Best Change Ever!!!

[Victory.2879]

I'd keep this change if they do something else too- which is remove all stealth from the game in it's current format. Stealth should not work coming straight at you, nor should you be allowed to zip around whilst in stealth. Make it being about stealthy, rather than just a cheese mechanic to allow one shots macros.

 

So far it's a fun fest for the stealth classes and no fun at all for any support class, who now get even less loot than before.

 

Travelling back to your zerg after you died has become less fun too with the increased number of cheese users out and about.

[JasonLucas.4981]

Just no.

There are a lot of problems with no downed state which affect skills/traits/runes and other things, Anet would need to invest time tweaking those, but the only thing I want them to focus now is the world restructuring.

[aspirine.5839]

> @"Meviken.2054" said:

> > @"aspirine.5839" said:

> > How are you dying from siege if you are in a zerg. Really how many times do you die from AC fire? That hardly does any damage at all.

>

> Having killed a few with siege when they were in zerg, it's really not that hard. Miss your dodge, and five ganged catapults smash you in the ground. An arrow cart doesn't do that much damage, but twenty of them at a time would. And trebs can be used on zergs to great effect. Yep. Killed a few that way, too, and got the bags.

 

I have never seen that situation in whole of WvW though. Perhaps a few like 2 or max 3 ac's. And that usually is not even enough to make a dent in the healing power a blob group has :/

[Wisty.1867]

As someone who does a blend of small/solo roaming in addition to zerging, I am really enjoying this. My build tends to be a tanky condi trap ranger, which usually doesn't have enough power burst to kill anything outright but can certainly reward longer engagements (15 seconds+). Normally, achieving downstate was simple enough of they remained in combat with me, but often didn't have the juice to finish someone if I also got downed, and made jumping in on me less of an issue sice they could go down due to condis after they stomp and then rally.

 

Now, however, it requires more risk assessment on the enemy's part - do they chase me as I kite them with Hard and Soft CC and tick passive DoT's, or do they re-think and reapproach / get more friends to deal with me? It makes it so a lot more thought goes into what engagements you take on the small scale.

 

For zerg play, this is even better! I saw tactics. TACTICS! Being used last night. 5 or so with mobility and stealth flanked an enemy blob while our "outnumbered" blob made attempts to "run away" or stall. Our stealth squad pounced the backline and blew up 5+ of their damage dealers and we engaged as the blob turned to fight them. It was beautiful. And I've never really seen this happening before; it's always been just... "Kinda poke at range until one side starts losing, I guess!" It also makes seige placement actually matter since if you put it in a stupid spot and you die on it, well congrats. Now you're punished for it harder.

 

Now, since the builds I run tend to be brawler/sustainy builds, this change has only benefitted me. My friend's glass rev has had a slightly harder time in small group roaming, but I think that is more a difficulty associated with "a sensible build" versus "brainless damage dealer" build.

 

Preliminary thoughts - no downed state is *feeling* good. It's fun and it's making me consider what I can and can't do more deeply. I've seen it bring back some strategy, too, which always makes me more excited to play WvW again. Things are unbalanced still, and they'll need looked at, but so far this change has felt very positive.

[Nanners.9428]

> @"Israel.7056" said:

> I made a post years ago talking about getting rid of downed state and I've had to wait this long to get to try it out but it's just as awesome as I thought it would be.

>

> No downstate is amazing ANET please consider making this a permanent feature.

>

> It makes the combat much feel more tense and high stakes and it feels great to just blow people up and be done with them.

>

> It also makes outnumbered fights much more feasible which is always good imo.

>

> Seriously please consider making this a permanent change to WvW.

>

 

+1 for this change to be implemented.

 

I also waited for this for a really long time since 2016. Love the idea of no downstate, one bad positioning and u cld be gameover, it makes wvw/gvg alot more skill based, fights and especially outnumbered fights will be more intense.

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

I did a old known strat that isnt as popular today as it was like 4+years ago. We easily wiped a group near or just above our size (~20...i love the fights). They didnt know what hit em.

[Arlette.9684]

Dude where’s my cow?

 

I like it but it’s less personal when you kill someone.

[revox.8273]

> @"Limodriver.4106" said:

> 1. PPL complaining are the one still playing with same build same style

> 2. small grp has chance to take out big blob now

> 3. tagging problem can be solved by allowing contribution thru grps so if 1 person in ur grp tagged u get the credit too

>

 

its so fun now with elementalist getting 1shotted in the moment you jumped down from the spawn point becouse some random s/d thief is allmost perma stealthed in the near/ or that 1-2- pew pew longbow ranger sees you from 1500 range/ or even eating a gunflame

1 depends from player to player

2 it was possible with relative ease to wipe 30 ppl with 10 good players in seconds

3 so basically i can heal 2-3 groupies and take tonz of loot? yeah shure, cant fault you for having a wyld dream tho

[Mil.3562]

Before ANet think of making this as a permanent or turning it into a regular thingy, please refund us those finishers we bought over the years and change those skills or traits that affect down-state.

 

WvW is the only reason I am still playing this game and lately I have been contemplating whether to quit this game for good because of how broken scrouges are in WvW. I wonder whose brilliant idea is it? Must be coming from someone who main a scrouge or a ganker.

[CowOfGlory.5816]

> @"BlueMelody.6398" said:

> There is an extreme divide of opinion here. Gankers love it, people who rely on range damage are being rewarded, siege humpers are getting free kills. Anyone who runs support in a large zerg, all-melee players, and all those people who keep getting one-shot from stealth while coming out of spawn are hating it, and for good reason.

 

I play Support guard and have to say this is the most fun I've had playing the class. I get to focus on actually keeping my team members fully alive, rather than interacting with (Reviving) all the bad players who don't know how to position themselves.

 

Being able to take on 30+ people with a group of 15 using a good combination of Burst and support is fantastic

[Arcaedus.7290]

Anyone else find it hilarious how polarized the community seems to be on this issue?

[LinhZeri.6412]

Now we get to see who is bad at WvW. Welcome change.... time to weed out the bads and bring back skilled play of the golden age of WvW.

[Celsith.2753]

> @"BlueMelody.6398" said:

> There is an extreme divide of opinion here. Gankers love it, people who rely on range damage are being rewarded, siege humpers are getting free kills. Anyone who runs support in a large zerg, all-melee players, and all those people who keep getting one-shot from stealth while coming out of spawn are hating it, and for good reason.

>

I've been playing my melee zerg rev and really enjoying the no down state, just as much as i'm enjoying it on my pick soul beast. Don't assume your hates are everyone else's please <3

 

Love this so far, as someone said to me last night, 'I don't think I can go back to how things were'

 

 

[Pinko.2076]

melee meta would easily adapt if this were permanent

people are just too used to the "stack defensive comp, poke at 900 range with scourges" gameplay which is VERY EASY to pick at.

[whoknocks.4935]

> @"Rysdude.3824" said:

> Im enjoying it as well. I like the risky feel of solo roaming. A bit tough when you encounter 2 or more roaming in a squad, but still fun.

 

I solo roam as well, i dont feel the risky feel you say, if you were downed you were stomped immediately anyway, now it's just faster.

 

I like how outnumbered fights like 1vs2 are more fun, you kill 1 of the 2 guys who are trying to kill you and you don't have to worry he could be ressed by some stupid npc kill or player ress, he is gone forever, so you can focus immediately the other guy and have a more fair fight.

 

Obviously skilless gankers are all over the place right now, way more than before, who chase you 5vs1 for half the map till they got you killed and put a siege on you.

[Grandtomatoe.2045]

should be a fun week but it wont stay permanent.

[Evolute.6239]

> @"Arcaedus.7290" said:

> Anyone else find it hilarious how polarized the community seems to be on this issue?

 

because half of the people who post here are probably leather classes or mesmer roamers who love this change, and the other half are (the majority) who play in large scale guild or zerg based groups where again this change is either good for you (as you outskill your opponents and have large bombs) or bad for you (because you lose a ton of people to random shatter mesmers)

 

if you are a soulbeast player i'm sure this week is fantastic. if you're an outnumbered zerg or against a pinsniping group this week is just bad.

 

I do like how this week makes leather classes more viable as they are better at securing downs (but not so much at KILLING downed state players) but I do not think the other classes, who fit into the meta just fine, should suffer for that

[Gwaihir.1745]

> @"alphafert.6730" said:

> > @"Gwaihir.1745" said:

> > > @"BlueMelody.6398" said:

> > > This is amazing for stealth+burst gankers, and arrow cart wizards, and absolute anathema for melee-only zerg players and identifiable commanders (pin-sniping is a thing).

> > >

> > > This should definitely not be a permanent thing.

> >

> > Permanent? No, but some huge changes to down state/ other mechanics.

> > 1. No invuln phase upon being downed.

> > 2. Greatly reduced res speed of down state players.

> > 3. No damaging skills from down state. Only a cc and the skill 4 heal to get yourself back up. You lost your hp, you don't get to continue the fight so enjoy watching from the sidelines. That guy taking you on 1v3 doesn't deserve to have a down picking away when by all means that player has lost until they are revived.

> > 4. No visible commander tag to opposing players.

> > 5. Rework of scrapper and other traits affecting down skills.

> >

> > > @"alphafert.6730" said:

> > > I am not a fan. I have played gw2 for over a year but just recently our small guild (3) got a guild hall and it is kind of forcing us to pvp/wvw. We can often do ok with our missions but (maybe its lack of skill) we res each other a lot getting us back much faster than running. This is going to cut out quite a few missions for us. pvp/wvw has been kind of an off-puting experience anyway

> >

> > You can still ress though? It just means that you don't get to bring a guy back until the fight is decided which is perfectly fine since they by all means lost. Should you win the fight its not a long wait to get your team back up.

>

> Often one of us will occupy enemy while the other resses. You can't res from dead while in combat so yes this kinda puts an end to any cap/hold missions for us.

>

> I also got killed several times trying to leave the spawn to meet up with the com on our map last night. A few of those times several friendlies past by just after death chasing off the enemy but by the time I respawned they were long gone leaving me to get killed again. Its not like I am going out with just any random build. I researched meta but there is no learning curve when a player appears & near insta kills well inside our territory. Its fine though, if you want only elites in wvw/pvp & no new players. I don't mind finding a new game as I am pretty much bored with pve

 

Thats not what im seeing at all. I've been asked for my build multiple times from newer players this week, and even some run of the mill weekly zerg players. They WANT to get better now because its obvious that theyre struggling when they get picked mid zerg. This is in no way locking out the new players for only 'elites' as you say. Is it harder? Yes. But new players actually wanting to learn to fight is alot better than just shoving them into a zerg and saying here run this you go down we pick you up.

 

And before anyone calls me out, im playing core guard with no 25% movement speed rune to get back to the fight if i die. (or passive, lol)

[Pinko.2076]

> @"Evolute.6239" said:

> > @"Arcaedus.7290" said:

> > Anyone else find it hilarious how polarized the community seems to be on this issue?

>

> because half of the people who post here are probably leather classes or mesmer roamers who love this change, and the other half are (the majority) who play in large scale guild or zerg based groups where again this change is either good for you (as you outskill your opponents and have large bombs) or bad for you (because you lose a ton of people to random shatter mesmers)

>

> if you are a soulbeast player i'm sure this week is fantastic. if you're an outnumbered zerg or against a pinsniping group this week is just bad.

>

> I do like how this week makes leather classes more viable as they are better at securing downs (but not so much at KILLING downed state players) but I do not think the other classes, who fit into the meta just fine, should suffer for that

 

That's really silly to assume. I know a good amount of the posters here, and they're ( and myself) actually a lot of people who enjoy "zerg" combat when it was dynamic and skill based. Modern meta is so far beyond trash in comparison. This change brings back a dynamic style of play where individual skill has a significant impact on if you live or die. Maybe some balance change would be good if this stayed, but the overall feel of combat is so much better on the individual, group, and zerg level compared to where the game is with downed state.

[Mil.3562]

> @"CowOfGlory.5816" said:

> > @"BlueMelody.6398" said:

> > There is an extreme divide of opinion here. Gankers love it, people who rely on range damage are being rewarded, siege humpers are getting free kills. Anyone who runs support in a large zerg, all-melee players, and all those people who keep getting one-shot from stealth while coming out of spawn are hating it, and for good reason.

>

> I play Support guard and have to say this is the most fun I've had playing the class. I get to focus on actually keeping my team members fully alive, rather than interacting with (Reviving) all the bad players who don't know how to position themselves.

>

> Being able to take on 30+ people with a group of 15 using a good combination of Burst and support is fantastic

 

So you are saying those with low hp base and wearing light or medium armours and without Ageis or invulnerability skills are bad players? Did you even try playing one and try dodging those 20+ toxic huge aoes? I supposed many players like you are the reasons why 80% of the classes in wvw zerg are fb and scrouges.

[Patterns.9067]

NO down state is easily the most fun I have had in wvw in a very long time,, keep it please!

[Israel.7056]

> @"Mil.3562" said:

> So you are saying those with low hp base and wearing light or medium armours and without Ageis or invulnerability skills are bad players?

 

If they're dying constantly yes.

[Brother.1504]

Do people really spend this much time in downstate regularly? Lol. Dying in a fight a few times a night happens. I’m more pleased with the loot buff.

[fufu.8345]

I've been waiting for this for four years and I have to say "It's the best and most rewarding change in wvw that I have experienced in a long time" I really hope Anet puts this to a vote to make permanent!

[CowOfGlory.5816]

> @"Mil.3562" said:

> So you are saying those with low hp base and wearing light or medium armours and without Ageis or invulnerability skills are bad players? Did you even try playing one and try dodging those 20+ toxic huge aoes? I supposed many players like you are the reasons why 80% of the classes in wvw zerg are fb and scrouges.

 

Being bad at positioning, and playing a light or medium armor class has nothing to do with each other. 70% of my gameplay time has been on s/f Fresh air ele, If i am positioned bad, i should be punished for it. But again, that has nothing to do with my weightclass or Hitpoints, I strictly said positioning.