Gehenna.3625 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > > @"Miellyn.6847" said: > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > Won't happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The pve legendary armor skins are tied to Herald's Envoy title which would thus become meaningless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If Arenanet wanted to make access to the legendary armor skins easier they would have given the skins to WvW and Spvp. > > > > > > > If the skins were priced at 25 LI per piece for first set/50 per piece for the next ones, and the ability to buy them was locked behind both the raid armor collection, and having a legendary armor piece of corresponding location and weight category, what difference would it make? You'd still need to go through all the "necessary" raid hoops, the only difference would be in non-raid related gifts. > > > > > > The difference would be that the PvE armor is way more expensive than PvP/WvW armor. > > > > > > PvP/WvW costs more time, PvE costs more materials. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The cost thing couldnt be more wrong: > > > > > According to gw2 efficiency: > > > > > Heavy PvE raid armor > > > > > Helm 282g. > > > > > Pauldrons 282g. > > > > > Breastplate 293g > > > > > Gauntlets 282g > > > > > Legs 288g > > > > > Greaves 282g > > > > > > > > > > heavy triumphant hero mistforged wvw armor: > > > > > Helm 286g. > > > > > Pauldrons 285g. > > > > > Breastplate 286g > > > > > Gauntlets 286g > > > > > Legs 286g > > > > > Greaves 286g > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So are you saying that getting these armor sets is just a matter of gold cost or is there also a cost in time with regards to activities you have to do in game to be able to get said armor sets? > > > > > > > > I've never gotten involved in legendary stuff but I've come to understand that it takes a lot more time and effort to get the PvE version. Perhaps someone can comment on that. > > > > > > WvW armor is the easiest to get, effort-wise, but you get no unique legendary skin. And the time-gated tickets you earn per week (maximum 365 per week) mean a minimum of 22 weeks for a leggy set. Hours spent for those 365 tickets depend on your wvw rank. > > > > Yes that was my understanding. So the extra effort involved is rewarded with a unique skin. This would then be devaluated if you could buy it off in another way, because it's the only thing you get for the extra effort since functionally both sets are the same. > > > > Part of that is of course that they wanted to give raiding a long term purpose which you would take away if you made the skin available in different ways. > > > > The conversation was strictly about the cost. The unique skins are a different matter. Noone (including myself) suggested WvW have the PvE raid skins. The cost in gold is the same. Actually no, this discussion is about making the Legendary PvE skins available outside the current way (raiding in short) by adding another way to buy the skins as an upgrade for the Legendary WvW armor sets.. The cost was a sub-discussion that is not the main discussion point here and still has to be seen in light of the original post. So it's perfectly legitimate in the light of the actual discussion topic to indicate that cost is not the only issue here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltekka.2375 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > > > @"Miellyn.6847" said: > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > > Won't happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The pve legendary armor skins are tied to Herald's Envoy title which would thus become meaningless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If Arenanet wanted to make access to the legendary armor skins easier they would have given the skins to WvW and Spvp. > > > > > > > > If the skins were priced at 25 LI per piece for first set/50 per piece for the next ones, and the ability to buy them was locked behind both the raid armor collection, and having a legendary armor piece of corresponding location and weight category, what difference would it make? You'd still need to go through all the "necessary" raid hoops, the only difference would be in non-raid related gifts. > > > > > > > The difference would be that the PvE armor is way more expensive than PvP/WvW armor. > > > > > > > PvP/WvW costs more time, PvE costs more materials. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The cost thing couldnt be more wrong: > > > > > > According to gw2 efficiency: > > > > > > Heavy PvE raid armor > > > > > > Helm 282g. > > > > > > Pauldrons 282g. > > > > > > Breastplate 293g > > > > > > Gauntlets 282g > > > > > > Legs 288g > > > > > > Greaves 282g > > > > > > > > > > > > heavy triumphant hero mistforged wvw armor: > > > > > > Helm 286g. > > > > > > Pauldrons 285g. > > > > > > Breastplate 286g > > > > > > Gauntlets 286g > > > > > > Legs 286g > > > > > > Greaves 286g > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So are you saying that getting these armor sets is just a matter of gold cost or is there also a cost in time with regards to activities you have to do in game to be able to get said armor sets? > > > > > > > > > > I've never gotten involved in legendary stuff but I've come to understand that it takes a lot more time and effort to get the PvE version. Perhaps someone can comment on that. > > > > > > > > WvW armor is the easiest to get, effort-wise, but you get no unique legendary skin. And the time-gated tickets you earn per week (maximum 365 per week) mean a minimum of 22 weeks for a leggy set. Hours spent for those 365 tickets depend on your wvw rank. > > > > > > Yes that was my understanding. So the extra effort involved is rewarded with a unique skin. This would then be devaluated if you could buy it off in another way, because it's the only thing you get for the extra effort since functionally both sets are the same. > > > > > > Part of that is of course that they wanted to give raiding a long term purpose which you would take away if you made the skin available in different ways. > > > > > > > The conversation was strictly about the cost. The unique skins are a different matter. Noone (including myself) suggested WvW have the PvE raid skins. The cost in gold is the same. > > Actually no, this discussion is about making the Legendary PvE skins available outside the current way (raiding in short) by adding another way to buy the skins as an upgrade for the Legendary WvW armor sets.. The cost was a sub-discussion that is not the main discussion point here and still has to be seen in light of the original post. So it's perfectly legitimate in the light of the actual discussion topic to indicate that cost is not the only issue here. > By 'the discussion' i meant what started after people said about the cost. Not the topic itself. The sub-discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltekka.2375 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Glider.5792" said: > Can it also become possible to buy the Sublime mistforged skin for idk, x LI or x tickets ? Maybe other Misforged skins also. Oh! Must not forget about that Warbringer skin also, would be great if we could just buy the skin and use it on our backpieces. Yes! Y-wait a minute... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asum.4960 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > @"Miellyn.6847" said: > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > Won't happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > The pve legendary armor skins are tied to Herald's Envoy title which would thus become meaningless. > > > > > > > > > > > > If Arenanet wanted to make access to the legendary armor skins easier they would have given the skins to WvW and Spvp. > > > > > If the skins were priced at 25 LI per piece for first set/50 per piece for the next ones, and the ability to buy them was locked behind both the raid armor collection, and having a legendary armor piece of corresponding location and weight category, what difference would it make? You'd still need to go through all the "necessary" raid hoops, the only difference would be in non-raid related gifts. > > > > The difference would be that the PvE armor is way more expensive than PvP/WvW armor. > > > > PvP/WvW costs more time, PvE costs more materials. > > > > > > > > > The cost thing couldnt be more wrong: > > > According to gw2 efficiency: > > > Heavy PvE raid armor > > > Helm 282g. > > > Pauldrons 282g. > > > Breastplate 293g > > > Gauntlets 282g > > > Legs 288g > > > Greaves 282g > > > > > > heavy triumphant hero mistforged wvw armor: > > > Helm 286g. > > > Pauldrons 285g. > > > Breastplate 286g > > > Gauntlets 286g > > > Legs 286g > > > Greaves 286g > > > > > > > > So are you saying that getting these armor sets is just a matter of gold cost or is there also a cost in time with regards to activities you have to do in game to be able to get said armor sets? > > > > I've never gotten involved in legendary stuff but I've come to understand that it takes a lot more time and effort to get the PvE version. Perhaps someone can comment on that. > > WvW armor is the easiest to get, effort-wise, but you get no unique legendary skin. And the time-gated tickets you earn per week (maximum 365 per week) mean a minimum of 22 weeks for a leggy set. Hours spent for those 365 tickets depend on your wvw rank. Depends on what you consider "effort". Playing **3+h every day** for a good 6 months for the WvW armor, or playing **3 hours once a week** for 2-5 months for the Raid armor at the minimum. As someone who can't commit that much time to WvW by a long shot, I'm closer to my second Raid Legendary Armor than I'am to my first WvW armor, and I have been saving up WvW tickets since about half a year before I first stepped into a Raid (and that's with 2 bonus Pips every tick), while spending more time weekly in WvW than Raids. The difference in effort to get Legendary Armor is absolutely massive, in favour of Raids being easier, laughably so. At least for me personally. Raid's aren't that difficult at all, and the time required in WvW every week to earn the tickets compared to LI from Raids is ridiculous, being about 7 times as much. And that's if you are only going for the non shiny WvW one.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neutra.6857 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Asum.4960" said: > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > @"Miellyn.6847" said: > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > Won't happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The pve legendary armor skins are tied to Herald's Envoy title which would thus become meaningless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If Arenanet wanted to make access to the legendary armor skins easier they would have given the skins to WvW and Spvp. > > > > > > If the skins were priced at 25 LI per piece for first set/50 per piece for the next ones, and the ability to buy them was locked behind both the raid armor collection, and having a legendary armor piece of corresponding location and weight category, what difference would it make? You'd still need to go through all the "necessary" raid hoops, the only difference would be in non-raid related gifts. > > > > > The difference would be that the PvE armor is way more expensive than PvP/WvW armor. > > > > > PvP/WvW costs more time, PvE costs more materials. > > > > > > > > > > > > The cost thing couldnt be more wrong: > > > > According to gw2 efficiency: > > > > Heavy PvE raid armor > > > > Helm 282g. > > > > Pauldrons 282g. > > > > Breastplate 293g > > > > Gauntlets 282g > > > > Legs 288g > > > > Greaves 282g > > > > > > > > heavy triumphant hero mistforged wvw armor: > > > > Helm 286g. > > > > Pauldrons 285g. > > > > Breastplate 286g > > > > Gauntlets 286g > > > > Legs 286g > > > > Greaves 286g > > > > > > > > > > > So are you saying that getting these armor sets is just a matter of gold cost or is there also a cost in time with regards to activities you have to do in game to be able to get said armor sets? > > > > > > I've never gotten involved in legendary stuff but I've come to understand that it takes a lot more time and effort to get the PvE version. Perhaps someone can comment on that. > > > > WvW armor is the easiest to get, effort-wise, but you get no unique legendary skin. And the time-gated tickets you earn per week (maximum 365 per week) mean a minimum of 22 weeks for a leggy set. Hours spent for those 365 tickets depend on your wvw rank. > > Depends on what you consider "effort". > > Playing **3+h every day** for a good 6 months for the WvW armor, or playing **3 hours once a week** for 2-5 months for the Raid armor at the minimum. > > As someone who can't commit that much time to WvW by a long shot, I'm closer to my second Raid Legendary Armor than I'am to my first WvW armor, and I have been saving up WvW tickets since about half a year before I first stepped into a Raid (and that's with 2 bonus Pips every tick), while spending more time weekly in WvW than Raids. > > The difference in effort to get Legendary Armor is absolutely massive, in favour of Raids being easier, laughably so. At least for me personally. > > Raid's aren't that difficult at all, and the time required in WvW every week to earn the tickets compared to LI from Raids is ridiculous, being about 7 times as much. > > And that's if you are only going for the non shiny WvW one.. The question of effort isn't just of time spent though. Once you get your participation up in WvW you can lazy your way through getting pips by just taking camps or something like that. If you aren't buying runs you can't really lazy your way to LI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gehenna.3625 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > > > > @"Miellyn.6847" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > > > Won't happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The pve legendary armor skins are tied to Herald's Envoy title which would thus become meaningless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If Arenanet wanted to make access to the legendary armor skins easier they would have given the skins to WvW and Spvp. > > > > > > > > > If the skins were priced at 25 LI per piece for first set/50 per piece for the next ones, and the ability to buy them was locked behind both the raid armor collection, and having a legendary armor piece of corresponding location and weight category, what difference would it make? You'd still need to go through all the "necessary" raid hoops, the only difference would be in non-raid related gifts. > > > > > > > > The difference would be that the PvE armor is way more expensive than PvP/WvW armor. > > > > > > > > PvP/WvW costs more time, PvE costs more materials. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The cost thing couldnt be more wrong: > > > > > > > According to gw2 efficiency: > > > > > > > Heavy PvE raid armor > > > > > > > Helm 282g. > > > > > > > Pauldrons 282g. > > > > > > > Breastplate 293g > > > > > > > Gauntlets 282g > > > > > > > Legs 288g > > > > > > > Greaves 282g > > > > > > > > > > > > > > heavy triumphant hero mistforged wvw armor: > > > > > > > Helm 286g. > > > > > > > Pauldrons 285g. > > > > > > > Breastplate 286g > > > > > > > Gauntlets 286g > > > > > > > Legs 286g > > > > > > > Greaves 286g > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So are you saying that getting these armor sets is just a matter of gold cost or is there also a cost in time with regards to activities you have to do in game to be able to get said armor sets? > > > > > > > > > > > > I've never gotten involved in legendary stuff but I've come to understand that it takes a lot more time and effort to get the PvE version. Perhaps someone can comment on that. > > > > > > > > > > WvW armor is the easiest to get, effort-wise, but you get no unique legendary skin. And the time-gated tickets you earn per week (maximum 365 per week) mean a minimum of 22 weeks for a leggy set. Hours spent for those 365 tickets depend on your wvw rank. > > > > > > > > Yes that was my understanding. So the extra effort involved is rewarded with a unique skin. This would then be devaluated if you could buy it off in another way, because it's the only thing you get for the extra effort since functionally both sets are the same. > > > > > > > > Part of that is of course that they wanted to give raiding a long term purpose which you would take away if you made the skin available in different ways. > > > > > > > > > > The conversation was strictly about the cost. The unique skins are a different matter. Noone (including myself) suggested WvW have the PvE raid skins. The cost in gold is the same. > > > > Actually no, this discussion is about making the Legendary PvE skins available outside the current way (raiding in short) by adding another way to buy the skins as an upgrade for the Legendary WvW armor sets.. The cost was a sub-discussion that is not the main discussion point here and still has to be seen in light of the original post. So it's perfectly legitimate in the light of the actual discussion topic to indicate that cost is not the only issue here. > > > > By 'the discussion' i meant what started after people said about the cost. Not the topic itself. The sub-discussion. Ok well, that still doesn't mean I can't feel like the cost discussion has become pointless and can move on to other arguments. For me the futility of the cost picture was already made clear. In the cost is based on more than just gold and therefore it's a subjective minefield that isn't going to be resolved here. It was interesting for me at first to see if the cost difference could be calculated objectively here but the longer it went on, the clearer it became to me that that's not going to happen. And besides, it seems to me that the only reason the OP wants this skin is because it's a leg skin and he's not willing to do what it takes to get it. I mean if I want a legendary with some cool effects I will have to pvp and wvw, which I don't want to do. So either I accept that I have to do that or I accept I won't get the item. And if many people have this issue ArenaNet could simple add another leg skin to the game that is accessible in the usual ways. That would be a much simpler solution than this. Or am I missing something here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gehenna.3625 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Asum.4960" said: > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > @"Miellyn.6847" said: > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > Won't happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The pve legendary armor skins are tied to Herald's Envoy title which would thus become meaningless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If Arenanet wanted to make access to the legendary armor skins easier they would have given the skins to WvW and Spvp. > > > > > > If the skins were priced at 25 LI per piece for first set/50 per piece for the next ones, and the ability to buy them was locked behind both the raid armor collection, and having a legendary armor piece of corresponding location and weight category, what difference would it make? You'd still need to go through all the "necessary" raid hoops, the only difference would be in non-raid related gifts. > > > > > The difference would be that the PvE armor is way more expensive than PvP/WvW armor. > > > > > PvP/WvW costs more time, PvE costs more materials. > > > > > > > > > > > > The cost thing couldnt be more wrong: > > > > According to gw2 efficiency: > > > > Heavy PvE raid armor > > > > Helm 282g. > > > > Pauldrons 282g. > > > > Breastplate 293g > > > > Gauntlets 282g > > > > Legs 288g > > > > Greaves 282g > > > > > > > > heavy triumphant hero mistforged wvw armor: > > > > Helm 286g. > > > > Pauldrons 285g. > > > > Breastplate 286g > > > > Gauntlets 286g > > > > Legs 286g > > > > Greaves 286g > > > > > > > > > > > So are you saying that getting these armor sets is just a matter of gold cost or is there also a cost in time with regards to activities you have to do in game to be able to get said armor sets? > > > > > > I've never gotten involved in legendary stuff but I've come to understand that it takes a lot more time and effort to get the PvE version. Perhaps someone can comment on that. > > > > WvW armor is the easiest to get, effort-wise, but you get no unique legendary skin. And the time-gated tickets you earn per week (maximum 365 per week) mean a minimum of 22 weeks for a leggy set. Hours spent for those 365 tickets depend on your wvw rank. > > Depends on what you consider "effort". > > Playing **3+h every day** for a good 6 months for the WvW armor, or playing **3 hours once a week** for 2-5 months for the Raid armor at the minimum. > > As someone who can't commit that much time to WvW by a long shot, I'm closer to my second Raid Legendary Armor than I'am to my first WvW armor, and I have been saving up WvW tickets since about half a year before I first stepped into a Raid (and that's with 2 bonus Pips every tick), while spending more time weekly in WvW than Raids. > > The difference in effort to get Legendary Armor is absolutely massive, in favour of Raids being easier, laughably so. At least for me personally. > > Raid's aren't that difficult at all, and the time required in WvW every week to earn the tickets compared to LI from Raids is ridiculous, being about 7 times as much. > > And that's if you are only going for the non shiny WvW one.. Well, it's not what I call effort but what anybody calls effort. I mean I put down some definitions that you didn't see yet I think but in the end, it's subjective and that's problematic. You chose raiding because it requires less time. Others chose wvw and didn't want that path that you took. And so as it's very subjective there is little point in trying to determine what a fair costing would be. And the Op just wants a leg skin. Seems easier to request another leg skin in the game than to mess with endgame rewards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > Yes that was my understanding. So the extra effort involved is rewarded with a unique skin. This would then be devaluated if you could buy it off in another way, because it's the only thing you get for the extra effort since functionally both sets are the same. How it would be devalued if you had to do the raid extra effort anyway, _on top of full WvW effort_, because it would be bought with LI and could be bought only if you had a corresponding legendary piece from other contents? Basically, as i understand, someone already has a legendary armor, wanst the raid skin, but doesn't need a second legendary set of the same weight. This way they could obtain the skin without having to pay the cost for purely open world dependant gifts (on top of the gifts for the set they've already paid). Basicaly, the end result would still be a single legendary armor set. The total gold cost would not be less than for a set of raid one. The total raid effort would not be less, but you would also spend wvw or pvp effort on top of it. No matter how you counted and what definitions you used, getting legendary armor skin this way would require more effort than just doing raids. Not less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gehenna.3625 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > Yes that was my understanding. So the extra effort involved is rewarded with a unique skin. This would then be devaluated if you could buy it off in another way, because it's the only thing you get for the extra effort since functionally both sets are the same. > How it would be devalued if you had to do the raid extra effort anyway, _on top of full WvW effort_, because it would be bought with LI and could be bought only if you had a corresponding legendary piece from other contents? > > Basically, as i understand, someone already has a legendary armor, wanst the raid skin, but doesn't need a second legendary set of the same weight. This way they could obtain the skin without having to pay the cost for purely open world dependant gifts (on top of the gifts for the set they've already paid). Basicaly, the end result would still be a single legendary armor set. The total gold cost would not be less than for a set of raid one. The total raid effort would not be less, but you would also spend wvw or pvp effort on top of it. > > No matter how you counted and what definitions you used, getting legendary armor skin this way would require more effort than just doing raids. > Because effort is not the only thing that matters and because effort also cannot be expressed as a single currency. Sometimes it's just a matter of doing x content and the reward being specific to activity x. The moment you allow it to be done with activity y it's not longer exclusive to activity x and devalues activity x. Also because the range of people who will have it increases, you will see more of it. So also it's no longer exclusive in that sense. It's like a title like say "Ultimate Raider" and getting it by doing WvW instead. Nobody would question that this is weird. However, this skin is a unique reward that you can ONLY acquire if you raid. So to raiders this can have the same value as the title because wearing it shows off that you are a raider and have achieved something within that activity. So even though it's not the same as a title, it can have a similar meaning to people. To tell you the truth, this is a discussion that I've seen in every MMO I was part of and it always comes back when people start whining that they have to do something they don't like to do but still want the reward for it. I'd rather they give alternative leg skins than mess with exclusive rewards. It was already a bad idea to have legendary weapons be sellable for gold. That also means that when someone has a legendary weapon it's not a sign of there effort and people can just buy their way through. I think it's important that each main activity has their own specific, unique rewards as to give value and meaning to that activity from the reward side of things. By not having that everything becomes the same and therefore bland because it will just come down to people doing the most efficient thing only and leaving the rest of the content. So rewards are very important in keeping different types of content alive and well. That's why I prefer that alternate skins are made available over taking exclusive rewards away from specific activities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasimir.6239 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > No matter how you counted and what definitions you used, getting legendary armor skin this way would require more effort than just doing raids. Not less. I'm still not convinced of that. The time spent might be more, but getting raid legendary armor also requires a collection that has you go through pretty much all of the HoT raid wings and successfully beat all bosses (sometimes several times ... the Jade Heart particularly says hello) . LIs on the other hand can be gotten (slowly but steadily) by nothing more than doing escort each week, which in no way, shape or form is even remotely comparable to doing the envoy armor collections. Oh, but if you happen to convince ANet of this idea, I'd like the pvp legendary back skin for my Ad Infinitum, please. Being older with lousy reflexes makes pvp a very unenjoyable game mode, and while I'd still like that skin, I don't really need a 2nd legendary backpack in any shape or form, seeing how I even have enough ascended ones to spare already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Asum.4960" said: > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > @"Miellyn.6847" said: > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > Won't happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The pve legendary armor skins are tied to Herald's Envoy title which would thus become meaningless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If Arenanet wanted to make access to the legendary armor skins easier they would have given the skins to WvW and Spvp. > > > > > > If the skins were priced at 25 LI per piece for first set/50 per piece for the next ones, and the ability to buy them was locked behind both the raid armor collection, and having a legendary armor piece of corresponding location and weight category, what difference would it make? You'd still need to go through all the "necessary" raid hoops, the only difference would be in non-raid related gifts. > > > > > The difference would be that the PvE armor is way more expensive than PvP/WvW armor. > > > > > PvP/WvW costs more time, PvE costs more materials. > > > > > > > > > > > > The cost thing couldnt be more wrong: > > > > According to gw2 efficiency: > > > > Heavy PvE raid armor > > > > Helm 282g. > > > > Pauldrons 282g. > > > > Breastplate 293g > > > > Gauntlets 282g > > > > Legs 288g > > > > Greaves 282g > > > > > > > > heavy triumphant hero mistforged wvw armor: > > > > Helm 286g. > > > > Pauldrons 285g. > > > > Breastplate 286g > > > > Gauntlets 286g > > > > Legs 286g > > > > Greaves 286g > > > > > > > > > > > So are you saying that getting these armor sets is just a matter of gold cost or is there also a cost in time with regards to activities you have to do in game to be able to get said armor sets? > > > > > > I've never gotten involved in legendary stuff but I've come to understand that it takes a lot more time and effort to get the PvE version. Perhaps someone can comment on that. > > > > WvW armor is the easiest to get, effort-wise, but you get no unique legendary skin. And the time-gated tickets you earn per week (maximum 365 per week) mean a minimum of 22 weeks for a leggy set. Hours spent for those 365 tickets depend on your wvw rank. > > Depends on what you consider "effort". > > Playing **3+h every day** for a good 6 months for the WvW armor, or playing **3 hours once a week** for 2-5 months for the Raid armor at the minimum. > > As someone who can't commit that much time to WvW by a long shot, I'm closer to my second Raid Legendary Armor than I'am to my first WvW armor, and I have been saving up WvW tickets since about half a year before I first stepped into a Raid (and that's with 2 bonus Pips every tick), while spending more time weekly in WvW than Raids. > > The difference in effort to get Legendary Armor is absolutely massive, in favour of Raids being easier, laughably so. **At least for me personally.** > > Raid's aren't that difficult at all, and the time required in WvW every week to earn the tickets compared to LI from Raids is ridiculous, being about 7 times as much. > > And that's if you are only going for the non shiny WvW one.. For you personally yes, but there are significant differences which require very different approaches to the game. Many players can not or are unwilling to devote the time to either game mode due to different personal reasons. WvW: - takes longer time played - can be done solo - can be done semi afk - rewards no unique skin - has absolutely 0 skill requirement PvE: - takes less time played but is stricter time gated - has some of the most annoying time gates in game (Provisioner tokens, Chack eggs, etc.) - requires cooperation with approximately 9 other players - as far as challenge, pretty much the most challenging content this game can provide (pve wise) - requires significant preparation, practice, game knowledge, encounter practice, etc. If you look at play time required from an experienced player who already has cleared all relevant bosses and has access to raids, the time required is significantly lower per legendary armor set compared to a new player accessing this content (in pve). I doubt people who start raiding clear the first 4 raid wings in 3 hours. WvW is strictly a time sink, nothing more. 0 challenge if not desired, similar to spvp. Thus the time gate and design of the armor was adapted to reflect this. Back on topic, if arenanet wanted people to have people get the pve legendary armor skins in WvW or Spvp (or for no gold investment) they would have adapted availability in the past. As is right now, a change to this system is very unlikely unless they add a gold expense to the LI required, which just ends being similar as crafting the armor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raiden The Beast.3016 Posted October 16, 2018 Author Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Miellyn.6847" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > > > > Won't happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The pve legendary armor skins are tied to Herald's Envoy title which would thus become meaningless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If Arenanet wanted to make access to the legendary armor skins easier they would have given the skins to WvW and Spvp. > > > > > > > > > > If the skins were priced at 25 LI per piece for first set/50 per piece for the next ones, and the ability to buy them was locked behind both the raid armor collection, and having a legendary armor piece of corresponding location and weight category, what difference would it make? You'd still need to go through all the "necessary" raid hoops, the only difference would be in non-raid related gifts. > > > > > > > > > The difference would be that the PvE armor is way more expensive than PvP/WvW armor. > > > > > > > > > PvP/WvW costs more time, PvE costs more materials. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The cost thing couldnt be more wrong: > > > > > > > > According to gw2 efficiency: > > > > > > > > Heavy PvE raid armor > > > > > > > > Helm 282g. > > > > > > > > Pauldrons 282g. > > > > > > > > Breastplate 293g > > > > > > > > Gauntlets 282g > > > > > > > > Legs 288g > > > > > > > > Greaves 282g > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > heavy triumphant hero mistforged wvw armor: > > > > > > > > Helm 286g. > > > > > > > > Pauldrons 285g. > > > > > > > > Breastplate 286g > > > > > > > > Gauntlets 286g > > > > > > > > Legs 286g > > > > > > > > Greaves 286g > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So are you saying that getting these armor sets is just a matter of gold cost or is there also a cost in time with regards to activities you have to do in game to be able to get said armor sets? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've never gotten involved in legendary stuff but I've come to understand that it takes a lot more time and effort to get the PvE version. Perhaps someone can comment on that. > > > > > > > > > > > > WvW armor is the easiest to get, effort-wise, but you get no unique legendary skin. And the time-gated tickets you earn per week (maximum 365 per week) mean a minimum of 22 weeks for a leggy set. Hours spent for those 365 tickets depend on your wvw rank. > > > > > > > > > > Yes that was my understanding. So the extra effort involved is rewarded with a unique skin. This would then be devaluated if you could buy it off in another way, because it's the only thing you get for the extra effort since functionally both sets are the same. > > > > > > > > > > Part of that is of course that they wanted to give raiding a long term purpose which you would take away if you made the skin available in different ways. > > > > > > > > > > > > > The conversation was strictly about the cost. The unique skins are a different matter. Noone (including myself) suggested WvW have the PvE raid skins. The cost in gold is the same. > > > > > > Actually no, this discussion is about making the Legendary PvE skins available outside the current way (raiding in short) by adding another way to buy the skins as an upgrade for the Legendary WvW armor sets.. The cost was a sub-discussion that is not the main discussion point here and still has to be seen in light of the original post. So it's perfectly legitimate in the light of the actual discussion topic to indicate that cost is not the only issue here. > > > > > > > By 'the discussion' i meant what started after people said about the cost. Not the topic itself. The sub-discussion. > > Ok well, that still doesn't mean I can't feel like the cost discussion has become pointless and can move on to other arguments. For me the futility of the cost picture was already made clear. In the cost is based on more than just gold and therefore it's a subjective minefield that isn't going to be resolved here. It was interesting for me at first to see if the cost difference could be calculated objectively here but the longer it went on, the clearer it became to me that that's not going to happen. > > And besides, it seems to me that the only reason the OP wants this skin is because it's a leg skin and he's not willing to do what it takes to get it. I mean if I want a legendary with some cool effects I will have to pvp and wvw, which I don't want to do. So either I accept that I have to do that or I accept I won't get the item. And if many people have this issue ArenaNet could simple add another leg skin to the game that is accessible in the usual ways. That would be a much simpler solution than this. Or am I missing something here? > Actually the gw2 approach was, " you can play the game as you want and recieve what you want" but however, yes u r right after 1 1/2 pve raid leg armors im done with this content as mainly PvP player..., so why not make it possible to spend a less amount in LI to get just the skin and Transfer it to my leg PvP 0.5 armor parts? Cmon dont Force me to Grind that boring npc smash content Over and Over again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Rasimir.6239" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > No matter how you counted and what definitions you used, getting legendary armor skin this way would require more effort than just doing raids. Not less. > I'm still not convinced of that. The time spent might be more, but getting raid legendary armor also requires a collection that has you go through pretty much all of the HoT raid wings and successfully beat all bosses (sometimes several times ... the Jade Heart particularly says hello) . LIs on the other hand can be gotten (slowly but steadily) by nothing more than doing escort each week, which in no way, shape or form is even remotely comparable to doing the envoy armor collections. I did address that in my first post in this thread, didn't I. > Oh, but if you happen to convince ANet of this idea, I'd like the pvp legendary back skin for my Ad Infinitum, please. Being older with lousy reflexes makes pvp a very unenjoyable game mode, and while I'd still like that skin, I don't really need a 2nd legendary backpack in any shape or form, seeing how I even have enough ascended ones to spare already. I have been always in support of multiple paths to all legendaries, so i see no problem with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gehenna.3625 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 > @"Raiden The Beast.3016" said: > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > > > > @"Gehenna.3625" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Miellyn.6847" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > Won't happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The pve legendary armor skins are tied to Herald's Envoy title which would thus become meaningless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If Arenanet wanted to make access to the legendary armor skins easier they would have given the skins to WvW and Spvp. > > > > > > > > > > > If the skins were priced at 25 LI per piece for first set/50 per piece for the next ones, and the ability to buy them was locked behind both the raid armor collection, and having a legendary armor piece of corresponding location and weight category, what difference would it make? You'd still need to go through all the "necessary" raid hoops, the only difference would be in non-raid related gifts. > > > > > > > > > > The difference would be that the PvE armor is way more expensive than PvP/WvW armor. > > > > > > > > > > PvP/WvW costs more time, PvE costs more materials. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The cost thing couldnt be more wrong: > > > > > > > > > According to gw2 efficiency: > > > > > > > > > Heavy PvE raid armor > > > > > > > > > Helm 282g. > > > > > > > > > Pauldrons 282g. > > > > > > > > > Breastplate 293g > > > > > > > > > Gauntlets 282g > > > > > > > > > Legs 288g > > > > > > > > > Greaves 282g > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > heavy triumphant hero mistforged wvw armor: > > > > > > > > > Helm 286g. > > > > > > > > > Pauldrons 285g. > > > > > > > > > Breastplate 286g > > > > > > > > > Gauntlets 286g > > > > > > > > > Legs 286g > > > > > > > > > Greaves 286g > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So are you saying that getting these armor sets is just a matter of gold cost or is there also a cost in time with regards to activities you have to do in game to be able to get said armor sets? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've never gotten involved in legendary stuff but I've come to understand that it takes a lot more time and effort to get the PvE version. Perhaps someone can comment on that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > WvW armor is the easiest to get, effort-wise, but you get no unique legendary skin. And the time-gated tickets you earn per week (maximum 365 per week) mean a minimum of 22 weeks for a leggy set. Hours spent for those 365 tickets depend on your wvw rank. > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes that was my understanding. So the extra effort involved is rewarded with a unique skin. This would then be devaluated if you could buy it off in another way, because it's the only thing you get for the extra effort since functionally both sets are the same. > > > > > > > > > > > > Part of that is of course that they wanted to give raiding a long term purpose which you would take away if you made the skin available in different ways. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The conversation was strictly about the cost. The unique skins are a different matter. Noone (including myself) suggested WvW have the PvE raid skins. The cost in gold is the same. > > > > > > > > Actually no, this discussion is about making the Legendary PvE skins available outside the current way (raiding in short) by adding another way to buy the skins as an upgrade for the Legendary WvW armor sets.. The cost was a sub-discussion that is not the main discussion point here and still has to be seen in light of the original post. So it's perfectly legitimate in the light of the actual discussion topic to indicate that cost is not the only issue here. > > > > > > > > > > By 'the discussion' i meant what started after people said about the cost. Not the topic itself. The sub-discussion. > > > > Ok well, that still doesn't mean I can't feel like the cost discussion has become pointless and can move on to other arguments. For me the futility of the cost picture was already made clear. In the cost is based on more than just gold and therefore it's a subjective minefield that isn't going to be resolved here. It was interesting for me at first to see if the cost difference could be calculated objectively here but the longer it went on, the clearer it became to me that that's not going to happen. > > > > And besides, it seems to me that the only reason the OP wants this skin is because it's a leg skin and he's not willing to do what it takes to get it. I mean if I want a legendary with some cool effects I will have to pvp and wvw, which I don't want to do. So either I accept that I have to do that or I accept I won't get the item. And if many people have this issue ArenaNet could simple add another leg skin to the game that is accessible in the usual ways. That would be a much simpler solution than this. Or am I missing something here? > > > > Actually the gw2 approach was, " you can play the game as you want and recieve what you want" but however, yes u r right after 1 1/2 pve raid leg armors im done with this content as mainly PvP player..., so why not make it possible to spend a less amount in LI to get just the skin and Transfer it to my leg PvP 0.5 armor parts? Cmon dont Force me to Grind that boring npc smash content Over and Over again Hahaha, wasn't that from that manifesto video? Let's just say that's not the most reliable bit of marketing I've seen ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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