't afraid to toss time and money into sometimes even complete old champion reworks and balance passes to ensure game stays fun and balanced. No P2W schemes whatsoever, yet their position as MOBA juggernaut stays secured and somehow i don't see them going bancrupt because the whales couldn't buy unfair advantage for $$. If Riot can, a-net can as well.

It'll most certainly not be money wasted, quite the opposite.

Necro has one boon in abundance - protection. That could be it's main. Well that and barrier, albeit it's not a boon per se.

> @"Crinn.7864" said:

> Spiteful Renewal will trigger on the self-vuln applied by Consume.

Ah indeed, that was mb. This is actually pretty smart, props to author there.

> Literally 3/4th of the meta necro builds that have existed over the years have no more mobility than the OP's build.

Wouldn't know. I play offmeta. And every time I (usually by mistake) don't trait warhorn and am with "3/4 builds' mobility", results are horrible to say the least.

> Transfusion is one of exactly 2 things on necro that scales well with healing power. Moreover he is Reaper, which doesn't even benefit from Transfusion's healing. On reaper you only use Transfusion for the down teleport. It would not make sense for him to invest in healing power.

Damn, that was mb. Though i will disagree with "2 things", it's true his builds doensn't use anything save transfusion with good healing scaling.

>

>

> While I'm not fond of the OP's build, your criticisms of his build are just plain incorrect.

Some are, I admit. Good job catching my mistakes. However the biggest point still stands - condi cleanse is nearly non existant. If he dives into a scourge, or meets a condi holo/mes/burnguard, he's not gonna have a good time.

Bad build detected.

**1. Almost no condi cleanse.**

Untraited consume conditions has brutal 30s cd, and anti-synergy with spiteful removal (if consume took all condies off, what's there left to trigger spiteful removal?)

Single condi lost on weapon swap ain't gonna salvage the situation.

**2. Poor mobility **

Warhorn is untraited, leading to around 50% uptime on swiftness with nothing else to compensate. Necro tends to get focused and dies a lot, so having high movement speed to rejoin the action asap is crucial. Also chasing enemies requires to be at least as fast as them!

**3. Lotsa healing, but hardly any healing power**

Only source of healing power is last rites passive in blood magic. If you're going so deep into healing as to pick transfusion grandmaster, it would make sense to back it up with some extra healing power.

**4. Half-assed damage resistance**

The spectral armor + Rise! combo looks badass on the surface but as experienced spvp necro i know this is just paintjob on a shoddy car if it is not backed by strong additional measures. Measures such as weakness (to shut down crits), additional sources of protection (you have only spectral armor and nothing else), maybe Corrosive Poison Cloud for projectile block.

Calling this build glass would be unfair - the barriers, heals and burst damage mitigation are real. However the chinks in the armor are pretty big, condi pressure being chief offender. Also if someone goes and strips your single protection from spectral armor - well...you're boned. Minions from Rise! can get slaughtered in a typical mid fight, which is where you often can find a reaper.

Also blood bond + blood is power may be a synergy on a power necro, but sacrificing Ritual of Life which is staple of getting people back on their feet in spvp is kinda like throwing out the car's engine to make it more light and go faster...

Now i feel sorry for you rangers :/

This looks like foefire bow mixed with Chaos Bow.....i could believe this being a black lion skin, but not a legendary:/

Tbh i thought they'd do 180 on kudzu and deliver something like charr compound bow, just with ~~bells and whistles~~ mechanical parts and exploding arrowheads like in Rambo 3. Welp guess not!

> @"Dadnir.5038" said:

> > @"ZeftheWicked.3076" said:

> > 20% condition damage reduction is fine where it is - inside dark defiance. If it was in putrid defense, it would weaken shroud buils since you would not be able to have shrouded removal and the reduction at the same time. And passive anti-condi defenses for shroud are needed badly.

>

> _Putrid defense_ in what I wrote reduce condi **duration** not damage. I didn't suggest a damage reduction of _dark defiance_.

Oh! my bad! That sounds better!

20% condition damage reduction is fine where it is - inside dark defiance. If it was in putrid defense, it would weaken shroud buils since you would not be able to have shrouded removal and the reduction at the same time. And passive anti-condi defenses for shroud are needed badly.

Tbh what hurts most is the loss of passive spectral armor in soul reaping. In pvp you need all the spectral armors you can get...

So in PvE nothing that horrible happening.

Necro - defenses are all about facetanking damage. You don't get to avoid damage, you gotta outheal it.

Condi application is slooow. Tons of jobs can burst condies, not necro, he really has to stack them up over time.

Forget boonshare - that's just about everyone's job but yours. Necro is about condies not boons.

In competitive most reliant of all professions on having a support. No other profession needs a firebrand or healer ele strapped to their ass to be successful.

Remember that little poppy you had? How it died? How you cried?

Well, now it's my bone minion...until i explode it.

You're welcome!

Idea for Death Magic itself is good - passive sustain boosts, perfectly tailored for shroud builds or builds without tons of stunbreaks and active defenses on utility bar.

It's the implementation that sucks. Most lines offer better sustain *and* healing (be it for base health or life force) + their own valid traits.

Currently compared to other lines that at least have 2 potent uses (like healing + damage for Spite) Death Magic feels like half a traitline, not a whole one.

I don't mind it being an engage or not doing aoe bomb damage, I just want a-net to stop trolling and fix the real issue - the cast time and abysmall projectile velocity. It's no exaggeration when i say that 50% of time enemies just outrun the reach of the skill and that's without being miles ahead of you...

The few ppl that actually saw their dark path land probs might remember, rest of us never had any reason to xD

....in the amount of bleed stacks.

Achievement unlocked:

"Troll'em all!"

Ranger is a great pick. By default he can share some good stuff with allies like fury, swiftness, good combo fields (water, fire, ice) unique buffs (spirits), and if you specialize into druid, you can do even more!

In solo combat ranger is the class for soloing champs, thanks to his pet, and a vast array of defensive skills if there is a need for such.