Exploration and hidden outposts

[Sunburst.1529]

Hello :)

 

Exploring the maps and the beautiful world of Guild Wars has always been my favourite part of the game and now I would love to use this unique chance to ask some questions that are related to my liking on cartography :)

 

1.)

There are several old PvP-Arenas in Prophecies, that used to be accessible during the early days and are know inaccessible like Fort Koga.

 

Have these arenas been completely removed for the Factions release or would it be possible  to make them at least accessible for exploration again? Maybe together with the other arenas where the access is very limited like the arena in the Shiverpeaks or the Sunspear-Arena.

Even as an empty map just for cartography would be great.

 

2.)

What is the deal with those mysterious hidden outposts like the one in the Domain of Anguish  that directly lead to Mallyx? What are they needed for and how many of them are there in the game?

 

3.)

Is it possible to make some areas that nowadays are hard or impossible  to reach  (Fort Aspenwood, the huge area behind the gate in the Northlands or Vizunah Square (Local Quarter) for non-canthan characters) more easy to reach/explore or to add some "underground" areas like the maps for Alliance Battle and the Bonus Mission Pack to the worldmap to fill it even more and to allow more exploration of the world?

 

Thank you for reading my questions. I would be really glad if I could get some answers from you! :)

 

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

If I remember correctly there are ways into Vizunah Square (local quarter) for non-Canthan characters.

 

> Non-Factions characters are able to gain access to this outpost after having completed Zen Daijun by being in a party with a Factions character while they complete the quest Mayhem in the Market - the entrance will otherwise be blocked to non-Factions characters.

[Astralporing.1957]

> @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said:

> If I remember correctly there are ways into Vizunah Square (local quarter) for non-Canthan characters.

>

> > Non-Factions characters are able to gain access to this outpost after having completed Zen Daijun by being in a party with a Factions character while they complete the quest Mayhem in the Market - the entrance will otherwise be blocked to non-Factions characters.

That was okay during the times when people played the game extensively. Nowadays however it's a really strict requirement, as it not only requires you to know a second player, but that player will need to create a character specially for you (because the old players generally completed this mission long ago)

 

[Joe Kimmes.1357]

I don't know that we will have the opportunity to add ways to access the old arenas or change difficult to reach areas, but I appreciate your interest in completing the map.

 

Something I can ramble about a bit is the mission outposts. In Prophecies, the game was built around the idea that every 'mission' was by nature tied to an outpost - in fact, if I recall correctly the early vision was that the game was only Outposts and Missions, without explorable areas. The game maps are built around this premise at a very fundamental level, such that in creating a Mission, you automatically create a Outpost for it. Designers would later try different setups, like sending players from one mission straight into another, and with default settings this results in there being a dummy outpost that isn't normally accessible for the second mission. It's pretty rare though, since most missions do have a proper outpost.

[Ithilwen.1529]

I have just finished Elona in GW1, (In the past couple of days. ) **It could not be completed on a non Elona character without the "minion trick."** This trick is discussed on the official wiki. I understand that some "backstage" areas can be accessed in Cantha as well.

 

You literally won't make 100% map completion, at least in Elona without either minion tricking or an Elonian toon. Unfortunately.. using the SaO chain or Assassin skills seems to have been nerfed.

[Astralporing.1957]

It _is_ possible, just not very easy.

[Justine.6351]

> @"Ithilwen.1529" said:

> I have just finished Elona in GW1, (In the past couple of days. ) **It could not be completed on a non Elona character without the "minion trick."** This trick is discussed on the official wiki. I understand that some "backstage" areas can be accessed in Cantha as well.

>

> You literally won't make 100% map completion, at least in Elona without either minion tricking or an Elonian toon. Unfortunately.. using the SoA chain or Assassin skills seems to have been nerfed.

 

L2Scrape

Okay I run and hide now ;-)

 

Really though you maybe missed the challenge mission areas? I had to do those on my cathan mesmer 100 years ago for Cartographer.

[Ithilwen.1529]

> @"Justine.6351" said:

> > @"Ithilwen.1529" said:

> > I have just finished Elona in GW1, (In the past couple of days. ) **It could not be completed on a non Elona character without the "minion trick."** This trick is discussed on the official wiki. I understand that some "backstage" areas can be accessed in Cantha as well.

> >

> > You literally won't make 100% map completion, at least in Elona without either minion tricking or an Elonian toon. Unfortunately.. using the SoA chain or Assassin skills seems to have been nerfed.

>

> L2Scrape

> Okay I run and hide now ;-)

>

> Really though you maybe missed the challenge mission areas? I had to do those on my cathan mesmer 100 years ago for Cartographer.

 

I completed the tombs area and also got the Sunspear Arena. The Elonian Introduction Mission area was still needed.

[Justine.6351]

> @"Ithilwen.1529" said:

> > @"Justine.6351" said:

> > > @"Ithilwen.1529" said:

> > > I have just finished Elona in GW1, (In the past couple of days. ) **It could not be completed on a non Elona character without the "minion trick."** This trick is discussed on the official wiki. I understand that some "backstage" areas can be accessed in Cantha as well.

> > >

> > > You literally won't make 100% map completion, at least in Elona without either minion tricking or an Elonian toon. Unfortunately.. using the SoA chain or Assassin skills seems to have been nerfed.

> >

> > L2Scrape

> > Okay I run and hide now ;-)

> >

> > Really though you maybe missed the challenge mission areas? I had to do those on my cathan mesmer 100 years ago for Cartographer.

>

> I completed the tombs area and also got the Sunspear Arena. The Elonian Introduction Mission area was still needed.

 

From GWW:

 

GuildWiki has estimated the amount of leeway built-in to the titles as follows:

Tyria: > 1.49% (about the size of an average mission or explorable area, e.g. Salt Flats or Sanctum Cay)

Cantha: > 0.94% (about the size of Fort Aspenwood)

Elona:

~0.19% for non-Elonians (about the size of Pogahn Passage (outpost))

0.77% for Elonians (slightly larger than Churrhir Fields)

These estimates do not include exploring areas that are otherwise inaccessible; portal jumping and the Gate Glitch can provide additional leeway, especially for Cantha and Elona.

 

Its tight, but you probably just missed maybe ~10 nibs throughout elona.

[Tanner Blackfeather.6509]

> @"Ithilwen.1529" said:

> I have just finished Elona in GW1, (In the past couple of days. ) **It could not be completed on a non Elona character without the "minion trick."** This trick is discussed on the official wiki. I understand that some "backstage" areas can be accessed in Cantha as well.

>

> You literally won't make 100% map completion, at least in Elona without either minion tricking or an Elonian toon. Unfortunately.. using the SaO chain or Assassin skills seems to have been nerfed.

 

Several years ago, I've gotten Grandmaster Cartographer on my tyrian character, so the NF intro area is definitely not needed.

I'm not even sure both me and my partner got the little spot from the cutscene on the boat after rescuing Kormir.

[Sunburst.1529]

> @"Joe Kimmes.1357" said:

> In Prophecies, the game was built around the idea that every 'mission' was by nature tied to an outpost - in fact, if I recall correctly the early vision was that the game was only Outposts and Missions, without explorable areas.

 

Would you mind to expand on this a little further? This topic feels very interesting to me :)

What was the intention of the original decision to make the PvE-part just consisting of missions and outposts? When and why did you decide to change this setting and design the game like it is nowadays with explorable areas and quests? I`m sure there were many internal discussions about the change of such fundamental parts of the game.

 

About those hidden outposts:

From what I know so far is that they could be divided in two groups:

 

Hidden outposts that are only in the game because the setup of the developer-tools needs them or creates them automatic, but that have no use (and maybe don`t even an own map).

 

Accessible outposts that just don´t show up on the map to prevent the players from traveling to them without fulfilling special requirements (like the Deep and Urgoz´s Warren).

 

Is there even more to know about them?

Are there even more of them in the game? Maybe outposts that were cut out of the game before its release but are still in the game – just not accessible?

For example within the Fortress of Jahai is a huge area that looks like it was once intended to be an outpost or at least explorable. Even though there seems to be nothing at the moment. Maybe a hidden outpost is located there? Or what is the purpose of this area? Or another example: There seem to be several blocked portals in the Flame Temple Corridor. What is behind them?

 

I´m a really nosy person (that’s why I love to explore every accessible part of the game till the last corner) and it would be really great if I could finally unveil the myth around these enigmatic outposts that no player has ever seen or entered. Even if this might be a rather boring thing for a developer who created them and maybe knows everything about them it would be really great if could get an answer to this topic, as it’s really fascinating me. :)

 

I´m sure you´ve already noticed but I´m no native English speaker, so I would like to make sure I understood your statement about the old PvP-arenas correctly:

The arenas are still in the game and haven´t been removed. Furthermore due to unspecific reasons (maybe technical issues, a lack of time or not being interested) it´s unlikely that there will ever be a way to access them. Is this correct?