Ferelwing.8463 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Grogba.6204" said: > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > So true, even with class guides and rotations... It's not like GW2 is known for it's easy to read moves. > > > > Doesn't apply to raidbosses who attack incredible sluggish and the frontal attacks are for the "tank" to worry about anyway, everything else is telegraphed. > > > Sure, and then i see the video where the explaining group makes a kill so fast and clean that i just can't see what the problem could even be with doing it. > > Video is useful, but only as a visualisation to a written commentary. Without that commentary its usefulness drops down a lot. > > And as for class guides and rotations - no, i can't see anything in those except damage numbers. There's a ton of tricks that some classes use that simply cannot be seen if you already don't know what to look for, and on most videos it can be challenging to even follow the order of skills used. > > Not to mention, quite often a simple explanation of _why_ you need to do something can be far, far more useful than hours of videos. > > For example, there was a nice video on weaver some time before the last patch, that explained the rotation in very concise matter. It was that explanation that made the video so good, not the video itself. And that explanation could have been done as easily in a written form with no need to even see the weaver going through rotations. > > @"Vinceman.4572" said: > Dulfy.net <--- Read there! I always read Dulfy. It's my goto, but I like getting insight from other sources too I just wish there was more WRITTEN information instead of video after video after video. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor.2358 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > That's simply not how life works. Sorry... You can't expect freebies just because "life's too hard". > > This isn't life. > > This is a game. > > There are no rules other than the ones ANet decides to impose. Still some of the rules apply. Because if you decide not to impose them, the game ends up boring and/or unfair. And the players end up leaving it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teamkiller.4315 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? I don't know if you've been reading, but I don't really raid, and I don't have a single legendary, so even _if_ I were that kind of a jealous person, how would _I_ possibly get offended? You really picked the wrong rhetorical question. I'm going to ignore this chain from now on because it went totally off topic about me getting offended for something you assumed I had and gamemodes you assumed I grinded out. I've been back for only 4 months since my 4 year break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teamkiller.4315 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > Of course I'm fine with them having a cool looking skin for doing something I can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > I just don't think they should have *exclusive* access to it. So I see you're interested in playing semantics, in which case I'll return in kind. No one has exclusive access to envoy armor. You can learn to raid and get it, or you can buy raids and get it. Regular raiders just have an easier path, see? In the future, I'd appreciate if you didn't debate in such an intellectually honest manner. You have a problem with them getting something you "can't" (in quotes because you can), sure as day, and the evidence is your passionate crusade for raid easy modes. Seriously, is it _that_ hard to let raiders enjoy their **EXCLUSIVE** niche? Your wants, needs, and entitlement are _**that**_ important? > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > Seriously though, I do not mind. > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > You greatly underestimate "ordinary people." Yeah, I _did_ ask you to not answer that question because you would give a dishonest answer, and it turns out you did. You may want to stop assuming everyone's mindset as similar to yours, because it's been demonstrated that some of your beliefs are very bizarre to the average person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReaverKane.7598 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eponet.4829 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 Having been playing WoW recently, the QoL feature that I've loved the most out of all the ones that I've seen was the "Flexible group size" on normal and heroic that allowed you to run any number of players above or equal to 10 and below or equal to 30, with the encounters scaling to compensate for it, such that you could keep a larger than normal raid team without needing to sit people out each week, or go LFG diving because you ran exactly what was needed and someone didn't show up. Additionally, that buffer of extra players led to much less "Stop for 20 minutes while we find more people after a person or two left midway through" It also allowed groups to be more inclusive, since as long as a player was able to pull their weight, you could keep them around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"Feanor.2358" said: > Still some of the rules apply. Because if you decide not to impose them, the game ends up boring and/or unfair. And the players end up leaving it. And if you impose them too much, players also end up leaving. > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. Speak for yourself. I, for one, really like the heavy version, even if the color channels could work on it a bit better. And i don't really care about the "symbol of status" part. In fact, i'd rather it _weren't_ associated with raids, because if anything that association _lessens_ its value in my eyes. > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Nah, it's the mark of being a raider. Nothing more. > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. Some of the people i have seen with that armor show that yes, you very much can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vesica tempestas.1563 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? > > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. > Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. actually it is indeed simple farming, im doing it myself and both myself and the other wvw fans have fun doing it, with no penis measuring to boot. RE ' It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player' oh my word you surely have shown the dirty side of raider mentality here and dont even realise it i suspect! 1. get over yourself, 2. get with the times, the entire demographic is older and has moved on from this dated 'im better than you because im shinier' concept. The guild wars universe has never been about this kind of attitude, that's a different market, ie wow and co. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC.4521 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > Earned for no effort. That's pretty much free in my book. > > > It's not no effort either. Even if you claim otherwise. > > > > > > > > > > If you read carefully what Ohoni wants, it *is* practically no effort. Ye, ye, months and all that. Months of pressing '1'. Nope. > > If you read carefully what I say, then you might actually *read what I say,* which is not that. It is really no effort if you think about it carefully tho. Think about the current meta, think about the current build. So if easy mode is nerfed version of normal mode. The probability of healer build can easily carry their teammate and their teammate can just stack and spam 1 and win is higher. Just think about no green VG in raid right now where people just sustain and ignore 90% of mechanic by sustain the damage. Then think if that strategy applied to the easy mode of raid. 100% no effort, maybe druid user will be happy tho because they can sell their service to carry their team and let them afk There is a lot of things to consider if anet want to make easy mode and this thread only talking about rewards and acting as if they know the future, making statement like this will make everyone happy etc. How do you know tho? Can you see the future? Can you read people mind and said thats exactly what they gonna do? Pretty sure i read some post where they said this will be better for the game etc and people will do easy mode using pvt gear or other stat. What if they dont? What if they did the opposite of what you saying here? if you check the forum you can see there is thread asking for challenging content from time to time. Pretty sure they wont be happy with easy mode. Just like how some people dont like raid now. And about the rewards, adding access to legend armor on easy mode is just stupid. If anet really want to make easy mode then make it into progression to something better. Gold, magnetite shard and loot chance is the rewards. Why? Because shard can be exchanged to asc armor and you choose the stat so you can gearing your class to do the normal version. Just like legend backpack on fotm, need to do CM. And maybe like fractal progression, pretty sure no one staying at t1or t2 for their daily. No matter what anet gonna do later tho, 1 of the side will be unhappy. And im sure anet already make their stance about what they want to do with raid. Personally if i dont like anet decision in the future, i will just leave the game. This is not the only game out there, many people already left because anet decision in the past anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vesica tempestas.1563 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"BillC.4521" said: > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > Earned for no effort. That's pretty much free in my book. > > > > It's not no effort either. Even if you claim otherwise. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you read carefully what Ohoni wants, it *is* practically no effort. Ye, ye, months and all that. Months of pressing '1'. Nope. > > > > If you read carefully what I say, then you might actually *read what I say,* which is not that. > > It is really no effort if you think about it carefully tho. Think about the current meta, think about the current build. So if easy mode is nerfed version of normal mode. The probability of healer build can easily carry their teammate and their teammate can just stack and spam 1 and win is higher. > Just think about no green VG in raid right now where people just sustain and ignore 90% of mechanic by sustain the damage. Then think if that strategy applied to the easy mode of raid. 100% no effort, maybe druid user will be happy tho because they can sell their service to carry their team and let them afk > > There is a lot of things to consider if anet want to make easy mode and this thread only talking about rewards and acting as if they know the future, making statement like this will make everyone happy etc. How do you know tho? Can you see the future? Can you read people mind and said thats exactly what they gonna do? Pretty sure i read some post where they said this will be better for the game etc and people will do easy mode using pvt gear or other stat. What if they dont? What if they did the opposite of what you saying here? > if you check the forum you can see there is thread asking for challenging content from time to time. Pretty sure they wont be happy with easy mode. Just like how some people dont like raid now. > > And about the rewards, adding access to legend armor on easy mode is just stupid. > If anet really want to make easy mode then make it into progression to something better. Gold, magnetite shard and loot chance is the rewards. Why? Because shard can be exchanged to asc armor and you choose the stat so you can gearing your class to do the normal version. > Just like legend backpack on fotm, need to do CM. And maybe like fractal progression, pretty sure no one staying at t1or t2 for their daily. > > No matter what anet gonna do later tho, 1 of the side will be unhappy. And im sure anet already make their stance about what they want to do with raid. Personally if i dont like anet decision in the future, i will just leave the game. This is not the only game out there, many people already left because anet decision in the past anyway. create an easy mode and a hard mode, content for everyone. The only people that will be aggrieved by this are the selfish, and they are a poison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC.4521 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > > > > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? > > > > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. > > Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. > > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. > > actually it is indeed simple farming, im doing it myself and both myself and the other wvw fans have fun doing it, with no kitten measuring to boot. RE ' It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player' oh my word you surely have shown the dirty side of raider mentality here and dont even realise it i suspect! 1. get over yourself, 2. get with the times, the entire demographic is older and has moved on from this dated 'im better than you because im shinier' concept. The guild wars universe has never been about this kind of attitude, that's a different market, ie wow and co. Can i get my special gizmo from automated tournament 1st place by farming? Lets make thread asking for automated tournament rewards available on custom game room so everyone can farming it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vesica tempestas.1563 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"BillC.4521" said: > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > > > > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > > > > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > > > > > > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? > > > > > > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. > > > Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. > > > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. > > > > actually it is indeed simple farming, im doing it myself and both myself and the other wvw fans have fun doing it, with no kitten measuring to boot. RE ' It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player' oh my word you surely have shown the dirty side of raider mentality here and dont even realise it i suspect! 1. get over yourself, 2. get with the times, the entire demographic is older and has moved on from this dated 'im better than you because im shinier' concept. The guild wars universe has never been about this kind of attitude, that's a different market, ie wow and co. > > Can i get my special gizmo from automated tournament 1st place by farming? Lets make thread asking for automated tournament rewards available on custom game room so everyone can farming it. you know its easier talking than trying to be clever. I was referring to wvw., Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC.4521 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > Earned for no effort. That's pretty much free in my book. > > > > > It's not no effort either. Even if you claim otherwise. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you read carefully what Ohoni wants, it *is* practically no effort. Ye, ye, months and all that. Months of pressing '1'. Nope. > > > > > > If you read carefully what I say, then you might actually *read what I say,* which is not that. > > > > It is really no effort if you think about it carefully tho. Think about the current meta, think about the current build. So if easy mode is nerfed version of normal mode. The probability of healer build can easily carry their teammate and their teammate can just stack and spam 1 and win is higher. > > Just think about no green VG in raid right now where people just sustain and ignore 90% of mechanic by sustain the damage. Then think if that strategy applied to the easy mode of raid. 100% no effort, maybe druid user will be happy tho because they can sell their service to carry their team and let them afk > > > > There is a lot of things to consider if anet want to make easy mode and this thread only talking about rewards and acting as if they know the future, making statement like this will make everyone happy etc. How do you know tho? Can you see the future? Can you read people mind and said thats exactly what they gonna do? Pretty sure i read some post where they said this will be better for the game etc and people will do easy mode using pvt gear or other stat. What if they dont? What if they did the opposite of what you saying here? > > if you check the forum you can see there is thread asking for challenging content from time to time. Pretty sure they wont be happy with easy mode. Just like how some people dont like raid now. > > > > And about the rewards, adding access to legend armor on easy mode is just stupid. > > If anet really want to make easy mode then make it into progression to something better. Gold, magnetite shard and loot chance is the rewards. Why? Because shard can be exchanged to asc armor and you choose the stat so you can gearing your class to do the normal version. > > Just like legend backpack on fotm, need to do CM. And maybe like fractal progression, pretty sure no one staying at t1or t2 for their daily. > > > > No matter what anet gonna do later tho, 1 of the side will be unhappy. And im sure anet already make their stance about what they want to do with raid. Personally if i dont like anet decision in the future, i will just leave the game. This is not the only game out there, many people already left because anet decision in the past anyway. > > create an easy mode and a hard mode, content for everyone. The only people that will be aggrieved by this are the selfish, and they are a poison. Probably there are people that gonna complain about that in the future. Maybe about the rewards, even in fotm there is difference in rewards, and even about hard mode anet already said they still trying to find a way so they dont split the raid community because hard mode will have better rewards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC.4521 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > > > > > > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > > > > > > > > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? > > > > > > > > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. > > > > Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. > > > > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. > > > > > > actually it is indeed simple farming, im doing it myself and both myself and the other wvw fans have fun doing it, with no kitten measuring to boot. RE ' It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player' oh my word you surely have shown the dirty side of raider mentality here and dont even realise it i suspect! 1. get over yourself, 2. get with the times, the entire demographic is older and has moved on from this dated 'im better than you because im shinier' concept. The guild wars universe has never been about this kind of attitude, that's a different market, ie wow and co. > > > > Can i get my special gizmo from automated tournament 1st place by farming? Lets make thread asking for automated tournament rewards available on custom game room so everyone can farming it. > > you know its easier talking than trying to be clever. I was referring to wvw., Well pretty sure you and me know about that. And this thread about pve/raid content so i dont know why people keep bringing wvw and pvp here :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vesica tempestas.1563 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"BillC.4521" said: > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > > > > > > > > > > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? > > > > > > > > > > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. > > > > > Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. > > > > > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. > > > > > > > > actually it is indeed simple farming, im doing it myself and both myself and the other wvw fans have fun doing it, with no kitten measuring to boot. RE ' It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player' oh my word you surely have shown the dirty side of raider mentality here and dont even realise it i suspect! 1. get over yourself, 2. get with the times, the entire demographic is older and has moved on from this dated 'im better than you because im shinier' concept. The guild wars universe has never been about this kind of attitude, that's a different market, ie wow and co. > > > > > > Can i get my special gizmo from automated tournament 1st place by farming? Lets make thread asking for automated tournament rewards available on custom game room so everyone can farming it. > > > > you know its easier talking than trying to be clever. I was referring to wvw., > > Well pretty sure you and me know about that. > And this thread about pve/raid content so i dont know why people keep bringing wvw and pvp here :) I brought wvw in because the raiders were remonstrating against 'easy' legendary gear for easy mode raids without realising it seems that you can already get legendary gear through simple farming :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vesica tempestas.1563 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"BillC.4521" said: > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > Earned for no effort. That's pretty much free in my book. > > > > > > It's not no effort either. Even if you claim otherwise. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you read carefully what Ohoni wants, it *is* practically no effort. Ye, ye, months and all that. Months of pressing '1'. Nope. > > > > > > > > If you read carefully what I say, then you might actually *read what I say,* which is not that. > > > > > > It is really no effort if you think about it carefully tho. Think about the current meta, think about the current build. So if easy mode is nerfed version of normal mode. The probability of healer build can easily carry their teammate and their teammate can just stack and spam 1 and win is higher. > > > Just think about no green VG in raid right now where people just sustain and ignore 90% of mechanic by sustain the damage. Then think if that strategy applied to the easy mode of raid. 100% no effort, maybe druid user will be happy tho because they can sell their service to carry their team and let them afk > > > > > > There is a lot of things to consider if anet want to make easy mode and this thread only talking about rewards and acting as if they know the future, making statement like this will make everyone happy etc. How do you know tho? Can you see the future? Can you read people mind and said thats exactly what they gonna do? Pretty sure i read some post where they said this will be better for the game etc and people will do easy mode using pvt gear or other stat. What if they dont? What if they did the opposite of what you saying here? > > > if you check the forum you can see there is thread asking for challenging content from time to time. Pretty sure they wont be happy with easy mode. Just like how some people dont like raid now. > > > > > > And about the rewards, adding access to legend armor on easy mode is just stupid. > > > If anet really want to make easy mode then make it into progression to something better. Gold, magnetite shard and loot chance is the rewards. Why? Because shard can be exchanged to asc armor and you choose the stat so you can gearing your class to do the normal version. > > > Just like legend backpack on fotm, need to do CM. And maybe like fractal progression, pretty sure no one staying at t1or t2 for their daily. > > > > > > No matter what anet gonna do later tho, 1 of the side will be unhappy. And im sure anet already make their stance about what they want to do with raid. Personally if i dont like anet decision in the future, i will just leave the game. This is not the only game out there, many people already left because anet decision in the past anyway. > > > > create an easy mode and a hard mode, content for everyone. The only people that will be aggrieved by this are the selfish, and they are a poison. > > Probably there are people that gonna complain about that in the future. Maybe about the rewards, even in fotm there is difference in rewards, and even about hard mode anet already said they still trying to find a way so they dont split the raid community because hard mode will have better rewards hard mode wont have better rewards, maybe faster to get, but not better. They wont like that, but that's the reality of the GW universe, it's not about having the best gear in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nia.4725 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > > Earned for no effort. That's pretty much free in my book. > > > > > > > It's not no effort either. Even if you claim otherwise. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you read carefully what Ohoni wants, it *is* practically no effort. Ye, ye, months and all that. Months of pressing '1'. Nope. > > > > > > > > > > If you read carefully what I say, then you might actually *read what I say,* which is not that. > > > > > > > > It is really no effort if you think about it carefully tho. Think about the current meta, think about the current build. So if easy mode is nerfed version of normal mode. The probability of healer build can easily carry their teammate and their teammate can just stack and spam 1 and win is higher. > > > > Just think about no green VG in raid right now where people just sustain and ignore 90% of mechanic by sustain the damage. Then think if that strategy applied to the easy mode of raid. 100% no effort, maybe druid user will be happy tho because they can sell their service to carry their team and let them afk > > > > > > > > There is a lot of things to consider if anet want to make easy mode and this thread only talking about rewards and acting as if they know the future, making statement like this will make everyone happy etc. How do you know tho? Can you see the future? Can you read people mind and said thats exactly what they gonna do? Pretty sure i read some post where they said this will be better for the game etc and people will do easy mode using pvt gear or other stat. What if they dont? What if they did the opposite of what you saying here? > > > > if you check the forum you can see there is thread asking for challenging content from time to time. Pretty sure they wont be happy with easy mode. Just like how some people dont like raid now. > > > > > > > > And about the rewards, adding access to legend armor on easy mode is just stupid. > > > > If anet really want to make easy mode then make it into progression to something better. Gold, magnetite shard and loot chance is the rewards. Why? Because shard can be exchanged to asc armor and you choose the stat so you can gearing your class to do the normal version. > > > > Just like legend backpack on fotm, need to do CM. And maybe like fractal progression, pretty sure no one staying at t1or t2 for their daily. > > > > > > > > No matter what anet gonna do later tho, 1 of the side will be unhappy. And im sure anet already make their stance about what they want to do with raid. Personally if i dont like anet decision in the future, i will just leave the game. This is not the only game out there, many people already left because anet decision in the past anyway. > > > > > > create an easy mode and a hard mode, content for everyone. The only people that will be aggrieved by this are the selfish, and they are a poison. > > > > Probably there are people that gonna complain about that in the future. Maybe about the rewards, even in fotm there is difference in rewards, and even about hard mode anet already said they still trying to find a way so they dont split the raid community because hard mode will have better rewards > > hard mode wont have better rewards, maybe faster to get, but not better. They wont like that, but that's the reality of the GW universe, it's not about having the best gear in the game. I think you should check in the wiki the rewards for the current CM modes : ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltekka.2375 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"BillC.4521" said: > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > > > > > > > > > > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? > > > > > > > > > > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. > > > > > Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. > > > > > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. > > > > > > > > actually it is indeed simple farming, im doing it myself and both myself and the other wvw fans have fun doing it, with no kitten measuring to boot. RE ' It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player' oh my word you surely have shown the dirty side of raider mentality here and dont even realise it i suspect! 1. get over yourself, 2. get with the times, the entire demographic is older and has moved on from this dated 'im better than you because im shinier' concept. The guild wars universe has never been about this kind of attitude, that's a different market, ie wow and co. > > > > > > Can i get my special gizmo from automated tournament 1st place by farming? Lets make thread asking for automated tournament rewards available on custom game room so everyone can farming it. > > > > you know its easier talking than trying to be clever. I was referring to wvw., > > Well pretty sure you and me know about that. > And this thread about pve/raid content so i dont know why people keep bringing wvw and pvp here :) Cause they dont care about legendary armor functionality, but for the envoy skin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC.4521 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > > > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. > > > > > > Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. > > > > > > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. > > > > > > > > > > actually it is indeed simple farming, im doing it myself and both myself and the other wvw fans have fun doing it, with no kitten measuring to boot. RE ' It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player' oh my word you surely have shown the dirty side of raider mentality here and dont even realise it i suspect! 1. get over yourself, 2. get with the times, the entire demographic is older and has moved on from this dated 'im better than you because im shinier' concept. The guild wars universe has never been about this kind of attitude, that's a different market, ie wow and co. > > > > > > > > Can i get my special gizmo from automated tournament 1st place by farming? Lets make thread asking for automated tournament rewards available on custom game room so everyone can farming it. > > > > > > you know its easier talking than trying to be clever. I was referring to wvw., > > > > Well pretty sure you and me know about that. > > And this thread about pve/raid content so i dont know why people keep bringing wvw and pvp here :) > > I brought wvw in because the raiders were remonstrating against 'easy' legendary gear for easy mode raids without realising it seems that you can already get legendary gear through simple farming :) Well imo, for pve content its all about progression tho. So maybe its different with wvw Just see fotm legend backpack, need to do CM and progressing to t4, and anet already said fotm is the stage before you go to raid means its another progression to another better rewards. So i dont think it can be compared to wvw or pvp. Just like tournament special gizmo only for 1st place and not for everyone. The comparison will never end, the game mode already different, anet approach on each game mode different too. like why wvw tournament disappear etc but they add tournament to pvp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vesica tempestas.1563 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"BillC.4521" said: > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. > > > > > > > Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. > > > > > > > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. > > > > > > > > > > > > actually it is indeed simple farming, im doing it myself and both myself and the other wvw fans have fun doing it, with no kitten measuring to boot. RE ' It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player' oh my word you surely have shown the dirty side of raider mentality here and dont even realise it i suspect! 1. get over yourself, 2. get with the times, the entire demographic is older and has moved on from this dated 'im better than you because im shinier' concept. The guild wars universe has never been about this kind of attitude, that's a different market, ie wow and co. > > > > > > > > > > Can i get my special gizmo from automated tournament 1st place by farming? Lets make thread asking for automated tournament rewards available on custom game room so everyone can farming it. > > > > > > > > you know its easier talking than trying to be clever. I was referring to wvw., > > > > > > Well pretty sure you and me know about that. > > > And this thread about pve/raid content so i dont know why people keep bringing wvw and pvp here :) > > > > I brought wvw in because the raiders were remonstrating against 'easy' legendary gear for easy mode raids without realising it seems that you can already get legendary gear through simple farming :) > > Well imo, for pve content its all about progression tho. So maybe its different with wvw > > Just see fotm legend backpack, need to do CM and progressing to t4, and anet already said fotm is the stage before you go to raid means its another progression to another better rewards. > > So i dont think it can be compared to wvw or pvp. Just like tournament special gizmo only for 1st place and not for everyone. > The comparison will never end, the game mode already different, anet approach on each game mode different too. like why wvw tournament disappear etc but they add tournament to pvp i'm not comparing, im saying theres a precedent for legendary gear outwith current raids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"BillC.4521" said: > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > Earned for no effort. That's pretty much free in my book. > > > > It's not no effort either. Even if you claim otherwise. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you read carefully what Ohoni wants, it *is* practically no effort. Ye, ye, months and all that. Months of pressing '1'. Nope. > > > > If you read carefully what I say, then you might actually *read what I say,* which is not that. > > It is really no effort if you think about it carefully tho. Think about the current meta, think about the current build. So if easy mode is nerfed version of normal mode. The probability of healer build can easily carry their teammate and their teammate can just stack and spam 1 and win is higher. Sure, experienced people would be able to cheese it. But why would they bother? They can probably do normal mode already, and there would ne no incentive for them to do easy mode apart from lol factor. > Just think about no green VG in raid right now where people just sustain and ignore 90% of mechanic by sustain the damage. Then think if that strategy applied to the easy mode of raid. 100% no effort, maybe druid user will be happy tho because they can sell their service to carry their team and let them afk Again, why bother? The easy mode would be done by people that _can't_ just sustain and survive vg by overhealing. If they could, they would not be doing easy. > @"BillC.4521" said: > And about the rewards, adding access to legend armor on easy mode is just stupid. Why? Personally i think that the decision to restrict the only PvE legendary armor set to raids was a much bigger fail. > If anet really want to make easy mode then make it into progression to something better. And here you go with the assumption that higher difficulty is somehow "better". It isn't, it's just more difficult. > @"BillC.4521" said: > Just like legend backpack on fotm, need to do CM. Motes yes, modes no. There's a big difference. Challenge motes are way, way easier than Shattered and Nightmare CMs. > @"BillC.4521" said: > No matter what anet gonna do later tho, 1 of the side will be unhappy. And im sure anet already make their stance about what they want to do with raid. Personally if i dont like anet decision in the future, i will just leave the game. This is not the only game out there, many people already left because anet decision in the past anyway. Yes, decisions like introducing raids. > @"nia.4725" said: > I think you should check in the wiki the rewards for the current CM modes : ) The devs already mentioned that those rewards are that good only because you can't repeat them. If they ever make them repeatable, you can bet that the repeat rewards won't be even close to that. > @"BillC.4521" said: > Well imo, for pve content its all about progression tho. No, it's all about progression only for the old style MMORPG players. And not even most of them, because many got tired of that approach long ago. But GW2, in general, was _not_ supposed to be about that, PvE or no PvE. There's a reason why the term "progression" was always precluded with "horizontal". Or why there won't be a gear tier stronger than ascended, why even introducing ascended caused a massive backlash, and why anet backpedaled on their idea of continuing with "item progression initiative" after ascended, and abandoned their initial plans of someday making a level cap increase. It's because most players responded very negatively to even a hint of introducing a real ("vertical") progression in gw2. And when i say "most players" i don't mean PvP and WvW ones. I mean most _PvE_ players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohoni.6057 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > That's simply not how life works. Sorry... You can't expect freebies just because "life's too hard". > > > > This isn't life. > > > > This is a game. > > > > There are no rules other than the ones ANet decides to impose. > > Still some of the rules apply. Because if you decide not to impose them, the game ends up boring and/or unfair. And the players end up leaving it. That depends on how you design the game. It certainly doesn't apply to the discussion at hand though. > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > Of course I'm fine with them having a cool looking skin for doing something I can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > I just don't think they should have *exclusive* access to it. > > So I see you're interested in playing semantics, in which case I'll return in kind. No one has exclusive access to envoy armor. You can learn to raid and get it, or you can buy raids and get it. Regular raiders just have an easier path, see? In the future, I'd appreciate if you didn't debate in such an intellectually honest manner. I wasn't "playing semantics," I was making a valid point. I don't have a problem with ANYONE having Envoy armor, I just have a problem with them saying "I earned it this way, therefore *you* cannot possibly get it unless you do the exact same thing." I don't care what they have, I care what they tell me *I can't have.* > You have a problem with them getting something you "can't" (in quotes because you can), sure as day, and the evidence is your passionate crusade for raid easy modes. Seriously, is it _that_ hard to let raiders enjoy their **EXCLUSIVE** niche? Your wants, needs, and entitlement are _**that**_ important? I don't believe in anyone's right to exclusivity. I think that one person being happy because of what *they have,* automatically overrides the entitlement of anyone else to feel happy about that player *not* having that thing. > Yeah, I _did_ ask you to not answer that question because you would give a dishonest answer, and it turns out you did. Nope, 100% honest. Just because you choose not to believe that humans can be decent, doesn't mean that they aren't. >You may want to stop assuming everyone's mindset as similar to yours, because it's been demonstrated that some of your beliefs are very bizarre to the average person. I would suggest the same to you. People aren't as awful as you assume them to be. You are not average. > @"BillC.4521" said: > It is really no effort if you think about it carefully tho. Think about the current meta, think about the current build. So if easy mode is nerfed version of normal mode. The probability of healer build can easily carry their teammate and their teammate can just stack and spam 1 and win is higher. > Just think about no green VG in raid right now where people just sustain and ignore 90% of mechanic by sustain the damage. Then think if that strategy applied to the easy mode of raid. 100% no effort, maybe druid user will be happy tho because they can sell their service to carry their team and let them afk So what is your solution? How would you design an easy mode that would prevent this, while making it easier for random pugs of non-meta builds and mismatched gearing to complete it as well as an "on farm" static can today? "No change" is no solution. >if you check the forum you can see there is thread asking for challenging content from time to time. Pretty sure they wont be happy with easy mode. Just like how some people dont like raid now. They don't have to be happy about it. They already have their mode. That mode is for them. This is something else, for the other people. If you enjoy pineapple pizza, and a store offers pineapple pizza, then you have no right to get upset if they also offer pepperoni, because you can still get your pineapple pizza. >And about the rewards, adding access to legend armor on easy mode is just stupid. Then what would your solution be for players who want Envoy skins but never want to do raids in their current form? We can't just rest on "they won't get it" or "they have to raid anyway," because neither would make them happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC.4521 Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > Earned for no effort. That's pretty much free in my book. > > > > > It's not no effort either. Even if you claim otherwise. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you read carefully what Ohoni wants, it *is* practically no effort. Ye, ye, months and all that. Months of pressing '1'. Nope. > > > > > > If you read carefully what I say, then you might actually *read what I say,* which is not that. > > > > It is really no effort if you think about it carefully tho. Think about the current meta, think about the current build. So if easy mode is nerfed version of normal mode. The probability of healer build can easily carry their teammate and their teammate can just stack and spam 1 and win is higher. > Sure, experienced people would be able to cheese it. But why would they bother? They can probably do normal mode already, and there would ne no incentive for them to do easy mode apart from lol factor. > > > Just think about no green VG in raid right now where people just sustain and ignore 90% of mechanic by sustain the damage. Then think if that strategy applied to the easy mode of raid. 100% no effort, maybe druid user will be happy tho because they can sell their service to carry their team and let them afk > Again, why bother? The easy mode would be done by people that _can't_ just sustain and survive vg by overhealing. If they could, they would not be doing easy. so because you said it then no one from exp group will do it. okay. once again its still no effort mode, using the current meta build on easy makes it no effort, using their own build on easy mode still no effort too because their build will probably sustain or overhealing on easy mode and i believe in the long run they will improve and make its more time efficient and beating the rewards/time ratio on harder mode :), if anet wnt to avoid that then how far the difference in rewards should be? and stop assuming as if people wont or will do it like what you think. people dont have same mindset as you. it will depends on the rewards which one have better rewards/time ratio will win. well personally if i can do it easily and spend less time on raid each week, ill probably do easy mode tho, you'll never know what people gonna do :) i already finished my 2nd legend armor, its slow but i doubt easy mode gonna be slower than what im doing right now :p, maybe my teammates will join too lol > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > And about the rewards, adding access to legend armor on easy mode is just stupid. > Why? Personally i think that the decision to restrict the only PvE legendary armor set to raids was a much bigger fail. > > > If anet really want to make easy mode then make it into progression to something better. > And here you go with the assumption that higher difficulty is somehow "better". It isn't, it's just more difficult. > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > Just like legend backpack on fotm, need to do CM. > Motes yes, modes no. There's a big difference. Challenge motes are way, way easier than Shattered and Nightmare CMs. > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > No matter what anet gonna do later tho, 1 of the side will be unhappy. And im sure anet already make their stance about what they want to do with raid. Personally if i dont like anet decision in the future, i will just leave the game. This is not the only game out there, many people already left because anet decision in the past anyway. > Yes, decisions like introducing raids. and decision like introducing the easy mode will have their impact too. and you know what from what i read each of legendary trinket gonna be on each game mode, aurora for open world, ring for raid, there will be 1 for wvw and pvp too maybe > > > @"nia.4725" said: > > I think you should check in the wiki the rewards for the current CM modes : ) > The devs already mentioned that those rewards are that good only because you can't repeat them. If they ever make them repeatable, you can bet that the repeat rewards won't be even close to that. > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > Well imo, for pve content its all about progression tho. > No, it's all about progression only for the old style MMORPG players. And not even most of them, because many got tired of that approach long ago. But GW2, in general, was _not_ supposed to be about that, PvE or no PvE. > There's a reason why the term "progression" was always precluded with "horizontal". Or why there won't be a gear tier stronger than ascended, why even introducing ascended caused a massive backlash, and why anet backpedaled on their idea of continuing with "item progression initiative" after ascended, and abandoned their initial plans of someday making a level cap increase. > It's because most players responded very negatively to even a hint of introducing a real ("vertical") progression in gw2. And when i say "most players" i don't mean PvP and WvW ones. I mean most _PvE_ players. > and they still keep doing it tho? by saying raid should be harder than fotm means its a progression right? or am i wrong here? pretty sure anet said it like that but 100CM is harder than some of raid encounter tho. and if its really that easy to introduce easy mode like what you said, then why hard mode still not here then, since from what i read people saying there wont be any impact to the community if easy mode is there :) i dont care if they gonna make easy mode or not tho. if they did than i already said what i gonna do above :) but i prefer if anet use their time and resources on something else rather than wasting it on another easy/hard mode that will die or kill other mode on raid. lets say everything works like what you said theres probability normal mode will be the victim by introducing easy and hard mode depends on the rewards/time. rarely see 100 normal run on lfg since CM is more profitable and the run take about almost the same time to do anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReaverKane.7598 Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > > > > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? > > > > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. > > Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. > > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. > > actually it is indeed simple farming, im doing it myself and both myself and the other wvw fans have fun doing it, with no kitten measuring to boot. RE ' It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player' oh my word you surely have shown the dirty side of raider mentality here and dont even realise it i suspect! 1. get over yourself, 2. get with the times, the entire demographic is older and has moved on from this dated 'im better than you because im shinier' concept. The guild wars universe has never been about this kind of attitude, that's a different market, ie wow and co. Yes, that's why people rushed WvW when the latest shiny shows up, that's why, they can get away selling mounts for 2000 gold. FYI, i have no intentions of getting envoy armor, i dislike the skins. Will check the pvp one when they release the next version, maybe. Don't project your opinions on others. Just because you don't think that way (at least that's what you say), a lot of people do like their bling to show of their achievements. That's why rare items that are hard to get are more sought after than most legendaries. And if Raids aren't the epitome of PvE play, please do enlighten me to what is? And most importantly... **If it's simple why is this topic relevant? If it is simple farming, then you just DEMONSTRATED THERE'S NO NEED FOR AN EASY MODE**!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC.4521 Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > > @"BillC.4521" said: > > > > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > > > > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > > > > > > > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Teamkiller.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > > > > > I;m fine with them enjoying it. I want them to enjoy it. Nobody's talking about reducing that enjoyment. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh but you're not okay with it. You're not okay with them having a cool looking skin for doing something you can't, or rather I should say, refuse to learn to do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Ohoni.6057" said: > > > > > > > > > > >You mean like when they added wardrobes that allowed you to copy the skins over to multiple weapons? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know exactly what I'm talking about, don't feign ignorance. "Let's make copies of one of your prized possessions that you worked incredibly hard for and hand it out to everyone as a participation trophy." You wouldn't get annoyed? Well if you wouldn't, great for you, but that's not how ordinary people would react. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if its a different skin, and it take proportionally longer to attain then it has no bearing on your precious gear. Just like WVW and sPVP where simple farming gains legendary gear - your not offended by that right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, first it's not just "simple farming", second it's not envoy armor... Envoy Armor **means** you Raided to exhaustion, did the Provisioner ridiculous thing and completed the collections... All that conclude to a meh skin, that works as a great symbol of status. It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player. Like Legendary Weapons were in the first 6 months. > > > > > > > > Like the Legendary backs were in the first couple months after they released. > > > > > > > > But armor won't be easily dumbed down, that's why people rail against it... You can't fake your way through Raids as easily as you can through T4 Fractals. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > actually it is indeed simple farming, im doing it myself and both myself and the other wvw fans have fun doing it, with no kitten measuring to boot. RE ' It's the epitome of being a complete PvE player' oh my word you surely have shown the dirty side of raider mentality here and dont even realise it i suspect! 1. get over yourself, 2. get with the times, the entire demographic is older and has moved on from this dated 'im better than you because im shinier' concept. The guild wars universe has never been about this kind of attitude, that's a different market, ie wow and co. > > > > > > > > > > > > Can i get my special gizmo from automated tournament 1st place by farming? Lets make thread asking for automated tournament rewards available on custom game room so everyone can farming it. > > > > > > > > > > you know its easier talking than trying to be clever. I was referring to wvw., > > > > > > > > Well pretty sure you and me know about that. > > > > And this thread about pve/raid content so i dont know why people keep bringing wvw and pvp here :) > > > > > > I brought wvw in because the raiders were remonstrating against 'easy' legendary gear for easy mode raids without realising it seems that you can already get legendary gear through simple farming :) > > > > Well imo, for pve content its all about progression tho. So maybe its different with wvw > > > > Just see fotm legend backpack, need to do CM and progressing to t4, and anet already said fotm is the stage before you go to raid means its another progression to another better rewards. > > > > So i dont think it can be compared to wvw or pvp. Just like tournament special gizmo only for 1st place and not for everyone. > > The comparison will never end, the game mode already different, anet approach on each game mode different too. like why wvw tournament disappear etc but they add tournament to pvp > > i'm not comparing, im saying theres a precedent for legendary gear outwith current raids. and people here want the skin not the armor if they only want armor then probably no one gonna complain if they release easy mode to get the plain looking armor with the change stat ability well im farming for wvw mode too since its easier, just join zerg and get the pips, well if anet gonna release better skin like envoy armor for wvw/pvp i think they gonna lock it behind something rather than what you wvw/pvp have right now tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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