RyuDragnier.9476

> @"ugrakarma.9416" said:

> d) the real fear of Jormag is Aurene? all this mess is just to setup a lure to bring Aurene into the party?

This is probably what Jormag is doing. Jormag is luring us to it, and Aurene will likely sense something is wrong and come flying at mach speeds. Jormag knows better than anybody (by being in our heads) that we don't control Aurene. We're just being used as bait to pull Aurene in for a chat, and possibly also as a "bargaining chip". Jormag puts us under its spell, agrees to let us go, if, and ONLY if, Aurene does what it wants.

> @"SidewayS.3789" said:

> What IF, the "Mother" Kralkatorrik said about its the "Steve"? Deep SEA Dragon...As we know, water represent the element of life (metaphorically speaking). Maybe DSD its the creator of all EDs, since her domain will be the biggest of all (The Unending Ocean). I mean even the devs told us that, Kralkatorrik's last word was not something random like "LuL iz ded". And let's not forget, that Kralkatorrik crashed in the ocean (along side with all those inslands brought from Domains of the Gods). Just my opinion.

I'm not so sure it's DSD. If we look at The All, the 6 ED keep the balance of Tyria in place. The questions then change...if this "Mother" is who created the ED, does that then mean that said "Mother" is the creator of Tyria itself since the ED are needed to keep Tyria alive? Is said "Mother" a giant ED? Where is said "Mother", in the Mists or elsewhere? Could said "Mother" be...the very Tyria we explore itself?

There is one thing, and only one thing at all I can think of that Jormag would want to protect us from. Something that was mentioned in only one line, but has implications. "Mother..."

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> > @"Ashen.2907" said:

> > > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > > > @"Ashen.2907" said:

> > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > > > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > > > > > @"Braile.3894" said:

> > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > > > > > > No it's not ... what is needed is not subjective. If you can play the game without items from the GS, they aren't needed and since people have done and still do that ... then you know they aren't needed.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > By your thinking you never need to buy pof because you can just play core with restrictions.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I stopped playing on characters with less bag space a while ago because it was a shore till anet introduced unidentified gear to all of Tyria.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > That's not my thinking at all. You just don't need anything from the GS to play this game, PERIOD.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You might not need some optional stuff to play the game. However, some people might need some convenience items in order for the game to be fun for them.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > And I think that's what Braile is referring to. And what people mean when they start listing off QoL items on a list of things they need.

> > > > >

> > > > > No, they might WANT some convenience items in order for the game to be fun with them. I get what he means; i'm not the one that needs to be corrected here.

> > > >

> > > > If his fun is contingent on having those items then they are a necessity for having fun. That makes them a conditional need.

> > > >

> > > > The items are NOT needed to PLAY the game, but they might be needed for an individual to ENJOY playing the game. I doubt it though as this would indicate that the person played without enjoying the game for years.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > In the case of templates we had a free alternative.

> >

> > A temporary third party option, allowed only until the official feature was implemented.

>

> Still, it existed.

An actual question from me...are there numbers on how many players used it?

I really only have a meta build and a self-made "fun" build for my characters. Don't need more than 3 slots personally.

Apothecary. I really like goofing around on a "Survivalist" build for Thief. Just healing through Signet of Malice procs, it's quite nice.

People use more than 3 builds for PvE on any class? That...blows my mind.

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> Malice for Khan-Ur. She promotes peace and hasn't actually been in a situation of her territory being surrounded by enemies like Smodur.

The problem is, she also has no experience with the other leaders of Tyria. To them she's an unknown variable, and a known spy. They will be too on guard. But Smodur as Khan-Ur, he has worked with the other leaders and met with them before, he's well known, and rather willing to do things out of the goodness of his heart (at least in the eyes of the other leaders). He can easily work with the other leaders, and Malice...can hide in the shadows nearby obtaining secrets beneficial to the Charr.

> @"perilisk.1874" said:

> > @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> > Blood Keep was said, in Guild Chat 91, to have been built as a gateway into the Shiverpeaks. I don't think it's meant to be the Blood capital or headquarters, just a major fortress that guards the northern Shiverpeaks pass.

>

> The imperator has an office there, though, just like Black Citadel.

Bangar doesn't seem like the type of Imperator to stay away from the battlefield.

> @"Loesh.4697" said:

> Joking aside, to add a bit more meat to this conversation, there is a running theme under this episode that i'd actually love to hear the developers thoughts on, because I feel like it's going to color the rest of the Icebrood Saga. In terms of Rytlock, of Crecia, and now we know even Bangar.

>

> Historical wrongs or rights aside, you can tell a lot about the health of a society based on the children that are present within it. One of the most striking things to me about humans and Charr even back as far as the core game were the differences that their parenting techniques created in the children under their care. One of the reasons why I am on the humans side in a lot of it is is because of how they treat their children and the sort of people that it tends to produce. Humans clearly have a much different perception of race relations even on at an early age, the kids in Divinity's Reach roleplay as old Ascalonian heroes but when you talk to them they are readily accepting of the fact there is a difference between the 'Bad Charr' of ages past and the good Charr now, that the worlds changed a lot and that the Charr were not a monolithically evil people In the Fields of Ruin this is different of course, a lot of people there had been fighting with Charr who had tried to kill them since early childhood, but even then there are kids like Olia in Forlorn Hope who wonder why they must fight with the Ogres. To them they see this fighting and don't always just default to killing their enemies, but try to understand the circumstances that make sharing the land impossible.

>

> Say what you will about human spirituality, but it's considerably different from the typical comparison people seem to make between Christianity and it. There is, after all, a world of difference between a Cross and an Ankh. Part of the reason I really like playing my human Guardian is it's like playing a Paladin that was into Greek Stoicism and Wicca. They are more like primordial elements of the universe that, while capable of immense cruelty as per the parables, are also capable of extreme kindness in their scriptures. Indeed the primary values of human faith are compassion, empathy, and protection. Even Balthazar, the most ruthless of the gods, had a philosophy that revolved around fighting to protect another rather then fighting for the sake of fighting.

>

> I'm not saying that religion produces objectively better children, after all one of the mist striking things you can find in Divinity's Reach is a human child who is being pressured into liking Grenth and learning about necromancy with his father dismissing it as just a phase. However what I AM saying is that spirituality can have a strong influence on what values a culture holds close to it's heart. Humans are in Guild Wars, a defensive people, and when I think of the kind of values their best teach I think of Gandalf speaking to Frodo in Moria. 'Many that live deserve death, and some that die can deserve life. Can you give it to them Frodo? do not be so eager to deal out death and judgement.' The gods themselves may fluctuate between good, evil, and somewhere inbetween, but the actual _values_ they taught their people were good.

>

> However the children of the Charr are much the opposite.

>

> Cubs in the Black Citadel would scoff at that kind of commentary, for violence and destruction are not only taught to be good things, but their wish fulfillment fantasies of enacting violence on their enemies are taught as a good thing. Exceptions may exist but by and large their children are fed on a steady diet of altered sanctioned history and a belief that only through violence can they gain respect from the people around them. In truth all it creates is fear, the same fear that Bangar Ruinbringer feels keeps them safe, fear that Shaman Ninukab points out has turned their homeland into a hellscape, fear that a cub expresses towards a Vigil soldier trying to calm them about Aurene, it's a fear of the other and it's encouraged. Children go out to the Stormcaller monument fed on such stories and wonder to their Primus why they don't kill all the humans already. Such fear is indeed, likely what drove Ajax Anvilburn to madness, he was as one of the Iron Legion soldiers say, a _coward._

>

> That's a very specific word to use to describe someone, and when I saw it I thought of all the times fear had come up in the last episode, and also how Jormag offers Bangar a way to escape his fear.

>

> That is the trap of Charr society. Humans have built a culture of vulnerability where people are encouraged to be compassionate to one another, even beyond the boundaries of race. It is why when the Skritt came to the surface of Tyria the Sylvari and humans were open to negotiating with them, where the Charr were all too happy to aid in the Asura's extermination campaign. The Charr by contrast built a society of strength, a Darwinian nightmare where only the 'strongest' live and the weak are discarded like refuse. The weak, the infirm, and elderly are consigned to huddling in farmsteads with their cattle while the youth taunt them about how they were basically sent out there to die.

>

> Real Charr are badasses, real Charr are defined by their ability to fight and kill with a completely blank emotionless expression, real Charr are also apparently defined by their deep seated insecurities of both themselves and the others around them.

>

> That I think is why I rush to humanity's defense, and why it's hard for me to believe, even in the early start of the war, that humanity was entirely at fault for what happened in Ascalon. Cultures of 'Strength' are about anything but, they are not about being strong, they are about a fear of other people, of change, of anyone controlling your destiny but you that isn't a healthy way to live. To gorge oneself of meaningless violence past the point of whats sane for no other reason then to prove your dominance and communicate it to others. Meanwhile a culture of the 'vulnerable' truly knows what it is to be strong, to confront their fears and tell others about them, to find strength in each other and hope for a better tomorrow even when the world seems nihilistic and cruel. Allowing yourself to be vulnerable is a key part to adulthood, if you never progress past that point you'll never grow up even fifty years later, you'll still be the same child terrified of the dark.

>

> Say what you will about human religion, say what you will about _religion in general_, but the spirituality and compassion taught there certainly allowed humans to raise better kids in my eyes. That was my take away from Bound by Blood.

>

Reading this, it makes it seem like Charr society is a jab at toxic masculinity and the older American mindsets. You aren't allowed to show emotion, you aren't allowed to cry, real men don't cry. Empathy and kindness are for weaklings. Born weak, are constantly sick, or old? Too bad, if you can't take care of yourself you're better off dead. We're better than you because of how we look. Etc etc. Basically outdated notions that cause harm in the long run.

> @"Ayakaru.6583" said:

> > @"Julia Nardin.9824" said:

> > I love seeing these sorts of conversations pop up on the forums! :3

> >

> > Bangar is pretty divisive, even here in the writers' room.

>

> While discussion and speculation is always nice, i have to say for anet staff to confirm or rebuke rumours, and downright spoil future content, i find highly unprofessional.

> Do with my opinion what you will, but to me it feels highly disrespectful of your own product and integrity and as dev.

> :(

I saw no spoilers for future content there, just things we already knew. That Jormag is talking to somebody. We just know now it's Bangar, nothing more. We don't know where the story will go in the future for the most part. Closing one door merely leaves dozens more still open for answers.

 

Confirming/debunking rumors/theories and speculation is not a bad thing, you see a lot of other companies do it too. One theory going around dealing with a FFXIV character was debunked by the team themselves during a Q&A a few months back.

> @"Thornwolf.9721" said:

> Im pretty sure we will loose rytlock by the end of this, not to death. But by leading his people and him becoming the next Khan-ur, which he then will basically ensure true peace between the charr and humans and enforce it. I think this is like the King arthur story they are going with, where Rytlock will have to overcome his fears and failures as a person to become stronger and since he has the sword of flame he would be the only one capable of leading. (Or some such thing.)

>

> Might be we meet the original Khan-ur's spirit and we find that rytlock is a direct descendant and that this spirit has been with rytlock all this time, guiding him and watching him to make sure he doesn't fail like the original did. The "You were born for this" role... so to speak.

I think it'd be funny (if not ironic) if he turned out to be the reincarnation of Prince Rurik.

> @"ThatOddOne.4387" said:

> It's still not even the Searing. The charr still prosecuted the war after the Searing and after they had overthrown the Flame Legion.

>

> My previous point still stands, there are no charr who really regret what charr did during the Searing and afterwards (Or go "IT WAS THE FLAME LEGION ALL THEM"), whilst there are plenty of humans who have regrets about similar atrocities that humans have committed (Even if they were not even directly involved/affected or even of the same nation).

>

> This is just the character of their race, and I don't get why people can't just accept that and instead need to find a way that the charr are somehow 'justified' in performing those atrocities, when if it was the humans they would be roundly criticised and lambasted.

>

> It's called double standards and I see it in full effect when it comes to charr and humans.

Charr are raised in a military hierarchy and given military training from a young age. The majority of their race is military minded. In the case of military history, one could look at the Searing as a major military victory due to how it allowed the Charr to get a foothold back into Ascalon (despite the destruction caused). The Charr do point out however that the Flame Legion shamans were the ones that actually did the Searing (as they were the only ones with the magic to pull it off). The Olmakhan would likely think differently of the events due to how they're more at one with nature, but nobody's asked them.

A letter alone would be nice to have every LS chapter. In the case of charr, a letter from the warband and possibly your father (if he's still alive and not imprisoned) would be nice.

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> While we have your attention, do you mind clarifying the nature of the ruins for Cathedral of Flames and The Ooze Pits? In GW1, it was never truly clarified what those structures' origins were (CoF housed spoils from Ascalon, Ooze Pits had a Grenth mural, but all dungeons used a mixture of art assets, and only the Catacombs of Kathandrax was given origin lore: dwarven). When delving through, best guess I could gather was that Cathedral of Flames was charr-made (and, alongside Rragar's Menagerie, the only stone structures of theirs). For GW2, it seems you gave them Ascalonian ruins, but it's unclear if they were built there by humans (if so, why build underground?) or ruins taken by the charr (perhaps as part of the spoils of war), or it's just a case of "generic ruins" being used (wouldn't be the first time Ascalonian ruins got used as generic ruins)?

I actually asked about the lore on Cathedral of Flames just yesterday. Doesn't seem to be much of anything on it, and I really want to know why it's there, who made it, and what was it used for (outside of the weapon depository, I mean).

> @"azzardome.9184" said:

> nerfing base thief and daredevil while deadeye is left untouched. same goes for condi drd. some real big brain balance here

Where in the patch notes has Thief and DD been touched? Wondering because I don't see it.

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> You're failing to see when humans bring up their side of the story, because you're so focused on _charr dialogue,_ as opposed to _human dialogue._

I'm starting to believe (in a joking manner) that witcher is a member of the White Mantle from how much he's going off the handle about the supposed "anti-human" sentiment he keeps seeing.

> @"Dami.5046" said:

> I just hope people get a stack of chili's when a few years down the line they will be needed and there's no cries of 'a stacks too much please nerf'

> Hearts were good for that and I actually miss them TBH.

Watch the chili be found and used in Chapter 1 as well. If we're going into such cold temperatures, we're going to need to keep warm.

> @"witcher.3197" said:

> This is not Bangar being smart and manipulative, this is Anet trying to paint Ascalonians as villains and Charr as the victims, a VERY consistent theme since 2012.

>

> Bangar's motivations and actions completely make sense even without Anet amping up the completely BS Charr victim complex. It feels like yet another unnecessary jab at people who are rooting for Ascalon.

Because Charr WERE the ones who had the lands before humans did. Balthazar commanded humanity to take the lands by force and ended up causing a long seated grudge. A grudge, btw, that Anet has constantly been pushing as something people need to get over. A Charr PC will even point out that the world has changed, and the Charr need to change with it, letting go of old grudges. Something it appears you need to do as well.

> @"Boogiepop Void.6473" said:

> Also there wasn't a lot of those being purchased. The ROI was low since you had to keep doing a certain map over and over for you to make back what you spent.

IMO that's why I never bought any of them. They were only for a single map. If they were for every map in a season, with each map providing a different selection of them, it would have been far different. But I'm not paying that much for just a single map, no LS meta has been that good.

> @"Dragon Priestess.9760" said:

> Expletives? I've not seen a single F-bomb in the entire game.

I think he's referring to a 4 letter word starting with D and ending with N. I've seen that dropped a lot, but in this day and age it's not really considered a cuss word.

As of right now, Braham. I'm really hoping this Saga gives him enough character development to make him likeable (especially after what he did in LS3, which HE WILL NEVER LIVE DOWN).

> @"Tamias.7059" said:

> [As someone on reddit has pointed out,](

"As someone on reddit has pointed out,") Bangar keeps a corrupted (by Jormag) norn artefact in his office. [Now where have we seen this before?](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Corporal_Kellach "Now where have we seen this before?")

I'm wondering where he got that artifact. A gift from Ryland during an earlier mission? Or was it something that he conveniently found a while back?

> @"Tremor.7481" said:

> > @"Arden.7480" said:

> > I think his son will be turned half Icebrood, and Rytlock will have to kill him to not let Ryland suffer, but while dealing the blow, Ryland will spread the corruption on Rytlock, and he will play it cool, but in time Rytlock will also turn icebrood, very slowly, but Sohothin will keep him alive.

>

> I suspect given Rytlock's major issues surrounding Sohothin, my theory is that it comes down to Ryland will need to wield Sohothin to keep the corruption in check; forcing Rytlock to decide between the weapon that has defined his adult life, or the son he doesn't know.

A "passing of the torch" moment? Could work, and if Rytlock ends up becoming Imperator, that leaves us with an empty slot that needs to be filled.

> @"Jokubas.4265" said:

> I don't think this has been the plan for the Deep Sea Dragon, but I think this is an absolutely amazing idea for it.

>

> Turning our seeming inability to learn anything substantial about the Deep Sea Dragon into a _plot point_ could actually work. It seems popular nowadays to attempt to canonize running gags, but it very often turns out fairly awkward. In this case, however, I think it would be within the realm of what we could accept from an Elder Dragon, that one had some ability to warp reality in ways of obscuring its identity. Perhaps it could play off the 'fear of the unknown' in a very direct sense. Certainly, having learning itself be nigh impossible would be quite the way for the Dragon to protect its weakness. It could also be an excuse to not just have asura research and technology figure everything out for us.

>

We could then have Aurene gives us answers, but have some of them obscured. A way to where she can clear things up, but not everything. Like, it exists, its at this position, and these are its powers, but anything on weaknesses, minions, champions ends up being forgotten. Make DSD powerful enough to where we understand how and why the ED can't fight each other. The powers are so great they cancel each other out to an extent.