Quite Frustrated with PoF

[Manasa Devi.7958]

I can't help wondering how they managed to take a great concept and turn it into such atrocious gameplay.

 

First, fighting a fallen god and hurting him badly enough to earn the privilege of being killed by him so you can progress. That's patently ridiculous. Winning a fight to lose it. What? Why not just have him trying to kill you, and giving an achievement for getting him at health percentages without being downed before he kills you at 10%?

 

Then, a whole lot of just walking around doing nothing interesting at all. The storytelling is great, but the gameplay is vacuous. I couldn't stomach a second playthrough without going afk to do something else several times. Running up to a bird to witness memories and waiting for them to play out? (And that's the most interesting part, if you can believe it!) Why not something more involved, some actual activity to earn those memories?

[Danikat.8537]

I loved The Departed, and I'm enjoying the PoF story overall. My only complaint is that after all the build-up the Eater of Souls fight was very simple. And I don't think that's because of the nerfs because it sounds like the mechanics were the same before, it just did more damage. I was waiting for the part where I have to keep it away from other ghosts or block/reflect it's attempt to steal my life energy or...anything except use the same attacks I use on everything else.

 

It sounds to me like a big part of the problem is the OP and some other people are seeing the story as a checklist of objectives to complete as quickly as possible. In that case I can understand why it's frustrating to have sections without map markers or where you have to speak to an NPC for "one line of dialogue". Whereas if you approach it as an actual story to be experienced and pay attention to what's being said in that dialogue and what's happening to your character it makes total sense.

 

I loved the fact that there was no map or quest markers during The Departed because it put me in a similar position to my character. It wasn't exactly the same because I knew exactly who she was and what she was doing, but there was no way for Anet to change that. I also like the fact that exploring the maps and learning about the area is part of the story, instead of going in somehow knowing all about everything and jumping straight to what we need to do - that would have made absolutely no sense under the circumstances, and this way it also serves to introduce the player to the maps and key NPCs.

[FrizzFreston.5290]

> @TexZero.7910 said:

> > @Sylvanwood.2746 said:

> > The Departing is one of the best chapters of the POF story, in my opinion.

>

> Disagree with this one. Nothing is fun about being strung out when the villain who had the element of surprise and the intent to kill us uses us for a punching bag instead of just shoving the sword through our chest. Nothing is fun about the several bugs this chapter has including but not limited to cut scenes failing to load, server DC's at the end of the speech etc...

>

 

Other than the bugs thats just working as intended.

[Zaltys.7649]

> @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> First, fighting a fallen god and hurting him badly enough to earn the privilege of being killed by him so you can progress. That's patently ridiculous. Winning a fight to lose it. What? Why not just have him trying to kill you, and giving an achievement for getting him at health percentages without being downed before he kills you at 10%?

That was explained later in the mission. He kept you alive as a bait for Aurene. ...though she got there awfully fast, considering that I at least didn't spend many minutes on the fight.

 

Anyway, as for the next segment: I wandered around for more than half an hour, looking for something to do, checking same places multiple times just to see if I missed something. No idea what finally triggered Joko's dialogue, it seemed very random at the time, as I had already checked the area several times.

[ProtoGunner.4953]

It really wasn't a big deal to find your way. A lot of games do that, where the player has to find a way. If you had so much trouble getting through it I wonder what you do in all those games where parts like this happens.

[Manasa Devi.7958]

> @Zaltys.7649 said:

> > @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> > First, fighting a fallen god and hurting him badly enough to earn the privilege of being killed by him so you can progress. That's patently ridiculous. Winning a fight to lose it. What? Why not just have him trying to kill you, and giving an achievement for getting him at health percentages without being downed before he kills you at 10%?

> That was explained later in the mission. He kept you alive as a bait for Aurene. ...though she got there awfully fast, considering that I at least didn't spend many minutes on the fight.

It's not explained, only implied. But since it makes no sense, the implication fails. It's also presented rather clumsily, at a time I'm not really paying attention to anything else than the fight I'm involved in. The whole Balthazar monologue during the fight is a bit stupid anyway as it is totally disconnected from what's actually happening if you're doing well in the fight. "Suffer a little more loudly. Cry out! Let everyone hear!" when my health has hardly dipped and he's almost lost half?

[Feanor.2358]

I absolutely loved "The Departed". Taking out the minimap and the objective markers was a brilliant way to make you feel lost and confused. Just like the character's spirit is supposed to feel. Beautifully done. One of the best moments in the whole story.

[Danikat.8537]

> @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> > @Zaltys.7649 said:

> > > @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> > > First, fighting a fallen god and hurting him badly enough to earn the privilege of being killed by him so you can progress. That's patently ridiculous. Winning a fight to lose it. What? Why not just have him trying to kill you, and giving an achievement for getting him at health percentages without being downed before he kills you at 10%?

> > That was explained later in the mission. He kept you alive as a bait for Aurene. ...though she got there awfully fast, considering that I at least didn't spend many minutes on the fight.

> It's not explained, only implied. But since it makes no sense, the implication fails.

 

I thought it made perfect sense.

 

We've been told multiple times that Aurene has chosen the player character as her champion, even before she hatched (that's why carrying the egg gave you special movement skills) and both told and shown that she is psychically connected to you and aware of what's happening - this is why a phantom Aurene will appear sometimes, especially when you're downed. During the preceding chapter (The Way Forward) we learned why this is important - Vlast never had that connection to other living things and it made him resent his mission and only grudgingly go along with it. We were also told by Taimi that since we went to the desert Aurene has been frustrated - trying to fly and to escape the egg chamber. It doesn't take much to guess that might be because she wants to play her part in the fight against Balthazar, especially after her brother died.

 

We were also told that Balthazar needed Vlast and Aurene for his plan to destroy Kralkatorrik.

 

Of course he didn't explicitly say he was toying with us to draw Aurene out (because that would ruin the plan), but considering how easily he beat us before it was obvious he was deliberately drawing the fight out this time. And I thought it became obvious why as soon as Aurene appeared.

 

Admittedly we were never told when or how she escaped, or (if it was after the fight started) how she got to the Crystal Desert so fast, but considering even before she was born she was able to give us skills to move faster and more directly, even going straight through obstacles, it's possible she can magically speed up her own flight too.

[Zaltys.7649]

> @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> It's not explained, only implied. But since it makes no sense, the implication fails. It's also presented rather clumsily, at a time I'm not really paying attention to anything else than the fight I'm involved in. The whole Balthazar monologue during the fight--

I'm not talking about battle monologues.

Later in the mission, it's clearly explained that Balthazar kept you barely alive so that Aurene would rush to your aid. You must've skipped the dialogue. ...unless only Asura characters figure that out, which would be exceedingly odd.

 

Edit: Wait, no, maybe it wasn't during the mission. Might've been explained when you contact Taimi between the missions. (I always checked those, there's new dialogue after each mission).

[Randulf.7614]

It was certainly the weakest instance for me, which is a shame because the story began so well in Act 1 and even Act 2 with the lore sequences. This was a slow, meandering instance whose seemingly single purpose was to show us where Joko was. The worst bit being the interminable fight to kick it all off with (I'm never a fan of story instances starting with a boss fight - they should build into it).

 

Act 3 in general was a let down for me. I don't wont to say too much about it for fear of spoilers, but whilst the last instance was epic in style and glamour, it was illogical storytelling as it undid the rest of the preceding Act.

[Manasa Devi.7958]

> @Danikat.8537 said:

> > @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> > > @Zaltys.7649 said:

> > > > @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> > > > First, fighting a fallen god and hurting him badly enough to earn the privilege of being killed by him so you can progress. That's patently ridiculous. Winning a fight to lose it. What? Why not just have him trying to kill you, and giving an achievement for getting him at health percentages without being downed before he kills you at 10%?

> > > That was explained later in the mission. He kept you alive as a bait for Aurene. ...though she got there awfully fast, considering that I at least didn't spend many minutes on the fight.

> > It's not explained, only implied. But since it makes no sense, the implication fails.

>

> I thought it made perfect sense.

>

> We've been told multiple times that Aurene has chosen the player character as her champion, even before she hatched (that's why carrying the egg gave you special movement skills) and both told and shown that she is psychically connected to you and aware of what's happening - this is why a phantom Aurene will appear sometimes, especially when you're downed. During the preceding chapter (The Way Forward) we learned why this is important - Vlast never had that connection to other living things and it made him resent his mission and only grudgingly go along with it. We were also told by Taimi that since we went to the desert Aurene has been frustrated - trying to fly and to escape the egg chamber. It doesn't take much to guess that might be because she wants to play her part in the fight against Balthazar, especially after her brother died.

>

> We were also told that Balthazar needed Vlast and Aurene for his plan to destroy Kralkatorrik.

>

> Of course he didn't explicitly say he was toying with us to draw Aurene out (because that would ruin the plan), but considering how easily he beat us before it was obvious he was deliberately drawing the fight out this time. And I thought it became obvious why as soon as Aurene appeared.

>

> Admittedly we were never told when or how she escaped, or (if it was after the fight started) how she got to the Crystal Desert so fast, but considering even before she was born she was able to give us skills to move faster and more directly, even going straight through obstacles, it's possible she can magically speed up her own flight too.

 

It makes no sense because Balthazar doesn't need us to get to Aurene. He could just go to Tarir. Again.

 

It makes no sense because unless he is omniscient or can read minds from many miles away, he has no way of knowing Aurene is en route. We, who have a bond with her as you rightly stated, have no idea where she is or what she's up to, but Balthazar can anticipate her behavior to a fault. No sale, it doesn't work for me.

 

> @Zaltys.7649 said:

> Edit: Wait, no, maybe it wasn't during the mission. Might've been explained when you contact Taimi between the missions. (I always checked those, there's new dialogue after each mission).

I've reread the mission dialogue, there's nothing there except Balthazar's misinformed rantings. I wouldn't know what Taimi said. I hate Taimi with a passion and I don't contact her unless a story step absolutely requires me to. I want an achievement called "Never time for Taimi". I'm absolutely not going to go out of my way to listen what little miss effing annoying has to say. It's an optional achievement, it shouldn't be required to fill in plotholes.

[TexZero.7910]

> @FrizzFreston.5290 said:

> > @TexZero.7910 said:

> > > @Sylvanwood.2746 said:

> > > The Departing is one of the best chapters of the POF story, in my opinion.

> >

> > Disagree with this one. Nothing is fun about being strung out when the villain who had the element of surprise and the intent to kill us uses us for a punching bag instead of just shoving the sword through our chest. Nothing is fun about the several bugs this chapter has including but not limited to cut scenes failing to load, server DC's at the end of the speech etc...

> >

>

> Other than the bugs thats just working as intended.

 

I know its normal save for the bugs, my gripe is that the "normal" is unnecessary and just a waste of player time and ruins the experience and writing that went into said character.

 

[castlemanic.3198]

> @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> It makes no sense because Balthazar doesn't need us to get to Aurene. He could just go to Tarir. Again.

>

> It makes no sense because unless he is omniscient or can read minds from many miles away, he has no way of knowing Aurene is en route. We, who have a bond with her as you rightly stated, have no idea where she is or what she's up to, but Balthazar can anticipate her behavior to a fault. No sale, it doesn't work for me.

>

 

This does bring up a couple of points worth mentioning.

 

First is that Tarir is halfway across the world from elona, so it doesn't entirely make sense for Balthazar to go all the way there only to drag her all the way back to Elona when he could simply get her to come. Secondly, toying with the commander until Aurene comes its a two step plan, because right after he captures Aurene, he kills us, which is also a primary goal of his. Remember, in Balthazar's mind, killing us means we won't come back to stop him from killing Kralkatorrik and stealing it's power. It's also extremely likely that Balthazar found out about the commander's ties with Aurene in the exact same method he found out about the egg, the egg chamber and Tarir as a whole *even before the egg hatched*. Balthazar also witnessed Vlast sacrificing himself to save the commander, so he also could have made the connection that Aurene would have done the same if he didn't simply try to kill the commander instantly.

 

However, Balthazar has shown the capability of teleporting and teleporting things with him, like he took Omadd's machine, and instantly killing us if we accept that he was toying with us until Aurene showed up. It's also apparent that he Deus Ex Machina'd his way into the egg chamber in the first place, which means his deus ex machina'ing of learning about the connection between the two also can apply and can, also, be criticized. Balthazar seems to know a ton of info that is odd, like Kralkatorrik's weakness, how utilizing Aurene would work instead of just working with the energy of the branded Crystals and some other things too that I can't quite pick at or remember right now.

 

Which also begs another question, why does he need Aurene in the first place? We learn Kralkatorrik's weakness is himself, via either his energy or his physical form. While we destroy the spear, there's a hell of a lot of brand crystals that can be harvested, placed into the machine and used as a battery, and we can assume he was trying to capture Vlast for the same reason, but if Kralkatorrik's own blood could kill him, why not use energy from branded crystals, or if it required a living thing, why not some branded? He seemingly perfected the technology too.

 

It seems weird, in the very least, though I could be missing some pieces of info.

[zeonozero.5860]

It is actually very easy to know where to go. Upon entering I agree it can be a bit hard, but you can see from where you spawn the jail that Joko is in and a named spirit. Head that direction. When the Judge tells you to go find your equipment, he actually points in the direction that you are supposed to go. Again Ill give that the equipment isnt named, but it does have the shiny glow like an item on the ground. Just click all of them. Upon getting your equipment your named spirit actually runs right by you. Just follow it into the cave. Subsequently after the cave event, you literally go outside and you can see the raven spirit your purpose. Follow it until the mission is done.

To be honest, this doesn't sound like content is too hard, you just physically missed most clues that were given to you. Please look a little more carefully as it is there.

[Tolkien.4810]

Themepark kids... Back in UO we dont have anything of that lol

[Zaltys.7649]

> @zeonozero.5860 said:

> It is actually very easy to know where to go. Upon entering I agree it can be a bit hard, but you can see from where you spawn the jail that Joko is in and a named spirit.

And that was supposed to do something? I had to go around finding every single spirit and talking to them (making most of them vanish), before those two acknowledged my pretense. ...or at least I think that's what triggered it. Got no response before that.

 

[Manasa Devi.7958]

> @zeonozero.5860 said:

> It is actually very easy to know where to go. Upon entering I agree it can be a bit hard, but you can see from where you spawn the jail that Joko is in and a named spirit. Head that direction. When the Judge tells you to go find your equipment, he actually points in the direction that you are supposed to go. Again Ill give that the equipment isnt named, but it does have the shiny glow like an item on the ground. Just click all of them. Upon getting your equipment your named spirit actually runs right by you. Just follow it into the cave. Subsequently after the cave event, you literally go outside and you can see the raven spirit your purpose. Follow it until the mission is done.

> To be honest, this doesn't sound like content is too hard, you just physically missed most clues that were given to you. Please look a little more carefully as it is there.

I found it makes a HUGE difference whether or not you have the "Show all NPC names" option turned on. I don't have that on, and I'm sure that made me miss some of them on my first playthrough. I turned it on for my second character, and breezed through it. The shiny glow on equipment only triggered when I moused-over it. Holding the alt key made no difference. So, also easy to miss.

[castlemanic.3198]

> @Zaltys.7649 said:

> > @zeonozero.5860 said:

> > It is actually very easy to know where to go. Upon entering I agree it can be a bit hard, but you can see from where you spawn the jail that Joko is in and a named spirit.

> And that was supposed to do something? I had to go around finding every single spirit and talking to them (making most of them vanish), before those two acknowledged my pretense. ...or at least I think that's what triggered it. Got no response before that.

>

 

That sounds like a bug, because I ran up to them and it immediately triggered a response the two times i've done this instance.

[VendettaChef.6809]

I've always enjoyed GW2's combat and even simple design that allows me to do it encourages me to play.

 

I could be wrong, but I believe there are plenty of Hero Points that require specific mounts (I never said griffin, I never said masteries).

 

I also said I had trouble finding the npc that stole my name, not The Judge. It seems like people who are mad at me for my opinion only pay attention to half of what I'm talking about...

 

I do not mind gameplay that is devoid of combat - but it needs something else in it's place. Heart of Thorns included many examples of this, such as interesting platforming. However, The Departed consists of just walking around. I didn't mind it so much when it used that to recap on everything up to this part, I didn't mind it when various characters were discussing new plot points. I DID mind it when I was left to walk around with no indication hunting for someone with less tools than before, with absolutely nothing going on in the game. I don't mind more expansive maps with fewer waypoints to encourage mount usage - but I do mind wide empty spaces of no content, or having you travel from point to point just to listen to someone before having you repeat whole process.

 

Part of the reason I wrote this post was because I was curious as to how others received these mechanics - I even said something to that effect. While most members seem to have enjoyed it, others have not (both are okay). I think the best term used to describe many of these segments is "Vacuous".

 

Mystery and Exploration are wonderful things - when you have stuff to do.

[tenryuta.2014]

departed and its previous chapter felt horrid,

>! you died, you ran around, you were told, "hey kill eater and you get to hax your self back to life..."(a copout because your character dying would be bad) and then fighting bal felt so anti-climactic, just meh, the raid fest of telegraphs hurt my wrists more than aurene being taken away... AGAIN!

[lordmitz.2047]

> @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:.

> I hate Taimi with a passion

 

YOURE A MONSTER

 

[TheOrlyFactor.8341]

> @lordmitz.2047 said:

> > @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:.

> > I hate Taimi with a passion

>

> YOURE A MONSTER

>

 

Eh, he's entitled to his opinion even if I don't agree with it either. I'm sure people think the same of me when I go on about how much I hate/loathe/dislike Rytlock with a passion and how I want to see less and less of him in game.

[Zaltys.7649]

> @TheOrlyFactor.8341 said:

> Eh, he's entitled to his opinion even if I don't agree with it either. I'm sure people think the same of me when I go on about how much I hate/loathe/dislike Rytlock with a passion and how I want to see less and less of him in game.

Yeah, a lot of Taimi's dialogue is optional (you can choose not to call her between missions), whereas Rytlock's whining cannot be skipped..

 

 

[PirateLove.6417]

I played GW1 and still 'The Departing' was a cool moment. I got to hear the reaction of the other person who was doing it for the first time and it was pretty epic.

 

To your first point, the lack of a mini-map for a PART of the story gave me the player a small inkling of what the character would be going through: surprise and confusion. It was pretty cool.

 

To the second point, I can see how it would seem pointless if maybe you don't enjoy the detective role or are playing in auto mode just randomly running up to people and clicking. Paying attention to the clues I think you can get through that portion by only speaking to an npc (some repeated) nine times? And that includes the guy who auto engages you outside the elder's tent. It's not for everyone, but I don't think it was a failing either in the story.

 

I think this is the best story in flow so far. I have done it on multiple characters for completion sake and it doesn't drag the way some of the other story chapters have. Just as it feels like it is going to start dragging - you are chasing down the beast!

 

And really, I didn't get lost in 'The Departed' I saw a bunch of speech going on near me.... I walk over and my quest log updated to hear Joko out... so I do. Then you follow the lady who leads you to the judge... It did take a bit of figuring out where the weapons were but everything else is just following the two npcs who guide you around or chasing down the mimic.

 

I get your opinion though I think the judgement you hold against the game...

 

> @VendettaChef.6809 said:

> instead of effectively punishing players with tedium because they have to advance the story to access this content.

>

 

Is more harsh than it needs to be because though it wasn't your cup of tea, some have really liked it. I think they did a great job! Hopefully the stuff you liked about the expansion will make up for the parts you didn't care for.

[lordmitz.2047]

 

> > @TheOrlyFactor.8341 said:

> Eh, he's entitled to his opinion even if I don't agree with it either. I'm sure people think the same of me when I go on about how much I hate/loathe/dislike Rytlock with a passion and how I want to see less and less of him in game.

 

 

sure, he's entitled to his opinion but he's still a monster

how could anyone hate that squishy face

buncha savages