Thoughts on the new fractal?

[Nephalem.8921]

> @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > @"Nephalem.8921" said:

> > > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > > > @"Nephalem.8921" said:

> > > > > @"Rodrick.1942" said:

> > > > > > @"Boogiepop Void.6473" said:

> > > > > > > @"Turin.6921" said:

> > > > > > > > @"Boogiepop Void.6473" said:

> > > > > > > > My regular group which runs every fractal including CMs in one go with no rezzing tried for 2 hours to get through the fractal before giving up. The difficulty is completely out of line with all the other fractals, exceeding even the CMs at T4.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I cannot believe that. I did it with a non meta comp with people that had very little CM experience and the only part that we found tough was the last boss on the ship and that we got it 3 pulls after realizing what all the mechanics were and found a druid to give us some might. No way a CM group would not take that champ down the moment they understood how it works. You were probably just doing sth wrong when it came to the mechanics.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Aside from a couple problems with the skeleton, the last boss was the entire issue. No matter how hard we tried we were overwhelmed by the sheer amount of mobs, AOEs, displacements, and undodgeable instant downs (sharks). We couldn't position, we could barely DPS, and even after changing to max cleave characters there was so much kitten everywhere from the mobs that we could barely even see anything.

> > > > >

> > > > > You just need a support who focus on healing, another support who focus on pulse defense boons and sustain healing(you know which class im talking about) , and 1 or 2 dps who's better on cleave mobs/boss. Problem solved

> > > >

> > > > You just need a druid with healing spring. The direct damage is very low. Its the condis that kill everyone. Get projectile defenses on top of that and you will probably not even need healing.

> > > > You could also get a renegade with veantari and afk in that bubble. Almost all attacks are projectiles.

> > > > At least projectile defenses are usefull again. Condi fb is insane on that boss btw. F1 resets on every kill.

> > > >

> > > > > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > > > > Isnt the bonus dmg on breakbar only a think in dungeons and fractals? Iirc boses dont get that in raids. Also i agree the bonus dmg is not needed, it hard trvialises fights and overpromotes burst dps.

> > > >

> > > > You would just igore the breakbar then most of the time. At least it rewards skill this way.

> > >

> > > Except what I just said was to make the breakbar stop deadly skills, so you wouldn't ignore them.

> > >

> > > You know, like you don't interrupt Arkk's giant ball phase you all wipe. Or Siax's megadeath channel.

> > >

> > > It doesn't even need to be megadeath, it could be the breakbar interrupting Artsariv's bullet hell channel or shorten the beach ball phase.

> > >

> > > I'm sure they can come up with a bunch of deadly kitten to interrupt via breakbar considering GW1 had a ton of stuff you needed to interrupt or you wiped.

> > >

> > > It's already absurd that many power specs are overperforming condition specs without breakbar phases on long raid fights because of how nerfed condi specs have been, we don't need a ridiculous damage bonus that gives them even more of an advantage.

> >

> > They can buff condi when they nerf scourge + mirage into the ground. Trailblazer scourge does like 8% less damage than viper while being almost unkillable. Same for mirage probably. Almost all power builds are super glassy and lose a lot of damage with tanky gear.

> >

> > They would have to design abilities to interrupt then. Wont happen so we would end ignoring a lot of breakbars outside of cm fractals.

>

> Oh, please, guardian is rolling in blocks on top of a conal invulnerability, and daredevil has 19839273028 dodges for every occasion where something might hit them.

>

> The only high risk power build is weaver, and condi weaver is just as glassy, so it's an ele specific problem, not a power problem.

>

> And mirage is not even better to power chrono. Power chrono has blurred frenzy, sword 4, focus 5 for reflects, and his distortion can be used on 0 clones for even more faceroll survival whereas mirage using distortion or diversion is a massive dps loss.

>

> Power reaper has also way better survival than scourge.

 

Using distortion is not a massive dps loss. Thats some confusion. Well power chrono is another story. 30k dps self buffed on top of 5 million blocks. The mesmer rework as a whole just broke the class. Fractals have slaying sigils + potions + night sigils etc. Condi will only become a thing there if power becomes up in raids.

Condi is probably stronger in unorganized pugs though. Power builds suffer much harder from not having buffs. Condi firebrand works really good in low dps pugs. Well power chrono would be best in that case aswell but it will/should be nerfed anyways.

Condi firebrand is also quite insane on the new fractal endboss.

 

Removing the 50% damage from breakbar wouldn't change anything except for maybe switching weaver out of meta for some power chronos. Phases are just too short for condi in a high dps group and invuln phases remove all condis. Would help condi builds more if condis wouldn't just disappear after a phase and remaining time on condis would be saved and reapplied in next phase.

The invuln state change was also the reason why condi became so weak on so many raid bosses.

[Eramonster.2718]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> > @"Vinceman.4572" said:

> > At the moment this fractal is a nightmare in usual (non-CM) groups. At first, people are constantly joining with elementalists which will turn enemies invisible. It's funny though because before the patch I haven't had nearly that much weavers in casual T4s.

> > Additionally it's like during open world game play, almost nobody cares about mechanics, spawning mobs inside the tunnel endlessly and not having any clue about cannons or how to position themselves for cleave damage etc.

>

> Gotta love them event like fractals.

>

> Btw is it ele whos causing them enemies to not spawn? Was it also the cause of ark going invisible?

 

Can someone verify this? Add chrono/mirage to the list as well :angry:.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

Well did it the other night when it was T4. I still think it's a fun fractal, but kitten the amount of trash. Our group was: Druid, Core Guard, DH, Firebrand (quickness) and melee Soulbeast. You would think that comp had more than enough cleave to deal with the trash, but we wiped on the final boss. The druid ended up swapping to an epi Scourge, and it was amazing how quickly the trash thinned out.

[Turin.6921]

> @"phokus.8934" said:

> The last boss needs a complete toning down on the frequency of adds and wind drifts.

 

> @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> Well did it the other night when it was T4. I still think it's a fun fractal, but kitten the amount of trash. Our group was: Druid, Core Guard, DH, Firebrand (quickness) and melee Soulbeast. You would think that comp had more than enough cleave to deal with the trash, but we wiped on the final boss. The druid ended up swapping to an epi Scourge, and it was amazing how quickly the trash thinned out.

 

BTW there is a way to control the adds on last boss. I think they spawn every 10% of boss health (not sure though). So if accurate if you clear trash before you focus on boss it should be fine.

[Talindra.4958]

Alright.. heres mine.

I can say.. I find the new fractal Siren's Reef is very very very boring. the encounter.. eg green circle.. targeted players, pizza aoe on ground.. etc etc.. nothing new about this. we have a main npc to fight on an enclosed platform and then all the typical boring aoes appears timely wise. Only difference is the graphic art around it, the pixel.. the mechanic wise all the same ol boring stuff. that's how I feel anyway... if every new fractal going to be like this.. its not fun. I like to see different play.. no hard feelings!! :) graphic and landscape wise .. its cool. thanks for the new fractal..

 

[yann.1946]

> @"Nephalem.8921" said:

> > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > > @"Nephalem.8921" said:

> > > > @"Rodrick.1942" said:

> > > > > @"Boogiepop Void.6473" said:

> > > > > > @"Turin.6921" said:

> > > > > > > @"Boogiepop Void.6473" said:

> > > > > > > My regular group which runs every fractal including CMs in one go with no rezzing tried for 2 hours to get through the fractal before giving up. The difficulty is completely out of line with all the other fractals, exceeding even the CMs at T4.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I cannot believe that. I did it with a non meta comp with people that had very little CM experience and the only part that we found tough was the last boss on the ship and that we got it 3 pulls after realizing what all the mechanics were and found a druid to give us some might. No way a CM group would not take that champ down the moment they understood how it works. You were probably just doing sth wrong when it came to the mechanics.

> > > > >

> > > > > Aside from a couple problems with the skeleton, the last boss was the entire issue. No matter how hard we tried we were overwhelmed by the sheer amount of mobs, AOEs, displacements, and undodgeable instant downs (sharks). We couldn't position, we could barely DPS, and even after changing to max cleave characters there was so much kitten everywhere from the mobs that we could barely even see anything.

> > > >

> > > > You just need a support who focus on healing, another support who focus on pulse defense boons and sustain healing(you know which class im talking about) , and 1 or 2 dps who's better on cleave mobs/boss. Problem solved

> > >

> > > You just need a druid with healing spring. The direct damage is very low. Its the condis that kill everyone. Get projectile defenses on top of that and you will probably not even need healing.

> > > You could also get a renegade with veantari and afk in that bubble. Almost all attacks are projectiles.

> > > At least projectile defenses are usefull again. Condi fb is insane on that boss btw. F1 resets on every kill.

> > >

> > > > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > > > Isnt the bonus dmg on breakbar only a think in dungeons and fractals? Iirc boses dont get that in raids. Also i agree the bonus dmg is not needed, it hard trvialises fights and overpromotes burst dps.

> > >

> > > You would just igore the breakbar then most of the time. At least it rewards skill this way.

> >

> > Except what I just said was to make the breakbar stop deadly skills, so you wouldn't ignore them.

> >

> > You know, like you don't interrupt Arkk's giant ball phase you all wipe. Or Siax's megadeath channel.

> >

> > It doesn't even need to be megadeath, it could be the breakbar interrupting Artsariv's bullet hell channel or shorten the beach ball phase.

> >

> > I'm sure they can come up with a bunch of deadly kitten to interrupt via breakbar considering GW1 had a ton of stuff you needed to interrupt or you wiped.

> >

> > It's already absurd that many power specs are overperforming condition specs without breakbar phases on long raid fights because of how nerfed condi specs have been, we don't need a ridiculous damage bonus that gives them even more of an advantage.

>

> They can buff condi when they nerf scourge + mirage into the ground. Trailblazer scourge does like 8% less damage than viper while being almost unkillable. Same for mirage probably. Almost all power builds are super glassy and lose a lot of damage with tanky gear.

>

> They would have to design abilities to interrupt then. Wont happen so we would end ignoring a lot of breakbars outside of cm fractals.

 

marauder is also not that much of a dpsloss for powerclasses. tankieness is an inherent classthing, a marauder thief with invigarating precision is also almost unkillable.

And a powerwarrior and guardian are also pretty tanky altough for slightly different reasons.