Wintersday Balance Update: Feedback Thread

[viquing.8254]

@all cry about mesmer op, just three questions :

- How many mesmers did you see in top tier pvp (let say 250 as we can see the names) ?

- On top tier pvp mesmers, how many are playing axe ?

- Ok if you stay as pole, you can got 30 confu stacks, done by ultra telegraphied skills. What bout 30 unrealistic confusions stacks in1 sec versus 8-10 k damages done on shorter coldown on many other professions ?

 

------

 

>Inspiring Distortion: This trait now grants 5 seconds of aegis instead of 1 second of distortion.

Some people around me shearch why this change was done.

Is it because of PVE to add more diversity in raid compositions ?

Or because of a side effect on PVP, WvW ?

 

>Chaos Vortex: This skill now attempts to face the selected target before firing when it's targeted on foes beside or behind the caster.

Nice QoL.

 

> Ether Clone: Torment duration has been adjusted from 2 stacks for 5 seconds to 1 stack for 9 seconds.

On Patch line.

 

>Portal Exeunt: This skill now performs a range check before activating to prevent unusable portals from being created.

**Very nice QoL !**

 

>Arcane Thievery: In addition to its previous effects, successfully hitting a target now inflicts slow on the target for 4 seconds while granting quickness to the mesmer for the same duration.

Hard to choose in PvP because of ulititary slots needed for mobility/portal/sustain.

Can produce good directs bursts with chrono and slow traits.

 

>Mantra of Resolve: This skill no longer grants resistance when fully charged. Instead, it now removes all conditions.

The strongest dispell skill in the game ?

 

> Other mantras changes.

Ok they are up, probably because they aren't used.

But the main problem with mantras isn't their usefulness (ok it's a little about it ;) .) but the fact that we are free-kill during casting times (think about random CC and random aoe dammage.).

The things that hurt me really hard during the last big mantra's review wasn't the 3rd charge lost but the +600 toughness lost in a PvP/WvW context.

Also if one day we can get back the synergy with centaur's runes who proc on Mantra of Recovery incantation, it would be really great !

 

> Tides of Time: Improved the consistency of the returning wave in situations where the outgoing wave impacts walls or terrain.

Haven't tested it much yet but probably nice QoL.

 

>Imaginary Axes: Increased the confusion stacks applied by the player from 2 to 3. Increased the duration of confusion stacks applied by both the player and clones from 4 seconds to 5 seconds.

>Phantasmal Seeking Axe: Increased torment duration from 3 seconds to 4.5 seconds.

Probably up because not many people used axe in PvP/WvW (personnal view) due to the facts that :

- axe attacks are easily predictable.

- other weapon better fit the game mode.

 

 

 

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

> @"viquing.8254" said:

> @all cry about mesmer op, just three questions :

> - How many mesmers did you see in top tier pvp (let say 250 as we can see the names) ?

> - On top tier pvp mesmers, how many are playing axe ?

> - Ok if you stay as pole, you can got 30 confu stacks, done by ultra telegraphied skills. What bout 30 unrealistic confusions stacks in1 sec versus 8-10 k damages done on shorter coldown on many other professions ?

 

I shall reply from a WvW viewpoint, because thats what i play.

 

1) I see them roaming a LOT. See them more than any other class at the moment. Most of them being Mirage, a few Chrono and a few base Mesmer. They are in groups, they are in zergs. They are in Solo. They are VERY strong in WvW

 

2) Most of them. It does have its issue, personally i tried Axe and hated it, but theres been very few i have seen roaming that dont have Axe. Hard to say for Zergs, because most just switch to their ranged weapon and spam away. But in Solo most i have seen run Axe.

 

3) You get them from Ranged skills, you get them from melee skills, you get them from traits, Utilities, Even their elite. They have FAR too much access to confusion for it to be a burst. Because a burst signifies down time. There is no down time to constant, never ending application. If they need to have high burst, fine. They would need a HEAVY reduction on how they apply it. They shouldnt be able to have Burst application AND sustained application. It SHOULD be Burst or Sustained. Not both.

 

This is again from WvW viewpoint, so might be different for sPvP. Though from what i have read, it seems like they are also broken there as well. Though it seems funny that most (all?) those that are trying to defend them are those that play them....

[viquing.8254]

Dis you ever defend a class you didn't play ? ;)

And your point of view about WvW is detailled but I think that you see many mirages in WvW much because of their mobility than their condi burst, maybe i'm wrong.

[Chokolata.1870]

Hi Irenio!

 

Thank you for the opportunity to express our thoughts on balance in this manner.

 

I would just like to express a few thoughts on the balance changes in this patch and a few things that have been bugging me for a while regarding balance/design of some of Ranger's Core traits and abilities.

 

Throw torch (Torch 4)

- I am fully aware that the goal of this patch was to limit burst conditional application, however with this skill now applying 1 stack of burning perhaps adding another perk to it could be a solid idea? Perhaps a daze or a knock back?

 

Hornets sting/Monarch leap (Sword 2)

- Hornets sting seems rather unreliable due to its high casting time. Perhaps lowering it would increase responsiveness and the overall evasive feel of the weapon

 

Evasive shot (Short bow 3)

- the default movement when free cast is to jump you back. Perhaps making the ability jump you forward if there is no target would increase the QoL of the ability and increase its viability in PvP and WvW.

 

Farsighted (new trait)

- I feel that it is rather weak considering its a major and comparing it to the Dragon Hunter trait. Also, projectile only is a very limiting factor

 

Traps

- The trap skill set is missing a stun breaker. Spike trap could be the perfect candidate

 

 

 

 

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

> @"viquing.8254" said:

> Dis you ever defend a class you didn't play ?

 

I dont limit myself to playing a single class, i have every class except warrior. I also dont play bunker condition builds, because no matter the class (except ele - condi ele sucks lol) is boring as hell. I have pointed out several times in other professions that there are things of classes that should be nerfed or fixed, that goes for any of the classes i play. Mostly because i decide to play the weaker/class or builds. I would rather win because i was better (or they sucked...) than simply down to by build or class.

 

I'm Currently enjoying Weaver Ele at the moment and while the update some how managed to nerf an already weak spec, i still enjoy playing it.

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

> @"viquing.8254" said:

> @all cry about mesmer op, just three questions :

> - How many mesmers did you see in top tier pvp (let say 250 as we can see the names) ?

> - On top tier pvp mesmers, how many are playing axe ?

> - Ok if you stay as pole, you can got 30 confu stacks, done by ultra telegraphied skills. What bout 30 unrealistic confusions stacks in1 sec versus 8-10 k damages done on shorter coldown on many other professions ?

 

Another example, an actual example from a fight. I got jumped by a Mirage, 5 stacks of Confusion INSTANTLY. Thats quite damaging. Taking several taking several thousand damage to remove that because well. 5 stacks hits hard. What do you know, less than a second or 2 later. Boom another 5 stacks of Confusion. This is of course accompanied by the other conditions that are also applied to make it that much harder to remove the threatening ones.

 

Constant burst application is unbalanced. Sustained. Fine. Burst. Fine. Both? Not fine. Not balanced.

 

[viquing.8254]

I'm the kind of people who chose a main during 2 month of testing multiple class 5 years ago and it's really hard to move to something else after. (bad in diversity but more immersive.)

To say more about me, I adapt to my team by swaping between chrono tank, shatter burst and condi mirage builds for the moment and I don't see that much mirage on solo ranked Q.

I agree that with WvW equipment, condi can hit way better than in PvP.

[Mr Godlike.6098]

> @"Dadnir.5038" said:

> > @"Mr Godlike.6098" said:

> > (PvP ELE) :

> >

> > Why fury change? What was broken or needed to fix?

> >

>

> The answer will most likely be infuriating but also very logic: Anet wanted to get rid of the "vuln on crit" trait and thought that it would be good to add the vuln on top of electric discharge (which was a clever choice). However, this left a minor trait blank in the "crit" traitline and what come to mind when you think of crit? Fury. Then they felt that the boon would be redundant if you could have access to it from both arcane and air magic so they replaced it in arcane with might which they feel like is a good damage increase.

>

> > Why nerfing condi on class with irrelevant condi builds?

> >

>

> The tune down aimed at skills/traits that dished out a lot of in built damaging conditions. This wasn't aimed at any build in particular. Look they even made the change on underwater skills.

>

> > What was overall goal of balance team with changes on ele?

> >

>

> Most likely there were no "goal" appart the fact that they wanted to get rid of the vuln on crit trait and change the high damaging condition stacks number skills the way they thought would tune down the ramp up of conditions. No specific goal for elementalist just a common goal on conditions for the game.

>

> > What direction should build crafters for ele in pvp should look now after this changes? What are balance team suggestions?

>

> It's not their job to suggest builds to players, this is something that players have to find by themself.

 

If your answers are right then pvp ele is dead and will stay this way for more then one season. Currently almost all exproleage ele buildcrafters left the game (even phanataram doesn't stream for some reason). I hope devs will answer and prove me wrong.

 

 

 

[Ara.4569]

You were very clear when you said you won't split PvE and PvP skills. So I guess you're asking for PvE feedbacks only.

 

If you're not, then I would advise you to play a PvP match every day. That's 10 minutes. Test the weather. At some point, you will get the big picture in full HD. It will be worth more than a thousand words, if not a thousand feedbacks.

[Lockheart.4312]

Do you guys regret revenant so much as a class that you simply want people to stop playing it? Was the shortbow the subtle message and this patch the arm breaking?

[raynn.9254]

In my opinion, the only thing Mirage needs to be fixed in PvP is the Elusive Mind (with already relatively high endurance generation and energy sigils EM is insanely overpowered and basically blocks any potential counterplay tactic for somewhat less experienced players).

Also, I think it might be healthy for all of us to remember that not all classes/builds are designed to beat to all other classes/builds. Two years ago or so I remember similar complaints against Thieves... Some build designs are better at 1v1 bringing close to 0 utility to the group, and vice versa, that's it. It's like rock paper scissors game on a much larger scale.

 

On a related topic, I would love to see anet change the conditions to be DoT style like in Aion for example. But this would lead to fights having a longer duration, which is something I guess anet is trying to avoid at the moment.

 

Cheers!

[Aylaine.1036]

People crying about Mirage Axe buffs when most people in SPvP use sword and not axe...right, okay.

 

Anyways, Mirage in sPvP needs to be adjusted. I play Mirage in all game modes, it's fine in PvE (now, hopefully the less intuitive people won't cry nerf again) but does need to be nerfed in PvP. I'm a big fan of reducing confusion durations for sPvP **ONLY.** That is the only place they are causing problems. In PvE the durations are needed for Mirage to be a proper DPS spec. Please adjust Mirage skills in **sPvP only,** and _leave_ PvE alone. The recent buff we got was all we really needed to become relevant again, losing anything else would make a lot of now happy again mesmers angry including me.

 

 

[Meridian.9103]

So, i would like to jump in and second many of the already mentioned concerns and also give my perspective (mainly PvP focused) on them:

* **Less Condi-Burst:** First of all, this is a very good attempt which i think is crucial for the game's health. Condi's are fine to deal high amounts of damage, as long as you have possibilities of counterplay. Longer duration means that condi cleanse becomes more significant and encourages intelligent use of them. You surely know yourself that it is still a way to go, but first steps in the right direction have been made.

* **Damage Spikes via Vulnurability:** Another very good intention, but executed poorly, mostly irrelevant.

* **Support Firebrand:** I was very very surprised as i read these notes, to say the least. This spec is already way superior to any other support/bunker in competitive play and it was buffed even further, which means a Scourge is nearly immortal near a good Firebrand. This is not good, since the Firebrand itself is very hard to kill while pumping out insane amounts of heal, condi cleans and blocks/stab. The latter is imo the biggest offender, since powerful one-hit effects like Moa are so unreliable to use, that they are in fact useless. Something has to be toned down here significantly and i suggest to distinguish between Firebrand as a supportive Bunker and e.g. Tempest as a little less bulky, but therefore little stronger and more mobile Support. Overall the buff to Firebrand was just wrong.

* **Scourge:** As i said in the first point, the changes to condi application are very appreciated. Still Scourge is insanely strong versus players due to the high amount of boon corruption, which in turn leads to the application of so many different condis at once, that only very high amounts of cleanse can compensate this. Boon removal is ok and something a Scourge should have good access to, but boon corruption is too strong because it double punishes the one getting hit by it. My suggestion is to change the corruption from Nefarious Favor to boon removal and in turn give it 1 or 2 stacks of bleeding. This would leave boon corruption on higher cd skills with better telegraphs and make condi cleanse weigh more. A neat side effect would be that such a change would also be considered a buff in PvE.

* **Mirage:** Well, as Mirage player myself, i truly admit that i am very surprised that Mirage goes untouched, because it does many things too good. It has high mobility, high burst and stealth to make it an excellent roamer, but it also inflicts very consistent amounts of conditions, mainly confusion, to put out high damage in longer fights. This comes paired with a lot of damage mitigation via dodges, distorts and mirrors and a good amount of cc via sword ambush, diversion and chaos storm. Even though Mirage is a very fun class with nice synergies between the traits and skills, i think the constant pressure from confusion has to be lowered, if you want to maintain it as a bursty condition. My suggestion is to focus on traits that only find use in PvP: Lower the condi duration of Riddle of Sand and Ineptitude.

* **Revenant/Herald:** First, i like the changes you did with off hand sword in the past. The new mobility from sword 5 gives a bit more roaming potential. Besides that, Revenant has a very hard time in PvP for a while now. Since PoF and the introduction of Scourge, it is barely playable because one false move will instantly kill you. The reason for this is easy to find: It desperatly needs more condi cleanse. Put it somewhere in the known Power Herald build, maybe a glint skill. I even think that buffing Cleansing Channel to 2 condis removed would not hurt. This in conjunction with some nerfs to boon corruption/overall condi application could help Revenants a lot. Lastly, the rework of exposed defences missed the mark of "creating synergie". It effectively lowered synergie within the same traitline. You go from ~+10% permanent to occasional +12%, which does honestly not look like a good change. If you want to create significant damage spike opportunities, then double the stacks of vulnurabilty applied by this trait.

* **Others:** I cannot give detailed feedback to Holosmith since i barely know this class, but it feels to me that the damage output is also too high. i would like to see it toned down a bit alongside Firebrand, Scourge and Mirage. Also i believe that others are right questioning the weaver changes.

[RabbitUp.8294]

> @"Morwath.9817" said:

> * Rev Tablet is gated by energy and it doesn't have enough cleanse.

 

The energy gate is not as significant as a 40s cooldown.

 

>* Fireband healing is superior to Tempest and Revenant in every single way, especially if we take amount of cleanse Firebrand has.

 

And it's exactly the opposite in pve, where firebrand is by far the worst of the actual healer builds. Cleansing is also irrelevant for most of the content.

 

Until anet realises the need for splitting, it's one mode over the other. So, instead of asking for nerfs to one the worse support specs in pve, how about making Ventari and

Tempest more viable for pvp?

 

[otto.5684]

> @"RabbitUp.8294" said:

> > @"Morwath.9817" said:

> > * Rev Tablet is gated by energy and it doesn't have enough cleanse.

>

> The energy gate is not as significant as a 40s cooldown.

>

> >* Fireband healing is superior to Tempest and Revenant in every single way, especially if we take amount of cleanse Firebrand has.

>

> And it's exactly the opposite in pve, where firebrand is by far the worst of the actual healer builds. Cleansing is also irrelevant for most of the content.

>

> Until anet realises the need for splitting, it's one mode over the other. So, instead of asking for nerfs to one the worse support specs in pve, how about making Ventari and

> Tempest more viable for pvp?

>

 

FB is not meant to be played as support in PvE. Healing output does not determine if you play a support role or not. You have to provide offensive buffs. That is why only chrono and rev are used for this role.

 

And you are right, FB healing is not the best, but it is spikes when using ToR, which is what makes it ideal for sPvP. No class can do massive quick heals the way FB does.

 

It does not need a split. The heal scaling of most ToR skills needs to be nerfed.

[Vaeo.4097]

> @"Turk.5460" said:

> Why was Mesmer (Chrono/Mirage) confusion burst unaffected by your primary focus of this patch?

 

> @"Morwath.9817" said:

> What I would like to see "hotfixed" :

> * Confusion damage reduced in sPvP by ~20%.

 

These becomes worrisome. Why you asking to nerf Chronomancer? He wasn't OP even before PoF. He's damage was average. He was good duelist but pretty useless in teamfights. Now you're asking to make him trash.

 

In this and similar threads many people equate words "Mesmer", "Chronomancer" and "Mirage". It's not the same. Chronophantasma Shatter is still viable build. Please, stop asking to nerf him into ashes.

Reducing confusion damage or nerfing Illusions trait line will kill Chronomancer.

[babazhook.6805]

Rending Strikes: This trait has been renamed Sundering Burst, and its functionality has been changed. It now causes burst skills to inflict 5 stacks of vulnerability for 8 seconds upon hitting the target, and 5 additional stacks for 8 seconds if the attack is a critical hit. Burst skills that strike multiple times, such as Combustive Shot or Flurry, have a 5-second cooldown between vulnerability applications.

 

 

I suggested a form of this as a means to addressing issues with Conditions in another post. I think if more of them designed in this manner, wherein added stacks hide behind a need to crit wall , we would end up with a more balanced system. Precision CAN be made to work with Conditions and I think if durations increased, the need to take expertise via traits and gear becomes less important . After this tested more in practise I think it might be a route to explore.

 

I suggest as a start some of those Confusion stacks from the Mesmer burst be looked at wherein some of the stacks that are applied on any use of a given skill only occur when there a crit achieved. This would still allow for "burst" while at the same time somewhat moderating the amount of burst unless investment made in precision.

 

 

[Morwath.9817]

> @"Vaeo.4097" said:

> > @"Turk.5460" said:

> > Why was Mesmer (Chrono/Mirage) confusion burst unaffected by your primary focus of this patch?

>

> > @"Morwath.9817" said:

> > What I would like to see "hotfixed" :

> > * Confusion damage reduced in sPvP by ~20%.

>

> These becomes worrisome. Why you asking to nerf Chronomancer? He wasn't OP even before PoF. He's damage was average. He was good duelist but pretty useless in teamfights. Now you're asking to make him trash.

>

> In this and similar threads many people equate words "Mesmer", "Chronomancer" and "Mirage". It's not the same. Chronophantasma Shatter is still viable build. Please, stop asking to nerf him into ashes.

> Reducing confusion damage or nerfing Illusions trait line will kill Chronomancer.

 

Sorry, but if you "nerf" Guardian conditions, Revenant conditions, Ranger conditons, Engineer condtions and Elementalist conditions, which are far far worse than Chronomancer as Chronomancer still is strong build in sPvP (just overshadowed by overpowered Mirage), I don't see a reason to not touch Chronomancer.

[Xuazinegueri.3592]

Hello guys, I want to share my toughts about the recent patch changes. Note: I'm saying about the sPvP point of view.

 

1st: Condition changes:

- I think this was the most waited notice for all the PvP community. They reduced the damage and application of the conditions and increased their duration, removing their non-intended and non-sense spike, making it looks like a condition. Damage over time. In my opinion, this was a good step and I'm really satisfied with the changes, you don't get exploded for a source of damage that was suppose to kill you if you let them hurting you for so long. I really liked it, good move ANet.

 

 

2nd: Barrier changes:

- I liked because the old barriers were... strange? Now they last longer but instat disappear, and 5 seconds is a good timing.

 

 

3rd: Profession Changes: (Note: I know that core professions and some HoT specializations need improvements too but I'm not talking about them in this top, I will focus the "meta")

- Mesmer: I really don't understand much about the profession but it looked like buff for the class... This isn't what I was expecting. Mirage already was in a good spot before the patch, it was a little stronger than it should be in my opinion, but looking the fact of being more harder to master maybe it was something understandable. But that confusion spam was TOTALLY unnecessary and they didn't get rid of it...

 

- Firebrand: They buffed the specialization that is the most dangerous for PvP, after necromancer, to the game. It already was way too strong as a support and now it has even more domination. Trying to be positive, the "Chapter 4: Shining River" changes could be interesting. Changing the heal of instant to overtime was a good move to prevent health spikes and I agree that buffs for the healing, since is overtime now, are welcome, but, really? 50% base + 65% scaling? I think this is too much... The other changes are to follow the condition update and animations review, what isn't a real buff.

 

- Ranger: I was going to say that i liked the changes, specially the damage increases, but I never played ranger so I don't know what they could done better but, even not being a main ranger, I can say that druid have way too much survability and it should be tooned down.

 

- Revenant: I was expecting buffs for the class since it REALLY isn't in a good spot at the moment, specially renegade...

 

- Thief: Same as ranger for thief, I don't play the class so I really don't know what they could do better but looking the changes, it was a buff for PvE and a smaller one for PvP. Ok.

 

- Warrior: They increased the source of might, gave a buff of damage depending on the stacks of might that the player got and nerfed the endurance generation per might stacked. I think they tried to increase the damage while not nerfing survability, just controling it to not be the PoF release SB.

 

- Elementalist: I was expecting buffs and, as far as i readed in the forum, this patch was a nerf. I can't talk much about it but elementalists need some atention in the PvP scenario.

 

- Engineer: People said was a nerf, in my opinion, it didn't look like a nerf, they just updated to the new condition system and buffed some things, not much. And Holosmiths are good at the moment, I don't think they need buffs or nerfs.

 

- Necromancer: I liked the changes in the profession, but I was expecting some tooning down on Scourge. They adapted the condition application to the new system, fixed "Dhuumfire" bug and buffed axe. Buffing axe was smart because almost any scourge use it, what helps power reaper to get back into the game and axe was needing some attention. I, particularly, don't like trait's like Dread that increases damage while enemies are under an effect but I will give it a try. As a main Necromancer(and is not needed to be one to say) even after the changes, Scourges are really strong and they will still strong until ANet do something about the boon corruption. The condition application of the profession is fine. We do damage but isn't that spike that was before. The problem is, every single class has boons and punishment skills brings a lot of boon corrupt. Scourge gets unbalanced when they remove the strength of an enemy and turn it into a weakness. To be honest, I really don't think they can change the utility skills, since "Trail of Anguish" and "Sand Swell" are easy to evade, no one takes "Serpent Siphon" and "Gastly Breach" ask you to leave the area, and that's it. ("Dessicate" isn't "evadable" but isn't a danger factor).

 

Analyzing that they don’t want drastic changes, what they could do is:

 

- "Nerfarious Favor": Cooldown increased from 8 to 12 seconds (PvP Only) > This is what necro needs right now, in my opinion. They are too strong because of their boon corrupt, what decreases the enemies resistance or damage and increases our source of conditions. Increasing the "F2" cooldown increases the cooldown on the trait "Path of Corruption" and don't affect reaper or core necromancers. If needed, they can change the skill to convert 3 conditions into boons instead of just 2 to don't affect the specialization survability but I think scourge do fair enough with just 2, and that FB on his side won't let him die anyway.

 

- Dhuumfire has now a 1 second cooldown beetwen scourge profession skills. (Yes, make this not a bug, what prevents players that just press everything at the same time of stacking too much burning).

[Brujeria.7536]

Im kinda thorn on this balance patch. The delay of the condi ramp up time is generally a good thing in my opinion, however i feel like youre not factoring in what the classes are capable to do based on the survival and theme of the class. Mesmer as the best example has a lot of ways to survive, to spam clones which will cause conditions, these classes are not hit that hard as for example necros, who are not so trong defensive wise. By reducing the condi damage burst you increase the time an opponent can go full offensive before dealing with the conditions - a necromancer is already pressured too easily, while a mesmer doenst - in reverse it should be okay for a necromancer to burst condi damage, because of the severe lack of defense, compared to similar condi classes.

 

The vulnerability changes are kinda meh, really. The biggest chunk of vulnerability application should come from skills, not from traits. I feel like just with regular condis, you have way too little options in the weapon and utility skill departments, a condi set does just that, you cant DEFINE a tradeoff, do i want more general condi pressure with vulnerability and stuff or do i focus more on damaging condis? Most classes only have one weapon for condis. Vulnerability is mostly an "unvisible" effect you cant feel that distinct like chill, slow or 20 stacks of burn are, so i think you could get away with the pre patch trait effects.

 

In that context, what really upset me is the necromancer trait changee in the spite line, you added another fear related trait, in a power line. We dont have a power weapon that applies fear, in fact necromancer only has at most 3 reliable sources of fear, one of which is tied to staff, one to each shroud, and one is tied to spectral wall.

We have more traits that revolve around fear than we have options to CAUSE fear, given the fact that fear is a very weak CC (because it suffers the drawbacks of condis AND regular CCs; stab, resistance, stunbreak, Condi remove, reduced condi duration) this change is just horrible in my opinion... either give necromancers more access to fear and change fear to be just a condi with CC (unaffected by stunbreak and stability) or let it just be a CC.. not both. Also, reduce the amount of fear traits to 2 or 1, really. So much place is used up by fear traits for such little practical use in game.

 

Apart from that it was a nice little patch

[Ghos.1326]

> @"OriOri.8724" said:

> > @"Morwath.9817" said:

> > What I would like to see "hotfixed" :

> > * Arcane Prowess gives now 3 stacks of Might for 6 seconds instead of 1 for 8 seconds.

>

> Please no. I actually want more might traits to follow this example, of giving out only 1 stack of might but for longer durations. Due to how powerful 25stacks of might is, to me its something that should be primarily coming from might generation skills, not from traits. Yet right now in PvE the might generation comes almost entirely from traits, because they will pump out both high stacks and relatively high duration of might simultaneously.

 

Yeah I don't think bursty builds need more might, but less, to not overpower them. I think the builds that focus more on a sustained damage/bruiser play style need more might, and more instances of applying vuln to deal some nicer damage.

[Vaeo.4097]

> @"Morwath.9817" said:

> Sorry, but if you "nerf" Guardian conditions, Revenant conditions, Ranger conditons, Engineer condtions and Elementalist conditions, which are far far worse than Chronomancer as Chronomancer still is strong build in sPvP (just overshadowed by overpowered Mirage), I don't see a reason to not touch Chronomancer.

 

So you think that Chronomancer burst is comparable with burn guardian or burn firebrand or condi trapper ranger burst? By the way, ranger's traps are untouched, same for guardian's torch.

And overall condi damage for these classes is unchanged. While for chronomancer you asking 20% overall damage reduction.

Ok you want Chronomancer to be treated as others. This means -- less stacks, more duration. Would you like to have permanent 4-6 stacks of confusion on you?

So you not asking to treat Chronomancer same as others. You asking significant nerf to make it unviable.

 

 

 

[Morwath.9817]

> @"Vaeo.4097" said:

> > @"Morwath.9817" said:

> > Sorry, but if you "nerf" Guardian conditions, Revenant conditions, Ranger conditons, Engineer condtions and Elementalist conditions, which are far far worse than Chronomancer as Chronomancer still is strong build in sPvP (just overshadowed by overpowered Mirage), I don't see a reason to not touch Chronomancer.

>

> So you think that Chronomancer burst is comparable with burn guardian or burn firebrand or condi trapper ranger burst? By the way, ranger's traps are untouched, same for guardian's torch.

> And overall condi damage for these classes is unchanged. While for chronomancer you asking 20% overall damage reduction.

> Ok you want Chronomancer to be treated as others. This means -- less stacks, more duration. Would you like to have permanent 4-6 stacks of confusion on you?

> So you not asking to treat Chronomancer same as others. You asking significant nerf to make it unviable.

>

 

Confusion shouldn't get same threatment as other conditions, as it's working differently than other conditions, it's like long daze which is constantly dealing damage to you, even if you do nothing. What is worse, you get punished for **trying** to cleanse it, as it's nearly always covered with other conditions.

 

I would rather see Condi Chrono killed completly, if that is what we need to be done to deal properly with Mirage condi burst, same as I would rather see Chrono as Power and Mirage as Condi specializations. For same reason I hope Elusive Mind gets ICD sooner rather than later, as it's completly broken.

 

P.S.

None of condi builds you mentioned, e.g. "burn firebrand" isn't even close to viable, those are nothing but troll builds.

[otto.5684]

> @"Vaeo.4097" said:

> > @"Morwath.9817" said:

> > Sorry, but if you "nerf" Guardian conditions, Revenant conditions, Ranger conditons, Engineer condtions and Elementalist conditions, which are far far worse than Chronomancer as Chronomancer still is strong build in sPvP (just overshadowed by overpowered Mirage), I don't see a reason to not touch Chronomancer.

>

> So you think that Chronomancer burst is comparable with burn guardian or burn firebrand or condi trapper ranger burst? By the way, ranger's traps are untouched, same for guardian's torch.

> And overall condi damage for these classes is unchanged. While for chronomancer you asking 20% overall damage reduction.

> Ok you want Chronomancer to be treated as others. This means -- less stacks, more duration. Would you like to have permanent 4-6 stacks of confusion on you?

> So you not asking to treat Chronomancer same as others. You asking significant nerf to make it unviable.

>

>

>

 

Chrono is most certainly better than burn guardian or burn firebrand or condi trapper ranger. It is completely power creeped by Mirage, but that is a failure in design end on Anet end, making PoF elite perform the same function in sPvP as HoT elite, while being vastly superior.

 

Yes, confusion should get some shave in sPvP.

[Turk.5460]

> @"Vaeo.4097" said:

> > @"Turk.5460" said:

> > Why was Mesmer (Chrono/Mirage) confusion burst unaffected by your primary focus of this patch?

>

> > @"Morwath.9817" said:

> > What I would like to see "hotfixed" :

> > * Confusion damage reduced in sPvP by ~20%.

>

> These becomes worrisome. Why you asking to nerf Chronomancer? He wasn't OP even before PoF. He's damage was average. He was good duelist but pretty useless in teamfights. Now you're asking to make him trash.

>

> In this and similar threads many people equate words "Mesmer", "Chronomancer" and "Mirage". It's not the same. Chronophantasma Shatter is still viable build. Please, stop asking to nerf him into ashes.

> Reducing confusion damage or nerfing Illusions trait line will kill Chronomancer.

 

Good duelist? Try top, equal to Core Warrior (also incredibly OP in 1v1 situations only). Condi Chrono has always been OP, and has been complained about since shortly after HoT released. The condi spam, on top of one of the best block/evasion/stealth rotations, ability to disengage quite easily, and all while wearing TB/Dire...

 

There is a reason it has been the go-to solo-roam profession for all the weenies who aren't confident enough to actually play the game.