What is Revenant supposed to do in PvP?

[GrubySzymek.1362]

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > People need to stop assuming that bad in PVP = a class problem. I can't help but think that Anet purposefully has made classes vary in difficulty over a wide range to appeal to a wide range of PVPer's interests; not everyone wants a faceroll and not everyone wants a tryhard. I know it's the not answer people look for but ... you need to choose a class that works for you and suits your capabilities/interests. Unlike other games I've played, it's not so much the build that's the differentiator for PVP success in GW2, it's the class. The best part is that Anet makes it as easy as possible for you to do that ... take advantage of how character 'development' works in PVP to the fullest extent.

> >

> > This is profession problem. Revenant was only nerfed after release, its abilities are underpowered compared to other professions, has no option to deal with condition builds.

>

> No, it's not really. People who are very capable are successful with it ... it's simply one of those 'high threshold' classes. I'm not saying there isn't problems, but the evidence seems to indicate that Revenant isn't designed to be a scrub class in PVP either. Even you are indicating that the more you use it, the more capable you are with it. This makes more sense to me if you are one of the more capable PVP people.

>

> If there is a point to take away here; we can't assume Anet's not on their target with how the class performs, in any game mode, just because it doesn't compare well with other classes. For this class, it seems very natural it's harder to play in PVP, just by the nature of how Legends work and that's not something that's wrong that needs fixing; I believe classes of very different levels or performance requiring different levels of player are quite intended .. and sensible. The only thing we can fault Anet with is that they do a very poor job communicating that these differences exist and how to direct players looking for different experience levels; the class concept is NOT the only thing that differentiates class performance.

 

No. For revenant it's lack of any idea from anet how to handle this profession. It tries to be heavy armor thief but is outplayed by thief in every spectrum - mobility, offense and defense. This profession has been created with roles in mind. Its legends and traits are highly specialised. Meanwhile other profession has always been jacks of all trades because of how game was designed originally. Rev lacks firepower and reliable defenses - mainly heals and condi cleanse. Its defensive rotation is only useful when you want to run away because after you finish it, you are done. Rev is also double crippled - by energy and cooldowns, both on weapons and utilities. With rune of surging going away, another defense is byebye. So even though rev may work against bad players - everything would work on them anyway. That's non-argument. This profession has no purpose, no niche, no role. If you choose to play rev - whatever build - you always feel that other profession would do your job better. Bunker - take guardian. Decap/+1 - take thief or warrior. Damage - literally anything, both power and condi. Support - druid all the way. What's special or good about rev that I would choose it instead of other professions?

[Kahyos.1437]

> @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > People need to stop assuming that bad in PVP = a class problem. I can't help but think that Anet purposefully has made classes vary in difficulty over a wide range to appeal to a wide range of PVPer's interests; not everyone wants a faceroll and not everyone wants a tryhard. I know it's the not answer people look for but ... you need to choose a class that works for you and suits your capabilities/interests. Unlike other games I've played, it's not so much the build that's the differentiator for PVP success in GW2, it's the class. The best part is that Anet makes it as easy as possible for you to do that ... take advantage of how character 'development' works in PVP to the fullest extent.

> > >

> > > This is profession problem. Revenant was only nerfed after release, its abilities are underpowered compared to other professions, has no option to deal with condition builds.

> >

> > No, it's not really. People who are very capable are successful with it ... it's simply one of those 'high threshold' classes. I'm not saying there isn't problems, but the evidence seems to indicate that Revenant isn't designed to be a scrub class in PVP either. Even you are indicating that the more you use it, the more capable you are with it. This makes more sense to me if you are one of the more capable PVP people.

> >

> > If there is a point to take away here; we can't assume Anet's not on their target with how the class performs, in any game mode, just because it doesn't compare well with other classes. For this class, it seems very natural it's harder to play in PVP, just by the nature of how Legends work and that's not something that's wrong that needs fixing; I believe classes of very different levels or performance requiring different levels of player are quite intended .. and sensible. The only thing we can fault Anet with is that they do a very poor job communicating that these differences exist and how to direct players looking for different experience levels; the class concept is NOT the only thing that differentiates class performance.

>

> No. For revenant it's lack of any idea from anet how to handle this profession. It tries to be heavy armor thief but is outplayed by thief in every spectrum - mobility, offense and defense. This profession has been created with roles in mind. Its legends and traits are highly specialised. Meanwhile other profession has always been jacks of all trades because of how game was designed originally. Rev lacks firepower and reliable defenses - mainly heals and condi cleanse. Its defensive rotation is only useful when you want to run away because after you finish it, you are done. Rev is also double crippled - by energy and cooldowns, both on weapons and utilities. With rune of surging going away, another defense is byebye. So even though rev may work against bad players - everything would work on them anyway. That's non-argument. This profession has no purpose, no niche, no role. If you choose to play rev - whatever build - you always feel that other profession would do your job better. Bunker - take guardian. Decap/+1 - take thief or warrior. Damage - literally anything, both power and condi. Support - druid all the way. What's special or good about rev that I would choose it instead of other professions?

 

Honestly, I only play rev cause its fun. Warrior feels too bland. Thief might be a good substitute for me but I'm also kinda bored with it.

[GrubySzymek.1362]

> @"Kahyos.1437" said:

> > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > > People need to stop assuming that bad in PVP = a class problem. I can't help but think that Anet purposefully has made classes vary in difficulty over a wide range to appeal to a wide range of PVPer's interests; not everyone wants a faceroll and not everyone wants a tryhard. I know it's the not answer people look for but ... you need to choose a class that works for you and suits your capabilities/interests. Unlike other games I've played, it's not so much the build that's the differentiator for PVP success in GW2, it's the class. The best part is that Anet makes it as easy as possible for you to do that ... take advantage of how character 'development' works in PVP to the fullest extent.

> > > >

> > > > This is profession problem. Revenant was only nerfed after release, its abilities are underpowered compared to other professions, has no option to deal with condition builds.

> > >

> > > No, it's not really. People who are very capable are successful with it ... it's simply one of those 'high threshold' classes. I'm not saying there isn't problems, but the evidence seems to indicate that Revenant isn't designed to be a scrub class in PVP either. Even you are indicating that the more you use it, the more capable you are with it. This makes more sense to me if you are one of the more capable PVP people.

> > >

> > > If there is a point to take away here; we can't assume Anet's not on their target with how the class performs, in any game mode, just because it doesn't compare well with other classes. For this class, it seems very natural it's harder to play in PVP, just by the nature of how Legends work and that's not something that's wrong that needs fixing; I believe classes of very different levels or performance requiring different levels of player are quite intended .. and sensible. The only thing we can fault Anet with is that they do a very poor job communicating that these differences exist and how to direct players looking for different experience levels; the class concept is NOT the only thing that differentiates class performance.

> >

> > No. For revenant it's lack of any idea from anet how to handle this profession. It tries to be heavy armor thief but is outplayed by thief in every spectrum - mobility, offense and defense. This profession has been created with roles in mind. Its legends and traits are highly specialised. Meanwhile other profession has always been jacks of all trades because of how game was designed originally. Rev lacks firepower and reliable defenses - mainly heals and condi cleanse. Its defensive rotation is only useful when you want to run away because after you finish it, you are done. Rev is also double crippled - by energy and cooldowns, both on weapons and utilities. With rune of surging going away, another defense is byebye. So even though rev may work against bad players - everything would work on them anyway. That's non-argument. This profession has no purpose, no niche, no role. If you choose to play rev - whatever build - you always feel that other profession would do your job better. Bunker - take guardian. Decap/+1 - take thief or warrior. Damage - literally anything, both power and condi. Support - druid all the way. What's special or good about rev that I would choose it instead of other professions?

>

> Honestly, I only play rev cause its fun. Warrior feels too bland. Thief might be a good substitute for me but I'm also kinda bored with it.

 

I agree that revenant is definitely unique in its playstyle.

[Shirlias.8104]

I like the Ventari Revenant.

[Doctor.1384]

> @"Exalted Quality.8534" said:

> > @"Doctor.1384" said:

> > Rev is NOT a support class. Power rev is definately not a support build, It is best described as a cross between a warrior and a thief. It also has a very high skill cap which is why so many people say its bad. You can fight mirages and scourges but you must use your dodges and blocks effectively. To be effective in skirmishes you want to preassure their squishier classes and finnish downs.

>

> If Rev is not a support class, how do you explain BOTH herald and renegade being extremely weak specs for solo, but stronger in groups? How do you explain Revs being the 1st or 2nd best class at providing alacrity, but not being able to benefit from it in a significant way (utilities are not supposed to have cooldowns and you can never use all of your weapon skills because of the bad energy system).

>

> That said, most of the advice people gave above is accurate. Pick your fights and use your dodges wisely. If you have a support class to keep you alive, you can be somewhat effective at mid point. If you’re getting focused at mid (and you don’t have a dd, mirage, sb, or druid already filling the decapping role) play sides.

>

> After gimping power revs into nonexistence, A-net gifted us with the worst espec ever in the game in Renegade. Not only is it simply just terrible in everything outside of PvE, but it doesn’t bring any unique play style to the profession as especs are supposed to do.

>

> I’m less confident than others that the upcoming patch will put revs in a better spot. History always repeats itself...

 

Herald is perfectly fine solo, you can look on youtube for proof of that, however renegade is utter trash because the spec has no idea what it is supposed to be doing.

[Obtena.7952]

> @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > People need to stop assuming that bad in PVP = a class problem. I can't help but think that Anet purposefully has made classes vary in difficulty over a wide range to appeal to a wide range of PVPer's interests; not everyone wants a faceroll and not everyone wants a tryhard. I know it's the not answer people look for but ... you need to choose a class that works for you and suits your capabilities/interests. Unlike other games I've played, it's not so much the build that's the differentiator for PVP success in GW2, it's the class. The best part is that Anet makes it as easy as possible for you to do that ... take advantage of how character 'development' works in PVP to the fullest extent.

> > >

> > > This is profession problem. Revenant was only nerfed after release, its abilities are underpowered compared to other professions, has no option to deal with condition builds.

> >

> > No, it's not really. People who are very capable are successful with it ... it's simply one of those 'high threshold' classes. I'm not saying there isn't problems, but the evidence seems to indicate that Revenant isn't designed to be a scrub class in PVP either. Even you are indicating that the more you use it, the more capable you are with it. This makes more sense to me if you are one of the more capable PVP people.

> >

> > If there is a point to take away here; we can't assume Anet's not on their target with how the class performs, in any game mode, just because it doesn't compare well with other classes. For this class, it seems very natural it's harder to play in PVP, just by the nature of how Legends work and that's not something that's wrong that needs fixing; I believe classes of very different levels or performance requiring different levels of player are quite intended .. and sensible. The only thing we can fault Anet with is that they do a very poor job communicating that these differences exist and how to direct players looking for different experience levels; the class concept is NOT the only thing that differentiates class performance.

>

> No. For revenant it's lack of any idea from anet how to handle this profession. It tries to be heavy armor thief but is outplayed by thief in every spectrum - mobility, offense and defense. This profession has been created with roles in mind. Its legends and traits are highly specialised. Meanwhile other profession has always been jacks of all trades because of how game was designed originally. Rev lacks firepower and reliable defenses - mainly heals and condi cleanse. Its defensive rotation is only useful when you want to run away because after you finish it, you are done. Rev is also double crippled - by energy and cooldowns, both on weapons and utilities. With rune of surging going away, another defense is byebye. So even though rev may work against bad players - everything would work on them anyway. That's non-argument. This profession has no purpose, no niche, no role. If you choose to play rev - whatever build - you always feel that other profession would do your job better. Bunker - take guardian. Decap/+1 - take thief or warrior. Damage - literally anything, both power and condi. Support - druid all the way. What's special or good about rev that I would choose it instead of other professions?

 

Whether Anet has any idea on how to handle the profession is completely irrelevant though ... it's the end result that matters.

 

If it's reasonable to assume there should be different difficulties between classes for a threshold of performance, how they get it really doesn't matter. If Anet achieves a desired level of difficulty by chance, it's almost a freebie to Anet, no matter how any player wants to attribute that difficulty.

 

I don't think it's actually honest to say they don't have any idea of how to handle the profession. I mean, the idea of legends doesn't require a Ph.D. to understand it ... so the idea as a concept isn't about not knowing how to 'handle' it. You can question if it's a sound concept; I think where this concept fails is that it sacrifices versatility for ... I'm not sure. It's too restricitive for seemingly little advantage. This makes it hard play; that might be complete intended.

 

Ultimately, as I will say over and over again, it's up to the player to pick a class that works for them, regardless if you buy into the 'intended varition in difficulty' theory, or whether you think Anet is just a big screwup ... Choice is what saves you here because if you believe the class is so fundamentally flawed because of legend implementation, then there isn't really any fix for that in the first place; there isn't any real value in Anet reworking a class that many people don't succeed with because they have given us choice of class for PVP/WVW.

[GrubySzymek.1362]

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > > People need to stop assuming that bad in PVP = a class problem. I can't help but think that Anet purposefully has made classes vary in difficulty over a wide range to appeal to a wide range of PVPer's interests; not everyone wants a faceroll and not everyone wants a tryhard. I know it's the not answer people look for but ... you need to choose a class that works for you and suits your capabilities/interests. Unlike other games I've played, it's not so much the build that's the differentiator for PVP success in GW2, it's the class. The best part is that Anet makes it as easy as possible for you to do that ... take advantage of how character 'development' works in PVP to the fullest extent.

> > > >

> > > > This is profession problem. Revenant was only nerfed after release, its abilities are underpowered compared to other professions, has no option to deal with condition builds.

> > >

> > > No, it's not really. People who are very capable are successful with it ... it's simply one of those 'high threshold' classes. I'm not saying there isn't problems, but the evidence seems to indicate that Revenant isn't designed to be a scrub class in PVP either. Even you are indicating that the more you use it, the more capable you are with it. This makes more sense to me if you are one of the more capable PVP people.

> > >

> > > If there is a point to take away here; we can't assume Anet's not on their target with how the class performs, in any game mode, just because it doesn't compare well with other classes. For this class, it seems very natural it's harder to play in PVP, just by the nature of how Legends work and that's not something that's wrong that needs fixing; I believe classes of very different levels or performance requiring different levels of player are quite intended .. and sensible. The only thing we can fault Anet with is that they do a very poor job communicating that these differences exist and how to direct players looking for different experience levels; the class concept is NOT the only thing that differentiates class performance.

> >

> > No. For revenant it's lack of any idea from anet how to handle this profession. It tries to be heavy armor thief but is outplayed by thief in every spectrum - mobility, offense and defense. This profession has been created with roles in mind. Its legends and traits are highly specialised. Meanwhile other profession has always been jacks of all trades because of how game was designed originally. Rev lacks firepower and reliable defenses - mainly heals and condi cleanse. Its defensive rotation is only useful when you want to run away because after you finish it, you are done. Rev is also double crippled - by energy and cooldowns, both on weapons and utilities. With rune of surging going away, another defense is byebye. So even though rev may work against bad players - everything would work on them anyway. That's non-argument. This profession has no purpose, no niche, no role. If you choose to play rev - whatever build - you always feel that other profession would do your job better. Bunker - take guardian. Decap/+1 - take thief or warrior. Damage - literally anything, both power and condi. Support - druid all the way. What's special or good about rev that I would choose it instead of other professions?

>

> Whether Anet has any idea on how to handle the profession is completely irrelevant though ... it's the end result that matters.

>

> If it's reasonable to assume there should be different difficulties between classes for a threshold of performance, how they get it really doesn't matter. If Anet achieves a desired level of difficulty by chance, it's almost a freebie to Anet, no matter how any player wants to attribute that difficulty.

>

> I don't think it's actually honest to say they don't have any idea of how to handle the profession. I mean, the idea of legends doesn't require a Ph.D. to understand it ... so the idea as a concept isn't about not knowing how to 'handle' it. You can question if it's a sound concept; I think where this concept fails is that it sacrifices versatility for ... I'm not sure. It's too restricitive for seemingly little advantage. This makes it hard play; that might be complete intended.

 

What you are talking about would be true only if revenant was on same power level as other professions. As I already explained to you, anything that revenant does, other professions ALWAYS do better. This is not problem of player skill, this is a problem of balance and direction, which revenant lacks.

[Obtena.7952]

No, it's true even if Revenant is not on the same power level of other professions. There is NOTHING in this game that gives players the illusion that classes should perform at the same level, have the same level of difficulty to play or that there is any correlation between how hard it is to play and how well you can do with it; NOTHING. If you think that's true, you've convinced yourself of it.

 

I mean, it's very irrelevant if class X does something better than another. That doesn't make a specific class bad in PVP/WVW. That argument doesn't make sense. Being the best at any number of things doesn't predisposition a class for being good in PVP, EVEN if you believe every class should perform at the same level. The same thing is true at being the worst at any number of things. There are lots of things that go into what makes a class 'good' and anyone that thinks it's any one particular thing that makes it not good doesn't understand that part of the game to begin with.

[ImperialWL.7138]

> @"Forsakens.9726" said:

> Revenant is a support class. You job is too boon share with the support of glint facets, or to provide damage support with renegade, either one is useful. Revenant requires a heavy learning curve. If you could get pass this barrier of struggle, you could almost be put on the level of other classes. Here is a tip when engaging in a 1v1 situation. always take it slow, look at the enemy instead of the user interface that shows your skills cooldowns, just make quick glances at it you don’t need to look at it for long. And when I mean “take it slow” don’t just spam your attack and evades, revenant n1 weakness is to be taken down before your heals skill is up, so when their is like 6 seconds left until your glint heal is ready, play defensively to pass time on your heal skill.

>

> Also avoid fighting mirages or scourges they would eat you alive.

 

Please ignore this guy cos his very first sentence is 180 wrong.

 

Since OP is talking about exclusively PvP, revenant's role is DPS. The marauder build on meta battle is the most popular DPS build but you can also play some others such as hammer or even condi. You can team fight or roam on it because it has some degree of mobility with superspeed and phase traversal. Rev is a hard class to learn and be successful at.

 

Most of the revs issues revolve around surviving.it doesn't have the sustain to excel in team fights and the glint heal is easily countered. You need to pick your fights carefully and know when to go in/disengage. You want to play like a thief almost, because sword 4 is very strong in terms of burst. Your best source of burst is phase traversal + sword 4 then sword 2, for instance.

 

If all you're interested in is getting Revenant achievements then just keep at it. Rev will become better soon because most other meta builds will be taking substantial nerfs but not worth the wait cos you will very easily get the achievements anyway.

[Forsakens.9726]

> @"ImperialWL.7138" said:

> > @"Forsakens.9726" said:

> > Revenant is a support class. You job is too boon share with the support of glint facets, or to provide damage support with renegade, either one is useful. Revenant requires a heavy learning curve. If you could get pass this barrier of struggle, you could almost be put on the level of other classes. Here is a tip when engaging in a 1v1 situation. always take it slow, look at the enemy instead of the user interface that shows your skills cooldowns, just make quick glances at it you don’t need to look at it for long. And when I mean “take it slow” don’t just spam your attack and evades, revenant n1 weakness is to be taken down before your heals skill is up, so when their is like 6 seconds left until your glint heal is ready, play defensively to pass time on your heal skill.

> >

> > Also avoid fighting mirages or scourges they would eat you alive.

>

> Please ignore this guy cos his very first sentence is 180 wrong.

>

> Since OP is talking about exclusively PvP, revenant's role is DPS. The marauder build on meta battle is the most popular DPS build but you can also play some others such as hammer or even condi. You can team fight or roam on it because it has some degree of mobility with superspeed and phase traversal. Rev is a hard class to learn and be successful at.

>

> Most of the revs issues revolve around surviving.it doesn't have the sustain to excel in team fights and the glint heal is easily countered. You need to pick your fights carefully and know when to go in/disengage. You want to play like a thief almost, because sword 4 is very strong in terms of burst. Your best source of burst is phase traversal + sword 4 then sword 2, for instance.

>

> If all you're interested in is getting Revenant achievements then just keep at it. Rev will become better soon because most other meta builds will be taking substantial nerfs but not worth the wait cos you will very easily get the achievements anyway.

 

How is my first sentence wrong? Bro you based your facts on a metabuild and you’re disagreeing with me for saying rev isn’t a support class. It could be a support class, it could be a dps class, it could be a tank class. It could be your mum as well.

 

Plus you added that revenant role “should” be similar to that of a thief and then you complained about it for haveing survivability issues. My god dude, lets just ignore the fact that revenant has 2 heal skills, let’s just ignore the fact that my Venturi build isnt lacking in sustain. Let’s just all ignore the fact that I can pulse protection with my facet of chaos. Some people (I’m not saying it’s only you) divert the community into thinking revs Job should be like a thief in pvp (it could be though) even though a thief does a better job at rev in this catagory.

 

 

So what is revenants role in pvp? Should it be a thief? Should it be a bunker class? Should it be a support class? Should it be a dps class?

I am sorry if no one really understood my indea on rev.

And If you really want to know you, must try rev and play the different build and say “this build suits my playstyle I want to be a bunker rev or a a dps variant” it’s up to you to decide. And don’t always base your facts on meta builds, it’s what the community thinks only.

I hope this clears up on what I said earlier (and I apologize)

 

P.s you may come up with a revolutionary build for rev.

Adios my revenant bros.

[Forsakens.9726]

> @"ImperialWL.7138" said:

> > @"Forsakens.9726" said:

> > Revenant is a support class. You job is too boon share with the support of glint facets, or to provide damage support with renegade, either one is useful. Revenant requires a heavy learning curve. If you could get pass this barrier of struggle, you could almost be put on the level of other classes. Here is a tip when engaging in a 1v1 situation. always take it slow, look at the enemy instead of the user interface that shows your skills cooldowns, just make quick glances at it you don’t need to look at it for long. And when I mean “take it slow” don’t just spam your attack and evades, revenant n1 weakness is to be taken down before your heals skill is up, so when their is like 6 seconds left until your glint heal is ready, play defensively to pass time on your heal skill.

> >

> > Also avoid fighting mirages or scourges they would eat you alive.

>

> Please ignore this guy cos his very first sentence is 180 wrong.

>

> Since OP is talking about exclusively PvP, revenant's role is DPS. The marauder build on meta battle is the most popular DPS build but you can also play some others such as hammer or even condi. You can team fight or roam on it because it has some degree of mobility with superspeed and phase traversal. Rev is a hard class to learn and be successful at.

>

> Most of the revs issues revolve around surviving.it doesn't have the sustain to excel in team fights and the glint heal is easily countered. You need to pick your fights carefully and know when to go in/disengage. You want to play like a thief almost, because sword 4 is very strong in terms of burst. Your best source of burst is phase traversal + sword 4 then sword 2, for instance.

>

> If all you're interested in is getting Revenant achievements then just keep at it. Rev will become better soon because most other meta builds will be taking substantial nerfs but not worth the wait cos you will very easily get the achievements anyway.

 

Okay I am going off topic in this discussion and I must admit it’s harder for me to deal with sources and mirages. But you said “pick your fights carefully” what if I’m up against a team with only scourges? Do I pick the weaker scourge to deal with? Plus u said your job is to be like a thief. A thief doesn’t pick targets, it kills whatever’s on the point. And when I said avoid fighting mirage or scourges I was joking. I guess I was equally as guilty. :(((((

 

 

[ScottBroChill.3254]

> @"Forsakens.9726" said:

> Plus you added that revenant role “should” be similar to that of a thief and then you complained about it for haveing survivability issues. My god dude, lets just ignore the fact that revenant has 2 heal skills, let’s just ignore the fact that my Venturi build isnt lacking in sustain. Let’s just all ignore the fact that I can pulse protection with my facet of chaos. Some people (I’m not saying it’s only you) divert the community into thinking revs Job should be like a thief in pvp (it could be though) even though a thief does a better job at rev in this catagory.

>

It's original skills balance and intention made it excel in the thief category, and then because that play style was nerfed we were left with some of the support options and one mediocre power build that has little sustain. The condi specs are good, but because of the dependency on resistance, it tends to be weak because of the constant corruption and boon strip especially in places like pvp and WvW. Another thing to talk about is the 2 healing skills. They aren't that good and they provides no benefits to the class. It basically splits up the power of a single heal skill into two, and then the power of the skill is situational dependent and aren't reliable to get you out of a jam. Glints heal, arguably a really good heal, does nothing if the enemy sees you've cast it and doesn't attack for a couple of seconds. It has no value when kiting or running away. Shiros heal forces you to hit people with it. Jalis has arguably the only good, all around heal for the class.

 

Also, ventari sustain? You do realize that you must build for bunker and heal for this to work, which means the ventari sustain has no benefit to the rest of the class. You cant really use the skills and trait line for a bruiser spec. Its not like the passive sustain that war and guard can use for even their dps or bruiser builds. So in every dps or offensive oriented build, rev still has little to no sustain. I'm not arguing they should have or not have sustain, I'm just saying they don't have sustain as a core competence and what do they get as a trade off? Nothing noteworthy. They used to have assassin-like potential, but not anymore. And I agree, its damage has been gutted so bad (excluding a couple scenarios) that it is forced to use support options. But that's similar to if ele had its damage ripped to shreds so all that was left was auramancer support builds. It would make an ele a support class out of default but, it would be severely outperformed by druid and chrono.

 

 

[Forsakens.9726]

> @"ScottBroChill.3254" said:

> > @"Forsakens.9726" said:

> > Plus you added that revenant role “should” be similar to that of a thief and then you complained about it for haveing survivability issues. My god dude, lets just ignore the fact that revenant has 2 heal skills, let’s just ignore the fact that my Venturi build isnt lacking in sustain. Let’s just all ignore the fact that I can pulse protection with my facet of chaos. Some people (I’m not saying it’s only you) divert the community into thinking revs Job should be like a thief in pvp (it could be though) even though a thief does a better job at rev in this catagory.

> >

> It's original skills balance and intention made it excel in the thief category, and then because that play style was nerfed we were left with some of the support options and one mediocre power build that has little sustain. The condi specs are good, but because of the dependency on resistance, it tends to be weak because of the constant corruption and boon strip especially in places like pvp and WvW. Another thing to talk about is the 2 healing skills. They aren't that good and they provides no benefits to the class. It basically splits up the power of a single heal skill into two, and then the power of the skill is situational dependent and aren't reliable to get you out of a jam. Glints heal, arguably a really good heal, does nothing if the enemy sees you've cast it and doesn't attack for a couple of seconds. It has no value when kiting or running away. Shiros heal forces you to hit people with it. Jalis has arguably the only good, all around heal for the class.

>

> Also, ventari sustain? You do realize that you must build for bunker and heal for this to work, which means the ventari sustain has no benefit to the rest of the class. You cant really use the skills and trait line for a bruiser spec. Its not like the passive sustain that war and guard can use for even their dps or bruiser builds. So in every dps or offensive oriented build, rev still has little to no sustain. I'm not arguing they should have or not have sustain, I'm just saying they don't have sustain as a core competence and what do they get as a trade off? Nothing noteworthy. They used to have assassin-like potential, but not anymore. And I agree, its damage has been gutted so bad (excluding a couple scenarios) that it is forced to use support options. But that's similar to if ele had its damage ripped to shreds so all that was left was auramancer support builds. It would make an ele a support class out of default but, it would be severely outperformed by druid and chrono.

>

>

 

I agree with what you said but

so many people complain about rev for having such a non-passive style. If it were to have a more passive playstyle many more people would pick up on rev which I feel isn't a good thing because how anet made rev to be a really unique profession. (every profession is unique in its own way but revs I feel is a lot unique)

 

I feel rev is for the people who are tired of the passive gameplay of the core professions and they want to experience something different because revenant is such a dynamic class. (This is just my opinion I'm not saying everyone has the same point of view)

 

And what is the point of playing rev when some people want it to have the same treatment as a guardian or warrior? Just play war or guardian because it's a lot easier to play.

 

 

[ScottBroChill.3254]

> @"Forsakens.9726" said:

> I agree with what you said but

> so many people complain about rev for having such a non-passive style. If it were to have a more passive playstyle many more people would pick up on rev which I feel isn't a good thing because how anet made rev to be a really unique profession. (every profession is unique in its own way but revs I feel is a lot unique)

>

> I feel rev is for the people who are tired of the passive gameplay of the core professions and they want to experience something different because revenant is such a dynamic class. (This is just my opinion I'm not saying everyone has the same point of view)

>

> And what is the point of playing rev when some people want it to have the same treatment as a guardian or warrior? Just play war or guardian because it's a lot easier to play.

>

>

 

I just don't think revs active playstyles are effective or useful anymore. There are currently increasing cooldowns and decreasing energy costs, basically making the energy management non existent. Although, it wasn't really working well before with how the skills were built. They provide benefits that shouldnt be spammed because of how strong they'd be, so they need cooldowns. But with cooldowns there is not point in energy. Then, its survivability has been gutted a bunch for its offensive builds, so a sw/sw and staff rev build for power dps although it requires a very active playstyle doesn't really measure up to other builds. It takes a lot of team support and the only reason you see some people wreck on it is because people who are just really skilled at the game just outplay bad players from a mechanical standpoint, but that says nothing of the classes balance, but more so an imbalance in player skill. All of its meta builds are rather passive boon bots with herald who just pulses out boons or kalla which applies its kalla's fervor and you press f2 and f4 a lot. So i agree with you, its just that the passive builds for revs are the only ones worth playing in the meta if you're trying to be effective. I guess ventari healer is an exception.

[ZeftheWicked.3076]

I honestly think that in major portion (but not whole) rev's not the problem here. It's everything else.

 

Firstly starting with other professions that are given unbalanced defensive options.

Rev has a LOT of defenses if he builds for them. But they are all balanced and fair, with clear counterplay.

Compare that to stuff like mesmer distortions, dragon hunter's F3 block that lets him attack all day long and interrupted still stays there like nothing, or thief evade spam with sw/dagger or dagger/dagger builds. Not to mention stuff like full counter (sure, we can talk outplays vs spellbreaker in 1v1, but walk into middle node and FC gets triggered, always).

 

The amulet choices in spvp also aren't making it easy for rev. They took their sweet time making sure that you don't more then one of tougness, vitality or healing power on any given amulet save paladin. Especially for condi, which a while ago did get addressed (less stacks, longer duration, so it can't be used for power style quick bursts), and could use bit more love stat-wise.

 

On rev's part i must say condi suffers in competitive. Power revs have amazing ability to stick to their targets like a bad case of flu, while condi builds can't catch them even if their life depended on it.

 

More over too many condi rev's skills are pulsing skillshots, which means that not only you have to land that thing proper, but the enemy will 99% sure walk/dodge/blink outta it before it even gets started doing real damage, while your condi kit offers little to prevent that scenario from happening.

[GrubySzymek.1362]

Hello again bois,

 

I've read your suggestions and I can't wait to test rev during season. I know the spec didn't really change after the patch but since others are now nerfed I expect my gameplay better this time. Rune of surging is still Q_Q for me, but I remember playing rev with Leadership before so should be fine.

[wwDefuser.2056]

I play hammer - s/s -rev at the moment.

 

I feel more compfortable with hammer cause you are not limited in range fighting scourges, ... . Also you have 2 ranged cc and and quite good dodge on ham #3.

 

[GrubySzymek.1362]

Revenant is beyond redemption. Unless anet reworks and/or significantly buffs this profession, it's actually shameful practice to sell it as expansion feature.

[messiah.1908]

in pvp you can test paladin amulet sustain dmg with hammer. so fight with a group

the old meta is still viable but dont try 1v1 mesmer, warrior and a thief as it can get you killed or wasting time

[Master Ketsu.4569]

> @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

>damage is weak

 

wat.

 

Revenant damage is awesome. We are the only soldier class that can auto a bunker to death. Our sword 4-5 combo instantly deletes squishies too.

 

The issues this class faces are purely utility. We simply do not have the options and get out of jail cards that other classes have, so rev can get screwed by dumb crap like binding roots which is easily avoidable on any other meta spec.

 

 

[GrubySzymek.1362]

Ladies and Gentlemen, I managed to survive the nightmare and get both Revered achievements yesterday. Being silver 3 (sometimes reaching gold 2) player doesn't allow me to discuss PvP itself, however I feel that talking about profession itself isn't bad thing to do for me.

 

I was playing standard duelist/bursting herald build as support option didn't really work for me in the long run.

 

I agree that rev damage isn't bad at all. After they reworked offhand sword and taking into consideration sustain nerfs for other professions in last patch, revenant finally feels bursty. It's also really "sticky" as tools provided to chase enemy are really good. Not thief level but still good enough to kill running enemy.

 

My win ratio this season up to now is slightly above 50% (65/125). Passive boon stacking is obviously great thing about herald and helps in teamfights. Unaware enemies can be killed really fast if not paying attention and positioning is the key. Mobility is also great with Impossible Odds and perma swiftness.

 

However, when you are focused as rev or dueling with player aware of your skills and profession strengths/weaknesses, you are outplayed really fast. Especially against conditions, which is pretty well known fact. When I am targeted and focused by scourge I really struggle with rev. Like seriously, whole condi cleanse rotation may sound nice but it is nothing when scourge is pulsing it's AoEs. I only engaged them when they were either running away at low health or +1 in teamfight and even then it was never safe to do so. During teamfights it feels like yes, I can burst and even down players but as long as the fight is going I have no way to secure the stomp. And it feels like any profession has something to do so - wars can pop stances, guardians have multiple block choices, necros are tanks by design, thieves can stealth, eles can block or mistform, mesmers... hehe, engineers can eli S, rangers same as necros + stealth. With rev it feels like if I allow myself to stop - I'm dead.

 

For defensive abilities I don't know what could really help. Maybe pulsating passive stab for Glint Elite upkeep or traitet block/invuln for 1-2 secs when channeling.

 

For condi cleanse I'd welcome a buff to staff 4. AoE ally condi remove stays at 2 but rev personal removel should be 4 condis with maaybe if 4 condis are removed CD is shortened by 30%.

 

In conclusion, after last week patch the gap between rev and other professions is smaller but some tweaks still should happen.

 

I never tried renegade, I don't like the spec but from what I've heard it's even worse. And yeah, even for a scrub like me renegades I met were free kills.

[messiah.1908]

> @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> Ladies and Gentlemen, I managed to survive the nightmare and get both Revered achievements yesterday. Being silver 3 (sometimes reaching gold 2) player doesn't allow me to discuss PvP itself, however I feel that talking about profession itself isn't bad thing to do for me.

>

> I was playing standard duelist/bursting herald build as support option didn't really work for me in the long run.

>

> I agree that rev damage isn't bad at all. After they reworked offhand sword and taking into consideration sustain nerfs for other professions in last patch, revenant finally feels bursty. It's also really "sticky" as tools provided to chase enemy are really good. Not thief level but still good enough to kill running enemy.

>

> My win ratio this season up to now is slightly above 50% (65/125). Passive boon stacking is obviously great thing about herald and helps in teamfights. Unaware enemies can be killed really fast if not paying attention and positioning is the key. Mobility is also great with Impossible Odds and perma swiftness.

>

> However, when you are focused as rev or dueling with player aware of your skills and profession strengths/weaknesses, you are outplayed really fast. Especially against conditions, which is pretty well known fact. When I am targeted and focused by scourge I really struggle with rev. Like seriously, whole condi cleanse rotation may sound nice but it is nothing when scourge is pulsing it's AoEs. I only engaged them when they were either running away at low health or +1 in teamfight and even then it was never safe to do so. During teamfights it feels like yes, I can burst and even down players but as long as the fight is going I have no way to secure the stomp. And it feels like any profession has something to do so - wars can pop stances, guardians have multiple block choices, necros are tanks by design, thieves can stealth, eles can block or mistform, mesmers... hehe, engineers can eli S, rangers same as necros + stealth. With rev it feels like if I allow myself to stop - I'm dead.

>

> For defensive abilities I don't know what could really help. Maybe pulsating passive stab for Glint Elite upkeep or traitet block/invuln for 1-2 secs when channeling.

>

> For condi cleanse I'd welcome a buff to staff 4. AoE ally condi remove stays at 2 but rev personal removel should be 4 condis with maaybe if 4 condis are removed CD is shortened by 30%.

>

> In conclusion, after last week patch the gap between rev and other professions is smaller but some tweaks still should happen.

>

> I never tried renegade, I don't like the spec but from what I've heard it's even worse. And yeah, even for a scrub like me renegades I met were free kills.

 

i kinda find scourge more doable . with renagade also :D

i even try SB with maraduer amulets and in team fights it melt them fast but dont get focused or you are dead in a sec or two.

my problem revenant become more and more team player from where it used to be. cleanse abilities anet refuse to give us and want to push use to jalis (heal skill buff)

 

[BlaqueFyre.5678]

Respawn...

[Buran.3796]

To be fair is not supposed for the Rev to be used in PvP: has clear disadvantages in most of 1 vs 1 (with some pretty clear hard counters). People will argue that is meant to be played as +1, but let's be realistic here: most of the matches displays 0 teamwork (you call a target and no one focus on him, you try to heal team mates with support classes and they flee from you, etc.) so trying to play as +1 is oftenly a wishful thinking, specially when there's other classes in the game which do that role better while having strong 1 vs 1 matchups.

 

Rev was also interesting in the past because albeit not as mobile as Thief our cleave damage was useful in teamfights and killing downed foes, but with the rise of the Scourge, and the nerf of IO our AoE cleave is now clearly overshadowed (not to mention that plenty other classes can secure stomps in a blink).

[SWI.4127]

> @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> >damage is weak

>

> wat.

>

> Revenant damage is awesome. We are the only soldier class that can auto a bunker to death. Our sword 4-5 combo instantly deletes squishies too.

>

> The issues this class faces are purely utility. We simply do not have the options and get out of jail cards that other classes have, so rev can get screwed by dumb crap like binding roots which is easily avoidable on any other meta spec.

>

>

 

You are right about lack of utility, but just for the sake of your example, you can use Riposting Shadows to get out of immob