shadowpass.4236 Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. Used to be. Changed. It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoopop.5630 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 seems like a certain someone has been quiet, so we good with the mesmer defending for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deihnyx.6318 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"Arlette.9684" said: > If you get hit by defender, I’m sorry but it’s an l2p issue. What the combat log fails to showcase is that the defender is immobile and has a rather small radius, so simply moving away from it would’ve saved you from taking any damage. You only have yourself to blame. > > P.S. I almost forgot everyone’s favorite line. > Git Gud! It's not, as soon as there's 2 mesmers in a team it becomes ridiculous. And I'm sorry, but for most classes that deal high damage there's also a high risk. Mesmer has no risk/reward, you fail to 1 shot? no problem to run away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. > > Used to be. Changed. > > It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. It changed, which is precisely why its now an issue and should be nerfed or changed again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > > > > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. > > > > Used to be. Changed. > > > > It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. > > It changed, which is precisely why its now an issue and should be nerfed or changed again. I think the max damage on it should be capped much lower but calling it a defensive is like calling Prime Light Beam a defensive skill. It's objectively 100% wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > > > > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > > > > > > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. > > > > > > Used to be. Changed. > > > > > > It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. > > > > It changed, which is precisely why its now an issue and should be nerfed or changed again. > > I think the max damage on it should be capped much lower but calling it a defensive is like calling Prime Light Beam a defensive skill. It's objectively 100% wrong. I think they should come out with a utility called Phantasmal Attacker and have it do 0 damage and nullify all damage in a 600 range circle. Because that _makes sense._ It's called Illusionary DEFENDER. It should not hit for 75% or more of someone's health. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > > > > > > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > > > > > > > > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. > > > > > > > > Used to be. Changed. > > > > > > > > It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. > > > > > > It changed, which is precisely why its now an issue and should be nerfed or changed again. > > > > I think the max damage on it should be capped much lower but calling it a defensive is like calling Prime Light Beam a defensive skill. It's objectively 100% wrong. > > I think they should come out with a utility called Phantasmal Attacker and have it do 0 damage and nullify all damage in a 600 range circle. Because that _makes sense._ > > It's called Illusionary DEFENDER. It should not hit for 75% or more of someone's health. You're getting way too hung up on the name. It's still called defender because the phantasm blocks attacks aimed at it and does damage based on how much it absorbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > > > > > > > > > > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. > > > > > > > > > > Used to be. Changed. > > > > > > > > > > It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. > > > > > > > > It changed, which is precisely why its now an issue and should be nerfed or changed again. > > > > > > I think the max damage on it should be capped much lower but calling it a defensive is like calling Prime Light Beam a defensive skill. It's objectively 100% wrong. > > > > I think they should come out with a utility called Phantasmal Attacker and have it do 0 damage and nullify all damage in a 600 range circle. Because that _makes sense._ > > > > It's called Illusionary DEFENDER. It should not hit for 75% or more of someone's health. > > You're getting way too hung up on the name. It's still called defender because the phantasm blocks attacks aimed at it and does damage based on how much it absorbs. No lmao it's called defender because it used to reduce the damage taken by the mesmer and nearby allies by 50%. However they buffed it to ridiculousness and kept the name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. > > > > > > > > > > > > Used to be. Changed. > > > > > > > > > > > > It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. > > > > > > > > > > It changed, which is precisely why its now an issue and should be nerfed or changed again. > > > > > > > > I think the max damage on it should be capped much lower but calling it a defensive is like calling Prime Light Beam a defensive skill. It's objectively 100% wrong. > > > > > > I think they should come out with a utility called Phantasmal Attacker and have it do 0 damage and nullify all damage in a 600 range circle. Because that _makes sense._ > > > > > > It's called Illusionary DEFENDER. It should not hit for 75% or more of someone's health. > > > > You're getting way too hung up on the name. It's still called defender because the phantasm blocks attacks aimed at it and does damage based on how much it absorbs. > > No lmao it's called defender because it used to reduce the damage taken by the mesmer and nearby allies by 50%. However they buffed it to ridiculousness and kept the name. Eliminate Chronophantasma and Mental Defense, make the max damage cap 50% lower than it is and I'm perfectly fine with the skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OriOri.8724 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > > > > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > > > > > > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. > > > > > > Used to be. Changed. > > > > > > It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. > > > > It changed, which is precisely why its now an issue and should be nerfed or changed again. > > I think the max damage on it should be capped much lower but calling it a defensive is like calling Prime Light Beam a defensive skill. It's objectively 100% wrong. No. Its still a defensive skill. Its just very poorly tuned, in almost every way imaginable. When you use the skill, a different entity taunts the enemy, taking pressure off of yourself. Conceptually its a defensive skill. And it should be balanced in such a way that reflects that, or be redesigned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"OriOri.8724" said: > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > > > > > > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > > > > > > > > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. > > > > > > > > Used to be. Changed. > > > > > > > > It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. > > > > > > It changed, which is precisely why its now an issue and should be nerfed or changed again. > > > > I think the max damage on it should be capped much lower but calling it a defensive is like calling Prime Light Beam a defensive skill. It's objectively 100% wrong. > > No. Its still a defensive skill. Its just very poorly tuned, in almost every way imaginable. When you use the skill, a different entity taunts the enemy, taking pressure off of yourself. Conceptually its a defensive skill. And it should be balanced in such a way that reflects that, or be redesigned And Prime Light Beam is a blow out that also takes pressure off yourself by ccing the enemy. The damage is overturned but the core mechanics of the skill are fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaldaRaric.6305 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 After coming back to my Mesmer main I can tell this is a L2P issue. It’s so easy to spot when you get taunted by the ID. Like, the fact that people say they can’t see it because of the illusion spam makes me laugh. I used to cry about the illusion spam until I learned to play against a Mesmer. They are also definitely really not that hard to pick out the real one. Hint, when you get taunted, your target changes and you lose control of your character and start running towards the ID while auto attacking. Your screen also flashes. You also get a symbol above your head. You people REALLY can’t tell you are attacking it??? LEARN TO PLAY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"CaldaRaric.6305" said: > After coming back to my Mesmer main I can tell this is a L2P issue. It’s so easy to spot when you get taunted by the ID. Like, the fact that people say they can’t see it because of the illusion spam makes me laugh. I used to cry about the illusion spam until I learned to play against a Mesmer. They are also definitely really not that hard to pick out the real one. > > Hint, when you get taunted, your target changes and you lose control of your character and start running towards the ID while auto attacking. Your screen also flashes. You also get a symbol above your head. > > You people REALLY can’t tell you are attacking it??? > > LEARN TO PLAY. > Yeah its a L2P issue. That's precisely why Chronomancer (the build that uses Phantasmal Defender) got banned from the Mist Challenger Tournament last Saturday. It's because every single high tier player competing in the tournament has a L2P issue. :] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagrant.7206 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"CaldaRaric.6305" said: > After coming back to my Mesmer main I can tell this is a L2P issue. It’s so easy to spot when you get taunted by the ID. Like, the fact that people say they can’t see it because of the illusion spam makes me laugh. I used to cry about the illusion spam until I learned to play against a Mesmer. They are also definitely really not that hard to pick out the real one. > > Hint, when you get taunted, your target changes and you lose control of your character and start running towards the ID while auto attacking. Your screen also flashes. You also get a symbol above your head. You would be right if there wasn't a little thing called stability. See, stability prevents taunt's CC from affecting the player. So if you're a holosmith, warrior, or firebrand who has stability on (current meta builds with stability), you may never notice the taunt in the first place, which makes phantasmal defender **much** harder to spot amidst the other illusions. Additionally, the phantasm will also punish everyone in the given area, so in a teamfight if a scourge or holo is brainlessly spamming on your team, the phantasmal defender may actually kill somebody who wasn't even attacking it. In general, not a good design -- it's fine to have a skill that punishes players for attacking recklessly (IE Retaliation), but it's not ok for it to do as massive damage as it seems to currently do, especially when it's hurting players who may not have hit it at all. If you go back to GW1, there's a great hex that can be used as an example -- [spiteful Spirit](https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Spiteful_Spirit "Spiteful Spirit"). I'd rather see phantasmal defender replaced with something akin to this, as it requires more skill to use effectively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deihnyx.6318 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"CaldaRaric.6305" said: > After coming back to my Mesmer main I can tell this is a L2P issue. It’s so easy to spot when you get taunted by the ID. Like, the fact that people say they can’t see it because of the illusion spam makes me laugh. I used to cry about the illusion spam until I learned to play against a Mesmer. They are also definitely really not that hard to pick out the real one. > > Hint, when you get taunted, your target changes and you lose control of your character and start running towards the ID while auto attacking. Your screen also flashes. You also get a symbol above your head. > > You people REALLY can’t tell you are attacking it??? > > LEARN TO PLAY. > Again, 1 mesmer is fine, 2 (or more because people swap and exploit this stupid) is quickly ridiculous. 3 and I would love to see videos of teams that beat a team with 3 mesmers in it. And yes it is a visual mess (just like scourge can be when they team up). Unlike scourge though, which -has- counters, mesmers have no good counters, or it requires nerfing your build to oblivion. And again, the risk/reward is ridiculously generous for mesmer, they take no/very little risk doing anything unlike other classes. If you miss your one shot it's not a big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Used to be. Changed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It changed, which is precisely why its now an issue and should be nerfed or changed again. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think the max damage on it should be capped much lower but calling it a defensive is like calling Prime Light Beam a defensive skill. It's objectively 100% wrong. > > > > > > > > > > > > I think they should come out with a utility called Phantasmal Attacker and have it do 0 damage and nullify all damage in a 600 range circle. Because that _makes sense._ > > > > > > > > > > > > It's called Illusionary DEFENDER. It should not hit for 75% or more of someone's health. > > > > > > > > > > You're getting way too hung up on the name. It's still called defender because the phantasm blocks attacks aimed at it and does damage based on how much it absorbs. > > > > > > > > No lmao it's called defender because it used to reduce the damage taken by the mesmer and nearby allies by 50%. However they buffed it to ridiculousness and kept the name. > > > > > > Eliminate Chronophantasma and Mental Defense, make the max damage cap 50% lower than it is and I'm perfectly fine with the skill. > > > > Did you see the screenshot? Defender can hit for more than 14k. Halving that to 7k is still WAY too much for a defensive skill. > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > @"OriOri.8724" said: > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > > > > > > I'm fail to see which part of this phantasm make you say its DEFENSIVE phantasm ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It doesn't provide any defense for the mesmer. At all. It's called defender because it blocks attacks aimed at the phantasm itself. Nothing about the skill defends the mesmer. It's literally just a ticking time bomb you drop on the ground. The max damage should be capped much lower, and the Inspiration grand master that summons one for free should get changed. But calling it a defensive skill is objectively nonsense. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It used to be a defensive skill until they changed it to a mini mobile nuke that ccs you at the same time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Used to be. Changed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's also not mobile. Once it enters it's stance it won't move anymore. > > > > > > > > > > > > It changed, which is precisely why its now an issue and should be nerfed or changed again. > > > > > > > > > > I think the max damage on it should be capped much lower but calling it a defensive is like calling Prime Light Beam a defensive skill. It's objectively 100% wrong. > > > > > > > > No. Its still a defensive skill. Its just very poorly tuned, in almost every way imaginable. When you use the skill, a different entity taunts the enemy, taking pressure off of yourself. Conceptually its a defensive skill. And it should be balanced in such a way that reflects that, or be redesigned > > > > > > And Prime Light Beam is a blow out that also takes pressure off yourself by ccing the enemy. > > > > > > The damage is overturned but the core mechanics of the skill are fine. > > > > The stupidity on the forums surprises me more and more every day. > > > > Prime Light Beam is a purely offensive skill. > > > > Illusionary Defender is a utility skill on a shorter cooldown that can be used more frequently while doing more damage than an elite skill. Nerf the damage by 75% minimum so it hits for 3k and the skill will be more balanced. > > It's not a defensive skill in any sense. Get over it. > > Would you be this stubborn and bent out of shape if it was called something like Phantasmal Redirector? You're so absurdly hung up on the name it's ridiculous. > > I also don't appreciate being called stupid. Chill out. You STILL don't seem to understand. I don't give a flying fuck what the name is. Also, everyone knows its not a defensive skill. Everyone is saying it SHOULD be. It used to be a purely defensive utility until Anet decided to make a spammable AI that ccs you and has the potential to chunk you for 75% or more of your health in a single hit. Yes, I would still be annoyed at the fact that a spammable utility does 14,000 damage while ccing you. Would you not? Chrono is busted as fuck. There's only a select few that don't seem to understand that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > You STILL don't seem to understand. I don't give a flying kitten what the name is. > Also, everyone knows its not a defensive skill. Everyone is saying it SHOULD be. It used to be a purely defensive utility until Anet decided to make a spammable AI that ccs you and has the potential to chunk you for 75% or more of your health in a single hit. Ahh I see. I get it no- > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > Did you see the screenshot? Defender can hit for more than 14k. Halving that to 7k is still WAY too much for a defensive skill. > @"shadowpass.4236" said:> The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > No lmao it's called defender because it used to reduce the damage taken by the mesmer and nearby allies by 50%. However they buffed it to ridiculousness and kept the name. Well you sure fooled me. If that was what you were trying to communicate maybe you should have just said that instead of all caps typing "DEFENDER" at me and calling me stupid. > Yes, I would still be annoyed at the fact that a spammable utility does 14,000 damage while ccing you. Would you not? > > Chrono is busted as kitten. There's only a select few that don't seem to understand that. I've been one of the most vocal people on this forum about the broken state of Chronomancer and pointing out exactly where the problems with it lie. This is my diagnosis for nerfing phantasmal defender: 1. Eliminate Chronophantasma in it's current form. Each defender summoning twice is an absurd thing to expect any player to deal with. 2. Eliminate Mental Defense in it's current form. Phantasmal Defender is too powerful of a skill to summon for free when a Mesmer blocks or evades an attack. Two of them for free with Chronophantasma. 3. Nerf the damage by 50%. Maybe more. But I'm overall fine with the skill being a phantasm that taunts and blocks and chunks enemy players based on how many attacks it absorbs. I think 7k on a Berserker Amulet and 4k on a Paladin Amulet are about how much damage a super charged defender should hit for. On an individual level I think it's a fun skill to play around. The problem is that it's currently simultaneously overtuned and Chronomancers can summon a million of them back to back to back. But please, keep calling me stupid friendo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > You STILL don't seem to understand. I don't give a flying kitten what the name is. > > Also, everyone knows its not a defensive skill. Everyone is saying it SHOULD be. It used to be a purely defensive utility until Anet decided to make a spammable AI that ccs you and has the potential to chunk you for 75% or more of your health in a single hit. > Ahh I see. I get it no- > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > Did you see the screenshot? Defender can hit for more than 14k. Halving that to 7k is still WAY too much for a defensive skill. > > @"shadowpass.4236" said:> The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > No lmao it's called defender because it used to reduce the damage taken by the mesmer and nearby allies by 50%. However they buffed it to ridiculousness and kept the name. > > Well you sure fooled me. If that was what you were trying to communicate maybe you should have just said that instead of all caps typing "DEFENDER" at me and calling me stupid. > > > Yes, I would still be annoyed at the fact that a spammable utility does 14,000 damage while ccing you. Would you not? > > > > Chrono is busted as kitten. There's only a select few that don't seem to understand that. > > I've been one of the most vocal people on this forum about the broken state of Chronomancer and pointing out exactly where the problems with it lie. This is my diagnosis for nerfing phantasmal defender: > > 1. Eliminate Chronophantasma in it's current form. Each defender summoning twice is an absurd thing to expect any player to deal with. > 2. Eliminate Mental Defense in it's current form. Phantasmal Defender is too powerful of a skill to summon for free when a Mesmer blocks or evades an attack. Two of them for free with Chronophantasma. > 3. Nerf the damage by 50%. Maybe more. > > But I'm overall fine with the skill being a phantasm that taunts and blocks and chunks enemy players based on how many attacks it absorbs. I think 7k on a Berserker Amulet and 4k on a Paladin Amulet are about how much damage a super charged defender should hit for. On an individual level I think it's a fun skill to play around. The problem is that it's currently simultaneously overtuned and Chronomancers can summon a million of them back to back to back. > > But please, keep calling me stupid friendo. - No, that was directed at Odik, not you. I don't see what you're trying to say. The skill used to be a purely defensive utility. Hence why it was called Phantasmal DEFENDER. Now, it went from a defensive skill to a spammable utility that ccs and deals ridiculous amounts of damage. You're just arguing with me about the name. If you're really insistent, it has the word "defense" in the name but it is literally everything BUT defensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > You STILL don't seem to understand. I don't give a flying kitten what the name is. > > > Also, everyone knows its not a defensive skill. Everyone is saying it SHOULD be. It used to be a purely defensive utility until Anet decided to make a spammable AI that ccs you and has the potential to chunk you for 75% or more of your health in a single hit. > > Ahh I see. I get it no- > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > Did you see the screenshot? Defender can hit for more than 14k. Halving that to 7k is still WAY too much for a defensive skill. > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said:> The name, "Phantasmal **DEFENDER**." > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > No lmao it's called defender because it used to reduce the damage taken by the mesmer and nearby allies by 50%. However they buffed it to ridiculousness and kept the name. > > > > Well you sure fooled me. If that was what you were trying to communicate maybe you should have just said that instead of all caps typing "DEFENDER" at me and calling me stupid. > > > > > Yes, I would still be annoyed at the fact that a spammable utility does 14,000 damage while ccing you. Would you not? > > > > > > Chrono is busted as kitten. There's only a select few that don't seem to understand that. > > > > I've been one of the most vocal people on this forum about the broken state of Chronomancer and pointing out exactly where the problems with it lie. This is my diagnosis for nerfing phantasmal defender: > > > > 1. Eliminate Chronophantasma in it's current form. Each defender summoning twice is an absurd thing to expect any player to deal with. > > 2. Eliminate Mental Defense in it's current form. Phantasmal Defender is too powerful of a skill to summon for free when a Mesmer blocks or evades an attack. Two of them for free with Chronophantasma. > > 3. Nerf the damage by 50%. Maybe more. > > > > But I'm overall fine with the skill being a phantasm that taunts and blocks and chunks enemy players based on how many attacks it absorbs. I think 7k on a Berserker Amulet and 4k on a Paladin Amulet are about how much damage a super charged defender should hit for. On an individual level I think it's a fun skill to play around. The problem is that it's currently simultaneously overtuned and Chronomancers can summon a million of them back to back to back. > > > > But please, keep calling me stupid friendo. > > - No, that was directed at Odik, not you. > > I don't see what you're trying to say. The skill used to be a purely defensive utility. Hence why it was called Phantasmal DEFENDER. Now, it went from a defensive skill to a spammable utility that ccs and deals ridiculous amounts of damage. > > You're just arguing with me about the name. If you're really insistent, it has the word "defense" in the name but it is literally everything BUT defensive. You were literally quoting me, no one else, and called me stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragnarox.9601 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 Dont argue, we all know this will be nerfed, so the question is, is it going to be nerfhammered or just "buffing spirit weapons" type nerf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odik.4587 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"Ragnarox.9601" said: > Dont argue, we all know this will be nerfed, so the question is, is it going to be nerfhammered or just "buffing spirit weapons" type nerf. I'm absolutely fine with it being nerfhammered (but rework into actually defending phantasm is appreciated) because mesmer before never took Phantasmal defender no matter which build they were running. Lets be honest here . Every class have a lot of skills that they never want to bring in PvP . Defender was one of them like disenchanter before this absurd rework. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rank eleven monk.9502 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"CaldaRaric.6305" said: > > After coming back to my Mesmer main I can tell this is a L2P issue. It’s so easy to spot when you get taunted by the ID. Like, the fact that people say they can’t see it because of the illusion spam makes me laugh. I used to cry about the illusion spam until I learned to play against a Mesmer. They are also definitely really not that hard to pick out the real one. > > > > Hint, when you get taunted, your target changes and you lose control of your character and start running towards the ID while auto attacking. Your screen also flashes. You also get a symbol above your head. > > > > You people REALLY can’t tell you are attacking it??? > > > > LEARN TO PLAY. > > > > Yeah its a L2P issue. That's precisely why Chronomancer (the build that uses Phantasmal Defender) got banned from the Mist Challenger Tournament last Saturday. It's because every single high tier player competing in the tournament has a L2P issue. > > :] Wow that analogy. Chronomancer is imbalanced therefore Phantasmal Defender is imbalanced :D Based on this logic you could call Blink or staff1 imbalanced as well. Let's look at this properly: Chronomancer is obviously imbalanced but NOT because of Phantasmal Defender. Stacking up the Defender's damage IS a l2p issue. Getting beaten by a chrono is not. There are far worse problems with chrono - chronophantasma in it's current state, SoI (yes, still), Bountiful Disillusionment and I could go on (there are a gazillion threads about this already). Defender in itself not one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"rank eleven monk.9502" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"CaldaRaric.6305" said: > > > After coming back to my Mesmer main I can tell this is a L2P issue. It’s so easy to spot when you get taunted by the ID. Like, the fact that people say they can’t see it because of the illusion spam makes me laugh. I used to cry about the illusion spam until I learned to play against a Mesmer. They are also definitely really not that hard to pick out the real one. > > > > > > Hint, when you get taunted, your target changes and you lose control of your character and start running towards the ID while auto attacking. Your screen also flashes. You also get a symbol above your head. > > > > > > You people REALLY can’t tell you are attacking it??? > > > > > > LEARN TO PLAY. > > > > > > > Yeah its a L2P issue. That's precisely why Chronomancer (the build that uses Phantasmal Defender) got banned from the Mist Challenger Tournament last Saturday. It's because every single high tier player competing in the tournament has a L2P issue. > > > > :] > Wow that analogy. Chronomancer is imbalanced therefore Phantasmal Defender is imbalanced :D Based on this logic you could call Blink or staff1 imbalanced as well. > > Let's look at this properly: Chronomancer is obviously imbalanced but NOT because of Phantasmal Defender. Stacking up the Defender's damage IS a l2p issue. Getting beaten by a chrono is not. There are far worse problems with chrono - chronophantasma in it's current state, SoI (yes, still), Bountiful Disillusionment and I could go on (there are a gazillion threads about this already). Defender in itself not one of them. > > If the massive amount of damage is a L2P issue, then why was Gazelle damage nerfed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Math.5123 Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 > @"rank eleven monk.9502" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"CaldaRaric.6305" said: > > > After coming back to my Mesmer main I can tell this is a L2P issue. It’s so easy to spot when you get taunted by the ID. Like, the fact that people say they can’t see it because of the illusion spam makes me laugh. I used to cry about the illusion spam until I learned to play against a Mesmer. They are also definitely really not that hard to pick out the real one. > > > > > > Hint, when you get taunted, your target changes and you lose control of your character and start running towards the ID while auto attacking. Your screen also flashes. You also get a symbol above your head. > > > > > > You people REALLY can’t tell you are attacking it??? > > > > > > LEARN TO PLAY. > > > > > > > Yeah its a L2P issue. That's precisely why Chronomancer (the build that uses Phantasmal Defender) got banned from the Mist Challenger Tournament last Saturday. It's because every single high tier player competing in the tournament has a L2P issue. > > > > :] > Wow that analogy. Chronomancer is imbalanced therefore Phantasmal Defender is imbalanced :D Based on this logic you could call Blink or staff1 imbalanced as well. > > Let's look at this properly: Chronomancer is obviously imbalanced but NOT because of Phantasmal Defender. Stacking up the Defender's damage IS a l2p issue. Getting beaten by a chrono is not. There are far worse problems with chrono - chronophantasma in it's current state, SoI (yes, still), Bountiful Disillusionment and I could go on (there are a gazillion threads about this already). Defender in itself not one of them. > > Chronomancers fundamental design is flawed and the class is basically overpowered by nature. CS is a huge offender here. Another offender is how good mesmer trait-lines synergizes with each other. That being said, it's the absurd damage coming from disenchanter and defender that's pushing it into god tier status. If the damage was on par with other classes running paladin, it would just be an obnoxious tank. However, when the tank hits about as hard as a radiance guardian, zerk core war or an S/D thief. That's when we have the issue that is the current implementation of Chronomancer. Hopefully the build will get butchered tonight, because numbers alone won't fix it. No matter how low the numbers are, the build is still incredibly unfun to play vs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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