Anet, you want to destroy the PUG raiding or what?!

[Henry.5713]

> @LordOtto.2650 said:

> > @Henry.5713 said:

> > I kind of wonder why anyone would expect pugs to be able to perform the "greens" perfectly so soon after the release. And why would anyone who has already killed Dhuum and therefor has mastered the mechanics have to pug it now outside of some rare cases? Just give it time. People have claimed the "Boss X will never be pugable" before. It never happened and will not happen with Dhuum either. I am pretty happy bosses are being designed around mechanics rather than simple tank and spank.

> > One of my favorites now even after I spend five hours kiting Messengers only.

> > All though, I am not surprised to see the regular doomsayers jump on this topic. I remember someone who claimed that the game already died back in 2012 thus nobody should bother to play it. Wonder why all of us bother to play a dead game.

>

> So you are saying you kite it, I can kite it too, then who will do the greens? Few elite floating experts?! So the LFG will be 7 friends, and 3 green floating expert! How I now see it on LFG, every time they need 1-2 person (greens)! So you should make a research on it!

> Please go and do greens for 3 hours or more, please just try it in a PUG!

 

It was a joke about me liking the boss even when I had the most boring job. Nevermind though, sarcasm, jokes and simple reasoning seem to be lost on you.

Simply put, don't join a group looking for a "green floating expert" if you aren't one as silly as it maybe be to expect pugs to know the mechanic that well. Anyone is free to advertise for any person they see fit. You are not required to know a role to ask for such a person. Raids aren't dying, pugs aren't all mean assholes. You are just upset that the only spot they have is the one you do not fit. That is all there is to it.

[LordOtto.2650]

Ok, let's see after 1 month! I hope I'm wrong, I just will do it with guild, hope the majority of the PUG players will do it, and like it! I just hope that! I will kite, heal, dps, and let other people, that like that mechanic.

Wish you all luck, hope you all kill it!

[Cynn.1659]

> @LordOtto.2650 said:

> Ok, let's see after 1 month! I hope I'm wrong, I just will do it with guild, hope the majority of the PUG players will do it, and like it! I just hope that! I will kite, heal, dps, and let other people, that like that mechanic.

> Wish you all luck, hope you all kill it!

 

Already did it with pugs twice, it's not even hard. As long as you don't have any leechers that don't want to improve.

[LordOtto.2650]

Of course it's not hard besides the green mech! You just need 3-4 floating expert, and it's not hard! What is improving on a non skill based floating object?! Tell me?!

[Xillllix.3485]

Difficulty settings would solve all that shit.

[STIHL.2489]

> @Coulter.2315 said:

> > @STIHL.2489 said:

> > > @kiranslee.4829 said:

> > > Pps.

> > > I think in time anet wil realize how badly this will affect them. I know at least one other company who had to change from this path ;-)

> >

> > Tanking bets... it' after it's done irreparable damage to their brand.

> >

>

> Their brand's integrity requires raids to be pugged by people who are bad at the mechanics within a week? I don't think GW2 was advertised this way.

 

It was originally advertised as a play the way you like, a very casual easy going MMO, striving to break the mold of traditional MMO's, where players were not forced to group to have fun, now they are moving towards more Riads and thus hurdling people into small static groups.

 

yah.. doing that kind of flop around.. can kill your brand.

[Cerioth.7062]

How exactly is it going to affect your day if you skip this raid since you are not willing to put in the effort to clear it? That's what us raiders like - content that you have t learn together with people and practice it to become good. Pugs havent had the time for that yet.

[Andred.1087]

> @LordOtto.2650 said:

> Let me tell you a story, most of the people can't afford the time for guild clears, because they jsut simply go home, have 3 hours to play, they do it with different people! Those are like the 90% of the raid player base!

 

Aside from you just blatantly making that statistic up to support your argument, how exactly is it more time-efficient to not join a guild and have a reliable group of people to raid with? Pugging takes longer almost every time, because you will inevitably get somebody who just doesn't know what to do, or doesn't care enough to learn.

 

There are plenty of guilds advertising for recruitment *right now* in the LFGuild forum that do raids, surely you can find a group that will try to work with whatever schedule you have. If you aren't interested in making that effort to find a solid group, that's your own problem.

 

[Chris McSwag.4683]

Your inability to learn quickly or failure to find people that accept that you are learning is not the same as anet wanting to destroy pug raiding. It’s all about experience. It takes a few tries to learn how to do the greens and by which time you need to be at a spot, but it really isn’t that complex. Pugs have killed dhuum, and with time it won’t be worse to pug than any other end boss.

 

[Murdock.6547]

This thread is absolute nonsense.

[miku.3025]

How can this thread be absolutely nonsense? every comment in relation to raids are relevant even complaints or people who show frustration they are to be acknowledge too.. this guy isn't alone, many are experiencing the same. nevertheless for saying this, the new raid wings is by far the most fun wing i have ever played. just give it a bit of time.

[Chris McSwag.4683]

> @miku.3025 said:

> How can this thread be absolutely nonsense? every comment in relation to raids are relevant even complaints or people who show frustration they are to be acknowledge too.. this guy isn't alone, many are experiencing the same. nevertheless for saying this, the new raid wings is by far the most fun wing i have ever played.

 

Because it’s a poorly written rant about not being able to successfully do mechanics, which somehow is anets sinister plan to eliminate raid pugs?

 

[Miellyn.6847]

> @STIHL.2489 said:

> > @Coulter.2315 said:

> > > @STIHL.2489 said:

> > > > @kiranslee.4829 said:

> > > > Pps.

> > > > I think in time anet wil realize how badly this will affect them. I know at least one other company who had to change from this path ;-)

> > >

> > > Tanking bets... it' after it's done irreparable damage to their brand.

> > >

> >

> > Their brand's integrity requires raids to be pugged by people who are bad at the mechanics within a week? I don't think GW2 was advertised this way.

>

> It was originally advertised as a play the way you like, a very casual easy going MMO, striving to break the mold of traditional MMO's, where players were not forced to group to have fun, now they are moving towards more Riads and thus hurdling people into small static groups.

>

> yah.. doing that kind of flop around.. can kill your brand.

 

No, that statement always stopped at instanced content. You could never complete all dungeons and fractals with random builds, random stats and random players. You always needed some coordination and planned builds. It was also never true for GW1. Open world is still very casual as it was since release.

Play how you want and succeed at everything and get everything was never the trademark of GuildWars. It appeared when people needed an argument to justify their entitlement to get everything they want.

[zealex.9410]

> @Cynn.1659 said:

> > @LordOtto.2650 said:

> > Ok, let's see after 1 month! I hope I'm wrong, I just will do it with guild, hope the majority of the PUG players will do it, and like it! I just hope that! I will kite, heal, dps, and let other people, that like that mechanic.

> > Wish you all luck, hope you all kill it!

>

> Already did it with pugs twice, it's not even hard. As long as you don't have any leechers that don't want to improve.

 

Already did it with pug eh? :3

[Umut.5471]

Raids are made to make an economy around people's desire to get a legendary armor.

Solution is making raids bound to difficulty levels just like fractals. Make the easier ones enough to complete legendary armor collection.

So people who don't like raids can just complete easier levels then forget about raids after they get their armor.

With that, give people very good rewards for doing higher difficulty tiers, so dedicated raid community can do high tiers, farm them and

get better rewards than those people who do low levels.

That would make everyone happy. Otherwise I'm not paying 1k to those opportunists who sell raids, those armor skins don't deserve that cost.

[Genesis.5169]

> @Umut.5471 said:

> Raids are made to make an economy around people's desire to get a legendary armor.

> Solution is making raids bound to difficulty levels just like fractals. Make the easier ones enough to complete legendary armor collection.

> So people who don't like raids can just complete easier levels then forget about raids after they get their armor.

> With that, give people very good rewards for doing higher difficulty tiers, so dedicated raid community can do high tiers, farm them and

> get better rewards than those people who do low levels.

> That would make everyone happy. Otherwise I'm not paying 1k to those opportunists who sell raids, those armor skins don't deserve that cost.

 

People will just complain that they can't do the harder content like they do in every mmo.

[STIHL.2489]

> @Miellyn.6847 said:

> > @STIHL.2489 said:

> > > @Coulter.2315 said:

> > > > @STIHL.2489 said:

> > > > > @kiranslee.4829 said:

> > > > > Pps.

> > > > > I think in time anet wil realize how badly this will affect them. I know at least one other company who had to change from this path ;-)

> > > >

> > > > Tanking bets... it' after it's done irreparable damage to their brand.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Their brand's integrity requires raids to be pugged by people who are bad at the mechanics within a week? I don't think GW2 was advertised this way.

> >

> > It was originally advertised as a play the way you like, a very casual easy going MMO, striving to break the mold of traditional MMO's, where players were not forced to group to have fun, now they are moving towards more Riads and thus hurdling people into small static groups.

> >

> > yah.. doing that kind of flop around.. can kill your brand.

>

> No, that statement always stopped at instanced content. You could never complete all dungeons and fractals with random builds, random stats and random players. You always needed some coordination and planned builds. It was also never true for GW1. Open world is still very casual as it was since release.

> Play how you want and succeed at everything and get everything was never the trademark of GuildWars. It appeared when people needed an argument to justify their entitlement to get everything they want.

 

LOL, sure you could do dungeons.. storymode was a joke, and could be done at level in yellow and white.

 

Fractals came later, with them came the introduction of Ascended and gear grind.. which was a serious break from their original design manifesto.

 

HoT, with their maze of Open Word and Raid with their introduction of "roles" .. talk about a nail in the coffin.

 

Anyway.. Yah.. believe what you want.. The damage is being done. The trust is being broken.

[Amineo.8951]

I just want the death of Chronomancer so we can finally have fun, there are so many bad players claiming to be good when they got carried by the Chronos and the healers...

 

It's time to nerf it Anet, it's too overpowered in all game modes.

[Jojo.6140]

> @Amineo.8951 said:

> I just want the death of Chronomancer so we can finally have fun, there are so many bad players claiming to be good when they got carried by the Chronos and the healers...

>

> It's time to nerf it Anet, it's too overpowered in all game modes.

 

As a mesmer main in this game i stopped playing this class in instanced content mainly because of this whole "pls do 90% of the mechanics for us, kthx" attitude and geared a dps-class for raids and fractals. I think it would be a good start if they would remove the ability to share distortion with the group, so that everyone has to pay attention to incoming attacks.

[Amineo.8951]

> @Jojo.6140 said:

> > @Amineo.8951 said:

> > I just want the death of Chronomancer so we can finally have fun, there are so many bad players claiming to be good when they got carried by the Chronos and the healers...

> >

> > It's time to nerf it Anet, it's too overpowered in all game modes.

>

> As a mesmer main in this game i stopped playing this class in instanced content mainly because of this whole "pls do 90% of the mechanics for us, kthx" attitude and geared a dps-class for raids and fractals. I think it would be a good start if they would remove the ability to share distortion with the group, so that everyone has to pay attention to incoming attacks.

 

I got burned out after playing too much Chronomancer in raids and fractals, it was just not fun and I'm glad I made the Heavy Legendary Set instead of the Light one, Firebrand is so much more fun to play as a support but people prefer to get carried by a Druid or Chrono instead so I get to play Dragonhunter most of the time which is sad...

[Cyninja.2954]

> @Amineo.8951 said:

> > @Jojo.6140 said:

> > > @Amineo.8951 said:

> > > I just want the death of Chronomancer so we can finally have fun, there are so many bad players claiming to be good when they got carried by the Chronos and the healers...

> > >

> > > It's time to nerf it Anet, it's too overpowered in all game modes.

> >

> > As a mesmer main in this game i stopped playing this class in instanced content mainly because of this whole "pls do 90% of the mechanics for us, kthx" attitude and geared a dps-class for raids and fractals. I think it would be a good start if they would remove the ability to share distortion with the group, so that everyone has to pay attention to incoming attacks.

>

> I got burned out after playing too much Chronomancer in raids and fractals, it was just not fun and I'm glad I made the Heavy Legendary Set instead of the Light one, Firebrand is so much more fun to play as a support but people prefer to get carried by a Druid or Chrono instead so I get to play Dragonhunter most of the time which is sad...

 

As a mesmer main I get where you are coming from. I'm just not sure I agree that basically destroying the entire meta just so some people like yourself can have "fun" is the way to go. No matter how you change the meta, there will always be some classes and especially roles which will have to do more.

 

The difficulty is already at a point where we get enough negative attention, not sure I'd want to up this even more with putting even more pressure on the composition.

 

I could kind of see them changing chrono to affect 10 people (similar to druid) just so they remove the necessity for 2 chronos. The druid and might change on warriors last patch made the entire raid composition more flexible (while again making content easier).

[Wandering Mist.2973]

> @Jojo.6140 said:

> > @Amineo.8951 said:

> > I just want the death of Chronomancer so we can finally have fun, there are so many bad players claiming to be good when they got carried by the Chronos and the healers...

> >

> > It's time to nerf it Anet, it's too overpowered in all game modes.

>

> As a mesmer main in this game i stopped playing this class in instanced content mainly because of this whole "pls do 90% of the mechanics for us, kthx" attitude and geared a dps-class for raids and fractals. I think it would be a good start if they would remove the ability to share distortion with the group, so that everyone has to pay attention to incoming attacks.

 

It's a good point, and I too would welcome removal of distortion sharing. You could literally keep the rest of the build the same amd just remove distortion sharing from the inspiration tree. This wouldn't even be a nerf to chronomancers in general because they would be able to take something other than inspiration, which is useless aside from distortion sharing.

 

It would be interesting to see how much harder the raid bosses are when you can't just flat out negate certain mechanics.

[Magnus Godrik.5841]

This conversation always pops up when a new raid is introduced. Make your own learning group.

[Chris McSwag.4683]

> @"Wandering Mist.2973" said:

> > @Jojo.6140 said:

> > > @Amineo.8951 said:

> > > I just want the death of Chronomancer so we can finally have fun, there are so many bad players claiming to be good when they got carried by the Chronos and the healers...

> > >

> > > It's time to nerf it Anet, it's too overpowered in all game modes.

> >

> > As a mesmer main in this game i stopped playing this class in instanced content mainly because of this whole "pls do 90% of the mechanics for us, kthx" attitude and geared a dps-class for raids and fractals. I think it would be a good start if they would remove the ability to share distortion with the group, so that everyone has to pay attention to incoming attacks.

>

> It's a good point, and I too would welcome removal of distortion sharing. You could literally keep the rest of the build the same amd just remove distortion sharing from the inspiration tree. This wouldn't even be a nerf to chronomancers in general because they would be able to take something other than inspiration, which is useless aside from distortion sharing.

>

> It would be interesting to see how much harder the raid bosses are when you can't just flat out negate certain mechanics.

 

Inspiration is not useless apart from distortion sharing. The extra signet share helps greatly with quickness uptime(since you don’t want to use time warp on a multitude of bosses), focus cd or reflects, the minor team cleanse on heal is good for sloth etc etc. Inspiration is useless in terms of dps, but for utility it is very strong.

 

[Eramonster.2718]

Not trying to be rude here but I don't get why turn the blames.

Firstly LordOtto, the problem youre facing being kicked because of inexperienced is not the Anets fault. If one is not familiar with the mechanic, kindly inform the PuG leader to get another player w exp to handle the role. If youre still removed after being forced to take it, the fault lies w the PuG leader.

Second, yes raid did made some big changes to the game but is it really all bad? Raid is the one pve content that is actually making players to reach out and make guilds meant something. I had friends playing and besides raids, its practically SoloWar Farming game hours and hours doing the same meta events to farm gold is a job not a game. Theres so little player interactions in game compared other mmo's(Don't get me wrong the players in gw2 is friendly, kind, helpfull and lesser jerks compared to other mmo but when is the last time anyone talked or bothered try to make friends?)

Third, METAs. I agree some classes do perform better in certain situations, promoting better success rates with them. But raids is group effort and metas aint dead set. You can play a class the way you want and work together the combination to have it work to have a good success rate. Why try to be others, when you're best at being yourself? If anyone said having a mesmer to tank back before it was popular(even you might have doubted or questioned it during your first time) what changed was you seen it worked and its widely used, this does not mean theres no other class to tank.