A rant: More and more players have not very fair behavior

[TEKnowledgy.1760]

> @Shirlias.8104 said:

> I think they just don't care or don't see players around em.

>

> When i am moving in pof i just do it trying to avoid mobs and optimize the path i am following in terms of time and shortcuts.

>

> For an instance, if i see somebody Downed sometimes i help them and sometimes i don't. Not a big deal.

 

I'm more forgiving with PoF mobs lol i know why they so scared of fighting them. Plus the aggros range is crazy there, what like 2-3x further away? I've actually to this point not had much problem from 3rd party aggro effecting me in PoF. Though, give it time I just picked it up tuesday so haven't had time to be taken out by it. I expect it though. Once it happens to ya once, you become more aware of the possibility. So in away maybe it was a good thing i got to enjoy it first hand and as early as i did. Might help me in the long run and maybe even help another to, as I'm more aware to it and watch my own aggros not just in PoF, but where ever I ride a mount.

[Oldirtbeard.9834]

Truth be told I run Minion Master so my little buddies hold aggro while I run away.

[Urud.4925]

I feel the OP and it happened also what SmirkDog said. Unfortunately it's also not safe to teleport to a waypoint and stay in idle for few seconds anymore.

I think most of the players don't do it on purpose, but it's true that I saw a lot of new/returning players (the ones glued to their mount and 6-7 mastery points) that simply rush through the maps, passing careless over downed players.

Until few months ago, whenever I saw a downed player for example, everyone rushed to ress him, even diverting from his path (I always do it). Now it's not that common. Few players decide to unmount to help someone else :/

Pity. But I think that these new/returning players will start to appreciate how awesome is to play a game with a good and helpful community, once they understand that no one cares about their mounts. I'll give them time.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

There are all sorts of reasons that explain the OP's examples that don't involve rudeness.

* Player is trying to escape certain death and doesn't have much choice in it.

* Player doesn't realize just how long it takes before mobs 'leash' in PoF, i.e. how far they will chase.

* Player is trying to get OOC so they can re-mount and hasn't noticed much else.

* Player has "Turn Player Nameplates Off" to reduce visual clutter (or improve performance) and doesn't even realize there are other players nearby.

* Player has already helped others in that area with the same sets of mobs and has earned some time to help themselves.

 

I'm sure there are players that simply don't care and I'm sure that there are trolls. But without evidence beyond "they ran thataway," I don't think it's fair to condemn others without taking the time to learn the circumstances.

[TEKnowledgy.1760]

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> There are all sorts of reasons that explain the OP's examples that don't involve rudeness.

> * Player is trying to escape certain death and doesn't have much choice in it.

> * Player doesn't realize just how long it takes before mobs 'leash' in PoF, i.e. how far they will chase.

> * Player is trying to get OOC so they can re-mount and hasn't noticed much else.

> * Player has "Turn Player Nameplates Off" to reduce visual clutter (or improve performance) and doesn't even realize there are other players nearby.

> * Player has already helped others in that area with the same sets of mobs and has earned some time to help themselves.

>

> I'm sure there are players that simply don't care and I'm sure that there are trolls. But without evidence beyond "they ran thataway," I don't think it's fair to condemn others without taking the time to learn the circumstances.

 

Opinions don't necessarily need proof. Like atheist his/her opinion god doesn't exist nor can he/she prove it and Christians opinion is god does exist but also equally can't prove it.

last i checked stating opinion on the forum is completely fine as long as it's not pointing a finger directly at another specific person say by name in a shaming or aggressive way. So honestly, it's just as fair as your own opinion to it not being fair.

[Faaris.8013]

I recommend equipping some "escape" skills, since you won't be able to change other players' behaviour. I mainly play thief, and have no isssues with this at all. I have no toughness increasing gear, so mobs don't prefer me over others usually. I have traited that my dodge is replaced by a dash, so usually 2 dodges get me out of the aggroe range. If that doesn't work, I shadow step away, or simply stealth myself. Other classes have less options, but there is always something that gives you an edge over mobs as long as you haven't been hit by a slow yet, maybe even a weapon skill that dashes you forward. Being aware of your surroundings and making quick decisions helps too: can I swing a third time before getting away or will the mob hit me before I finish?

[elrin.4750]

This behavior is normal in Bitterfrost. BF is a very annoying map, hence the "unusual" player behavior :)

[Yakubyogami.7586]

> @"Dreamy Lu.3865" said:

> Since a while, there are more and more players who, when they have foes running after them (that they did aggro while farming or else), run by other players by, put those foes "on" the other players and happily leave without caring to help at the fight they have caused. This is getting worse since mounts are used. I find this behavior unfair and unacceptable. Maybe I am old fashion? Could be. But well, I do not like that and as I witness it more and more often, on a daily basis, I need to complain about. :3

 

This is called 'training' and has been going on for the past 2 decades. I know this for a fact because I used to do it myself in Everquest on the Orc Highway, training 50+ orcs, 4 Spectres and a half-dozen Giants to the zone and giggling when people who zoned in died before the map loaded. It's less common now because of leashing (a mechanic created to prevent this exact thing), but it still happens. Don't damage mobs and they usually won't chase after you because A) they're chasing someone higher on their aggro table or B) they've been leashed and are running back to their pathing points.

 

 

[Goettel.4389]

Unkind players do have a function: they make me look goooood ;-)

[Vayne.8563]

I agree that it's bad ettiquette to train a bunch of foes onto someone and leave them to deal with it. However, I don't think this has anything to do with mounts. Long before mounts came into the game, this behavior was fairly common in Bitterfrost. However, you can't really regulate the actions of others. You can only be responsible for yourself. Just be happy you're not the kind of person who would do that.

[ProverbsofHell.2307]

Yeah it's just bad design. In WoW if you aggro lots of mobs and run past a player, they will ignore that player and when their aggro for the original is gone they run back to spawn point.

[Faaris.8013]

> @Yakubyogami.7586 said:

> This is called 'training' and has been going on for the past 2 decades. I know this for a fact because I used to do it myself in Everquest on the Orc Highway, training 50+ orcs, 4 Spectres and a half-dozen Giants to the zone and giggling when people who zoned in died before the map loaded. It's less common now because of leashing (a mechanic created to prevent this exact thing), but it still happens. Don't damage mobs and they usually won't chase after you because A) they're chasing someone higher on their aggro table or B) they've been leashed and are running back to their pathing points.

>

>

 

I'm always curious why people would publicly announce that they were/are griefing jerks. What's your reason?

[hellsqueen.3045]

> @ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

> Yeah it's just bad design. In WoW if you aggro lots of mobs and run past a player, they will ignore that player and when their aggro for the original is gone they run back to spawn point.

 

As people have said in this post, if you don't damage them, they won't aggro on you because by that point they should leash and go back to their zone.

[Lanhelin.3480]

> @Shirlias.8104 said:

> For an instance, if i see somebody Downed sometimes i help them and sometimes i don't. Not a big deal.

 

At least you decide and either give 100% or 0%. But there also are players who cannot decide, like reviving others to 50% and then run/glide away :-/

 

[TEKnowledgy.1760]

> @Lanhelin.3480 said:

> > @Shirlias.8104 said:

> > For an instance, if i see somebody Downed sometimes i help them and sometimes i don't. Not a big deal.

>

> At least you decide and either give 100% or 0%. But there also are players who cannot decide, like reviving others to 50% and then run/glide away :-/

>

 

lol i had somebody do that to me they was like if you dont thank me i wont res you fully i told them you wont get my thank you till you res me fully because if you die while rezzing me then you didn't deserve the thank you lmao. I guess you could say I dont let stuff like that get pulled on me i know where the wp is 1 silver isnt gonna hurt my bank account. I give thank yous when its deserved not when it's con'ed out of me ya know?

Personally, I don't care if you thank me or not, i consider it part of the game don't have to thank me for playing.

I sometimes whisper or in /say ask if a person is there or afk because if one resses an afker not really helping them if they die again just more broken gear.

[Ameepa.6793]

> @TEKnowledgy.1760 said:

 

> i told them you wont get my thank you till you res me fully because if you die while rezzing me then you didn't deserve the thank you lmao.

 

Sooo if someone comes to ress you and dies trying help, they do not even deserve a "thank you"? That's nice attitude..

 

 

[Yakubyogami.7586]

> @Faaris.8013 said:

> > @Yakubyogami.7586 said:

> > This is called 'training' and has been going on for the past 2 decades. I know this for a fact because I used to do it myself in Everquest on the Orc Highway, training 50+ orcs, 4 Spectres and a half-dozen Giants to the zone and giggling when people who zoned in died before the map loaded. It's less common now because of leashing (a mechanic created to prevent this exact thing), but it still happens. Don't damage mobs and they usually won't chase after you because A) they're chasing someone higher on their aggro table or B) they've been leashed and are running back to their pathing points.

> >

> >

>

> I'm always curious why people would publicly announce that they were/are griefing jerks. What's your reason?

 

1) Education on mechanics

2) If you're familiar with Everquest and you read my statement you'd see I did that nearly 2 decades ago.

3) EQ players were much, much thicker-skinned than most current MMO players and that entire game was a nightmare relative to GW2 so trains were not even in the top 10 list of things to rage over. It had a zone where, no joke, if you zoned in 2 raid-level mobs would hunt you down and murder you no matter where you were.

[VaaCrow.3076]

I do this and i love it, It's just part of the game, it isn't unfair or impolite, as they are subjective. If irl i was being chased by a pack of wolves with 2-3 other people, i'd trip them up too. wolves gotta eat and i don't wanna be dinner. Though to be fair in gw2 it is more of a convenience thing, i don't want to have to slaughter every mob on my travels gathering/running to instance/achievement hunting.

[Dreamy Lu.3865]

> @hellsqueen.3045 said:

> > @ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

> > Yeah it's just bad design. In WoW if you aggro lots of mobs and run past a player, they will ignore that player and when their aggro for the original is gone they run back to spawn point.

>

> As people have said in this post, if you don't damage them, they won't aggro on you because by that point they should leash and go back to their zone.

 

I do not agree on that. What I witness is different: Foes simply stay at the person they are put on, even if this person does not attack. You can very easily verify that by standing for some minutes at one of the famous farming spots like the location for elder wood farming in Malchor's Leap area, or the canyon for iron farming in Brisban area (as examples, there are many others). Elementals in the first and Hyenas in the second don't bother at all who have "waken" them up. They follow quite far and if they break aggro on the original guy, they don't return to initial position. They stay where they are and swap to whatever player is close, attacking him, even if the player does nothing to them, because busy farming. This is also like that with the raptors on the hard wood farming path in Sparkfly Fen. If it would happen the way you describe, then of course there would be no more trouble. It would be nice. But I believe it is not like that.

[Teofa Tsavo.9863]

> @Faaris.8013 said:

> > @Yakubyogami.7586 said:

> > This is called 'training' and has been going on for the past 2 decades. I know this for a fact because I used to do it myself in Everquest on the Orc Highway, training 50+ orcs, 4 Spectres and a half-dozen Giants to the zone and giggling when people who zoned in died before the map loaded. It's less common now because of leashing (a mechanic created to prevent this exact thing), but it still happens. Don't damage mobs and they usually won't chase after you because A) they're chasing someone higher on their aggro table or B) they've been leashed and are running back to their pathing points.

> >

> >

>

> I'm always curious why people would publicly announce that they were/are griefing jerks. What's your reason?

 

I try not to train mobs. It's just bad form. However, I have and will continue to train as much as I can onto obvious bot afk farmers, and I've done this for years.

[Djinn.9245]

> @"Dreamy Lu.3865" said:

> Dears

> Sorry in advance for the bother, but I need to rant a bit.

>

> [rant]

> Since a while, there are more and more players who, when they have foes running after them (that they did aggro while farming or else), run by other players by, put those foes "on" the other players and happily leave without caring to help at the fight they have caused. This is getting worse since mounts are used. I find this behavior unfair and unacceptable. Maybe I am old fashion? Could be. But well, I do not like that and as I witness it more and more often, on a daily basis, I need to complain about. :3

> [/rant]

>

> I believe it is because now, there are many players who just want things to go fast, and don't watch anymore around. They just want to hurry ahead and don't care. Fortunately, there are still a lot of players who care, but how long will that be the majority? Anyhow, thanks for hearing (reading)! LOL

 

Yes, most people are inherently selfish and don't think about the other people in the game. They only think about what they are trying to do. And mounts have certainly increased certain issues. This is even more of a problem in low level maps where some of the characters that get mobs trained on them are low level. If they are new players that is a great introduction to the game! But the selfish players don't think about these things - only themselves.

 

I try very hard not to train mobs for this reason and if I accidentally train mobs to someone I will stop and try to pull them away and fight them.

[pah.4931]

Heh. Reminds me of the "TRAIN TO ________" days in Everquest, when folks would round up every mob they could and run em to the zone boundary. Usually it was just an innocent person trying to survive (and calling out the warning in map chat), but sometimes it was jerks purposefully trying to get others killed (or at least scared).

 

Good times.

[crashburntoo.7431]

Reminds me of the EQ train days...

 

I land in the "really try not to do it" camp. I've likely inadvertently done it (apologies!), but I also consider it bad form. The Winterberry frenzy in BF is a good pre-PoF example. There have been some threads about spawn rates and aggro in PoF being tuned a little high, so it's possible that PoF zones are more "aggro-train capable". Mobs are designed to chase fast characters for longer distances, so it's less about mounts causing the problem and more about the spawn/aggro design.

 

I'm not full-on RP or anything, but I play like the character is an extension of me. I can't walk by downed or soon to be downed players without trying to help, and I definitely try not to dump a kittenstorm of mobs onto them.

 

EDIT: @"pah.4931" Just saw your post, EQ trains could get insane! I was the dead Froglok that didn't make it... every time.

[Nick Lentz.6982]

I see more people not helping players who are trying to get mastery/hero points that you have to commune with. They would rush to the point while someone is doing work and run away.

When that happens I always try to pull the mob on them. Sick of assholes like that.

 

The other one is when you or someone else is fighting a hero point or event boss and someone comes in at the last second to get credit.

 

Those are rage feeders :D

[Zedek.8932]

The only time where I am really stopping and helping others is when I accidently drag enemies into an AFK zone, like a waypoint or NPC areas or when they randomly stroll into those places and attack. I just can't watch a Charr dying without fighting back just because the player is AFK :-)

 

But else, I think the fact I am playing all alone for 2.5 years now basically changed my behaviour a lot in this game and I do not really care for others, as they care not as much for me in return. Downed players in the middle of the place apparently seem to forget about their regeneration spell often lately (no enemy around, probably killed while downed) and then they basically bleed to death. I am being yelled at "GIT GUD" too often for some deeper empathy. Also, I am used to either kill to survive or dying and waypointing back 15 km in PoF zones ^^

 

So if I am dragging enemies into others, that's the life in this game. I am not doing it on purpose, but also I am not here to help people out of it. It's actually 100% neutral.

 

Excelsior.