Psientist.6437

Becoming a Dragon Champion may be more complex and nuanced than we have seen so far. Jormag speaks as though wearily familiar with Champions. Willfully building a proper Commander type, Elder Dragon Champion may require as much planning and work as building proper Aurene type Elder Dragons. Champions could even be powerful enough to turn an Elder Dragon. Any story about finding replacement Dragons will include the search for Champions. Focusing more on the Champion would keep the focus on the PC hero journey. I think it is significant she is a human surrounded by liquid tossed bubbles.

> @"Grand Marshal.4098" said: > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > I like the way Echovald forest looks. The bubbles are...well, they exist. Could the bubbles in or coming from the Jade Sea? They look like bubbles underwater or in a thick medium, they aren't round. There could be some kind of substance filling the atmosphere. The prismatic effect may just be a way to make the bubbles stand out though. The new person has a royal bearing and is densely surrounded by whatever medium the bubbles are in. Perhaps there is some connection between Canthan royalty and the DSD. > > Combining this with what @"Tseison.4659" said, maybe it is possible that the royalty of the Empire of the Dragon are also the champions or lieutenants to said dragon. Now it doesnt have to be an Elder Dragon, because Glint, Aurene and Vlast already had ties with some form of champion, or tried to connect to one, without the need to reach ED status. So maybe Kuunavang? > > But if the Empire is evil, would Kuunavang help them? Perhaps it's time for a change in the hierarchy. LEt's overthrow an empire and put our own guys in charge!! xD I can't tell if the person looks insufferably entitled or deep in meditation. I am leaning towards the latter. She is channeling bubble magic. Hmmm...throwing away All balance or trivializing balance with a twin for Aurene would break my suspension of disbelief. Bubble magic as a domain for the DSD would push my suspension of disbelief beyond the breaking point, then rebuild it again.

I like the way Echovald forest looks. The bubbles are...well, they exist. Could the bubbles in or coming from the Jade Sea? They look like bubbles underwater or in a thick medium, they aren't round. There could be some kind of substance filling the atmosphere. The prismatic effect may just be a way to make the bubbles stand out though. The new person has a royal bearing and is densely surrounded by whatever medium the bubbles are in. Perhaps there is some connection between Canthan royalty and the DSD.

> @"Fipmip.7219" said: > My point about trench warfare is not meant to be hard evidence for its viability (although such in-game evidence does exist). It is simply meant as a background for why such warfare would be cool to see at some point in the future, a method of carrying the suspension of disbelief via a 'reasonable enough' plot development in hopefully the minds of most people. The way actual warfare would be executed is not something that can be calculated outside of whatever anet decides will be the theme of the season. There is already large dichotomy in what happens between large player fights, large NPC fights and cutscenes. the world on screen is a synecdoche of the world in canon. My simple reasoning is that battlefields like those seen in verdun and passchendaele make for exciting, cinematic gameplay areas that, going by what I have outlined in the OP, would fit reasonably well. > > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > Not taking into account magic; guns, tanks, and helicopters make trench warfare obsolete. With them, we get our real world version of the ancient strategy of using forward forts and rearward support to project force with regular patrols and rapid response tactics. Guns, tanks and helicopters would make it much easier for powerful Tyrians to control, protect or threaten civilian populations. Tyria adds teleportation, wormholes, dragon mounts, etc into the bag. If we take the premise of group buffing seriously, large scale Tyrian combat would likely look similar to WvW but with real death. The winner would then overwhelm the civilians and magic poor. > > besides the point, but I'd like to point out that trenches are still used in real-world modern warfare. Battlefields like that would be interesting and would be a great way to showcase the difference between soldiers with and without magic. Stalemates or hardened front lines form when opposing forces are evenly matched. Powerful heroes could show up and move the front line. Edit: We don't see trench warfare when combatants are using mature tank, helicopter and plane technology. We only see trenches used when modern combatants are limited to small and medium arms and artillery.

> @"draxynnic.3719" said: > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > This is intended fully in the spirit of friendly competitive speculation > > > @"draxynnic.3719" said: > > > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > > > Guns are vented bombs. Make the gun itself stronger and it can use more powerful or simply more propellant. A .44 magnum is bigger than a .22 for this very reason. The material of the projectile is important, but the strength of the gun is more important. The strongest projectile possible becomes even stronger with a bigger explosion behind it. > > > > > > > > Presumably, whatever magic defenses we could give to melee, ranged can use as well. It is very hard for range not to have the advantage. The Tyrian magic system is too hand wavy to make strong predictions, but I think only the strongest users of melee magic would be relevant in Tyrian large scale warfare. It looks as though magic users channel their magical ability through their gear. I don't see why magic users couldn't learn to do the same with a tank. > > > > > > Yeah, I did note that the strength of the barrel can certainly help, through the mechanism of allowing for a larger charge behind the projectile. However, in the race between armour and firepower, better materials usually benefit armour more. > > > > > Stronger materials have more impact on the chamber where the explosion happens. Projectile strength has always led armor strength. Armor can sometimes catch up but historically, has always fallen behind. Projectiles don't have to be harder than armor and projectiles can use materials armor can not. Modern anti-tank projectiles are constructed of a depleted uranium casing with a copper core that melts and then burns through the armor. I am not sure what you are basing your logic on. > > That's... really not true. Know where the term 'bullet proof' comes from? High-quality armour was tested by firing bullets at them. The dent was the proof that the armour could stand up to the bullet - it was "bullet proofed". People have an exaggerated idea of the effect of longbows, crossbows, and even early firearms against armour, and yes, it did get to a point where the guns got powerful enough that it became increasingly impractical to wear armour that could protect against it due to the weight it would require. So armour got reduced from full suits to breastplates and helmets, and then removed altogether - but this wasn't because people COULDN'T make armour that could stop bullets (just look at Ned Kelly), just that it was so heavy it wasn't practical for battlefield use. > > Armour has always been a compromise between protection and weight/practicality. Once armoured vehicles were invented, the main thing limiting how much armour could be layered on was how much weight the engine could push along. > > In both cases, the availability of a material that's both lighter and stronger than steel is going to make a _big_ difference. In the real world, we didn't get anything better for than high-quality steel until the invention of composite armour after World War 2, a time when advanced armour piercing shells were already flying around. In Tyria... we have mithril being presented as a material which is as much of a step up from steel as steel is from bronze, while in the meantime, we have _no_ evidence that projectile technology is any more advanced than WW1 at the latest. So you've got some explosive projectiles, incendiaries, gas and the like, but armour piercing is probably still solid slugs. > > Improving the metal of the chamber would help since it allows more propellant to be used per shot without risking breaking the weapon, but you're still looking at century-old propellant and projectile designs, and when it comes to armour, the quality of the material is pretty much _the_ determining factor of how tough it is once you get past design considerations. Considering that the Kelly gang's armour worked and that was pretty crude (albeit thick and heavy), then armour made out of a material that's lighter and stronger than steel would go a long way. > > > > > When it comes to the effect of magic - however handwavy you think it is, there are certain tendencies we can observe. For instance, almost every profession has some sort of projectile destruction or, worse, reflection field - guardian has several, mesmer has a couple, elementalist has Swirling Winds, necromancer has Corrosive Poison Cloud, scrapper has Defence Field, holosmith has Photon Wall, spellbreaker has Winds of Disenchantment, revenants have Protective Solace, and thieves have their various smoke effects (which technically only make those within impossible to target rather than actually stopping the bullets)... and Seal Area. Abilities that specifically act to keep melee enemies at bay are less common, usually on professions that _already_ have access to some form of projectile hate, and can generally be more easily countered (using Stability, teleports, or some other means of getting past the magical line). So the end result seems to be that magic, on the whole, is _more_ effective at countering ranged projectiles than other attacks, including melee. > > > > > > Another thing that needs to be considered is that from the Tyrian perspective, guns are more of an equaliser than a revolutionary technology. The most advanced non-magical guns we're seeing are early gatling guns - to someone capable of tossing fireballs, lightning bolts, [rapid-fire stone projectiles](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stone_Shards), or more exotic magical attacks, this isn't actually all that impressive. Most fantasy settings present magic-users as being fairly rare in an effort to _not_ have them revolutionise how wars are fought, but if you look at most human armies that you fight* in Guild Wars... traditional medieval period soldiers such as warriors and archers are certainly the most _common,_ but you're often still looking at about half their number being spellcasters, and I'd consider most _Guild Wars_ spellcasters to be scarier than any gun-armed infantryman before the arrival of true automatic small arms (which... we don't see in GW2). So if melee troops are still viable in the period of Guild Wars 1, I don't see the invention of firearms being something that really changes that. The reason why the three legions adopted technology was that, having outcast the Flame Legion, most of their enemies overmatched them in magic and they needed to close the gap - and the Pact then found ways to combine magic with charr technology. > > > > > > *I specify 'that you fight' because ArenaNet tends to be economical with forces that you're generally not expecting to fight. The best example is comparing Ascalonian forces in most of GW1 (where you pretty much only see warriors and rangers, apart from the Flaming Sceptre) to what you see from the ghost army in GW2 or the Ascalon Army in the Annihilator mission. > > > > The magiphysics behind class skills is purposefully hand-wavy. I don't have the source but the studio has said they keep the distinction between martial and magic skills unclear so players like yourself can make up your own distinctions. We have to be careful when using class skills as a genuine description of Tyrian magi-physics. Classes are also designed for balance. > > > > So what happens when Tyrians develop new gun magic? Look what they have done with martial weapons. You seem to be relying on scenarios pitting magic enriched melee and magic poor ranged. We can use a very simple approach to our question; magic as a multiplier for a weapons platform, magic power (weapon + armor + trinkets) = total PEW or THONK. We know Tyrian magic skills change. Using the correct definition of Darwinian fitness, we should also expect magic skills to evolve. Tyrians should get more fit at using magic guns. Perhaps the potential impact of guns depends just on the difference between the bow and gun as magic poor weapon platforms. The impact of magic(guns) would eventually be huge. > > > > edit: The impact of magic(exposives) would eventually be huge as well. > > We see some examples of 'gun magic', I think. Unclear distinction or not, the graphics for deadeye attacks look like magic projectiles to me. The end result... is not clearly more powerful than the spells that spellcasters can throw normally, unless you're talking about stuff that is essentially field artillery rather than small arms. It's certainly true that ranged weapons can likely be enhanced just as melee weapons and armour can (which is probably how _bows_ manage to remain relevant), but if improved metallurgy has brought armour and melee weapons up to the point where it remains relevant in the face of firearms (and direct spellcasting, which has been around for centuries), then the effect of adding magic is just going to boost them all up equally, assuming there isn't some factor that makes some things more enchantable than others (for instance, if enchanting a striking surface is important, it might be easier to enchant a single melee weapon than to enchant every bullet or arrow you're planning to shoot). > > But you've ignored one of the important points I raised: > > > When it comes to the effect of magic - however handwavy you think it is, there are certain tendencies we can observe. For instance, almost every profession has some sort of projectile destruction or, worse, reflection field - guardian has several, mesmer has a couple, elementalist has Swirling Winds, necromancer has Corrosive Poison Cloud, scrapper has Defence Field, holosmith has Photon Wall, spellbreaker has Winds of Disenchantment, revenants have Protective Solace, and thieves have their various smoke effects (which technically only make those within impossible to target rather than actually stopping the bullets)... and Seal Area. Abilities that specifically act to keep melee enemies at bay are less common, usually on professions that _already_ have access to some form of projectile hate, and can generally be more easily countered (using Stability, teleports, or some other means of getting past the magical line). So the end result seems to be that magic, on the whole, is _more_ effective at countering ranged projectiles than other attacks, including melee. > > We can point to existing spell effects and show that the effect of magic disproportionately protects against ranged projectiles. Consider if you had a squad of Guardians armed with sword and shield. With half a dozen of them, they can chain Shield of Absorption while advancing, making them (and anyone else within or behind the dome) basically immune to projectiles... and then when they're within range, they teleport in. It's worth keeping in mind that melee DID happen in WW1 once one side got into the enemy's trenches - the hard part was getting there in the first place. > > Now, Guardians seem to be fairly uncommon... but on the other hand, NPC guardians such as Braham and Logan seem to be able to maintain SoA-like effects for longer than the player can. And that's just one weaponset on one profession. Imagine a battlefield where Walls of Reflection, Feedback bubbles, and the like are popping up all over the place (and that's just considering the actual force fields, since if we applied real life physics things like smoke screens, Corrosive Poison Cloud, and Swirling Winds would probably just make it harder to hit with bullets rather than completely stopping them), and someone can teleport right next to you from a distance comparable to your weapon's range. Suddenly, bringing a sword to a gun (and magic) fight doesn't look like such a terrible idea. > > That's probably the most impactful difference between warfare in Tyria and warfare in the real world about a century ago. In the real world, there's no equivalent to all those anti-projectile fields. The fact that Tyrians also have access to improved metallurgy and magical materials which at least offers the _chance_ of providing personal armour that is still relevant against available small arms just adds to this. Nothing is bullet-proof. At best, we can achieve bullet resistant. If you can't wear sufficiently strong armor on the battlefield then sufficiently strong armor doesn't exist on the battlefield. Your first response makes no sense. Everywhere in the real world, throughout history, projectile strength and distance always, eventually, surpasses armor. Perhaps your focus on material strength is keeping you from seeing reality. With projectiles, speed and mass are more important than hardness. Get a marshmallow going fast enough and it could destroy the Moon. Tyrian explosive technology may be in its infancy but we shouldn't expect that to last. Your assumptions about what bullets are made of are just assumptions and your focus on material is inaccurate. Why wouldn't there be mithril bullets? The last section about magical protection from projectiles is important and I didn't ignore it. I'm also not making the case that melee would be obsolete. A projectile shield is another form of armor. As projectiles become more advanced and magical, shields would have to get stronger and require more power. We are just trading power requirements for weight. We would need a lot of arbitrary rules that limit the evolution of projectile weapons and magic but somehow didn't effect melee weapons. One of the core narrative premises is that Tyrian weapon systems are becoming more powerful and combat is changing. I trust the narrative to tell me more about combat narrative then game mechanics. We've been focusing on combat between institutions and heroes. Perhaps guns would have a bigger impact on the lives of the magic poor.

Magic enriched martial classes would be extremely fit for occupation.

> @"Hypnowulf.7403" said: > I the _Rule of Wonder_ applies here, and it all comes down to how well it's implemented. > > I'm not sure if that rule actually exists, mind you! I surmise that it does. There are rules of Cool and Fun. If it does not, use TVTropes or a similar analogue and fashion your own supposition as to how a Rule of Wonder would work. > > The point is? Wonder is the dominating force. > > This is an extremely vertical tank with a lion face. How does it stay upright? Dunno! It doesn't matter, really, as the rules of another reality need not match our own. So long as _internal consistency_ is on point, anything can and will be possible because that's just more compelling to the kinds of people who enjoy these settings. In fact, at one point there was no "Fantasy" genre, there was only "Science-Fiction." The Tolkienesque perspective of separation came later. > > I know Tolkien isn't to blame for this directly as he didn't create this separation; He did, however, popularise it. Earlier settings would play around with the concepts of Fantasy and Science, often blurring the line. A truly fantastic example of this is Anne McAffrey's Dragonriders of Pern, where whether the setting is perceived as Fantasy or Science-Fiction would be down to which era you were reading about. > > Such as—caveat lector but five decades is long enough to not have to worry about spoilers, I'd think—_before or after_ they discovered that there are spaceships and that dragons are genetically engineered creatures. > > In more recent years we've seen the lines blur again as I feel most have become tired with the... _stark_ separation between the two, desiring a _merging of the realms_ if you will. (No one's going to get that reference, even were I to belabour it to say it's been a _journey_ getting here.) Hm. There have been clumsier applications of this creative amalgamation, popularising the combination of the two as though it were an original idea, and they've paved the way for stronger examples of how the genre used to be. Loathe as I am to admit it, World of Warcraft likely played a large role by... Well, ripping off Warhammer wholesale. Blizzard's always been better at marketing the stolen works of others than their original creators ever were. > > So, what does this gun do? Does it make sense? Rule of Wonder. There's probably some in-Universe explanation that doesn't have to have anything to do with ours. How did that norn leap five miles across a gorge, at such a bizarre trajectory, only to land gracefully on their feet without breaking their legs? I mean, I don't know if that's actually happened in Guild Wars as it's hyperbole, but knowing the norn it _probably_ has. > > How does this spell work? How do you summon food out of the aether? How does this gun work? Rule of Wonder. > > Guild Wars 2 has played with some interesting perspectives of this as well as there's th dark side of the Rule of Wonder. If you're playing with things you truly don't understand, it might just blow up in your face. It might just blow up into a very ornery, upset, and murderous flame elemental. I think the asura might know a thing or two about that. I'd say lately they've gotten better about their scientific practises when dealing with dangerous and poorly understood forces. > > There is a dark side to wonder indeed. I think this is represented by the torment and the tumultuous nature of magicks and magical creatures within the realm of Tyria. I mean, I would trust the norn Spirits of the Wild as far as I could throw them. Skeevy doesn't even begin to encapsulate tehir manipulative, narcissistic, and sadistic mores. > > This tumult has lead to questioning whom can be trusted where magicks are involved. I know that we all have our opinions about that! That's how it is, though, with so little understood it always invites an air of mystery and you will have to suspend your disbelief with what's possible because with warped physics and magicks in the mix there's no essentially valid comparison to be made between our reality and theirs. > > If you can shield yourself in magic and leap great distances, there's no reason not to throw yourself at a tank. If you can get a lanky tank to stand upright so that it can fit through all but the tightest of alleyways then you might as well do that too. If you can have a metallic car with giant, equally metal wheels do wheelies then _why the heck not?_ All bets are off. > > The point is is that anything we could draw from our reality probably isn't directly applicable to theirs due to the massive number of different and new variables in play. If the charr managed to figure out quantum computing due to quirks in their reality that enabled them to do it quicker than we have in ours, it can't really be questioned because—to say it again—such comparisons aren't useful. > > It's like being irate that the charr have evolved so quickly in technological fields without taking into account the differences in physics, physical reality, and magicks that's come over silly to me in the past. We can't expect things to just work the way they do in our reality. The part I find especially fun is how the Rule of Wonder applies to technology as well as magicks, much as it has in some of my favourite settings, which is always worth taking into consideration. > > How can you throw a fireball? Rule of Wonder. How can that fireball be withstood by a tank? Rule of Wonder. There's probably some material that has anti-magic properties. This is, in fact, true. Materials in Guild Wars have been shown to have either magical or anti-magical properties—ghosts cannot pass through black iron, which is precisely why the Black Citadel is made from the stuff. > > So warfare systems in our world might not be applicable. If you were to have trenches, it'd be a simple matter for an Elementalist to flood them with lava—or water! Plain old water is good too. _But then you have to consider that the charr could also probably drive one of their super-lanky all-terrain tanks down into enemy trenches as well, since it'd fit._ It's just a funny mental image, it makes me giggle, you wouldn't want to be in trenches with one of those. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if the Black Citadel can transform into the bloody Technodrome. > > I think that this is why the most applicable warfare types just seem to involve a mix of guerilla tactics and everyone just scampering off everywhere in a mad free for all because it's just chaos. That's just how it is. It's more fun that way, I think. A world where anything can happen is the only rule eventually flies up its own kitten. Suspension of disbelief isn't indestructible. It is very easy for writers to use the Rule of Wonder as an excuse for staying superficial or making the story about their own motivations. The studio has wagered a lot of suspension of disbelief with our truce with Jormag. All works build rules. I get that a fantasy mmo is an atypical genre. The Commander perspective makes atypical audience demands. The studio has built interesting great big rules. The works that push the premise that anything can happen too far stand out because audiences react poorly. It would be easy for Tyria to become too unreal. More on topic, I think the depiction of combat is realistic because it fits within implied Tyrian magiphysics. Magic, not gear, make the fighter with magic as a psycho-reactive substance. A powerful enough Guardian could take a city. Conflict above a certain threshold would likely include magic users, martial or otherwise, and their strength would decide the outcome. The most powerful magic users will decide the shape of the immediate field of combat. Not taking into account magic; guns, tanks, and helicopters make trench warfare obsolete. With them, we get our real world version of the ancient strategy of using forward forts and rearward support to project force with regular patrols and rapid response tactics. Guns, tanks and helicopters would make it much easier for powerful Tyrians to control, protect or threaten civilian populations. Tyria adds teleportation, wormholes, dragon mounts, etc into the bag. If we take the premise of group buffing seriously, large scale Tyrian combat would likely look similar to WvW but with real death. The winner would then overwhelm the civilians and magic poor. Tyria could be a dark place for the magic poor. We have seen that narrative told. I would love to see more. Magic poor would describe someone who could use magic but can't afford training or gear. We have comments from the studio implying that everyone may be able to use magic. The story told by community material drives for NPCs could be so much richer.

This is intended fully in the spirit of friendly competitive speculation > @"draxynnic.3719" said: > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > Guns are vented bombs. Make the gun itself stronger and it can use more powerful or simply more propellant. A .44 magnum is bigger than a .22 for this very reason. The material of the projectile is important, but the strength of the gun is more important. The strongest projectile possible becomes even stronger with a bigger explosion behind it. > > > > Presumably, whatever magic defenses we could give to melee, ranged can use as well. It is very hard for range not to have the advantage. The Tyrian magic system is too hand wavy to make strong predictions, but I think only the strongest users of melee magic would be relevant in Tyrian large scale warfare. It looks as though magic users channel their magical ability through their gear. I don't see why magic users couldn't learn to do the same with a tank. > > Yeah, I did note that the strength of the barrel can certainly help, through the mechanism of allowing for a larger charge behind the projectile. However, in the race between armour and firepower, better materials usually benefit armour more. > Stronger materials have more impact on the chamber where the explosion happens. Projectile strength has always led armor strength. Armor can sometimes catch up but historically, has always fallen behind. Projectiles don't have to be harder than armor and projectiles can use materials armor can not. Modern anti-tank projectiles are constructed of a depleted uranium casing with a copper core that melts and then burns through the armor. I am not sure what you are basing your logic on. > When it comes to the effect of magic - however handwavy you think it is, there are certain tendencies we can observe. For instance, almost every profession has some sort of projectile destruction or, worse, reflection field - guardian has several, mesmer has a couple, elementalist has Swirling Winds, necromancer has Corrosive Poison Cloud, scrapper has Defence Field, holosmith has Photon Wall, spellbreaker has Winds of Disenchantment, revenants have Protective Solace, and thieves have their various smoke effects (which technically only make those within impossible to target rather than actually stopping the bullets)... and Seal Area. Abilities that specifically act to keep melee enemies at bay are less common, usually on professions that _already_ have access to some form of projectile hate, and can generally be more easily countered (using Stability, teleports, or some other means of getting past the magical line). So the end result seems to be that magic, on the whole, is _more_ effective at countering ranged projectiles than other attacks, including melee. > > Another thing that needs to be considered is that from the Tyrian perspective, guns are more of an equaliser than a revolutionary technology. The most advanced non-magical guns we're seeing are early gatling guns - to someone capable of tossing fireballs, lightning bolts, [rapid-fire stone projectiles](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stone_Shards), or more exotic magical attacks, this isn't actually all that impressive. Most fantasy settings present magic-users as being fairly rare in an effort to _not_ have them revolutionise how wars are fought, but if you look at most human armies that you fight* in Guild Wars... traditional medieval period soldiers such as warriors and archers are certainly the most _common,_ but you're often still looking at about half their number being spellcasters, and I'd consider most _Guild Wars_ spellcasters to be scarier than any gun-armed infantryman before the arrival of true automatic small arms (which... we don't see in GW2). So if melee troops are still viable in the period of Guild Wars 1, I don't see the invention of firearms being something that really changes that. The reason why the three legions adopted technology was that, having outcast the Flame Legion, most of their enemies overmatched them in magic and they needed to close the gap - and the Pact then found ways to combine magic with charr technology. > > *I specify 'that you fight' because ArenaNet tends to be economical with forces that you're generally not expecting to fight. The best example is comparing Ascalonian forces in most of GW1 (where you pretty much only see warriors and rangers, apart from the Flaming Sceptre) to what you see from the ghost army in GW2 or the Ascalon Army in the Annihilator mission. The magiphysics behind class skills is purposefully hand-wavy. I don't have the source but the studio has said they keep the distinction between martial and magic skills unclear so players like yourself can make up your own distinctions. We have to be careful when using class skills as a genuine description of Tyrian magi-physics. Classes are also designed for balance. So what happens when Tyrians develop new gun magic? Look what they have done with martial weapons. You seem to be relying on scenarios pitting magic enriched melee and magic poor ranged. We can use a very simple approach to our question; magic as a multiplier for a weapons platform, magic power (weapon + armor + trinkets) = total PEW or THONK. We know Tyrian magic skills change. Using the correct definition of Darwinian fitness, we should also expect magic skills to evolve. Tyrians should get more fit at using magic guns. Perhaps the potential impact of guns depends just on the difference between the bow and gun as magic poor weapon platforms. The impact of magic(guns) would eventually be huge. edit: The impact of magic(exposives) would eventually be huge as well.

Guns are vented bombs. Make the gun itself stronger and it can use more powerful or simply more propellant. A .44 magnum is bigger than a .22 for this very reason. The material of the projectile is important, but the strength of the gun is more important. The strongest projectile possible becomes even stronger with a bigger explosion behind it. Presumably, whatever magic defenses we could give to melee, ranged can use as well. It is very hard for range not to have the advantage. The Tyrian magic system is too hand wavy to make strong predictions, but I think only the strongest users of melee magic would be relevant in Tyrian large scale warfare. It looks as though magic users channel their magical ability through their gear. I don't see why magic users couldn't learn to do the same with a tank.

Hard to critique this chapter since it hasn't been completely released yet. Many of the complaints seem directed at the pacing and the size limit it places on each section of the chapter. Those could be fair complaints if the completed chapter is thin on engaging content. This is also the studio's first attempt at an evolved, LW season 1 format. I don't know what the studio has planned but genuine, Golden Path, player story agency is possible. Imagine this tech applied to the 2 episode, one zone model. Episode one is all 1-5 person instanced slices of the map. Players earn individual and community upgrades. Player work from episode one is complied and potentially combined with voting. This information is then used to set the final form of the episode 2 map. Episodes would share a map but the second season map would have completely different events based on what players did in episode one. Depending on the number and size of episode one instanced slices, the episode 2 map would likely include parts not explored in episode 2. Arenanet, forgive me if this lands too close to your plans, but too many people are kittening on this potentially game defining content.

This content wouldn't be for everyone but I bet it is coming. I am on this stalled at the station hype train. The studio is talking about returning to a narrative design space that included a semblance of player agency. They have built a suite of technologies to engage and map individual and community work to an array of factions. With DRMs they can layer individual, group and community agency and ensure story content is never lost. I may be insane and none of you may be real, but I am still on this hype train. The roll out for the DRM tech is happening and has traits. Hopefully, the system comes together. We may have to wait for the expansion for everything to take off. Or my hype train is really a cardboard box.

The story awards Crystal Bloom crystals and there is an achievement for buying a number of Crystal Bloom supply boxes. How could the Crystal Bloom crystal vendor be removed? Will players not apace with the LW buy CB boxes by converting the current alliance currency for the common currency at a worse rate? Will each group's box be moved to the common vendor? I still have my fingers crossed about DRM evolution but the studio has a proven track record choosing "clever" over interesting or engaging. Have they planned a "clever" way to create FOMO by playing 3 card monte with arbitrary earning efficiency mechanics? Right now the narrative design premise behind community events is incoherent and looks like a "clever" attempt at herding players. There is so much potential in the combination of DRMs and community events. Hopefully, the expansion is getting the fleshed out version and we just have to be patient as we work towards it.

Hello, you can not add to community goals or earn community goals after the community event ends. I would be amazed if the vendors were removed, but who knows what the studio's plan is at this point. The Dragon Response Missions and associated vendors for our NPC allies should remain. They should be there when you reach them. If the offerings are the same for every allied vendor, we could see them get swapped out as the story progresses until all are discovered and organized as a group somehow. I can not be certain, but I think we will see more LW focused community events. You would have to skip ahead to participate and the current story is going through a significant transition. If you want to experience the story in order and earn future, one-time community rewards, you will want to catch up.

> @"just.9782" said: > Came in the forums for this. So we have to wait 2 months to get xp again in ALL icebrood maps? And then again and again 2 month wait time or no xp at all? If this is the case i ll just play older maps only so i won't lose my xp. I can see why gw2 was delayed from Steam release. It has many stuff to resolve XP is never wasted or lost. XP earned beyond what can go into a season's mastery track goes into core game xp bar. You still get spirit shards.

To understand the plan you must forget the plan. This is some 5th dimensional kitten wrangling. The community event timer makes sense if you embrace it not having to make sense.

> @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > > > So 1 item sold for 20k gold wouldn't be the equivalent to 20000 items sold for 1 gold? > > > It would be. The first part of your mistake is in assuming that this kind of equivalency is something that would actually take place. > > > > > This equivalency is always taking place. > No, it is not. When you drop a price of a commodity by half, it doesn't mean the number of buyers will double as well. The very fact that you think it is always so tells me everything i need to know about your economic knowledge and theories. This thread is like being trapped in a Twilight Zone episode. You've now side stepped to arguing against a position you previously held and are trying to crowd me from mine by distorting my position. I am glad Arenanet understands the situation.

> @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > So 1 item sold for 20k gold wouldn't be the equivalent to 20000 items sold for 1 gold? > It would be. The first part of your mistake is in assuming that this kind of equivalency is something that would actually take place. > This equivalency is always taking place. The first premise of an economy is that it describes a coherently shaped spectrum of interacting item prices, effects and effect efficiencies. Items are always fighting for demand's attention. The Super Expensive Item is Super unlikely to crowd out the demand for any other item. Are you claiming these infusions aren't selling at all? I will continue but first I must ask a general question of everyone. Currently, can Arenanet be called a AAA rated RMT agent or service provider of a player controlled trade floor? Even when playing GW2 stops being fun for me, thinking about GW2's economy continues to deliver. I am not a TP baron. Took me 2 years to afford my only expensive skin, Nightfury. What attracts me is the metaphor. The economic term general inflation describes a kinetic phenomenon, something alive _of_ time. Persistent GDP is a structure built of trades, its surface conforming to leverage effect. Persistent GDP finds time in timely trades. I need to adjust a position I took earlier, that there is finite carrying capacity at every price tier. Every demand curve describes something real to be discovered, but I can't say any demand curve is 'finite'. My model doesn't require finite demand. The market can be deconstructed to a blockchain of trades. For any length, market agents must apply leverage, compete, to include their trade. If we assign letters to items, we would see a chain grow: A,G,H,T,U,E, etc. The chain could grow at a certain rate, it would have bandwidth. The blockchain would be pulled into shape by forces such as recipes, item price, item price effect, studio and player personality. Our goals are to increase blockchain length, overall shape stability, item to item cohesion, wealth content, wealth redistribution, and item variety. For any length of blockchain, even one Super Expensive Item delivers impressive results. These items will be maximally efficient at discovering gem to gold. The gold to gem lifestyle is an essential GDP lifestyle. Market agents targeting SEIs but not gems will discover materials and value added work. These agents will have be long term and/or effective workers, leveraging all lower cost GDP essential lifestyles effectively. Follow the effect of lower gold to gem rates and we see a potential lose in general supply. SEIs create two contrasting effects on supply, defining form. We also want the blockchain to have a personality. Most of the economies bandwidth should be dedicated to more meaningful narrative. Thyrian market narrative could be so much more meaningful. I feel like it is stuck. edited for clritie All trades of quantifiable work (calorie, gold, karma) among players and the game be included in GDP shape.

> @"PseudoNewb.5468" said: > He was originally voiced to be awkward and unsure. Being a firstborn sylvari, he also never learned to socialize like other mortals do and does not express his emotions with his voice. He is a bookworm and not actually very comfortable with going out into the field, however, he is guided by the sylvari's wild hunt to do these things. > > Basically his voice matches his backstory just fine. **People just don't like that he is an awkward character.** > > And stealing glory. He never does that. He becomes the pact marshal and that is pretty much it. And he didn't even become pact marshal out of popularity. He is appointed that position exactly because he seems so aloof. He is neutral, so he brought the least complaints from the three orders. > > Some players are just paranoid. The bolded is likely the most important but unspoken reason. An awkward character dared compete for any story focus. Imo, most of the criticisms are trying to rationalize why the PC shouldn't have to compete with a weak or awkward character for attention. 20/20 is hindsight, but I would given Trahearne a skill bar that better mirrored their character. Perhaps a unique skill bar based on being a scholar/supporter and not a fighter. The voice direction for all Sylvari makes them come off as a prep school drama club which doesn't help either.

I play mostly solo and like the easy, pick up nature of GW2 group PvE. I haven't tried public DRMs but I would expect them to be faster and easier than solo. I would be shocked if they weren't. Do think the tuning for solo and group is too different or unneeded?

> @"kharmin.7683" said: > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > > @"Dawdler.8521" said: > > > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > > > Could there be any better way to put the argument over whether female armor is sexualized to rest? > > > That argument was put to rest centuries ago since male armor is sexualized. Its not until the modern age that feminists once again has been shocked to realize that the female form look different from males, they would naturally wear a different kind of sexualized armor suited for their shapes. > > > > > > I mean unless women *want* to wear a huge metal codpiece to show off their big... uh... > > > > > > I wont judge. > > > > Where can I find men's Tyrian armor that is as sexualized as women's Tyrian armor? Or are you arguing from a general statement while ignoring that the general condition doesn't map to Tyria's specific condition. You are right that women's and mens's armor would be sexualized or designed to exaggerate features, but we don't see any parity in Tyra. A large portion of female armor looks like a Broadway theatrical performance starring women's pelvises. Only a small portion of men's armor use access to flesh as a design pillar. > > Really? A large portion of female armor? What ratio? I don't see this evidenced in any of the heavy armor sets that I have. Perhaps a bit of hyperbole to make a point? What threshold would I have pass to qualify for "large portion"? There are a lot of butt capes as drawn stage curtains in light armor. Some in medium. If I look for "armor that uses access to flesh as a design pillar" I find obvious examples in heavy armor. Are you really going to argue that there is parity men's and women's armor?!?!? I play female characters and often equip them with sexualized skins. I understand and experience the attraction but I won't pretend parity exists. OP, forgive me if this seems like a high jacking. I won't continue.

> @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > > > The question should read "Why is the market wealth and market activity produced from 20000 frivolous 1 gold items and 2 frivolous 10000K gold items acceptable but 1 frivolous 20000K gold item isn't?" > Yes, that's the mistake you are making. Assuming those numbers would be equivalent. > > So 1 item sold for 20k gold wouldn't be the equivalent to 20000 items sold for 1 gold? Is this your faith based argument that we can always convert that 1, 20k item into 20000+ items at 1 gold without ever losing wealth creation, wealth redistribution and market activity? Why isn't it possible to end up selling less than 20000 items at 1gold? Your theory is that we can remove super exclusive items and retain existing total market volume, shape and coherence.

> @"Dawdler.8521" said: > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > Could there be any better way to put the argument over whether female armor is sexualized to rest? > That argument was put to rest centuries ago since male armor is sexualized. Its not until the modern age that feminists once again has been shocked to realize that the female form look different from males, they would naturally wear a different kind of sexualized armor suited for their shapes. > > I mean unless women *want* to wear a huge metal codpiece to show off their big... uh... > > I wont judge. Where can I find men's Tyrian armor that is as sexualized as women's Tyrian armor? Or are you arguing from a general statement while ignoring that the general condition doesn't map to Tyria's specific condition. You are right that women's and mens's armor would be sexualized or designed to exaggerate features, but we don't see any parity in Tyra. A large portion of female armor looks like a Broadway theatrical performance starring women's pelvises. Only a small portion of men's armor use access to flesh as a design pillar.

The rewards will have a role but I think it may be more an issue that we don't know where this content is going and therefore we don't know when to apply work. If the population of DRMs grows and we can later upgrade our allies in the DRM, why play now? If this is all there is to DRMs why play more than once? There is so much obvious future potential in DRMs and players know the potential cost of applying work to early. That is where I am. Right now the community goal and reward is simply not interesting enough. The studio is metric focused which can lead to scenarios where the playerbase and the studio are caught in a codependent stalemate. Both waiting for the other to reveal themselves.

I love the idea and the responses. I love the tailored, masculine look on women. I also love the idea of wearing what you like and reflects your personality. It would be more work to map 2 skins onto 4 rigs than 2 skins onto 2 rigs. Could there be any better way to put the argument over whether female armor is sexualized to rest?

> @"FrizzFreston.5290" said: > > @"Cuks.8241" said: > > > @"Dadnir.5038" said: > > > Sure, they could increase the taxe for the item priced above 10k to 20% then increase it to 30% for the item above 50k, then 40% for the item at 100k and above... etc. And with only 50% refund if the item is removed by the player that put it on the trading post? Wouldn't it be a lovely middle point? > > > > Except no one would use TP for high priced items than. People that deal with large sums already try to avoid TP to avoid tax. > > So why raise the cap? People already avoid it to avoid tax. > > Plus this way, everything above 10k will be ingame mail and can be easier flagged as suspicious. > > The cap is therefore not going to change. Let me see if I understand. Every Big Spender is willing to work outside the EULA and implicate themselves in Thyrian tax evasion so we should make that the only option for anything trading naturally above the trade service limit. Big Spender demand above the trade service limit can be considered suspicious. Are you implying that the studio designed the drop rates for some infusions with these ideas in mind?