Please revert the Warclaw back to a faster speed. Balance should not be lowest common denominator.

[Tungsten Monarch.6058]

The WarClaw speed nerf makes no sense, please revert the speed, for faster paced action. This slow nonsense is not fun or enjoyable.

[Jura.2170]

the warclaw is now almost as slow as running

please make it faster

[Hannelore.8153]

This was highly requested because you couldn't ever catch someone in their own territories..

[Tungsten Monarch.6058]

> @"Hannelore.8153" said:

> This was highly requested because you couldn't ever catch someone in their own territories..

 

Running away or even Withdraw, is a valid war tactic, just ask the French.

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

imo the warclaw speed nerf was unwarranted. In my own territory I should be faster and harder to catch as its an incentive to keep an area for as long as you can.

 

Personally the endurance nerf for warclaw was all that needed to be done.

[Babytater.6803]

I love this change, please don't change it back. It's still faster than swiftness running. It'll just take a bit to get used to. Mounts should be very weak in WvW and these changes helped with that.

[Mogwai.4015]

No.

 

/10chars.

[Mil.3562]

> @"Babytater.6803" said:

> I love this change, please don't change it back. It's still faster than swiftness running. It'll just take a bit to get used to. Mounts should be very weak in WvW and these changes helped with that.

 

And may i know why mounts should be very weak in WvW? I understand they don't have to be strong but should be very weak? Why? Why? Why?.....

[God.2708]

> @"Mil.3562" said:

> > @"Babytater.6803" said:

> > I love this change, please don't change it back. It's still faster than swiftness running. It'll just take a bit to get used to. Mounts should be very weak in WvW and these changes helped with that.

>

> And may i know why mounts should be very weak in WvW? I understand they don't have to be strong but should be very weak? Why? Why? Why?.....

 

Because frankly they are not a very insightful or interesting addition to the mode. Their form of implementation actively harms both the PvP aspects of WvW and the zone control aspect of WvW by throwing respawn time (in the form of running back) off. In the way it was designed the only thing it actually helps is bad players who die a lot whether by intention or accidental. It doesn't even help new players as they won't have one (and up till this patch actively harmed them getting into the mode), just bad players by minimizing an active consequence of their actions. Anything that weakens that aspect of them will be most welcome.

[Tungsten Monarch.6058]

> @"God.2708" said:

> > @"Mil.3562" said:

> > > @"Babytater.6803" said:

> > > I love this change, please don't change it back. It's still faster than swiftness running. It'll just take a bit to get used to. Mounts should be very weak in WvW and these changes helped with that.

> >

> > And may i know why mounts should be very weak in WvW? I understand they don't have to be strong but should be very weak? Why? Why? Why?.....

>

> Because frankly they are not a very insightful or interesting addition to the mode. Their form of implementation actively harms both the PvP aspects of WvW and the zone control aspect of WvW by throwing respawn time (in the form of running back) off. In the way it was designed the only thing it actually helps is bad players who die a lot whether by intention or accidental. It doesn't even help new players as they won't have one (and up till this patch actively harmed them getting into the mode), just bad players by minimizing an active consequence of their actions. Anything that weakens that aspect of them will be most welcome.

 

Then don't use one, the rest of us enjoyed them, as it is, I don't enjoy the change. One of the reasons I came back to the game was the addition of the WarClaw to WvW. Communism by lowest common denominator might be your thing, but it makes the game slow paced and boring.

[tinyrawmonster.1957]

For me, this was by a huge margin the best WvW change they've done since they introduced it. The increased speed on allied territories should never have been a thing, and a beyond 15k on some characters extra healthpool+triple evade was ridiculous.

[God.2708]

> @"Tungsten Monarch.6058" said:

> > @"God.2708" said:

> > > @"Mil.3562" said:

> > > > @"Babytater.6803" said:

> > > > I love this change, please don't change it back. It's still faster than swiftness running. It'll just take a bit to get used to. Mounts should be very weak in WvW and these changes helped with that.

> > >

> > > And may i know why mounts should be very weak in WvW? I understand they don't have to be strong but should be very weak? Why? Why? Why?.....

> >

> > Because frankly they are not a very insightful or interesting addition to the mode. Their form of implementation actively harms both the PvP aspects of WvW and the zone control aspect of WvW by throwing respawn time (in the form of running back) off. In the way it was designed the only thing it actually helps is bad players who die a lot whether by intention or accidental. It doesn't even help new players as they won't have one (and up till this patch actively harmed them getting into the mode), just bad players by minimizing an active consequence of their actions. Anything that weakens that aspect of them will be most welcome.

>

> Then don't use one, the rest of us enjoyed them, as it is, I don't enjoy the change. One of the reasons I came back to the game was the addition of the WarClaw to WvW. Communism by lowest common denominator might be your thing, but it makes the game slow paced and boring.

 

I can't tell if you are being disingenuous or dumb. Whether I use one or not is irrelevant to the damage it does to the mode overall. The fact it still runs faster than anything else for the most part and still has some tertiary uses is more than enough. It didn't need to make any other form of movement obsolete.

[Babytater.6803]

Mounts hurt roaming by encouraging teaming up on people by easily catching up to them and out speeding them. Then like someone else said, it hurts the timing and life of zerg fights. Not only are the mount stomps stupid but they allow people who die to get back 2x as fast as before. This just doesn't benefit fights in the BL's

[Stand The Wall.6987]

> @"God.2708" said:

 

druid best immob

[Ragi.7291]

**The mount, its speed and its 3 dodges killed the roaming and many builds with it.**

 

Before this patch in WvW, it had become a frenetic race and if by misfortune somebody defends a camp or a fort even if you killed your enemy(s) you had not even the time of cap your objective that it was already back.

Now especially fights that I made, if you win your fight you can take your objective and it's normal, it's your reward, you're fight, you're win.

 

But of course I think very few people will say it's good because a lot of the roamers and people who liked the macro lead left WvW or this game more than a year ago when the mounts arrived.

 

nerf WarClaw speed, great.

 

All this to say very good point, the feature that allows the new player without a mount to follow an experienced player, veryyyy Great!!!!!!!!

 

50% reduction of the mount's endurance, Awesome!

 

Yes, game is slower, but that's ok it was 7 years ago and it's where there were the most players or everyone can experiment things, ...

The frantic race on karma train and the oneshot / two shot...

It's finally over! (almost ^^)

 

_I'm not saying everything's perfect, far from it._

[Tungsten Monarch.6058]

> @"Babytater.6803" said:

> Mounts hurt roaming by encouraging teaming up on people by easily catching up to them and out speeding them. Then like someone else said, it hurts the timing and life of zerg fights. Not only are the mount stomps stupid but they allow people who die to get back 2x as fast as before. This just doesn't benefit fights in the BL's

 

That is the point of using Cavalry tactics. This is not PvP where competitive balance matters, this is large scale warfare, where the tools of trade include Siege tactics and Cavalry tactics.

[Tungsten Monarch.6058]

> @"Ragi.7291" said:

> Yes, game is slower, but that's ok it was 7 years ago

 

no it was not OK seven years ago, we had to use running builds. Mounts freed up builds to allow groups to move quickly to respond to an invading enemy on two fronts. To say it was OK seven years ago is to say Siege weapons in the jumping puzzle was OK seven years ago.

[TheGrimm.5624]

> @"Bigpapasmurf.5623" said:

> imo the warclaw speed nerf was unwarranted. In my own territory I should be faster and harder to catch as its an incentive to keep an area for as long as you can.

>

> Personally the endurance nerf for warclaw was all that needed to be done.

 

Agree. There is two sides to this thought. If you are falling back in your own territory it means that you are probably getting away from something larger. Else it means you are trying to run down something in an area your control. In both cases it adds value in why you would want to control something.

[phreeak.1023]

> @"Babytater.6803" said:

> I love this change, please don't change it back. It's still faster than swiftness running. It'll just take a bit to get used to. Mounts should be very weak in WvW and these changes helped with that.

 

Sure ppl love it. The gankers, sorry i mean roamers, can now jump again on one guy to kill him and throw Catas..

[Tungsten Monarch.6058]

> @"God.2708" said:

> > @"Tungsten Monarch.6058" said:

> > > @"God.2708" said:

> > > > @"Mil.3562" said:

> > > > > @"Babytater.6803" said:

> > > > > I love this change, please don't change it back. It's still faster than swiftness running. It'll just take a bit to get used to. Mounts should be very weak in WvW and these changes helped with that.

> > > >

> > > > And may i know why mounts should be very weak in WvW? I understand they don't have to be strong but should be very weak? Why? Why? Why?.....

> > >

> > > Because frankly they are not a very insightful or interesting addition to the mode. Their form of implementation actively harms both the PvP aspects of WvW and the zone control aspect of WvW by throwing respawn time (in the form of running back) off. In the way it was designed the only thing it actually helps is bad players who die a lot whether by intention or accidental. It doesn't even help new players as they won't have one (and up till this patch actively harmed them getting into the mode), just bad players by minimizing an active consequence of their actions. Anything that weakens that aspect of them will be most welcome.

> >

> > Then don't use one, the rest of us enjoyed them, as it is, I don't enjoy the change. One of the reasons I came back to the game was the addition of the WarClaw to WvW. Communism by lowest common denominator might be your thing, but it makes the game slow paced and boring.

>

> I can't tell if you are being disingenuous or dumb. Whether I use one or not is irrelevant to the damage it does to the mode overall. The fact it still runs faster than anything else for the most part and still has some tertiary uses is more than enough. It didn't need to make any other form of movement obsolete.

 

strange as I could ask you the same question. The benefit of the speed was it's use as Calvary. That is the point of Calvary, a fast response, blitzkrieg maneuvering, actual tactics being used to win the situation. If you can't win by an evolving battle field condition, you don't then say, EVERYONE SLOW DOWN WE CAN'T PVP, MOUNTS ARE OP, WE CAN'T ADAPT. Not only is it intellectually disingenuous, it stagnates the game play.

[Tungsten Monarch.6058]

> @"TheGrimm.5624" said:

> > @"Bigpapasmurf.5623" said:

> > imo the warclaw speed nerf was unwarranted. In my own territory I should be faster and harder to catch as its an incentive to keep an area for as long as you can.

> >

> > Personally the endurance nerf for warclaw was all that needed to be done.

>

> Agree. There is two sides to this thought. If you are falling back in your own territory it means that you are probably getting away from something larger. Else it means you are trying to run down something in an area your control. In both cases it adds value in why you would want to control something.

 

Very well stated, and again, that's Calvary tactics.

[God.2708]

> @"Tungsten Monarch.6058" said:

> > @"God.2708" said:

> > > @"Tungsten Monarch.6058" said:

> > > > @"God.2708" said:

> > > > > @"Mil.3562" said:

> > > > > > @"Babytater.6803" said:

> > > > > > I love this change, please don't change it back. It's still faster than swiftness running. It'll just take a bit to get used to. Mounts should be very weak in WvW and these changes helped with that.

> > > > >

> > > > > And may i know why mounts should be very weak in WvW? I understand they don't have to be strong but should be very weak? Why? Why? Why?.....

> > > >

> > > > Because frankly they are not a very insightful or interesting addition to the mode. Their form of implementation actively harms both the PvP aspects of WvW and the zone control aspect of WvW by throwing respawn time (in the form of running back) off. In the way it was designed the only thing it actually helps is bad players who die a lot whether by intention or accidental. It doesn't even help new players as they won't have one (and up till this patch actively harmed them getting into the mode), just bad players by minimizing an active consequence of their actions. Anything that weakens that aspect of them will be most welcome.

> > >

> > > Then don't use one, the rest of us enjoyed them, as it is, I don't enjoy the change. One of the reasons I came back to the game was the addition of the WarClaw to WvW. Communism by lowest common denominator might be your thing, but it makes the game slow paced and boring.

> >

> > I can't tell if you are being disingenuous or dumb. Whether I use one or not is irrelevant to the damage it does to the mode overall. The fact it still runs faster than anything else for the most part and still has some tertiary uses is more than enough. It didn't need to make any other form of movement obsolete.

>

> strange as I could ask you the same question. The benefit of the speed was it's use as Calvary. That is the point of Calvary, a fast response, blitzkrieg maneuvering, actual tactics being used to win the situation. If you can't win by an evolving battle field condition, you don't then say, EVERYONE SLOW DOWN WE CAN'T PVP, MOUNTS ARE OP, WE CAN'T ADAPT. Not only is it intellectually disingenuous, it stagnates the game play.

 

They are still faster. There are obvious huge disadvantages to cavalry in a real war setting (like your mount dying often meant you dying our being completely out of commission for the rest of the fight) that don't apply. I don't see you calling for dying on your mount to result in the player ending up in downstate.

 

There is also the obvious balance considerations you probably aren't even blipping on your radar. PLAYERS move as fast as people on the mounts do. Whether mounted or not. Do you want perma stealth thieves running around at 40% faster than swiftness movement until they gank you because there's one player on a warclaw sitting there like bait? Or an entire Zerg to rush at mount speed from stealth when it looks like a single player?

 

It isn't a perfect solution, but it is the right one thus far.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

Meh, I think it is fine as it is now. You still have advantages by using it.

- it moves faster than swiftness (slightly) and is a boon to any build that has no source of swiftness

- it still provides you 2 dodges , immunity to CC and slight health bumper

- Sniff has a use

- Lance exists

- It still looks awesome to ride

 

Now all ANET has to do is:

- remove the damage and stomp from Battle Maul. Mount shouldn't be used as a weapon even if that is how PvE mounts work

- do something with Chain Pull. Like seriously, what a joke

- Address the issue with Golems benefiting from the revamped Warclaw mastery. Intended as a means of making Golems more effective, or just another oversight? In the case of the latter, when will it be corrected?

[Tungsten Monarch.6058]

> @"God.2708" said:

> > @"Tungsten Monarch.6058" said:

> > > @"God.2708" said:

> > > > @"Tungsten Monarch.6058" said:

> > > > > @"God.2708" said:

> > > > > > @"Mil.3562" said:

> > > > > > > @"Babytater.6803" said:

> > > > > > > I love this change, please don't change it back. It's still faster than swiftness running. It'll just take a bit to get used to. Mounts should be very weak in WvW and these changes helped with that.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > And may i know why mounts should be very weak in WvW? I understand they don't have to be strong but should be very weak? Why? Why? Why?.....

> > > > >

> > > > > Because frankly they are not a very insightful or interesting addition to the mode. Their form of implementation actively harms both the PvP aspects of WvW and the zone control aspect of WvW by throwing respawn time (in the form of running back) off. In the way it was designed the only thing it actually helps is bad players who die a lot whether by intention or accidental. It doesn't even help new players as they won't have one (and up till this patch actively harmed them getting into the mode), just bad players by minimizing an active consequence of their actions. Anything that weakens that aspect of them will be most welcome.

> > > >

> > > > Then don't use one, the rest of us enjoyed them, as it is, I don't enjoy the change. One of the reasons I came back to the game was the addition of the WarClaw to WvW. Communism by lowest common denominator might be your thing, but it makes the game slow paced and boring.

> > >

> > > I can't tell if you are being disingenuous or dumb. Whether I use one or not is irrelevant to the damage it does to the mode overall. The fact it still runs faster than anything else for the most part and still has some tertiary uses is more than enough. It didn't need to make any other form of movement obsolete.

> >

> > strange as I could ask you the same question. The benefit of the speed was it's use as Calvary. That is the point of Calvary, a fast response, blitzkrieg maneuvering, actual tactics being used to win the situation. If you can't win by an evolving battle field condition, you don't then say, EVERYONE SLOW DOWN WE CAN'T PVP, MOUNTS ARE OP, WE CAN'T ADAPT. Not only is it intellectually disingenuous, it stagnates the game play.

>

> They are still faster. There are obvious huge disadvantages to cavalry in a real war setting (like your mount dying often meant you dying our being completely out of commission for the rest of the fight) that don't apply. I don't see you calling for dying on your mount to result in the player ending up in downstate.

>

> There is also the obvious balance considerations you probably aren't even blipping on your radar. PLAYERS move as fast as people on the mounts do. Whether mounted or not. Do you want perma stealth thieves running around at 40% faster than swiftness movement until they gank you because there's one player on a warclaw sitting there like bait? Or an entire Zerg to rush at mount speed from stealth when it looks like a single player?

>

> It isn't a perfect solution, but it is the right one thus far.

 

You're conflating a lot of issues. For example, perma stealth thief's, the issue is perma stealth, not the fast movement. Saying they are still faster, ... not by much which makes Calvary less valuable as a resource on any battlefield. Historically Calvary works, for a good reason, and guess what, they ran down people too. In WvW, that's a valid tactic or should be a valid tactic.

[TheGrimm.5624]

> @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> Meh, I think it is fine as it is now. You still have advantages by using it.

> - it moves faster than swiftness (slightly) and is a boon to any build that has no source of swiftness

> - it still provides you 2 dodges , immunity to CC and slight health bumper

> - Sniff has a use

> - Lance exists

> - It still looks awesome to ride

>

> Now all ANET has to do is:

> - remove the damage and stomp from Battle Maul. Mount shouldn't be used as a weapon even if that is how PvE mounts work

> - do something with Chain Pull. Like seriously, what a joke

> - Address the issue with Golems benefiting from the revamped Warclaw mastery. Intended as a means of making Golems more effective, or just another oversight? In the case of the latter, when will it be corrected?

 

Chain pull, almost wonder if this would be better served as a pull on a player, a way to pull people out of zergs. Shouldn't work vertically though. Can't say the last time I saw it actually used on a gate. Still going round on the golem speed up, if its a bug then remove, if intended lets see how it plays out. Battle maul, even if not advantageous to lower numbers it adds a level of tactics, not sure I would change and that comes from Havoc/Roamer perspective. Sniff, as I said before, buff it, add a mark for stealthed targets, not a reveal, just a mark on mini-map.