The TRUE Release Notes

[Nimon.7840]

> @"Chasind.3128" said:

> I guess people who do not play elementalist regularly do not understand what ele has gone though in nerfs. Sure, it has high DPS but if you sneeze on an ele, the ele dies. You have to learn about positioning, timing and to take your licks because their healing is terrible. their toughness is terrible. their evades aren't anything to praise. their conditions are terrible. They give crap boons. So, what makes them unique compared to every other class that does literally everything better? The ele DPS. (which revenant can reach just as easily and can 1 shot any weaver)

 

Wanna speak about necro? The only thing necro has is 19k base hp

 

Sustain/healing is bad

Dmg is bad

Easy target to cc

Weak against ranged attacks

Immobile af.

Same thoughness as ele

Scalings are terrible (esp healing)

No real good defense. Only defense is shroud. That has 10 seconds cd and is capped behind lifeforce

 

And actually if you only invest a little bit into healpower on ele you can get pretty good heals and heal up from 0 to 100%

 

Didn't look into last patch notes. But before last patch ele was very good.

[Dadnir.5038]

> @"Chasind.3128" said:

> I guess people who do not play elementalist regularly do not understand what ele has gone though in nerfs. Sure, it has high DPS but if you sneeze on an ele, the ele dies. You have to learn about positioning, timing and to take your licks because their healing is terrible. their toughness is terrible. their evades aren't anything to praise. their conditions are terrible. They give crap boons. So, what makes them unique compared to every other class that does literally everything better? The ele DPS. (which revenant can reach just as easily and can 1 shot any weaver)

 

I'm affraid, the issue isn't there. Your point of view come from someone in the elementalist's shoes and certainly make sense. However, from this point of view you can't really see the world the same way other professions see the world.

 

Hard fact are that the elementalist have been the favored pick as a dps for 5 years and a half now (not 6 because in the first half year players didn't realized the potential of the elementalist). The same hard facts show that the elementalist can provide a lot of boon, dish out a lot of different conditions (even if restricted in damaging conditions), output large amount of heal, provide unique support... etc.

 

The point is that some other professions can't even provide things close to any of those things that the elementalist got at hand. And those professions feel that it's only fair that the elementalist see himself brought down a notch due to that.

 

The issue of the elementalist is that it's players are caught into a DPS race mindset. I'm not saying that this is not in line with the way PvE is competitive, however it doesn't mean that the elementalist don't have way more advantage over quite a few professions than just DPS. It's just that those advantages aren't exploited by PvE group. Fire shield for example, it look like crap but allow your allies to inflict and extra burn tick of damage every time they take a hit. Applied to 5 allies it's a potential 1k7 extra dps for your team. and this is merely an example, conjure are supposed to be laid as support for allies not as tools for personnal dps... etc. The moment you ponder about what the elementalist got, you realise that he is way more than a simple DPS and that it's not only due to it's dps that he managed to dominate PvE for almost 6 years already.

 

Yes the elementalist's dps got nerfed over and over and over again, but guess what? The elementalist is still a top tier dps even after that while some other professions like the thief, for example, have been in the low tier for a long time despite their inate survivability being on par with elementalist's.

 

A few elementalists players even litterally got on a crusade against the necromancer's only skill allowing them a spot in PvE. These past 6 years the necromancer got, cumulated, 4 month of glory in high end PvE whereas the elementalist stood at the top for years. Do you really think there is no reason for the necromancers to ressent elementalists players?

 

Revenant (herald) got nerfed as soon as they seemed to be competitive in high end PvE and renegade still don't have more chance to be taken in a raid than elementalists. Don't you think that from their point of view the elementalist's tears have a bitter taste?

 

Even from the point of view of a guardian or an engineer, elementalist's complaints in PvE are hard to swallow.

 

Yes the elementalist need a bit of help in PvP, they are compelled into bunker builds in this gamemode and it's understandable that elementalists feel sick of this. However, in PvE, the elementalist got nothing to say. They've been basked in glory for a long time already and despite the nerf they are still competitive for a dps spot and they can still be taken as off-healer/support.

[Sephylon.4938]

> @"Chasind.3128" said:

> I guess people who do not play elementalist regularly do not understand what ele has gone though in nerfs. Sure, it has high DPS but if you sneeze on an ele, the ele dies.

 

Then hug your druid/fb and stop standing infront of the boss/in red circles.

 

>You have to learn about positioning, timing and to take your licks

 

Poor ele has to do something everyone has to do to not die to 1 shot mechanics or enemy zergs.

 

>because their healing is terrible. their >toughness is terrible.

Ha! I've seen eles go 10-100 in less than a sec, even on a 2v1. Your healing is only terrible coz you prob don't have healing power. Hug your healer.

 

>their evades aren't anything to praise.

Better than necro's since they actually have an evade outside of the 2 dodges

 

>their conditions are terrible.

Last checked their condi build was benched at 33k prior to this patch, which was better than necro's 30 at the time.

 

>They give crap boons.

Having access to regen, vigor, prot, might, and fury makes them better than necro, who has access to might, prot and fury.

 

>So, what makes them unique compared to every other class that does literally everything better? The ele DPS. (which revenant can reach just as easily and can 1 shot any weaver)

 

Btw which game mode are you even arguing for?

 

 

[Anchoku.8142]

> @"Chasind.3128" said:

> I guess people who do not play elementalist regularly do not understand what ele has gone though in nerfs. Sure, it has high DPS but if you sneeze on an ele, the ele dies. You have to learn about positioning, timing and to take your licks because their healing is terrible. their toughness is terrible. their evades aren't anything to praise. their conditions are terrible. They give crap boons. So, what makes them unique compared to every other class that does literally everything better? The ele DPS. (which revenant can reach just as easily and can 1 shot any weaver)

 

I quietly played Ele for a while before switching to Mesmer, Ranger, and Thief.

 

Necomancer's "problem" is that being the last one standing before a wipe does not help very much. Group support and/or dps is what is needed for raids and Necro is substandard at both. It is NOT anywhere close to how bad Necro was before HoT but it is still either too selfish or light on damage. Having low damage is fine, even very, very low damage, if Necro brings some needed anti-wipe or dps-buff to the group like the extreme examples of Ranger and Mesmer. If Necro does not bring enough group support for its dps in support builds, then the final criteria is pure dps build capability.

 

Necromancer had Epi-bouncing for the pure dps option, which was at least as technically challenging as an Ele rotation because it depended upon stacking Necro's who had to coordinate skills and timing where, with only one Necro, Epi could only be used to reduce pressure from additional mobs (add's). Epidemic bouncing is now dead because the timing to get 25% the original damage on the boss was cut in half.

 

Necromancer's original design theme of excelling at condition management has been broken for years. The profession can only do just enough condition management to survive on its own. It's ability to help others in a group is insufficient and unnecessary. I have never, ever, seen a forum comment or LFG request for Necromancer to handle conditions for the group or team.

 

Does Ele need a Necro to help it make top dps? Does any profession rely on Necro to manage conditions so it does not go down while focusing on dps?

 

This is the crux of Necro's problem: it cannot help other group members with what it is supposed to do best because it lacks the tools, which resulted in each profession receiving their own tools. Staff 4 used to transfer conditions from allies to enemies. There are several skills and traits designed to aid allies in condition management but were broken or neglected by Arenanet.

[Luca.4670]

I play from years both ele and necro and I find these costant nerfs very bad and stupid. SS nerf was already a joke no dhumfire nerf lol fa weaver nerf lol now staff ele too?ele must be high risk/trash reward?balance must be based on the PERCEPTION of tras/mediocre players?ppl understand that necro job was damage and corruption, but we had no sustain/mobility/active defenses for that?SS nerf killed the pace of scourge playstyle now dhumfire destroyed DL build for spvp and maybe roaming(lol scourge in roaming lol). For eles we cant have a dd build we cant have a scepter build, staff just viable for zergs/blobs and now nerfed, what we have left?I adapted to all changes but they are nerfing too much and this kind of habit must stop.

[SilentSam.1589]

> @"polvere.2805" said:

> The salt is real.

 

salt is always real it is what makes things tasty

[Paradox.2018]

But they were all of them deceived, for another nerf was made..

 

One nerf.. to rule them all!.

 

"The Lord of the Chronos. The fellowship of the nerfs".

[zinkz.7045]

> @"Feanor.2358" said:

> ELEMENTALIST

> We have noticed that elementalists have been preforming well in raids and fractals recently...

 

You know that only really works when the class in question has a reasonable amount of history of being underpowered, not when the class has spent large periods as best DPS to the point of being broken OP at times.

 

 

[polvere.2805]

It's pretty normal in GW2 that when a class get (rightfully) nerfed all the mains of that class go and complain, but this is the first time i've seen the same people wanting their class op again and all the others nerfed in pve environment.

[Dadnir.5038]

> @"Anchoku.8142" said:

> Necromancer's original design theme of excelling at condition management has been broken for years. The profession can only do just enough condition management to survive on its own. It's ability to help others in a group is insufficient and unnecessary. I have never, ever, seen a forum comment or LFG request for Necromancer to handle conditions for the group or team.

>

> Does Ele need a Necro to help it make top dps? Does any profession rely on Necro to manage conditions so it does not go down while focusing on dps?

 

You're quite right there. If we look at it objectively, boss and even mobs usually rely neither on boons nor on conditions to increase there damages. The necromancer's role might have been something if the boss relied on such things. Imagine a boss applying constantly vulnerability and weakness, a boss that would need to have a good amount of crit chance and thus the need for fury, a boss that don't dish out stupidly high damage unless he got 25 might stack...

 

The necromancer is designed to fight foes that ramp up in power by farting both conditions and boons, he is not designed to fight foes that have spurt of moments when then put all the conditions of the world on it's foes and don't care whether they got boons or not. For the necromancer's "role" the issue lie here and the breakbar didn't make this issue less glaring.

[The Bassist.5410]

Perhaps this cycle of class 're-balancing' has a purpose that supersedes how the player controls the avatar, and how that avatar interacts with the game environment? Maybe the 'intent' itself represents something very specific to the development team, and we as players can't(re. instead of won't) understand 'that' meaning because we lack the point-of-view to understand it?

 

Consider:

You are the Department Head for a team of programmers whom's sole purpose in that company is to 're-balance', 'renovate', 'update', and/or 'patch' any character class project assigned. And one day, you're given such a project. Yet, to your dismay, you and your team discover that the project 'class' is perfect(or near to). In fact, reviewing the project implies that any alterations would damage or disrupt it's intended functionality; 'patching' this character class would be a bad idea.

Well, you're the team leader, so it's your job to tell the Project Director that in relation to the assignment given, you and your team are....irrelevant.

I would not want that Department Head's job in that scenario.

 

But, an experienced, intelligent team leader wouldn't handle that issue in that manner. Nope. No way. Instead, the Department Head would scramble their team together and formulate a response to both the Director AND the game community that not only is that character class bad, but it needs constant revising....all the time....every day....for at least the next 20-25 years.

 

Job Security. It's tough to maintain in this day and age. It must be even more so given this era's gaming industry.

[DragonFury.6243]

> @"The Bassist.5410" said:

> Perhaps this cycle of class 're-balancing' has a purpose that supersedes how the player controls the avatar, and how that avatar interacts with the game environment? Maybe the 'intent' itself represents something very specific to the development team, and we as players can't(re. instead of won't) understand 'that' meaning because we lack the point-of-view to understand it?

>

> Consider:

> You are the Department Head for a team of programmers whom's sole purpose in that company is to 're-balance', 'renovate', 'update', and/or 'patch' any character class project assigned. And one day, your given such a project. Yet, to your dismay, you and your team discover that the project 'class' is perfect(or near to). In fact, reviewing the project implies that any alterations would damage or disrupt it's intended functionality; 'patching' this character class would be a bad idea.

> Well, you're the team leader, so it's your job to tell the Project Director that in relation to the assignment given, you and your team are....irrelevant.

> I would not want that Department Head's job in that scenario.

>

> But, an experience, intelligent team leader wouldn't handle that issue in that manner. Nope. No way. Instead, the Department Head would scramble their team together and formulate a response to both the Director AND the game community that not only is that character class bad, but it needs constant revising....all the time....every day....for at least the next 20-25 years.

>

> Job Security. It's tough to maintain in this day and age. It must be even more so given this era's gaming industry.

 

that all good but to have the brain capacity to nerf a elite in pve because of competitive modes is just wrong and no one can justifies that

regard the interaction that you mentioned who want to interacts with a profession that is under performing in all game mode

the only use i get from my scourge is collecting my home instance nodes

 

[The Bassist.5410]

> @"DragonFury.6243" said:

> that all good but to have the brain capacity to nerf a elite in pve because of competitive modes is just wrong and no one can justifies that

> regard the interaction that you mentioned who want to interacts with a profession that is under performing in all game mode

> the only use i get from my scourge is collecting my home instance nodes

>

 

"Try a different class." And that was about the best advice I was given when I tried Raiding. Still, I tried playing three other classes(Revenant, Guardian, Engineer -- The Guardian was a lot of fun actually; a more 'stereotypical' MMO class experience.), yet those classes didn't have 'it' like the Necromancer does -- The Necromancer is my main for a reason. So, now days, when I play Guild Wars 2, I do not Raid -- I couldn't care less about Raids. I don't even play high Tier Fractals anymore; there is additional content I don't invest in these days as well. This stance regarding how the Necromancer's been 'adjusted' over the years has had an impact on the 'how' and 'when' I choose to invest in the Guild Wars 2 product(I may have withheld purchasing content based on this.). Hence why when the subject of "class patch discrepancies" arises, I consider it a 'Developer' issue and not a 'Player' issue.

 

[DragonFury.6243]

> @"The Bassist.5410" said:

>I don't even play high Tier Fractals anymore; there is additional content I don't invest in these days as well. This stance regarding how the Necromancer's been 'adjusted' over the years has had an impact on the 'how' and 'when' I choose to invest in the Guild Wars 2 product(I may have withheld purchasing content based on this.). Hence why when the subject of "class patch discrepancies" arises, I consider it a 'Developer' issue and not a 'Player' issue.

>

 

me too haven't play any fractals and any content in that regards since the last patch

i can for sure switch to any of my other characters but just the thought about my necro all the work,gears and time went to waste

any professions shouldn't be lock away from end game content by a bad choice of balance

 

[Anchoku.8142]

> @"The Bassist.5410" said:

> Perhaps this cycle of class 're-balancing' has a purpose that supersedes how the player controls the avatar, and how that avatar interacts with the game environment? Maybe the 'intent' itself represents something very specific to the development team, and we as players can't(re. instead of won't) understand 'that' meaning because we lack the point-of-view to understand it?

>

> Consider:

> You are the Department Head for a team of programmers whom's sole purpose in that company is to 're-balance', 'renovate', 'update', and/or 'patch' any character class project assigned. And one day, you're given such a project. Yet, to your dismay, you and your team discover that the project 'class' is perfect(or near to). In fact, reviewing the project implies that any alterations would damage or disrupt it's intended functionality; 'patching' this character class would be a bad idea.

> Well, you're the team leader, so it's your job to tell the Project Director that in relation to the assignment given, you and your team are....irrelevant.

> I would not want that Department Head's job in that scenario.

>

> But, an experienced, intelligent team leader wouldn't handle that issue in that manner. Nope. No way. Instead, the Department Head would scramble their team together and formulate a response to both the Director AND the game community that not only is that character class bad, but it needs constant revising....all the time....every day....for at least the next 20-25 years.

>

> Job Security. It's tough to maintain in this day and age. It must be even more so given this era's gaming industry.

 

That scenario does not work in real life, at least not for long. I honestly believe the balance teams over the years do the best they can with the bandwidth and leeway to modify profession design they receive.