MUDse.7623 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > My party? I only solo roam, and with my mirage when i find a competent thief he completely obliterates me, when I find a bad thief and I bair their steal they have no changes, but really good thief outplay me so hard they stay almost 100% health all fight. > > > > you see thats basically the way many people talk about any profession. the 'bad' ones they kill, the 'good' ones kill them. there is probably a ton of thieves who will say the exact same about mirages: the bad ones they kill easily, the good ones dont drop below 100%. > > fights between thief and mirage are either both can onehit the other or neither can onehit the other and both can easily reset. its either a suprise gank/suprising the ganker for onehit encounters or it is a mindgame to make your opponent commit to the fight, to be able to kill them without them resetting. both have their advantage and disadvantage, but IMO that fight is not won by build. > > Wrong. > > Dragonhunter versus thief is 100% in favour of the dragonhunter, if you deny even this you don't know the basics of counters. > > Same as engineer since beta is countered hard by necro. (Now due to holosmith a bit less). > > Same story goes for thief against mirage (any mesmer), the match is in favour by the thief. > Then if the thief is bad of course he will lose against a better opponent. > > Same story for herald versus warrior, any herald should melt any warrior, end of the story. > And this is based on the traits, skills and utility you have. > > It's a simple profession counter profession. > > And this doesn't mean a good thief can't never win against a dragonhunter, but the odds of it happening if the dragonhunter is half decent are very low. > > Please don't be such closed minded. so i am close minded but you are the one who claims to know the outcome of a fight just by profession. and if that predicted outcome is wrong than the loser must be a bad player :) btw my 2 fights against your dragonhunter were both the very same 5 button presses: mark, binding shadows, assassin signet, skirmishers shot, deaths judgement - much skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoknocks.4935 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > My party? I only solo roam, and with my mirage when i find a competent thief he completely obliterates me, when I find a bad thief and I bair their steal they have no changes, but really good thief outplay me so hard they stay almost 100% health all fight. > > > > > > you see thats basically the way many people talk about any profession. the 'bad' ones they kill, the 'good' ones kill them. there is probably a ton of thieves who will say the exact same about mirages: the bad ones they kill easily, the good ones dont drop below 100%. > > > fights between thief and mirage are either both can onehit the other or neither can onehit the other and both can easily reset. its either a suprise gank/suprising the ganker for onehit encounters or it is a mindgame to make your opponent commit to the fight, to be able to kill them without them resetting. both have their advantage and disadvantage, but IMO that fight is not won by build. > > > > Wrong. > > > > Dragonhunter versus thief is 100% in favour of the dragonhunter, if you deny even this you don't know the basics of counters. > > > > Same as engineer since beta is countered hard by necro. (Now due to holosmith a bit less). > > > > Same story goes for thief against mirage (any mesmer), the match is in favour by the thief. > > Then if the thief is bad of course he will lose against a better opponent. > > > > Same story for herald versus warrior, any herald should melt any warrior, end of the story. > > And this is based on the traits, skills and utility you have. > > > > It's a simple profession counter profession. > > > > And this doesn't mean a good thief can't never win against a dragonhunter, but the odds of it happening if the dragonhunter is half decent are very low. > > > > Please don't be such closed minded. > > so i am close minded but you are the one who claims to know the outcome of a fight just by profession. and if that predicted outcome is wrong than the loser must be a bad player :) > btw my 2 fights against your dragonhunter were both the very same 5 button presses: mark, binding shadows, assassin signet, skirmishers shot, deaths judgement - much skill. My dragonhunter? I don't play dh while roaming in 5 months maybe more and i have maybe 1 hour or 2 with it. Deadeye is definitely an upgrade to core and daredevil in roaming. Btw what's wrong to understand? Ranger is favoured again necro in any 1vs1 match up, dragonhunter is favoured against thief in any 1vs1 match up. What's the difficult part to understand here? But if as dragonhunter you lose against thief it means 1. You got outplayed, 2. You play a bad build 3. You don't know how to dodge and burst and time your skills. As a dh against a thief you can afford quite a bit of mistakes before dying. As a thief against dh, if you commit more than 1 mistake it costs you the fight and you get downed. I don't know why you always try to attack me or deny every single post i make. I am not seeing weird or false things here, there are things that everybody knows. Guardian always countered thief since the game was released, same thing thief vs mesmer. In a game with lots and lots of profession and build DO EXIST counterclassing. You can be the best revenant in the game as a roamer, a full trailblazer mirage worse than you will be able to kill you with ease, because guess what? YOU ARE HARD COUNTERED BY CONDIS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUDse.7623 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > > My party? I only solo roam, and with my mirage when i find a competent thief he completely obliterates me, when I find a bad thief and I bair their steal they have no changes, but really good thief outplay me so hard they stay almost 100% health all fight. > > > > > > > > you see thats basically the way many people talk about any profession. the 'bad' ones they kill, the 'good' ones kill them. there is probably a ton of thieves who will say the exact same about mirages: the bad ones they kill easily, the good ones dont drop below 100%. > > > > fights between thief and mirage are either both can onehit the other or neither can onehit the other and both can easily reset. its either a suprise gank/suprising the ganker for onehit encounters or it is a mindgame to make your opponent commit to the fight, to be able to kill them without them resetting. both have their advantage and disadvantage, but IMO that fight is not won by build. > > > > > > Wrong. > > > > > > Dragonhunter versus thief is 100% in favour of the dragonhunter, if you deny even this you don't know the basics of counters. > > > > > > Same as engineer since beta is countered hard by necro. (Now due to holosmith a bit less). > > > > > > Same story goes for thief against mirage (any mesmer), the match is in favour by the thief. > > > Then if the thief is bad of course he will lose against a better opponent. > > > > > > Same story for herald versus warrior, any herald should melt any warrior, end of the story. > > > And this is based on the traits, skills and utility you have. > > > > > > It's a simple profession counter profession. > > > > > > And this doesn't mean a good thief can't never win against a dragonhunter, but the odds of it happening if the dragonhunter is half decent are very low. > > > > > > Please don't be such closed minded. > > > > so i am close minded but you are the one who claims to know the outcome of a fight just by profession. and if that predicted outcome is wrong than the loser must be a bad player :) > > btw my 2 fights against your dragonhunter were both the very same 5 button presses: mark, binding shadows, assassin signet, skirmishers shot, deaths judgement - much skill. > > My dragonhunter? > I don't play dh while roaming in 5 months maybe more and i have maybe 1 hour or 2 with it. > yep i didnt see you in a while tho you did play it more than 1-2 hours. > I don't know why you always try to attack me or deny every single post i make. > I am not seeing weird or false things here, there are things that everybody knows. > Guardian always countered thief since the game was released, same thing thief vs mesmer. > > In a game with lots and lots of profession and build DO EXIST counterclassing. > > You can be the best revenant in the game as a roamer, a full trailblazer mirage worse than you will be able to kill you with ease, because guess what? YOU ARE HARD COUNTERED BY CONDIS. i try to attack you? you said i am close minded only because i said the outcome of a fight between thief and mesmer is not determined by build. maybe in a duel, but not in roaming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawdler.8521 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > I don't know why you always try to attack me or deny every single post i make. > I am not seeing weird or false things here, there are things that everybody knows. > Guardian always countered thief since the game was released, same thing thief vs mesmer. Maybe, *just maybe*, because you kept contradicting yourself. "In favor of" doesnt mean gonna win 100% of the time. Because that's not how combat works. Besides, skill levels is always viewed differently. That thief vs mesmer duel video... you know what? I dont think that mesmer looks very good. Incapable of supressing the thief at range and equally incapable of punishing the thief in melee. It's like a beat thats out of sync which maintains the fight **in favor** of the thief, yes. That mesmer looks built to punish static people it surprises (mantra of pain is the most obvious tell of a shatter mirage and it's obviously completely ineffective here) and maybe he's great at that, but that's not how you outsustain a slippery thief (especially not in open field WvW). Or any other pure dps for that matter. That mesmer ironically remind me of many thieves I kill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoknocks.4935 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > > > My party? I only solo roam, and with my mirage when i find a competent thief he completely obliterates me, when I find a bad thief and I bair their steal they have no changes, but really good thief outplay me so hard they stay almost 100% health all fight. > > > > > > > > > > you see thats basically the way many people talk about any profession. the 'bad' ones they kill, the 'good' ones kill them. there is probably a ton of thieves who will say the exact same about mirages: the bad ones they kill easily, the good ones dont drop below 100%. > > > > > fights between thief and mirage are either both can onehit the other or neither can onehit the other and both can easily reset. its either a suprise gank/suprising the ganker for onehit encounters or it is a mindgame to make your opponent commit to the fight, to be able to kill them without them resetting. both have their advantage and disadvantage, but IMO that fight is not won by build. > > > > > > > > Wrong. > > > > > > > > Dragonhunter versus thief is 100% in favour of the dragonhunter, if you deny even this you don't know the basics of counters. > > > > > > > > Same as engineer since beta is countered hard by necro. (Now due to holosmith a bit less). > > > > > > > > Same story goes for thief against mirage (any mesmer), the match is in favour by the thief. > > > > Then if the thief is bad of course he will lose against a better opponent. > > > > > > > > Same story for herald versus warrior, any herald should melt any warrior, end of the story. > > > > And this is based on the traits, skills and utility you have. > > > > > > > > It's a simple profession counter profession. > > > > > > > > And this doesn't mean a good thief can't never win against a dragonhunter, but the odds of it happening if the dragonhunter is half decent are very low. > > > > > > > > Please don't be such closed minded. > > > > > > so i am close minded but you are the one who claims to know the outcome of a fight just by profession. and if that predicted outcome is wrong than the loser must be a bad player :) > > > btw my 2 fights against your dragonhunter were both the very same 5 button presses: mark, binding shadows, assassin signet, skirmishers shot, deaths judgement - much skill. > > > > My dragonhunter? > > I don't play dh while roaming in 5 months maybe more and i have maybe 1 hour or 2 with it. > > > yep i didnt see you in a while tho you did play it >more than 1-2 hours. In pve i have hours and map completion with it, not for roaming, and you killed me when DJ unblockable was a thing or with a malicious backstab. That being said I already told you deadeye is not the same as core or daredevil. Right now if you camp rifle no way you can win. Only with a malicious backstab which is impossible to predict tho. All i was saying was FAVOURABLE MATCHUPS, and thief vs dh, the dh is favoured. Ranger vs necro, ranger is favoured. Engi vs necro, necro is favoured, thief vs mesmer, thief is favoured. And this doesn't mean it's a 100% win for the favoured class, that's why i called you close minded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUDse.7623 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > > > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > > > > My party? I only solo roam, and with my mirage when i find a competent thief he completely obliterates me, when I find a bad thief and I bair their steal they have no changes, but really good thief outplay me so hard they stay almost 100% health all fight. > > > > > > > > > > > > you see thats basically the way many people talk about any profession. the 'bad' ones they kill, the 'good' ones kill them. there is probably a ton of thieves who will say the exact same about mirages: the bad ones they kill easily, the good ones dont drop below 100%. > > > > > > fights between thief and mirage are either both can onehit the other or neither can onehit the other and both can easily reset. its either a suprise gank/suprising the ganker for onehit encounters or it is a mindgame to make your opponent commit to the fight, to be able to kill them without them resetting. both have their advantage and disadvantage, but IMO that fight is not won by build. > > > > > > > > > > Wrong. > > > > > > > > > > Dragonhunter versus thief is 100% in favour of the dragonhunter, if you deny even this you don't know the basics of counters. > > > > > > > > > > Same as engineer since beta is countered hard by necro. (Now due to holosmith a bit less). > > > > > > > > > > Same story goes for thief against mirage (any mesmer), the match is in favour by the thief. > > > > > Then if the thief is bad of course he will lose against a better opponent. > > > > > > > > > > Same story for herald versus warrior, any herald should melt any warrior, end of the story. > > > > > And this is based on the traits, skills and utility you have. > > > > > > > > > > It's a simple profession counter profession. > > > > > > > > > > And this doesn't mean a good thief can't never win against a dragonhunter, but the odds of it happening if the dragonhunter is half decent are very low. > > > > > > > > > > Please don't be such closed minded. > > > > > > > > so i am close minded but you are the one who claims to know the outcome of a fight just by profession. and if that predicted outcome is wrong than the loser must be a bad player :) > > > > btw my 2 fights against your dragonhunter were both the very same 5 button presses: mark, binding shadows, assassin signet, skirmishers shot, deaths judgement - much skill. > > > > > > My dragonhunter? > > > I don't play dh while roaming in 5 months maybe more and i have maybe 1 hour or 2 with it. > > > > > yep i didnt see you in a while tho you did play it >more than 1-2 hours. > > In pve i have hours and map completion with it, not for roaming, and you killed me when DJ unblockable was a thing or with a malicious backstab. > That being said I already told you deadeye is not the same as core or daredevil. > > Right now if you camp rifle no way you can win. > Only with a malicious backstab which is impossible to predict tho. > > All i was saying was FAVOURABLE MATCHUPS, and thief vs dh, the dh is favoured. Ranger vs necro, ranger is favoured. Engi vs necro, necro is favoured, thief vs mesmer, thief is favoured. > > And this doesn't mean it's a 100% win for the favoured class, that's why i called you close minded. > > again your talking in absolutes. 'no way i can win' thats just asking to prove it. yes there are matchups that are favoured. yet thief vs mesmer is in a roaming scenario not favoured enough to decide the fight, mind games or who ever has the suprise on his side play a much bigger role in that fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoknocks.4935 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > > > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > > > > > > @"whoknocks.4935" said: > > > > > > > > My party? I only solo roam, and with my mirage when i find a competent thief he completely obliterates me, when I find a bad thief and I bair their steal they have no changes, but really good thief outplay me so hard they stay almost 100% health all fight. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you see thats basically the way many people talk about any profession. the 'bad' ones they kill, the 'good' ones kill them. there is probably a ton of thieves who will say the exact same about mirages: the bad ones they kill easily, the good ones dont drop below 100%. > > > > > > > fights between thief and mirage are either both can onehit the other or neither can onehit the other and both can easily reset. its either a suprise gank/suprising the ganker for onehit encounters or it is a mindgame to make your opponent commit to the fight, to be able to kill them without them resetting. both have their advantage and disadvantage, but IMO that fight is not won by build. > > > > > > > > > > > > Wrong. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dragonhunter versus thief is 100% in favour of the dragonhunter, if you deny even this you don't know the basics of counters. > > > > > > > > > > > > Same as engineer since beta is countered hard by necro. (Now due to holosmith a bit less). > > > > > > > > > > > > Same story goes for thief against mirage (any mesmer), the match is in favour by the thief. > > > > > > Then if the thief is bad of course he will lose against a better opponent. > > > > > > > > > > > > Same story for herald versus warrior, any herald should melt any warrior, end of the story. > > > > > > And this is based on the traits, skills and utility you have. > > > > > > > > > > > > It's a simple profession counter profession. > > > > > > > > > > > > And this doesn't mean a good thief can't never win against a dragonhunter, but the odds of it happening if the dragonhunter is half decent are very low. > > > > > > > > > > > > Please don't be such closed minded. > > > > > > > > > > so i am close minded but you are the one who claims to know the outcome of a fight just by profession. and if that predicted outcome is wrong than the loser must be a bad player :) > > > > > btw my 2 fights against your dragonhunter were both the very same 5 button presses: mark, binding shadows, assassin signet, skirmishers shot, deaths judgement - much skill. > > > > > > > > My dragonhunter? > > > > I don't play dh while roaming in 5 months maybe more and i have maybe 1 hour or 2 with it. > > > > > > > yep i didnt see you in a while tho you did play it >more than 1-2 hours. > > > > In pve i have hours and map completion with it, not for roaming, and you killed me when DJ unblockable was a thing or with a malicious backstab. > > That being said I already told you deadeye is not the same as core or daredevil. > > > > Right now if you camp rifle no way you can win. > > Only with a malicious backstab which is impossible to predict tho. > > > > All i was saying was FAVOURABLE MATCHUPS, and thief vs dh, the dh is favoured. Ranger vs necro, ranger is favoured. Engi vs necro, necro is favoured, thief vs mesmer, thief is favoured. > > > > And this doesn't mean it's a 100% win for the favoured class, that's why i called you close minded. > > > > > again your talking in absolutes. 'no way i can win' thats just asking to prove it. > yes there are matchups that are favoured. yet thief vs mesmer is in a roaming scenario not favoured enough to decide the fight, mind games or who ever has the suprise on his side play a much bigger role in that fight. Of course mind games play a big role, but if you are roaming with core thief and you see a mirage coming in your direction, and he sees you as well, you as core thief are favoured in that matchup. If you dodge properly you completely deny all the mirage burst, both condi or power and you have an important passive life safer (in acrobatics if not wrong) which helps you a lot if the enemy got a big oneshot burst on you. Plus double plasma from steal is crazy good against mirage. Then if the enemy mirage is good and bait your steal and you miss, you will die unless you escape to reset the fight. Again i repeat, favoured doesn't mean it's an autowin and even standin still you win, but if you have experience with thief you will find the matchup with mesmer pressy easy compared with other professions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeceiverX.8361 Posted January 11, 2019 Share Posted January 11, 2019 FFS people. Rifle DE hard-counters DH as even P/P Daredevil did. Medi DH hard-counters melee Daredevil and Core IN A DUEL ONLY. S/D meta Core, Daredevil and its variants, and DE all completely stomp core guard unless it gets a gank via its zerk JI hammer build l0l. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turk.5460 Posted January 11, 2019 Share Posted January 11, 2019 > @"DeceiverX.8361" said: > kitten people. > > Rifle DE hard-counters DH as even P/P Daredevil did. Not so much after DJ is no longer unblockable. It's fairly even of a match as all it takes for the DH to win is a single port trap smite . The DE has to use much of its resources just to stay at range or re-position. Lesser skilled DH's will make it seem like a very one sided match. But even a remotely decent DH that uses his ports/pulls/BLOCKS well will often give a DE trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeceiverX.8361 Posted January 11, 2019 Share Posted January 11, 2019 > @"Turk.5460" said: > > @"DeceiverX.8361" said: > > kitten people. > > > > Rifle DE hard-counters DH as even P/P Daredevil did. > > Not so much after DJ is no longer unblockable. It's fairly even of a match as all it takes for the DH to win is a single port trap smite . The DE has to use much of its resources just to stay at range or re-position. Lesser skilled DH's will make it seem like a very one sided match. But even a remotely decent DH that uses his ports/pulls/BLOCKS well will often give a DE trouble. Ehhhh. I'd argue that's more on the thief getting caught then. Meld the Reveal on SoJ. You can either stunbreak during the pull to not get hit by traps or DR spam out of range of the pull quite quickly. Dodge-porting gets you out of traps safely even if you do get pulled in the first time. Don't try to load them with conditions and Smite isn't much of a threat in respects to their burst combo. Even the blocks aren't that hard to deal with. Abuse DR and Kneel/TRB with Scope and Meld and it's pretty easy to shred them down enough and force major cooldowns, winning you trades. Bait/force the cooldowns and stay at range to force F1/F2 attempts. If they swap longbow just use Rifle Kneel 4 to deny them everything. I just dueled my guildmember two days ago who is the best guardian I've personally encountered in my time playing GW2, and despite going 0/15 on my D/D+S/D build to him, I went 10/0 into him while I was playing DE (which is in exotic gear and I hadn't played in months) with some of the matchups ending with me at full health. I didn't even opt for SA to cheese him down; I just went glass CS/Tr/DE. If you play solely as a DJ bot you won't do well into the matchup because of the fact DH has the blocks and sustain to deal with it Use the rest of the tools DE has with rifle and it's a very easy win. Yeah, if they run the wombo-combo JI-Hammer-Oneshot build and you don't see it coming you're in for a rough time, but that's the equivalent guardian version of D/P signet thief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turk.5460 Posted January 11, 2019 Share Posted January 11, 2019 > @"DeceiverX.8361" said: > If they swap longbow just use Rifle Kneel 4 to deny them everything. The good DH players aren't using Longbow. That's 10seconds of a death sentence on their part in WvW roaming since...well at least half a year. Its S/S or S/F and Greatsword for the competent roamers. If your guildmate is using Longbow *and* he's the best Guardian you've encountered...then I'm sorry to say you must not have really encountered many good DH players. -I'm not by any means saying that DH counters DE, or even holds an advantage over them. I'm just pointing out that DE is not a "hard-counter" to DH. Nor was it ever. We had a pretty big advantage with unblockable DJ, and with that gone we hold only a moderate advantage, and even with that advantage, often a *single* mistake on our part is the end of the fight or turn it completely in favor of the DH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeceiverX.8361 Posted January 11, 2019 Share Posted January 11, 2019 > @"Turk.5460" said: > > @"DeceiverX.8361" said: > > If they swap longbow just use Rifle Kneel 4 to deny them everything. > > The good DH players aren't using Longbow. That's 10seconds of a death sentence on their part in WvW roaming since...well at least half a year. Its S/S or S/F and Greatsword for the competent roamers. If your guildmate is using Longbow *and* he's the best Guardian you've encountered...then I'm sorry to say you must not have really encountered many good DH players. > > -I'm not by any means saying that DH counters DE, or even holds an advantage over them. I'm just pointing out that DE is not a "hard-counter" to DH. Nor was it ever. We had a pretty big advantage with unblockable DJ, and with that gone we hold only a moderate advantage, and even with that advantage, often a *single* mistake on our part is the end of the fight or turn it completely in favor of the DH. The mentioning for longbow was a general quote for how to deal with range or longbow DH, not targeted at my guildmember. A lot of DH's from what I've seen lately in T1/T2 are also opting back for longbow still when running double guardian as a two-man group due to longbow's extra CC and group roam potential, and it offers much better defense into soulbeast than GS. With TRB you pop their focus 5 while at 1500 (while they still can't use JI), which is a huge part in how S/F builds burst people down. If they precast wings or teleport with Sybol of Blades from 1500+ it means they're comboing it with JI and focus 5, so just detarget + dodge roll as soon as they're on you+DR twice and their combo and all the benefits of OH Focus pop-burst are gone. Worst case you mid-dodge shadowstep to get through Test of Faith. Then they're forced into range despite being a pure melee kit while on cooldowns and you can wait a few seconds for traps to disarm and TRB your way to victory while they're still out of range for SoJ. And then if they land SoJ, you just stunbreak again via Shadow Return while getting pulled and DR out since they're locked into melee, or if they set traps after their initial engage, you won't have needed shadowstep to disengage safely mid-roll, so you'll stunbreak through the pull that way or via another skill like RFI. Now they've got nothing left to close the gap and you've got the ranged advantage. If you burn excess initiative and dodge rolls into a DH, yeah, expect to die. But DE has all the tools needed to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turk.5460 Posted January 11, 2019 Share Posted January 11, 2019 > @"DeceiverX.8361" said: > > @"Turk.5460" said: > > > @"DeceiverX.8361" said: > > > If they swap longbow just use Rifle Kneel 4 to deny them everything. > > > > The good DH players aren't using Longbow. That's 10seconds of a death sentence on their part in WvW roaming since...well at least half a year. Its S/S or S/F and Greatsword for the competent roamers. If your guildmate is using Longbow *and* he's the best Guardian you've encountered...then I'm sorry to say you must not have really encountered many good DH players. > > > > -I'm not by any means saying that DH counters DE, or even holds an advantage over them. I'm just pointing out that DE is not a "hard-counter" to DH. Nor was it ever. We had a pretty big advantage with unblockable DJ, and with that gone we hold only a moderate advantage, and even with that advantage, often a *single* mistake on our part is the end of the fight or turn it completely in favor of the DH. > > The mentioning for longbow was a general quote for how to deal with range or longbow DH, not targeted at my guildmember. A lot of DH's from what I've seen lately in T1/T2 are also opting back for longbow still when running double guardian as a two-man group due to longbow's extra CC and group roam potential, and it offers much better defense into soulbeast than GS. > > With TRB you pop their focus 5 while at 1500 (while they still can't use JI), which is a huge part in how S/F builds burst people down. > > If they precast wings or teleport with Sybol of Blades from 1500+ it means they're comboing it with JI and focus 5, so just detarget + dodge roll as soon as they're on you+DR twice and their combo and all the benefits of OH Focus pop-burst are gone. Worst case you mid-dodge shadowstep to get through Test of Faith. Then they're forced into range despite being a pure melee kit while on cooldowns and you can wait a few seconds for traps to disarm and TRB your way to victory while they're still out of range for SoJ. And then if they land SoJ, you just stunbreak again via Shadow Return while getting pulled and DR out since they're locked into melee, or if they set traps after their initial engage, you won't have needed shadowstep to disengage safely mid-roll, so you'll stunbreak through the pull that way or via another skill like RFI. Now they've got nothing left to close the gap and you've got the ranged advantage. > > If you burn excess initiative and dodge rolls into a DH, yeah, expect to die. But DE has all the tools needed to win. Yes. That's how that particular fight would go. But you should know as well as I that those fights *hardly* go that way. There are quite a few things in your perfect scenario that just don't happen. If you post that scenario on the Guardian forums you will get more than enough reasons why. - TRB *is* excessive initiative use, especially against a DH. No halfway competent roamer is going to be hit by all 3, or even 2/3 of the TRB. Especially not at 1500 range. And that's halfway in part due to how your attack will be "out of range" unless your target is just standing still - which a formidable opponent *will not do.* - Any DH that is using Wings in that fashion already lost the fight - not something competent DH will do. - If they are using Focus5, any decent DH won't be on you until it's mid-explosion, and certainly wouldn't allow one TRB to pop it. - F3 and RF will undoubtedly spoil your offensive. - Back to your mentioning of DR and TRB, it's *six* initiative cost. DR You can't "TRB" your way to victory *and* DR back to far out of range. I'm not trying to downplay your ability here, but if what you describe is your typical encounter with DH's, then you really haven't faced any that are experienced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now