Bast.7253

> @"Sajuuk Khar.1509" said: > > @"Bast.7253" said: > > But I imagine it's pretty hectic as it all seems last minute and unplanned. > I mean, Anet stated back in February 3rd, just after episode 2 came out, that they were planning to do this. And that wasn't presented as a recent decision either. So we are looking at around late last year they had the idea for this. Maybe! But I highly doubt this was planned as early as late last year given how soon that was after the Icebrood announcement when they insisted fairly vehemently that there was no expansion in the works. And given the random fractal addition in the same time slot as a would be episode, after over a year of not touching fractals, it feels a bit out of place. Especially as the fractal itself wasn't actually originally designed to revolve around Cantha and was redesigned after the fact with no direct correlation to the current plot. I'm also giving them the benefit of a doubt that they didn't just hype up Visions of the Past, (an actually really good story delivery method) only to have one iteration of it and then switch to a completely different format of story telling because they just... wanted to capture the essence of Season 1. Strike missions had a fair chance and I never really saw the appeal but they were significantly more engaging than this 5 man/solo instance dps golemn Response Mission content. But yes, I suppose completely changing the format and not iterating on an existing system in favor of creating something new is par for the course for Arenanet. I'm not really invested either way and am fine logging in every 2 months or so to check out the story progression so it doesn't really matter to me. Just had the feeling that little of this has been highly mapped out and wouldn't be at all surprised if that February announcement was before work/planning had even been done for this part of the Saga, or surprised if even with Season 1 in mind they still had a different idea for these releases and had to cut back even further. Who knows. It's just another 6 months anyway.

In terms of The All, would the elder dragons really suffer from Tyria exploding from an imbalance? Or would they just live through it and keep going? And now that they have access to the mists, would The All being destroyed ultimately be beneficial to them somehow? Allowing them to go wherever they want, do whatever they want? I don't know, but it seems pretty obvious Jormag is hiding something and seems extremely hellbent on eliminating Primordus. I'm just not sure if this is a ruse and they're actually in their own alliance leading us into a trap, or if it's Jormag playing a game to come out on top. As far as twists go, I'd say the biggest twist would be that Primordus and Jormag are working together to play everyone else. Given Jormag's constant push and manipulation into getting us to look badly at Aurene for not stepping in, (suspicious or not), I'm wondering if the end goal of such an alliance would be to force Aurene's hand and have Primordus and Jormag ultimately looking to eliminate Aurene as the one being that likely has the strongest chance of standing in their way. I am interested in seeing more development on the effect of the absorbed elder dragons on Primordus and Jormag though. So far we've just seen hints of things here and there but now we're down 3 elder dragons and it seems like it's probably time to start delivering on that instead of occasionally dipping into it slightly here and there. And the Braham bit was definitely interesting and will play a larger role. So they're either building up to him being a champion of Primordus, or he's being corrupted by the magic he used to ignite the bow, or his connection to the spirits somehow has given him the ability to sense elder dragons on a different level. Given that we've only witnessed it with Primordus so far, it seems like it might have more to do with Primordus either using Mordremoth's mind power (if he has that) to lead Braham to him, or he's already been tainted by Primordus and the little bit of corruption he may have is starting to take hold. Only time will tell, but I'd imagine the story will involve a lot more action in the coming months than just Charr 1 bickering with Charr 2, which is a relief for me.

I had a random thought about the bow. In the Vision of the Past we saw all of the stone dwarves being corrupted by Primordus. What if the jotun scroll was actually infused with Primordus' power, thus why it was able to harm Jormag, and it's started to slowly corrupt Braham? It is weird that they made a note of it but the only other thing I can think of is his stronger bond to the spirits. Perhaps this is leading into the spirits having a much stronger tie-in to the origin of the elder dragons and his connection is allowing him to sense them? I had a half-baked low effort theory about Primordus being the Spirit of Fire that went rampaging, but given that Jormag is the twin I'm not really sure what that could mean for what Jormag's part would be in this in relation to the original spirits and Koda. Frankly though, I'd say we're pretty much done with the spirits at this point so I'm leaning more towards the bow theory than his connection to the spirits. But yes, you could be right. The next episode is called "Power" or something isn't it? Perhaps that power is Braham, vehemently arguing against siding with Jormag, deciding to attempt negotiations with Primordus and leading down the path of becoming its champion. I just find it a little less likely because Primordus hasn't really had any build up in terms of character development or personality... He just seems like a flaming rage monster.

I think it's pretty obvious they've shifted the vast majority of the studio over to the expansion. It does make me wonder how many people they still have working specifically on Guild Wars 2 though, or have had for awhile that they have to ship the remaining people working on the live game over to it. But I imagine it's pretty hectic as it all seems last minute and unplanned. As far as this episode, I set my expectations extremely low and and to be honest it was alright for what I was expecting. The story instances were alright. They added some dialogue to touch on a few things we've been wondering about in terms of lore like the pale tree, touching on the dead elder dragon's magics effects on Primordus. They brought back a few people like Taimi and Gorrik which was nice. Story-wise, it was a decent little play through even if it wasn't overly exciting but it's nice to get a break from the Charr story. I think one bad thing about the saga in general right now is that every episode is just Jormag being vague about everything. It's good for build up, but at some point it feels like we're going to be on the last episode and something will happen and it still won't really be that impactful because it's had TOO MUCH build, like snails pace constant dialogue kind of build up. In general, it's pretty much what I expected though and I've pretty much stuck with logging in on release days and then disappearing till the next. It's honestly more enjoyable that way and I think it helped me appreciate this patch more. In terms of development time and the resources that went into making it? I don't know. I mean, I'm pretty content with the 2 hours it took me to do these missions and story content until the next content drop and will probably never replay it again. So if there's a lot of people with the same mindset then it's probably not the best type of content they could have released. But some of that could be mitigated in the future with more appealing rewards to grind for, like a new armor set, a strike mission tossed in. As far as the Response Missions - not something I would repeat more than the first play through in the story. Long, relatively boring, rewards are laughable as usual. No interest in any of the recolored weapon sets or the new axe skin when I'll wind up replacing them all with near-legendary gemstore skins or actual legendary skins at some point anyway. Still not really sure what the point of the allied faction stuff is but no real desire to find out as I've done the story and don't plan on replaying the missions. To those of you that are disappointed, yes, I get it. It's pretty dull, but they're fully committing to the expansion and the only thing you can really do is play the new releases if you're interested for the story and then take a break till the next and quell your expectations until the expansion drops. I probably won't replay the older episodes either despite it being refreshing having voice acting again. I think a lot of us are kind of just ready to put this whole "Saga" behind us. :lol: Honestly though, I would almost prefer a watered down vision of the past than this, but I guess that would take environment artists and more people that they have left working on the live game so it is what it is. I think if you approach it from a state of complete apathy and just accept that the studio seems to be in a perpetual state of chaos (increasingly more so over the past 2 years) you'll find a lot more enjoyment. They probably had like 2 or 3 people working on this which is pretty impressive even if the content itself isn't overly exciting.

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said: > > @"Plagiarised.2865" said: > > Do we know specifically that four are needed? Aurene is "special" and all that. I know you don't like it as lazy writing, but I feel its just as possible. We just don't know enough about The All. Or that The All and the balance of magic are, at least, related. After all, Sadizi says > > Aurene is able to handle conflicting magic, which would otherwise result in Torment. Sadizi never mentions or hints about Torment. > > Sadizi talks about the balance of The All, and according to Taimi's research, a bare minimum of four are needed. And as we saw in Season 3, even though Zhaitan's and Mordremoth's magic and domains have been taken over by Primordus and Kralkatorrik, their spheres in The All remained dormant and inert. > > Aurene could theoretically absorb all the magic in the world and potentially be fine. But all evidence so far tells us that she cannot balance The All alone. And it's be foolish to give it a test run, in all honesty. > > "Yeah, I think Aurene can handle absorbing another Elder Dragons' power. She's immortal and magic doesn't conflict in her!" *-kills an Elder Dragon-* "Oh god the world's crumbling even though Aurene ate all of that dragon's magic and isn't suffering from Torment!" > > Not the kind of risk anyone with common sense would take. Canach may make a gamble about the world's fate as a third party, but even he wouldn't perform an act he is aware might cause the world's destruction if it doesn't work out. > > > > "Only then will the balance of magic truly become stable. Only then will Glint's legacy achieve its ultimate purpose." > > > > Or why there are six Elder Dragons specifically. We don't know exactly what caused the void, or the balance of The All. Does the system break down and collapse when there is not enough entities specifically? Or is it about how an entity acts within the system. Why would they keep talking about sharing the magic rather than hoard it? Or making it clear that Aurene is "one that can act as a kind of prism, separating and recombining all the magics in the spectrum." > > > > I'm just saying its possible that Aurene would be it. It is hokey and "she did because she is special!" feeling. But it is possible. > > There are six Elder Dragons - besides writer desires - because there are six Spheres in The All. > > As per Season 2: the Spheres are **NOT** the Elder Dragons themselves, but rather the Elder Dragons are directly tied to these spheres which represent some unstudied cosmic power. Some norn scholars think them to be spirit realms, jotuns called them stars, it's unclear. > > We do know what caused the void, btw - the death of Zhaitan and Mordremoth is what's being referred to. **WE** caused that void and caused the system to begin breaking down. So yes, it does break down and collapse when there are not enough entities. > > Sadizi's speech is a little weird because he jumps from past to present to past again. I believe in the Dragonfall release guild chat they hinted at Aurene's ability to handle conflicting magic potentially being temporary anyway. So, even if she does hold all of the magic, ignoring The All, I'd have to think based on that hint that the original plan (if it hasn't changed by now to quickly brush through the elder dragon plot) that Aurene was never meant to be the be all and end all of our dragon problem. Personally, while this would probably be difficult to pull off eloquently when the typical releases seemingly 2 episodes of mild build up with everything culminating in an explosive third, I could see them branching into the torment affecting her in subtle ways sooner than we might expect. Of course there wouldn't be time to fit that much character development in a 30 minute story chapter, but given Jormag's last dialogue in the Bangar achievement about Aurene not getting involved with Jormag and Primordus, insisting that Jormag just kill Primordus theirself, it makes me wonder if we aren't starting to see some of that torment/greed seeping in. I mean, it's possible that she just didn't want to interfere and has undoubtedly changed since ascension, but it seems like a bit of a shift of perspective. In all likelihood, the effects of losing another dragon and tipping the balance further will have been drastically overstated and while Tyria may face some devastating effects in the short term it may be more gradual than immediate destruction. Giving them time to show the effects during the playthrough and following season of Cantha.

More on the topic of Aurene, the only way I can see her being the sole carrier of that magic is if she's able to rapidly produce scions and can gift those domains and that magic to those scions. Perhaps that's her plan in the long run. And again, that could be either be torment causing her to want to have complete control over those domains and that magic or just be instinctive and presumably protective, believing that HER children are the only ones capable of doing what needs to be done. And to be honest, she does look like she's roosting in a nest in Eye of the North. Probably reading more into it than I should, but it could be another reason why she's less interested in getting directly involved in the war between Jormag and Primordus. I know it's early and she just ascended, and we don't really know anything about dragon reproduction, but it wouldn't surprise me to have a reveal that she's popped out a few eggs.

> @"Laila Lightness.8742" said: > Jormags nature is opposed to destruction tho as it us the elder dragon of ice and persuasion how can jormag. And the fact primordius is hostile to most life . So i guess out of the ed s jormag is the least hostile Maybe, but I'd also like to think that Jormag's strength comes from cunning and playing the long game like a GRRM character. It may be just as hostile as the rest, but knows that relying on brute force isn't going to result in anything but unwanted attention and creating enemies that are more useful in the long run as friends. With each introduction of Elder Dragon we've learned more and more. Our understanding of them has evolved and they've become increasingly complicated beings. But they presumably all suffer the same affliction, aside from Aurene who has just begun. If Primordus and Jormag are "twins" we can assume that they're the same age. As Primordus is usually the first to awaken it's assumed that he's always been the older, more powerful one. Which would lead me to believe the affliction would be just as strong with them as it was Kralk, if not stronger. Either way, I don't think trusting any of the pre-Aurene elder dragons is in anyone's best interest.

> @"Plagiarised.2865" said: > > @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said: Though I only see the later happening if they forego the whole need to have multiple replacements for the Elder Dragons (which is what will upset me). > > I see you bring this up a lot, Konig, but I still feel like they can make Aurene the sole Elder Dragon. If she circulates and shares magic rather than hoard it? > They could I suppose but it would go against a lot of what's already been established. 1.) Kralk went more and more mad the more magic he absorbed that wasn't natural to him. Aurene may be "special" but is she special enough to hold all of that? Say we kill off every elder dragon but her, that's Balthazar plus 5 other elder dragons magic she would be holding onto. Even if she somehow was able to "purify" it and give some off to the lesser races that's A LOT of magic she's giving away to the lesser races that they may not even be able to handle themselves without going insane. 2.) The domains that she's absorbed and her tie to the all. Can an elder dragon survive being connected to all 6 domains? Because it's not like she can pass off her connection to those domains to the lesser races. I think long term if she remained at her current level, she would probably be fine for eons. But I'd imagine the death of just one more elder dragon may be the tipping point to lead her down the same path as the others, thus why we go to Cantha. One thing that bothers me is that they haven't really dealt with the current potential candidates for replacements, like the Pale Tree. While I think this is mostly because of Arenanet keeping the plot moving in one-direction, if we wanted to toss out speculation on in-game character motives... is Aurene not pursuing that because she feels she's fine handling things the way they are? Or have the effects of the magic already taken toll and she's secretly not desiring to find replacements because the torment has begun and she's wanting to hoard as much as she can? If you look at the latest Bangar dialogue Jormag calls Aurene out on not interfering with Jormag and Primordus and leaving it to the mortals because there was "nothing to gain." Personally, I found this strange because before she ascended she would have likely jumped at the chance to defend the commander and others from a potential elder dragon threat. At least in my opinion. You could argue that there was nothing to gain because she knew killing them would create an imbalance, but her next line was pretty much "So you kill him then." Which shows that the death of them is obviously not a concern to Aurene. She just didn't want to get involved herself, and I have to wonder what the motive for that is. I do like the theory that someone tossed out implying that Jormag and Primordus are working together though. To me that makes sense because they're each other's weakness. They fought in the past and it seemed like it resulted in a pretty bloody battle. Who knows what shape Primordus was in after that. Was Jormag the only one injured or was Primordus injured as well? Leading them both to realize that they're better off in an alliance than as enemies? If all the others die and they are able to take over Tyria, they could potentially share Tyria in cycles as originally intended knowing that they have no equals. This goes against the torment and insanity bit but up until Primordus and Jormag we haven't really seen two elder dragons warring with one another. Potentially hundreds of thousands of years and they've seemingly been content finding their own corner of the world. What's so different now? And with presumably all of the remaining dragons having access to mist travel now, why are seemingly none of the remaining as interested in consuming the mists as Kralk was?