Holosmith damage is too crazy

[jihm.2315]

the game has good skills but very short time to use them since everyone dies so easy it gives not much options for counter play

instead of complaining about an average class complain about the game as a whole

[Vag.5682]

these forums are becoming retarted . Everyone is crying nerf to everyone. butserioysly holosmith hahaha ridiculus esp when it comes from Mesmer.

 

Thing is balance is relatively good in high rank pvp or in wvw when same geared. Consider whole package pvp - pve most classes are between 5% difference in power.

 

Unskilled noobies who rarely pvp or get owned by a good player cry all time though and that's the issue not the class balance

[Arheundel.6451]

Holo can be a nightmare to fight...**only when the player is actually good**, huge dmg right..but it's not a class where any casual can install today and become a champion over night like with./..cough...cough....scourge...spellbreaker...cough

[whoknocks.4935]

> @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> Holo can be a nightmare to fight...**only when the player is actually good**, huge dmg right..but it's not a class where any casual can install today and become a champion over night like with./..cough...cough....scourge...spellbreaker...cough

 

Exactly, or scourge, you try pvp for the first time with scourge, literally spam the shades when have enough life force and just win.

First time playing holo you get rekt so badly because you cannot simply spam the skills you have random, have to think it beforehand.

 

And even for top players scourge is pretty frustating to fight against when the scourge use a bit of brain, it's not only a low tier noob friendly class.

And people complain of holo... just sad.

[sephiroth.4217]

I like the Overheat trait (14k "burst")... combine that with Rifle 5 skill and boom! someone dies. I also like how I can proc it in safety with Elixer S.

 

I am bad player though


 

[Razor.6392]

> @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > It's almost like people are playing blindfolded. Holosmith has some of the most obvious tells of any of the PoF specs, and if you know what they are, are super easy to deal with. In the meantime, to everybody complaining about it's super-opness... go play it. Please. Please play it. Please play it and come back to tell me how good its sustain is.

> > >

> > > Because if it wasn't for scourge, scrapper would whoop holosmith's kitten pretty consistently.

> >

> > The problem with holo is that every single skill in forge is worth a dodge. Every single one.

> >

> > Blitz, leap, corona, shockwave, even the kitten autoattack. They all hit for a lot of damage.

> >

> > Also one last reminder, just because mirage, scourge and fb are power creeped to hell and back, doesn't mean holo is fine lol.

>

> You missed my point. If you roll back the power creep of the scourge and FB, there are actually builds that can survive the holo nuking and dish it right back (DH, scrapper, chrono). These builds cannot persist in the current meta due to scourge AoE corruption though. The current meta is primarily glass (except FB) because glass builds are the only reasonable options against scourge, given its ease of use and spammability for massive damage and corruption. Balance is a lot like an ecosystem -- overpowered builds muscle out other less powerful builds. Is holo powerful? Yes. Is it overpowered against the tankier HoT specs? I don't think so. DH kicks holo's kitten pretty thoroughly, as does scrapper.

>

> Also, to your response about the skills... have you not heard of kiting and cc? If you're 1v1'ing a holo, you can interrupt them as soon as they enter forge (because I guarantee they are going to pop corona), or you can simply move away and immob/chill/cripple (the reason why scourge is so kitten effective). If you are in their face, and you are just as glassy, you will get your kitten pounded into the ground.

>

> The other thing everyone seems to gloss over is Holo is the only PoF spec that comes with its own built-in drawback -- overheating. If I get overzealous, I am liable to kill myself. This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

>

> > @"Brandon.8294" said:

> > I feel like holos do not have large enough windows of opportunity for their enemies to exploit.

>

> 1. If a holo is distracted with somebody else, you can focus them down pretty quickly. On my holo I try to stay away from the enemy's attention until I'm ready to strike. If I get outnumbered, I generally try to run unless an opponent is down or very close to downed. In this sense, holo is a lot like a D/P thief.

> 2. A holo is a lot like a harder hitting, but less mobile D/P thief. They are very easily countered by heavy pressure - heavy condi or spike damage. I often will focus an enemy holo over an enemy necro for this reason.

> 3. If you watch holos closely, you can interrupt corona burst (they always pop it as soon as they enter forge). This is the most critical skill in the whole chain -- if it gets interrupted, it royally screws with the rotation.

> 4. If you're being focused by a holo, kite and use your immobs/chill/cripple, or defenses/block/temp invulns. Most of them will either pop prime light beam (which you can dodge) or pop back out of holo mode, giving you a nice window to pressure them.

> 5. A holo that's low on health should be running away -- they will only turn around when their burst is ready again. If you are chasing a holo who's injured, wait for them to turn around and pop forge, then use any invuln skill or kiting skill you have.

 

Kiting and cc a 2 seconds leap ain't that easy. Only thief can headshot a holo out of corona, no other class has an interrupt that fast and lastly kill yourself? really? who uses this in an argument lol, obviously no one with 3 braincells will let it happen.

[whoknocks.4935]

> @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> I like the Overheat trait (14k "burst")... combine that with Rifle 5 skill and boom! someone dies. I also like how I can proc it in safety with Elixer S.

>

> I am bad player though

> 

>

 

I wonder why it is not on the meta build this trait change if it is that OP, ah wait... because conquest mode it's not deathmatch.

Only works on bad players unfortunately for you.

[Loop.8106]

> @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

Blood is power necros says hi. Also, thats a pretty shitty argument haha

 

[Ario.8964]

The only serious problem with holo atm is the dodge roll damage. Minesweeper needs a damage nerf but that's about all you can touch on holo until other stuff gets nerfed so you don't force the class out of the meta entirely.

[Ivantreil.3092]

Let's also clear another thing mentioned before.

 

The reason Power Scrapper disappeared isn't due to Holo power creep, is due to that Engi, can't survive for an enough long period in Melee Range for like play Melee builds with this meta, Holo goes melee but the idea in Holo is that you burst as fast as possible and disengage after said burst is done, you never want to stick at melee.

 

Same thing could be said of Condi Engi, but this one has even more worse problems along with the incapability of melee survival, no wonder this build went extinct.

 

As long as Scourge and Spellbreaker are around, don't expect seeing Scrappers around.

[Lilyanna.9361]

> @"Ivantreil.3092" said:

> Let's also clear another thing mentioned before.

>

> The reason Power Scrapper disappeared isn't due to Holo power creep, is due to that Engi, can't survive for an enough long period in Melee Range for like play Melee builds with this meta, Holo goes melee but the idea in Holo is that you burst as fast as possible and disengage after said burst is done, you never want to stick at melee.

>

> Same thing could be said of Condi Engi, but this one has even more worse problems along with the incapability of melee survival, no wonder this build went extinct.

>

> As long as Scourge and Spellbreaker are around, don't expect seeing Scrappers around.

 

Technically Condi Engie= Condi scrapper, but yeah it pretty much died.

 

Scrapper traits got gutted and got power creeped out. Another spec you had to be decent, but again people cried that the dazes hurt too much or the gyros are annoying.

 

Smh, people have you not figured out the more you cry for nerfs the more painful the next OP thing is going to be?

[Falan.1839]

> @"Razor.6392" said:

> > @"KrHome.1920" said:

> > > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > People keep saying holo is a glass cannon.

> > >

> > > No.

> > >

> > > FA weaver = glass cannon.

> > >

> > > 1 trick staff thief = glass cannon.

> > >

> > > Anything deadeye = glass cannon.

> > >

> > > Staff zerk ele = glass cannon.

> > >

> > > To a lesser extent, power shatter mantra mesmer = glass cannon.

> > >

> > > Glass cannon are those specs that are feast or famine, kill or be killed. No defenses, extremely weak to pressure, and pretty much dead if their main burst doesn't land.

> > >

> > > Holo is not that.

> > Holo is pretty much dead if their main burst does not land (from a Power Reaper's perspective). He bursts, I dodge, I burst, he shrinks for 3 seconds, I wait 3 seconds, I kill him while he tries to heal up with his turret. Pretty much like a fight against a glass cannon should look like.

> >

>

> Nope. They have many tools (no pun intended xd) to fall back onto. Stealth up, rocket boots away, knock your kitten back, immobilize, shrink (active) or shrink (passive). What do the specs I listed have? They can't reset, they just die.

>

> Holo is leagues ahead in terms of survivability.

 

Rocket Boots aren't included in the current meta because it takes the tool line for them to be effective, which requires to ditch explosives that adds a lot of dmg to the build throw mines and the automated rocket. Alchemy is pretty much autolock because the survivability is utter garbage without passive Eli S and HGH. Engi has one secure option for stealth (Eli S toolbelt) and one RNG based one (the wall from Eli U toolbelt). However, stealth breaks extremely easy due to the mines, even good players will find themselves revealed A LOT almost immediately after stealthing up. Otherwise the only real survivability are the two elixirs S, with the passive one again being problematic cause it can fuck you over when you're heavily condi pressured or executing a vital skill (like Prime Light Beam). The only real genuine defence that the holo line gives is a ridiculously small barrier from the stability trait and a subpar reg after leaving holoforge (Heat Therapy). Mobility without rocket boots is largely limited to Rifle 5 to disengage (possibly Eli Gun 4 when used), since the holo leap barely deserves that name when it comes to distance covered (not saying the dmg is bad).

 

I can understand the frustration about the high passive dmg from dodging, and to a lesser degree about the high cc/dmg output from holoforge (which is strong, but also vital for the spec to be viable), but saying that holo somehow has excessive defense is pretty much alternative facts.

[whoknocks.4935]

> Rocket Boots aren't included in the current meta because it takes the tool line for them to be effective, which requires to ditch explosives that adds a lot of dmg to the build throw mines and the automated rocket. Alchemy is pretty much autolock because the survivability is utter garbage without passive Eli S and HGH. Engi has one secure option for stealth (Eli S toolbelt) and one RNG based one (the wall from Eli U toolbelt). However, stealth breaks extremely easy due to the mines, even good players will find themselves revealed A LOT almost immediately after stealthing up. Otherwise the only real survivability are the two elixirs S, with the passive one again being problematic cause it can kitten you over when you're heavily condi pressured or executing a vital skill (like Prime Light Beam). The only real genuine defence that the holo line gives is a ridiculously small barrier from the stability trait and a subpar reg after leaving holoforge (Heat Therapy). Mobility without rocket boots is largely limited to Rifle 5 to disengage (possibly Eli Gun 4 when used), since the holo leap barely deserves that name when it comes to distance covered (not saying the dmg is bad).

>

> I can understand the frustration about the high passive dmg from dodging, and to a lesser degree about the high cc/dmg output from holoforge (which is strong, but also vital for the spec to be viable), but saying that holo somehow has excessive defense is pretty much alternative facts.

 

I second all you said, and even the bombs dropped after dodging, a smart player just don't walk into them randomly because he knows about it and they are on the floor there visible, they are not hidden traps. If you just walk careless into the mines so you deserve to die because you are stupid. Same as staying stucked in the scourge shades, and few dropped mines are not at the level of freaking shades come on... Why don't complain more of mirage dodge which is really broken? But people complain on fair classes just because they can't deal with them.

 

 

[Vagrant.7206]

> @"Razor.6392" said:

> > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > It's almost like people are playing blindfolded. Holosmith has some of the most obvious tells of any of the PoF specs, and if you know what they are, are super easy to deal with. In the meantime, to everybody complaining about it's super-opness... go play it. Please. Please play it. Please play it and come back to tell me how good its sustain is.

> > > >

> > > > Because if it wasn't for scourge, scrapper would whoop holosmith's kitten pretty consistently.

> > >

> > > The problem with holo is that every single skill in forge is worth a dodge. Every single one.

> > >

> > > Blitz, leap, corona, shockwave, even the kitten autoattack. They all hit for a lot of damage.

> > >

> > > Also one last reminder, just because mirage, scourge and fb are power creeped to hell and back, doesn't mean holo is fine lol.

> >

> > You missed my point. If you roll back the power creep of the scourge and FB, there are actually builds that can survive the holo nuking and dish it right back (DH, scrapper, chrono). These builds cannot persist in the current meta due to scourge AoE corruption though. The current meta is primarily glass (except FB) because glass builds are the only reasonable options against scourge, given its ease of use and spammability for massive damage and corruption. Balance is a lot like an ecosystem -- overpowered builds muscle out other less powerful builds. Is holo powerful? Yes. Is it overpowered against the tankier HoT specs? I don't think so. DH kicks holo's kitten pretty thoroughly, as does scrapper.

> >

> > Also, to your response about the skills... have you not heard of kiting and cc? If you're 1v1'ing a holo, you can interrupt them as soon as they enter forge (because I guarantee they are going to pop corona), or you can simply move away and immob/chill/cripple (the reason why scourge is so kitten effective). If you are in their face, and you are just as glassy, you will get your kitten pounded into the ground.

> >

> > The other thing everyone seems to gloss over is Holo is the only PoF spec that comes with its own built-in drawback -- overheating. If I get overzealous, I am liable to kill myself. This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> >

> > > @"Brandon.8294" said:

> > > I feel like holos do not have large enough windows of opportunity for their enemies to exploit.

> >

> > 1. If a holo is distracted with somebody else, you can focus them down pretty quickly. On my holo I try to stay away from the enemy's attention until I'm ready to strike. If I get outnumbered, I generally try to run unless an opponent is down or very close to downed. In this sense, holo is a lot like a D/P thief.

> > 2. A holo is a lot like a harder hitting, but less mobile D/P thief. They are very easily countered by heavy pressure - heavy condi or spike damage. I often will focus an enemy holo over an enemy necro for this reason.

> > 3. If you watch holos closely, you can interrupt corona burst (they always pop it as soon as they enter forge). This is the most critical skill in the whole chain -- if it gets interrupted, it royally screws with the rotation.

> > 4. If you're being focused by a holo, kite and use your immobs/chill/cripple, or defenses/block/temp invulns. Most of them will either pop prime light beam (which you can dodge) or pop back out of holo mode, giving you a nice window to pressure them.

> > 5. A holo that's low on health should be running away -- they will only turn around when their burst is ready again. If you are chasing a holo who's injured, wait for them to turn around and pop forge, then use any invuln skill or kiting skill you have.

>

> Kiting and cc a 2 seconds leap ain't that easy. Only thief can headshot a holo out of corona, no other class has an interrupt that fast and lastly kill yourself? really? who uses this in an argument lol, obviously no one with 3 braincells will let it happen.

 

1. That 2 second leap barely moves faster than an engineer with swiftness. If you can't kite that, you don't know how to kite.

2. It's actually fairly predictable. There are certain times where a holo is likely to activate their forge, but you need to practice against a few to get a sense of the timing.

3. The self destruct is actually really easy to accidentally trigger. I've done it several times in the course of this season (sometimes intentionally, sometimes not), but it is always a major threat when it happens.

 

> @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> I like the Overheat trait (14k "burst")... combine that with Rifle 5 skill and boom! someone dies. I also like how I can proc it in safety with Elixer S.

>

> I am bad player though

 

That's actually pretty hard to pull off successfully in real matches. Overheat + elixir S + explosion requires you to precisely time the elixir s immediately when you overheat and you have to be in the perfect location. Rifle 5 + overheat also requires pretty precise timing and accuracy as well. You essentially have to be right on top of somebody after just finishing a holo burst to pull it off.

 

> @"Loop.8106" said:

> > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> Blood is power necros says hi. Also, thats a pretty kitten argument haha

>

 

You have to be pretty bad at playing blood is power to pull that off -- you generally don't lose as much health as an overheated holo (4 self bleeds vs 1/2 your health), and you would have to intentionally do that.

 

It's also a reasonable argument -- if you are bad at playing it and managing your heat, you will kill yourself.

[rwolf.9571]

> @"whoknocks.4935" said:

> > @"rwolf.9571" said:

> > High risk? more like No risk. I have never killed a Holo in a 1 v 1 Situation, not even the ones who play like kitten. Can't do damage to them, can't see these so called telegraphed attacks. (everything just a flurry of blue/yellow). Can't even evade dodge unblockables. (Nothing like in the middle of evade frames when a holo 1 shots you with his elite).

> >

> > Granted if a pug is smart and focus's him in a team battle he's dead meat. But ppl usually focus on somthing else, like ele or necro.

>

> Get glasses if cannot see the holo#5 skill or the elite one. You never killed them 1vs1 because you don't know how to dodge or maybe play classes easy counterable by holo.

> And PvP is not deathmatch, so you are not forced to 1vs1 and win all the times, just avoid the 1vs1s you can't win.

>

> "I have never killed a Holo in a 1 v 1 Situation, not even the ones who play like kitten."

> You play more kitten than them, and you can't win 1vs1s against all professions man, otherwise you were a god.

>

> "High risk? more like No risk." Yeah it's high risky because you are squishy and so vulnerable to condis.

> It's for people like you that good and fun classes like holo will get nerfed and braindead spammy classes like scourge don't get touched.

 

Oh I see his elite. A. I wasted my dodges avoiding his holo burst (which keeps on going on and on). or B. I dodge and get hit by it anyway.

 

Yes you are forced to 1 v 1's when your trying to hold or contest points. By that logic I should give up all points because I can fight on equal terms. And wait for my team to get toxic on me for not taking a point.

 

Equally kitten Holo > Equally kitten at any other class (exception is probably scourge)

 

If you can apply any condis....

Yes I can agree. OP classes are fun, I know because I've done that. And should be balanced likewise.

[Crinn.7864]

The issue is not that Holosmith is too tanky, or that holosmith is too easy, or that Holosmith doesn't have telegraph. The issue is that everything that Holosmith does hits enormously hard, which results in the only way to survive against a holosmith is to dodge everything the holosmith does - which just isn't feasible for the majority of classes.

 

You have to dodge prime light beam, you have to dodge holographic shockwave, you have to dodge proton blitz, you have to dodge mine trail, you have to dodge corona burst, you have to dodge holo leap. There are only a couple classes in the game that have the damage avoidance to survive against that.

 

 

> @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > @"Loop.8106" said:

> > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > Blood is power necros says hi. Also, thats a pretty kitten argument haha

> >

>

> You have to be pretty bad at playing blood is power to pull that off -- you generally don't lose as much health as an overheated holo (4 self bleeds vs 1/2 your health), and you would have to intentionally do that.

>

> It's also a reasonable argument -- if you are bad at playing it and managing your heat, you will kill yourself.

 

The difference is that the self damage from overheat is completely avoidable. However the self-condis from necro's corruption skills are completely unavoidable - they are always applied, and blowing your condi clear to handle your own self-applied condis means you have less clear for incoming condi bursts. Necro's corruption utilities are far more dangerous to necro than the overheat mechanic is to engi.

[whoknocks.4935]

> @"rwolf.9571" said:

> > @"whoknocks.4935" said:

> > > @"rwolf.9571" said:

> > > High risk? more like No risk. I have never killed a Holo in a 1 v 1 Situation, not even the ones who play like kitten. Can't do damage to them, can't see these so called telegraphed attacks. (everything just a flurry of blue/yellow). Can't even evade dodge unblockables. (Nothing like in the middle of evade frames when a holo 1 shots you with his elite).

> > >

> > > Granted if a pug is smart and focus's him in a team battle he's dead meat. But ppl usually focus on somthing else, like ele or necro.

> >

> > Get glasses if cannot see the holo#5 skill or the elite one. You never killed them 1vs1 because you don't know how to dodge or maybe play classes easy counterable by holo.

> > And PvP is not deathmatch, so you are not forced to 1vs1 and win all the times, just avoid the 1vs1s you can't win.

> >

> > "I have never killed a Holo in a 1 v 1 Situation, not even the ones who play like kitten."

> > You play more kitten than them, and you can't win 1vs1s against all professions man, otherwise you were a god.

> >

> > "High risk? more like No risk." Yeah it's high risky because you are squishy and so vulnerable to condis.

> > It's for people like you that good and fun classes like holo will get nerfed and braindead spammy classes like scourge don't get touched.

>

> Oh I see his elite. A. I wasted my dodges avoiding his holo burst (which keeps on going on and on). or B. I dodge and get hit by it anyway.

>

> Yes you are forced to 1 v 1's when your trying to hold or contest points. By that logic I should give up all points because I can fight on equal terms. And wait for my team to get toxic on me for not taking a point.

>

> Equally kitten Holo > Equally kitten at any other class (exception is probably scourge)

>

> If you can apply any condis....

> Yes I can agree. OP classes are fun, I know because I've done that. And should be balanced likewise.

 

Wrong, you are not forced to take 1vs1, it is fine to leave the point, wait for a teammates and make it an outnumbered fight so you didn't die and you get back the control point too. You seem to have no basic pvp knowledge or maybe if you talk of random low tiers matchups and nobody comes helps you outnumbering that's another problem of bad teammates. So what if a scourge is on the point? You challenge him 1vs, then you die and lost the point plus your 5 point deaths? No. You simply avoid him or fight him 2vs1.

Please tell me what class are you playing that makes you so frustated about holo.

[whoknocks.4935]

> @"Crinn.7864" said:

> The issue is not that Holosmith is too tanky, or that holosmith is too easy, or that Holosmith doesn't have telegraph. The issue is that everything that Holosmith does hits enormously hard, which results in the only way to survive against a holosmith is to dodge everything the holosmith does - which just isn't feasible for the majority of classes.

>

> You have to dodge prime light beam, you have to dodge holographic shockwave, you have to dodge proton blitz, you have to dodge mine trail, you have to dodge corona burst, you have to dodge holo leap. There are only a couple classes in the game that have the damage avoidance to survive against that.

>

>

> > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > @"Loop.8106" said:

> > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > > Blood is power necros says hi. Also, thats a pretty kitten argument haha

> > >

> >

> > You have to be pretty bad at playing blood is power to pull that off -- you generally don't lose as much health as an overheated holo (4 self bleeds vs 1/2 your health), and you would have to intentionally do that.

> >

> > It's also a reasonable argument -- if you are bad at playing it and managing your heat, you will kill yourself.

>

> The difference is that the self damage from overheat is completely avoidable. However the self-condis from necro's corruption skills are completely unavoidable - they are always applied, and blowing your condi clear to handle your own self-applied condis means you have less clear for incoming condi bursts. Necro's corruption utilities are far more dangerous to necro than the overheat mechanic is to engi.

 

Please just stop complaining just because you are bad, you have to kite and be at range and let the holo waste the burst. Obviously if you stand still and wait to get bursted that's your fault of being bad, not holo problem. Same as people standing into scourge shade and complain why they died. Just learn to use your class.

If a noob plays scourge he can melt an entire team, if a noob plays holo he never gets a single because there are buttons to press with a brain and not spammy like you can in scourge, you cant spam stealth, one second late stealth and you die, cant spam the shield tool kit and think it will make you survive.

[Vagrant.7206]

> @"Crinn.7864" said:

> The issue is not that Holosmith is too tanky, or that holosmith is too easy, or that Holosmith doesn't have telegraph. The issue is that everything that Holosmith does hits enormously hard, which results in the only way to survive against a holosmith is to dodge everything the holosmith does - which just isn't feasible for the majority of classes.

>

> You have to dodge prime light beam, you have to dodge holographic shockwave, you have to dodge proton blitz, you have to dodge mine trail, you have to dodge corona burst, you have to dodge holo leap. There are only a couple classes in the game that have the damage avoidance to survive against that.

 

You realize you don't actually have to dodge all that right? Photon Forge range is 600 (for photon blitz and holographic shockwave) and we don't have the gap closers that warriors do. Ranged classes (ranger, casters, etc) can relatively simply deal with the issue by staying at range, or you can use blocks/evade frames like warrior, thief, guardian, etc. Dodging everything is not the problem -- the approach is. Dragonhunter, scrapper, rangers, heavy condi pressure (IE scourge) are all quite sufficient to murder holos with ease.

 

> @"Crinn.7864" said:

> > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > @"Loop.8106" said:

> > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > > Blood is power necros says hi. Also, thats a pretty kitten argument haha

> > >

> >

> > You have to be pretty bad at playing blood is power to pull that off -- you generally don't lose as much health as an overheated holo (4 self bleeds vs 1/2 your health), and you would have to intentionally do that.

> >

> > It's also a reasonable argument -- if you are bad at playing it and managing your heat, you will kill yourself.

>

> The difference is that the self damage from overheat is completely avoidable. However the self-condis from necro's corruption skills are completely unavoidable - they are always applied, and blowing your condi clear to handle your own self-applied condis means you have less clear for incoming condi bursts. Necro's corruption utilities are far more dangerous to necro than the overheat mechanic is to engi.

 

* 4 Bleeds is not a whole lot of damage. Blowing your condi clear on that is rather wasteful. Not sure why necros complain about 4 bleeds when I'm talking half of an engineer's entire health bar (+lockout from PF).

* Overheating happens faster than you might imagine, or there are times when it is actually called for (as I said, I have done it intentionally a few times):

* Say for example that you just need one holo skill to finish an enemy. Popping out of the mode will give them sufficient time to survive and come back. Bam, overheat.

* Say for example you have quickness applied to you -- the autoattack heat builds up much faster, throwing off your rotation and causing overheat

* You can also forget that certain holo skills apply significantly more heat than others. Corona burst, for example, applies heat on both explosions. Blitz causes a rapid climb, and shockwave adds a massive 25% heat.

* Try juggling heat in an active situation -- it takes a lot of practice to watch the bar and be effective. Go play it. I'll wait.

 

In any of these scenarios, the holo is left either very weak or dead -- perfect time for an enemy to stroll up and look at us funny.

 

[zoopop.5630]

stop reading the troll comments after reading somewhere along the lines that holo can "block" attacks.

 

GG, the community stays begging for fucking nerfs just for the hell of it no wonder the PvP team/Balance team doesn't take shit serious anymore.

[Bish.8627]

I would rather have a stun break than a damage on dodge every time

[sephiroth.4217]

> @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > > It's almost like people are playing blindfolded. Holosmith has some of the most obvious tells of any of the PoF specs, and if you know what they are, are super easy to deal with. In the meantime, to everybody complaining about it's super-opness... go play it. Please. Please play it. Please play it and come back to tell me how good its sustain is.

> > > > >

> > > > > Because if it wasn't for scourge, scrapper would whoop holosmith's kitten pretty consistently.

> > > >

> > > > The problem with holo is that every single skill in forge is worth a dodge. Every single one.

> > > >

> > > > Blitz, leap, corona, shockwave, even the kitten autoattack. They all hit for a lot of damage.

> > > >

> > > > Also one last reminder, just because mirage, scourge and fb are power creeped to hell and back, doesn't mean holo is fine lol.

> > >

> > > You missed my point. If you roll back the power creep of the scourge and FB, there are actually builds that can survive the holo nuking and dish it right back (DH, scrapper, chrono). These builds cannot persist in the current meta due to scourge AoE corruption though. The current meta is primarily glass (except FB) because glass builds are the only reasonable options against scourge, given its ease of use and spammability for massive damage and corruption. Balance is a lot like an ecosystem -- overpowered builds muscle out other less powerful builds. Is holo powerful? Yes. Is it overpowered against the tankier HoT specs? I don't think so. DH kicks holo's kitten pretty thoroughly, as does scrapper.

> > >

> > > Also, to your response about the skills... have you not heard of kiting and cc? If you're 1v1'ing a holo, you can interrupt them as soon as they enter forge (because I guarantee they are going to pop corona), or you can simply move away and immob/chill/cripple (the reason why scourge is so kitten effective). If you are in their face, and you are just as glassy, you will get your kitten pounded into the ground.

> > >

> > > The other thing everyone seems to gloss over is Holo is the only PoF spec that comes with its own built-in drawback -- overheating. If I get overzealous, I am liable to kill myself. This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > >

> > > > @"Brandon.8294" said:

> > > > I feel like holos do not have large enough windows of opportunity for their enemies to exploit.

> > >

> > > 1. If a holo is distracted with somebody else, you can focus them down pretty quickly. On my holo I try to stay away from the enemy's attention until I'm ready to strike. If I get outnumbered, I generally try to run unless an opponent is down or very close to downed. In this sense, holo is a lot like a D/P thief.

> > > 2. A holo is a lot like a harder hitting, but less mobile D/P thief. They are very easily countered by heavy pressure - heavy condi or spike damage. I often will focus an enemy holo over an enemy necro for this reason.

> > > 3. If you watch holos closely, you can interrupt corona burst (they always pop it as soon as they enter forge). This is the most critical skill in the whole chain -- if it gets interrupted, it royally screws with the rotation.

> > > 4. If you're being focused by a holo, kite and use your immobs/chill/cripple, or defenses/block/temp invulns. Most of them will either pop prime light beam (which you can dodge) or pop back out of holo mode, giving you a nice window to pressure them.

> > > 5. A holo that's low on health should be running away -- they will only turn around when their burst is ready again. If you are chasing a holo who's injured, wait for them to turn around and pop forge, then use any invuln skill or kiting skill you have.

> >

> > Kiting and cc a 2 seconds leap ain't that easy. Only thief can headshot a holo out of corona, no other class has an interrupt that fast and lastly kill yourself? really? who uses this in an argument lol, obviously no one with 3 braincells will let it happen.

>

> 1. That 2 second leap barely moves faster than an engineer with swiftness. If you can't kite that, you don't know how to kite.

> 2. It's actually fairly predictable. There are certain times where a holo is likely to activate their forge, but you need to practice against a few to get a sense of the timing.

> 3. The self destruct is actually really easy to accidentally trigger. I've done it several times in the course of this season (sometimes intentionally, sometimes not), but it is always a major threat when it happens.

>

> > @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> > I like the Overheat trait (14k "burst")... combine that with Rifle 5 skill and boom! someone dies. I also like how I can proc it in safety with Elixer S.

> >

> > I am bad player though

>

> That's actually pretty hard to pull off successfully in real matches. Overheat + elixir S + explosion requires you to precisely time the elixir s immediately when you overheat and you have to be in the perfect location. Rifle 5 + overheat also requires pretty precise timing and accuracy as well. You essentially have to be right on top of somebody after just finishing a holo burst to pull it off.

>

> > @"Loop.8106" said:

> > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > Blood is power necros says hi. Also, thats a pretty kitten argument haha

> >

>

> You have to be pretty bad at playing blood is power to pull that off -- you generally don't lose as much health as an overheated holo (4 self bleeds vs 1/2 your health), and you would have to intentionally do that.

>

> It's also a reasonable argument -- if you are bad at playing it and managing your heat, you will kill yourself.

 

it's actually not that hard to pull off.....

 

While waiting for the match to begin, I'm in holo mode getting it to the red part. Once it's in the red I get out of holo mode and head to the point, start the engagement, switch into holo mode and use skill 5 for the CC which will overheat you then you use rifle 5 ontop of them... All the damage will hit them while they are still CC'd.

 

Timing it with Elixer S from my point of view is only good against a scourge, overheat yourself and elixer S into the desert shroud for a safe proc.

The overheat trait is also good as a blast finiher with the water field if timed right, negates the over heat damage to yourself.

 

As the other guy said though, only works on bad players, which is a good thing cuz apparently all the good players left :sunglasses:

[Vagrant.7206]

> @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > > > It's almost like people are playing blindfolded. Holosmith has some of the most obvious tells of any of the PoF specs, and if you know what they are, are super easy to deal with. In the meantime, to everybody complaining about it's super-opness... go play it. Please. Please play it. Please play it and come back to tell me how good its sustain is.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Because if it wasn't for scourge, scrapper would whoop holosmith's kitten pretty consistently.

> > > > >

> > > > > The problem with holo is that every single skill in forge is worth a dodge. Every single one.

> > > > >

> > > > > Blitz, leap, corona, shockwave, even the kitten autoattack. They all hit for a lot of damage.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also one last reminder, just because mirage, scourge and fb are power creeped to hell and back, doesn't mean holo is fine lol.

> > > >

> > > > You missed my point. If you roll back the power creep of the scourge and FB, there are actually builds that can survive the holo nuking and dish it right back (DH, scrapper, chrono). These builds cannot persist in the current meta due to scourge AoE corruption though. The current meta is primarily glass (except FB) because glass builds are the only reasonable options against scourge, given its ease of use and spammability for massive damage and corruption. Balance is a lot like an ecosystem -- overpowered builds muscle out other less powerful builds. Is holo powerful? Yes. Is it overpowered against the tankier HoT specs? I don't think so. DH kicks holo's kitten pretty thoroughly, as does scrapper.

> > > >

> > > > Also, to your response about the skills... have you not heard of kiting and cc? If you're 1v1'ing a holo, you can interrupt them as soon as they enter forge (because I guarantee they are going to pop corona), or you can simply move away and immob/chill/cripple (the reason why scourge is so kitten effective). If you are in their face, and you are just as glassy, you will get your kitten pounded into the ground.

> > > >

> > > > The other thing everyone seems to gloss over is Holo is the only PoF spec that comes with its own built-in drawback -- overheating. If I get overzealous, I am liable to kill myself. This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > > >

> > > > > @"Brandon.8294" said:

> > > > > I feel like holos do not have large enough windows of opportunity for their enemies to exploit.

> > > >

> > > > 1. If a holo is distracted with somebody else, you can focus them down pretty quickly. On my holo I try to stay away from the enemy's attention until I'm ready to strike. If I get outnumbered, I generally try to run unless an opponent is down or very close to downed. In this sense, holo is a lot like a D/P thief.

> > > > 2. A holo is a lot like a harder hitting, but less mobile D/P thief. They are very easily countered by heavy pressure - heavy condi or spike damage. I often will focus an enemy holo over an enemy necro for this reason.

> > > > 3. If you watch holos closely, you can interrupt corona burst (they always pop it as soon as they enter forge). This is the most critical skill in the whole chain -- if it gets interrupted, it royally screws with the rotation.

> > > > 4. If you're being focused by a holo, kite and use your immobs/chill/cripple, or defenses/block/temp invulns. Most of them will either pop prime light beam (which you can dodge) or pop back out of holo mode, giving you a nice window to pressure them.

> > > > 5. A holo that's low on health should be running away -- they will only turn around when their burst is ready again. If you are chasing a holo who's injured, wait for them to turn around and pop forge, then use any invuln skill or kiting skill you have.

> > >

> > > Kiting and cc a 2 seconds leap ain't that easy. Only thief can headshot a holo out of corona, no other class has an interrupt that fast and lastly kill yourself? really? who uses this in an argument lol, obviously no one with 3 braincells will let it happen.

> >

> > 1. That 2 second leap barely moves faster than an engineer with swiftness. If you can't kite that, you don't know how to kite.

> > 2. It's actually fairly predictable. There are certain times where a holo is likely to activate their forge, but you need to practice against a few to get a sense of the timing.

> > 3. The self destruct is actually really easy to accidentally trigger. I've done it several times in the course of this season (sometimes intentionally, sometimes not), but it is always a major threat when it happens.

> >

> > > @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> > > I like the Overheat trait (14k "burst")... combine that with Rifle 5 skill and boom! someone dies. I also like how I can proc it in safety with Elixer S.

> > >

> > > I am bad player though

> >

> > That's actually pretty hard to pull off successfully in real matches. Overheat + elixir S + explosion requires you to precisely time the elixir s immediately when you overheat and you have to be in the perfect location. Rifle 5 + overheat also requires pretty precise timing and accuracy as well. You essentially have to be right on top of somebody after just finishing a holo burst to pull it off.

> >

> > > @"Loop.8106" said:

> > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > > Blood is power necros says hi. Also, thats a pretty kitten argument haha

> > >

> >

> > You have to be pretty bad at playing blood is power to pull that off -- you generally don't lose as much health as an overheated holo (4 self bleeds vs 1/2 your health), and you would have to intentionally do that.

> >

> > It's also a reasonable argument -- if you are bad at playing it and managing your heat, you will kill yourself.

>

> it's actually not that hard to pull off.....

>

> While waiting for the match to begin, I'm in holo mode getting it to the red part. Once it's in the red I get out of holo mode and head to the point, start the engagement, switch into holo mode and use skill 5 for the CC which will overheat you then you use rifle 5 ontop of them... All the damage will hit them while they are still CC'd.

>

> As the other guy said though, only works on bad players, which is a good thing cuz apparently all the good players left :sunglasses:

 

Lol. Yeah, not gonna work on most decent players in real situations. Plus all that prep work... I'll go with the more reliable meta build. :P

[sephiroth.4217]

> @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > > > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > > > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > > > > It's almost like people are playing blindfolded. Holosmith has some of the most obvious tells of any of the PoF specs, and if you know what they are, are super easy to deal with. In the meantime, to everybody complaining about it's super-opness... go play it. Please. Please play it. Please play it and come back to tell me how good its sustain is.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Because if it wasn't for scourge, scrapper would whoop holosmith's kitten pretty consistently.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The problem with holo is that every single skill in forge is worth a dodge. Every single one.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Blitz, leap, corona, shockwave, even the kitten autoattack. They all hit for a lot of damage.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Also one last reminder, just because mirage, scourge and fb are power creeped to hell and back, doesn't mean holo is fine lol.

> > > > >

> > > > > You missed my point. If you roll back the power creep of the scourge and FB, there are actually builds that can survive the holo nuking and dish it right back (DH, scrapper, chrono). These builds cannot persist in the current meta due to scourge AoE corruption though. The current meta is primarily glass (except FB) because glass builds are the only reasonable options against scourge, given its ease of use and spammability for massive damage and corruption. Balance is a lot like an ecosystem -- overpowered builds muscle out other less powerful builds. Is holo powerful? Yes. Is it overpowered against the tankier HoT specs? I don't think so. DH kicks holo's kitten pretty thoroughly, as does scrapper.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also, to your response about the skills... have you not heard of kiting and cc? If you're 1v1'ing a holo, you can interrupt them as soon as they enter forge (because I guarantee they are going to pop corona), or you can simply move away and immob/chill/cripple (the reason why scourge is so kitten effective). If you are in their face, and you are just as glassy, you will get your kitten pounded into the ground.

> > > > >

> > > > > The other thing everyone seems to gloss over is Holo is the only PoF spec that comes with its own built-in drawback -- overheating. If I get overzealous, I am liable to kill myself. This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > > > >

> > > > > > @"Brandon.8294" said:

> > > > > > I feel like holos do not have large enough windows of opportunity for their enemies to exploit.

> > > > >

> > > > > 1. If a holo is distracted with somebody else, you can focus them down pretty quickly. On my holo I try to stay away from the enemy's attention until I'm ready to strike. If I get outnumbered, I generally try to run unless an opponent is down or very close to downed. In this sense, holo is a lot like a D/P thief.

> > > > > 2. A holo is a lot like a harder hitting, but less mobile D/P thief. They are very easily countered by heavy pressure - heavy condi or spike damage. I often will focus an enemy holo over an enemy necro for this reason.

> > > > > 3. If you watch holos closely, you can interrupt corona burst (they always pop it as soon as they enter forge). This is the most critical skill in the whole chain -- if it gets interrupted, it royally screws with the rotation.

> > > > > 4. If you're being focused by a holo, kite and use your immobs/chill/cripple, or defenses/block/temp invulns. Most of them will either pop prime light beam (which you can dodge) or pop back out of holo mode, giving you a nice window to pressure them.

> > > > > 5. A holo that's low on health should be running away -- they will only turn around when their burst is ready again. If you are chasing a holo who's injured, wait for them to turn around and pop forge, then use any invuln skill or kiting skill you have.

> > > >

> > > > Kiting and cc a 2 seconds leap ain't that easy. Only thief can headshot a holo out of corona, no other class has an interrupt that fast and lastly kill yourself? really? who uses this in an argument lol, obviously no one with 3 braincells will let it happen.

> > >

> > > 1. That 2 second leap barely moves faster than an engineer with swiftness. If you can't kite that, you don't know how to kite.

> > > 2. It's actually fairly predictable. There are certain times where a holo is likely to activate their forge, but you need to practice against a few to get a sense of the timing.

> > > 3. The self destruct is actually really easy to accidentally trigger. I've done it several times in the course of this season (sometimes intentionally, sometimes not), but it is always a major threat when it happens.

> > >

> > > > @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> > > > I like the Overheat trait (14k "burst")... combine that with Rifle 5 skill and boom! someone dies. I also like how I can proc it in safety with Elixer S.

> > > >

> > > > I am bad player though

> > >

> > > That's actually pretty hard to pull off successfully in real matches. Overheat + elixir S + explosion requires you to precisely time the elixir s immediately when you overheat and you have to be in the perfect location. Rifle 5 + overheat also requires pretty precise timing and accuracy as well. You essentially have to be right on top of somebody after just finishing a holo burst to pull it off.

> > >

> > > > @"Loop.8106" said:

> > > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > > This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > > > Blood is power necros says hi. Also, thats a pretty kitten argument haha

> > > >

> > >

> > > You have to be pretty bad at playing blood is power to pull that off -- you generally don't lose as much health as an overheated holo (4 self bleeds vs 1/2 your health), and you would have to intentionally do that.

> > >

> > > It's also a reasonable argument -- if you are bad at playing it and managing your heat, you will kill yourself.

> >

> > it's actually not that hard to pull off.....

> >

> > While waiting for the match to begin, I'm in holo mode getting it to the red part. Once it's in the red I get out of holo mode and head to the point, start the engagement, switch into holo mode and use skill 5 for the CC which will overheat you then you use rifle 5 ontop of them... All the damage will hit them while they are still CC'd.

> >

> > As the other guy said though, only works on bad players, which is a good thing cuz apparently all the good players left :sunglasses:

>

> Lol. Yeah, not gonna work on most decent players in real situations. Plus all that prep work... I'll go with the more reliable meta build. :P

 

I'm into prep work builds, main reason I play Ele for 5 years or what ever.

 

It works on platinum players but as I said before, I agree it only works on bad players so it's handy all the good players have left the game :lol:

 

[zoopop.5630]

> @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > > > It's almost like people are playing blindfolded. Holosmith has some of the most obvious tells of any of the PoF specs, and if you know what they are, are super easy to deal with. In the meantime, to everybody complaining about it's super-opness... go play it. Please. Please play it. Please play it and come back to tell me how good its sustain is.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Because if it wasn't for scourge, scrapper would whoop holosmith's kitten pretty consistently.

> > > > >

> > > > > The problem with holo is that every single skill in forge is worth a dodge. Every single one.

> > > > >

> > > > > Blitz, leap, corona, shockwave, even the kitten autoattack. They all hit for a lot of damage.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also one last reminder, just because mirage, scourge and fb are power creeped to hell and back, doesn't mean holo is fine lol.

> > > >

> > > > You missed my point. If you roll back the power creep of the scourge and FB, there are actually builds that can survive the holo nuking and dish it right back (DH, scrapper, chrono). These builds cannot persist in the current meta due to scourge AoE corruption though. The current meta is primarily glass (except FB) because glass builds are the only reasonable options against scourge, given its ease of use and spammability for massive damage and corruption. Balance is a lot like an ecosystem -- overpowered builds muscle out other less powerful builds. Is holo powerful? Yes. Is it overpowered against the tankier HoT specs? I don't think so. DH kicks holo's kitten pretty thoroughly, as does scrapper.

> > > >

> > > > Also, to your response about the skills... have you not heard of kiting and cc? If you're 1v1'ing a holo, you can interrupt them as soon as they enter forge (because I guarantee they are going to pop corona), or you can simply move away and immob/chill/cripple (the reason why scourge is so kitten effective). If you are in their face, and you are just as glassy, you will get your kitten pounded into the ground.

> > > >

> > > > The other thing everyone seems to gloss over is Holo is the only PoF spec that comes with its own built-in drawback -- overheating. If I get overzealous, I am liable to kill myself. This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > > >

> > > > > @"Brandon.8294" said:

> > > > > I feel like holos do not have large enough windows of opportunity for their enemies to exploit.

> > > >

> > > > 1. If a holo is distracted with somebody else, you can focus them down pretty quickly. On my holo I try to stay away from the enemy's attention until I'm ready to strike. If I get outnumbered, I generally try to run unless an opponent is down or very close to downed. In this sense, holo is a lot like a D/P thief.

> > > > 2. A holo is a lot like a harder hitting, but less mobile D/P thief. They are very easily countered by heavy pressure - heavy condi or spike damage. I often will focus an enemy holo over an enemy necro for this reason.

> > > > 3. If you watch holos closely, you can interrupt corona burst (they always pop it as soon as they enter forge). This is the most critical skill in the whole chain -- if it gets interrupted, it royally screws with the rotation.

> > > > 4. If you're being focused by a holo, kite and use your immobs/chill/cripple, or defenses/block/temp invulns. Most of them will either pop prime light beam (which you can dodge) or pop back out of holo mode, giving you a nice window to pressure them.

> > > > 5. A holo that's low on health should be running away -- they will only turn around when their burst is ready again. If you are chasing a holo who's injured, wait for them to turn around and pop forge, then use any invuln skill or kiting skill you have.

> > >

> > > Kiting and cc a 2 seconds leap ain't that easy. Only thief can headshot a holo out of corona, no other class has an interrupt that fast and lastly kill yourself? really? who uses this in an argument lol, obviously no one with 3 braincells will let it happen.

> >

> > 1. That 2 second leap barely moves faster than an engineer with swiftness. If you can't kite that, you don't know how to kite.

> > 2. It's actually fairly predictable. There are certain times where a holo is likely to activate their forge, but you need to practice against a few to get a sense of the timing.

> > 3. The self destruct is actually really easy to accidentally trigger. I've done it several times in the course of this season (sometimes intentionally, sometimes not), but it is always a major threat when it happens.

> >

> > > @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> > > I like the Overheat trait (14k "burst")... combine that with Rifle 5 skill and boom! someone dies. I also like how I can proc it in safety with Elixer S.

> > >

> > > I am bad player though

> >

> > That's actually pretty hard to pull off successfully in real matches. Overheat + elixir S + explosion requires you to precisely time the elixir s immediately when you overheat and you have to be in the perfect location. Rifle 5 + overheat also requires pretty precise timing and accuracy as well. You essentially have to be right on top of somebody after just finishing a holo burst to pull it off.

> >

> > > @"Loop.8106" said:

> > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > This is the only class/spec in the game that can actually kill itself.

> > > Blood is power necros says hi. Also, thats a pretty kitten argument haha

> > >

> >

> > You have to be pretty bad at playing blood is power to pull that off -- you generally don't lose as much health as an overheated holo (4 self bleeds vs 1/2 your health), and you would have to intentionally do that.

> >

> > It's also a reasonable argument -- if you are bad at playing it and managing your heat, you will kill yourself.

>

> it's actually not that hard to pull off.....

>

> While waiting for the match to begin, I'm in holo mode getting it to the red part. Once it's in the red I get out of holo mode and head to the point, start the engagement, switch into holo mode and use skill 5 for the CC which will overheat you then you use rifle 5 ontop of them... All the damage will hit them while they are still CC'd.

>

> Timing it with Elixer S from my point of view is only good against a scourge, overheat yourself and elixer S into the desert shroud for a safe proc.

> The overheat trait is also good as a blast finiher with the water field if timed right, negates the over heat damage to yourself.

>

> As the other guy said though, only works on bad players, which is a good thing cuz apparently all the good players left :sunglasses:

 

what level of skill players you playing against buddy? " i get out of holo mode and head to the point, start the engagement, and switch into holo mode to use skill 5 " just gonna stop you there....