FFS fix this goddamn pets coefficients already

[Avatar.3568]

I want to say something to that. I run atm the owl and the raven on core ranger and both do pretty good dmg, but you need to setup the dmg

 

After every pet swap I'll go in offensive mod, because I got fury might, and quickness and try to land the f2 (2 hits unblock able) and my mauls. The pet mostly hits do to its quickness and my positioning infront or directly behind my enemy and the dmg goes from 4-10k combined. Its really hard dps + the mauls but after that I need to retreat, kite and wait another 15 sec to deal dmg. The time between are ranger doing mostly no dmg.

(depends when enemy isn't attacking me I can do Lil bit dmg but not much).

 

So yes bird is doing hard dmg but only with the f2, and yes the birds are dying super fast so just kill them and core ranger with birds has no dmg spikes to setup.

[Leonidrex.5649]

> @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > So far, there is absolutely no arguments that justify absurd high damage coefficients that were left untouched on the pets.

> > Nice try to change the subject and make it a mesmer thread. Keep it up /s

> > Thats funny, making a right call on something that must be fixed sent certain ranger main into child-rage

>

> Gonna help you... You were hit by 6 Slash attacks that averaged out to be 2,167 per hit. Not sure if you know, but ranger coefficients are lower due to pets bc they are factored in to damage output. And if you want to talk about "pets", let's talk about Mind Wrack damage, number of targets and range... and all the advantages a Mesmer has with their "pet" designs.

>

> Gonna say this to finish this thread... You're not fooling most of us with your complaint. It's easy to avoid pets by simply moving (even walking) and/or killing it... And we have had thousands of threads complaining about the problems associated with the ranger pets flaws and designs, none of which Mesmer "pets" suffer from. We are not as dumb as you think we are on these matters. And if you are dying to the horrible AI designs of ranger pets, there may be some things you might want to consider working on.

 

how much HP does bird have? 16k? 18k?

with soulbeast ( merge every 10s ) you can heal the pet every 10s.

meaning you have to dish out 16k dmg, then it gets picked up and you have to deal 16k again, and you have to do it faster then 10s, or else all of that damage is wasted.

with core its 20s. nobody can afford to put that much damage into pet. Not in a realistic scenario. large scale is the only place where it can happen.

Since you spoke of mesmers shatter. Glass cannon mes can hit up to like 10k with mid wreck. mesmer needs to be in melee range and generate clone. its very comperable to hiding behind a wall and having to play twister to dodge pet attacks.

Dont know if you read through some of the pets but ALOT of them are ridiculous.

Pets with 5+ coof on skils.

Pets with 3-4 coof with 3s hard CC.

Pets with 3s immob on 20s cd, with ANOTHER 3s on 40s.

Pets that use heal for 6,5k ( bonus healing skill )

 

[Odik.4587]

> @"Swagger.1459" said:

Read post above about derailing into mesmer thread (and doing it bad : problems associated with the ranger pets flaws and designs, none of which Mesmer "pets" suffer from. Really eksdee.) and prove nothing but trying to call me bad. LoL.

No prob, according to @"ArlAlt.1630" its extremely easy to beat a ranger on mesmer. Come to 1x1 my ranger while you can play any mesmer build(that you pretend to be OP), inb4 I'm NA !

Ok. Since I'm bad ranger and just player and I beat top3 necro main then its pretty much a proof that ranger is just busted and should be nerfed into oblivion.

Contrary to some rangermain defenders that pet never hit moving targets - OWL is crippled, owl is CHILLED and still has no problems reaching necromancer and hit like a truck.

[toxic.3648]

> @"Odik.4587" said:

> > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> Read post above about derailing into mesmer thread (and doing it bad : problems associated with the ranger pets flaws and designs, none of which Mesmer "pets" suffer from. Really eksdee.) and prove nothing but trying to call me bad. LoL.

> No prob, according to @"ArlAlt.1630" its extremely easy to beat a ranger on mesmer. Come to 1x1 my ranger while you can play any mesmer build(that you pretend to be OP), inb4 I'm NA !

>

> Ok. Since I'm bad ranger and just player and I beat top3 necro main then its pretty much a proof that ranger is just busted and should be nerfed into oblivion.

> Contrary to some rangermain defenders that pet never hit moving targets - OWL is crippled, owl is CHILLED and still has no problems reaching necromancer and hit like a truck.

 

pleb ranger beating top 3 lol. imagine a veteran ranger ...

id love to see ppl argue with this

edit: im surprised ppl are still defending this tbh. last patch was meant to bring down powercreep yet pet coef's are "fine" as is. i found one with coef of kitten 9 for god sake xD and ppl thought prime light beam coef of 3 was overtuned :p

[Avatar.3568]

> @"toxic.3648" said:

> > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > Read post above about derailing into mesmer thread (and doing it bad : problems associated with the ranger pets flaws and designs, none of which Mesmer "pets" suffer from. Really eksdee.) and prove nothing but trying to call me bad. LoL.

> > No prob, according to @"ArlAlt.1630" its extremely easy to beat a ranger on mesmer. Come to 1x1 my ranger while you can play any mesmer build(that you pretend to be OP), inb4 I'm NA !

> >

> > Ok. Since I'm bad ranger and just player and I beat top3 necro main then its pretty much a proof that ranger is just busted and should be nerfed into oblivion.

> > Contrary to some rangermain defenders that pet never hit moving targets - OWL is crippled, owl is CHILLED and still has no problems reaching necromancer and hit like a truck.

>

> pleb ranger beating top 3 lol. imagine a veteran ranger ...

> id love to see ppl argue with this

> edit: im surprised ppl are still defending this tbh. last patch was meant to bring down powercreep yet pet coef's are "fine" as is. i found one with coef of kitten 9 for god sake xD and ppl thought prime light beam coef of 3 was overtuned :p

 

Actually pets never get touched so they are clean from power creep since ever

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

> @"Odik.4587" said:

> > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> Read post above about derailing into mesmer thread (and doing it bad : problems associated with the ranger pets flaws and designs, none of which Mesmer "pets" suffer from. Really eksdee.) and prove nothing but trying to call me bad. LoL.

> No prob, according to @"ArlAlt.1630" its extremely easy to beat a ranger on mesmer. Come to 1x1 my ranger while you can play any mesmer build(that you pretend to be OP), inb4 I'm NA !

>

> Ok. Since I'm bad ranger and just player and I beat top3 necro main then its pretty much a proof that ranger is just busted and should be nerfed into oblivion.

> Contrary to some rangermain defenders that pet never hit moving targets - OWL is crippled, owl is CHILLED and still has no problems reaching necromancer and hit like a truck.

 

Barely getting bellow 50% hp and didn't even used elite.

What narrative will rangers change to?

Somehow I think your duel proposal will be denied.

[toxic.3648]

> @"Avatar.3568" said:

> Actually pets never get touched so they are clean from power creep since ever

 

pets have been touched tho , dunno where u gotten that from :)

 

 

[Avatar.3568]

> @"toxic.3648" said:

> > @"Avatar.3568" said:

> > Actually pets never get touched so they are clean from power creep since ever

>

> pets have been touched tho , dunno where u gotten that from :)

>

>

Oh yeah I forgot the nerf on gazelle last patch.

My pets doing the same dmg (actually less than vanilla)

[Sunshine.5014]

> @"Avatar.3568" said:

> > @"toxic.3648" said:

> > > @"Avatar.3568" said:

> > > Actually pets never get touched so they are clean from power creep since ever

> >

> > pets have been touched tho , dunno where u gotten that from :)

> >

> >

> Oh yeah I forgot the nerf on gazelle last patch.

> My pets doing the same dmg (actually less than vanilla)

 

This was not touched since 2013, 7 years ago:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Slash_(bird)

 

And this got touched in 2017, but it's a buff to make sure it hits even more consistently.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Chilling_Slash

[LughLongArm.5460]

Some things to keep in mind about rangers and pets.

 

1) Pets do not scale with gear. In low stats environments like spvp, pets will be much more noticeable compared to high stats environments like WvW. This always been an issue that made pets really hard to balance and also made core rangers less likely to run glass canons build(as you will not get full value out of it).

 

2)Most, if not all of the "glass cannon pets"(birds/cats/gazelle) are single target dmg dealers exclusively, the pets attack effectiveness reduces significantly in any team related combat(even 2v2).

 

3)Pets pathing is not multidimensional, pets dont know how to jump up and down from platforms, in any combat terrain which is not 100% flat, the pets effectiveness will highly diminish.

 

4)Pets don't have CC break and for most cases don't have condi removal. It is not rare to see a pet fully "out of commission" just from AOE CC abilities and Condi cleaving. Again, this will be much more present in a group combat environment.

 

5) "glass cannon pets" will die from cleave in many team related combat scenarios , you don't need to focus the pets.

 

Going over 1-5 you can probably notice a pattern. Pets performance in the sPVP lobbly going for random 1vs1 in a fully open flat terrain with LOS(perfect terrain for ranger you could imagine), will not reflect the pets performance in any real combat scenario that the game should be balanced around. The Necro challenge is moronic, LB rangers were always hard counter for necros in 1vs1. Some specs have 100% hard to counter to one another when it comes to dueling, this is a fact(one of the reasons you dont balance around 1vs1).

 

Going over 1-5 you can also probably understand that rangers cannot relay on pets damage as a constant damage dealer, the only time a ranger will expect a pet to deal damage, is exactly after the moment the ranger will F4(for pet swap), as you can control the pet position and limit the chance it will get effected by CC and condis(also many ranger traits synergies with pet swap) . So, it is not passive at all, works exactly like most burst mechanics in the game.

 

But how do we go from here? Most rangers will love to get adjustments to the pet mechanic. pets stats scaling with ranger's gear is something rangers have been asking for years, another thing Rangers will love is to trade pets burst potential with utility(there is a reason why Smokescale is the most popular pets even after years of damage nerfs). I also support @"Eurantien.4632" Post about the skill "Sic 'Em" it should be nerfed or even better, get a re-design.

 

So sure, Birds and cats coefficients may be adjusted, but this will be the lazy solution , which will probably won't change much. Necros will keep losing to rangers in 1vs1, I can promise you that.

[Eurantien.4632]

> @"Leonidrex.5649" said:

> > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > So far, there is absolutely no arguments that justify absurd high damage coefficients that were left untouched on the pets.

> > > Nice try to change the subject and make it a mesmer thread. Keep it up /s

> > > Thats funny, making a right call on something that must be fixed sent certain ranger main into child-rage

> >

> > Gonna help you... You were hit by 6 Slash attacks that averaged out to be 2,167 per hit. Not sure if you know, but ranger coefficients are lower due to pets bc they are factored in to damage output. And if you want to talk about "pets", let's talk about Mind Wrack damage, number of targets and range... and all the advantages a Mesmer has with their "pet" designs.

> >

> > Gonna say this to finish this thread... You're not fooling most of us with your complaint. It's easy to avoid pets by simply moving (even walking) and/or killing it... And we have had thousands of threads complaining about the problems associated with the ranger pets flaws and designs, none of which Mesmer "pets" suffer from. We are not as dumb as you think we are on these matters. And if you are dying to the horrible AI designs of ranger pets, there may be some things you might want to consider working on.

>

> how much HP does bird have? 16k? 18k?

> with soulbeast ( merge every 10s ) you can heal the pet every 10s.

> meaning you have to dish out 16k dmg, then it gets picked up and you have to deal 16k again, and you have to do it faster then 10s, or else all of that damage is wasted.

> with core its 20s. nobody can afford to put that much damage into pet. Not in a realistic scenario. large scale is the only place where it can happen.

> Since you spoke of mesmers shatter. Glass cannon mes can hit up to like 10k with mid wreck. mesmer needs to be in melee range and generate clone. its very comperable to hiding behind a wall and having to play twister to dodge pet attacks.

> Dont know if you read through some of the pets but ALOT of them are ridiculous.

> Pets with 5+ coof on skils.

> Pets with 3-4 coof with 3s hard CC.

> Pets with 3s immob on 20s cd, with ANOTHER 3s on 40s.

> Pets that use heal for 6,5k ( bonus healing skill )

>

 

Or just throw out a cripple or chill on the pet and keep moving. Pet will never hit you.

 

For core and druid, if a pet dies, then the pet is swapped. The CD on pet swap is now 60s. Which means it's now much more likely for the new pet to die too, perpetually crippling the ranger. Pets on non soulbeast are super manageable actually...

 

That being said, since there are two of them and one can spontaneously be swapped into being at the rangers location, it actually makes soulbeast a little easier to deal with since its just one pet.

 

Pet problems (besides broken things like pre patch gazelle) are really just l2p problems. Top players almost never get hit by pets which is why smokescale is so meta, its smoke assault is a guaranteed threat.

[shadowpass.4236]

> @"Odik.4587" said:

> > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> Read post above about derailing into mesmer thread (and doing it bad : problems associated with the ranger pets flaws and designs, none of which Mesmer "pets" suffer from. Really eksdee.) and prove nothing but trying to call me bad. LoL.

> No prob, according to @"ArlAlt.1630" its extremely easy to beat a ranger on mesmer. Come to 1x1 my ranger while you can play any mesmer build(that you pretend to be OP), inb4 I'm NA !

>

> Ok. Since I'm bad ranger and just player and I beat top3 necro main then its pretty much a proof that ranger is just busted and should be nerfed into oblivion.

> Contrary to some rangermain defenders that pet never hit moving targets - OWL is crippled, owl is CHILLED and still has no problems reaching necromancer and hit like a truck.

 

Top 3 necro main??

 

1. At the start of the video he entered reaper shroud after getting hit by PBS instead of dodging or anti-projectiling it with his Death's Charge.

2. After you evaded and swapped into GS he spammed autos even though he should have known you had both weapon swap and the block up so he triggered Counterattack Kick stupidly.

3. He kept using Soul Spiral even after his stab from Infusing Terror ran out even though he just triggered Counterattack and then proceeded to NOT dodge the knockback from Counterattack Kick.

4. He used Executioner Scythe on your pet instead of targetting you...

5. He didn't dodge Hilt Hash.

6. Random evaded after you used Maul.

7. More than 10 second had passed (his shroud was back off cooldown), and yet he doesn't enter it to anti-projectile you or dodge the PBS after you swapped back into longbow.

8. Etc. etc. he didn't even use line of sight at all and decided to kite you by backpedaling and strafing in an open field.

 

I don't know who this guy with the silver badge is but he played terribly.

[Odik.4587]

> @"LughLongArm.5460" said:

Yesterday you told me that you agree that bird is OP, today is a different day? Thanks for calling me best mesmer you fought, that was very flattering ;)

What you have said about the pets is pretty much applies on all AI's/summons/clones etc.

Gazelle is not a glass cannon pet, check it stats few times ;)

>Rangers will love is to trade pets burst potential with utility(there is a reason why Smokescale is the most popular pets even after years of damage nerfs

The reason: it does okayish consistent damage, its pretty tanky, has a 2s knockdown and easly follows up enemies all around with smokeassault(does good damage) and smoke field for stealth? The best pet of all times.

Simply look at owl total stats 8159 vs 9623 gazelle vs 9244 smokesacle? Thats pure powercreep to me

On the side note they should review a lot of core pets/hot*/pof pets and bring them closer to each other and make their abilities more useful ? Many core pets are just so bad that no one would ever look their way, they should do something about it and I highly doubt they would. That deserves to have an entirely new thread and discussion, mine is not about it.

[Tayga.3192]

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> I don't know who this guy with the silver badge is but he played terribly.

 

I also remember he won Roy's 2v2 last year or so.

[Eurantien.4632]

Ever had a pet with 16k hp or so, no toughness, no ability to dodge, or condi clear walk/fly into a 2v1 to help the 1, and have it just instantly get disintegrated?

 

How about when there are 3 enemies, or 4, or 5? What about just 1v1ing a firebrand or fireweaver?

 

Ever had someone LoS and just insta nuke your pet after you swap It?

 

Guess not.

 

Maybe pet damage should be lowered? In return they should be made way tankier.

[Leonidrex.5649]

0:16. he runs, pets hit him anyways. he is not crippled or slowed.

0:18 happens again

0:25 he kites sideways away from the pet, it hits him anyways

[LughLongArm.5460]

> @"Odik.4587" said:

> > @"LughLongArm.5460" said:

> Yesterday you told me that you agree that bird is OP, today is a different day? Thanks for calling me best mesmer you fought, that was very flattering ;)

> What you have said about the pets is pretty much applies on all AI's/summons/clones etc.

> Gazelle is not a glass cannon pet, check it stats few times ;)

> >Rangers will love is to trade pets burst potential with utility(there is a reason why Smokescale is the most popular pets even after years of damage nerfs

> The reason: it does okayish consistent damage, its pretty tanky, has a 2s knockdown and easly follows up enemies all around with smokeassault(does good damage) and smoke field for stealth? The best pet of all times.

> Simply look at owl total stats 8159 vs 9623 gazelle vs 9244 smokesacle? Thats pure powercreep to me

> On the side note they should review a lot of core pets/pof pets and bring them closer to each other and make their abilities more useful ? Many core pets are just so bad that no one would ever look their way, they should do something about it and I highly doubt they would. That deserves to have an entirely new thread and discussion, mine is not about it.

 

I do think you are an amazing Mesmer, and not because you killed me like 3 times straight on an experimental trapper build I tried. I thought you were amazing because you interrupted all my most crucial abilities(heal, blast skill when I wanted to stealth etc) exactly at the most crucial moments. Having awareness and appreciation to another player's finesse is a key factor when considering balance issues. Another player would just call you a noob that is being carried by a noob build, then go on forums and post, MESMERS OP, PLEASE NERF.

 

When I told you birds were OP, it was more of me agreeing it is very good ATM and also in the context of 1vs1. My reasoning is that 1vs1 is not a good benchmark to balance pets around. I did agree however that cats and birds coefficients should be examined for the sake of "standardization", some pets got coefficient reduction while other got none. But like other "standardization" changes for other classes I wish for those kind of nerfs to a start of an ongoing process to make pets more utility oriented and gear stats based.

 

-It is true Gazelle got more tank heavy stats, but after last patch it is also not really a glass cannon, most players take take for the CC, not the damage. The pathing of this pet is the worst of all(due to the run to oblivion skill), resulting with this pet harder to sustain(this is my experience with it atleast).

 

- Regarding somkescalre I agree. For it is a sample of a smart pet design. It is very well rounded, the damage is consistent but low(not OKish, like 3k every 16sec) and its winning point will always be the smoke field(utility).

 

 

[Odik.4587]

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > > > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > > > Read post above about derailing into mesmer thread (and doing it bad : problems associated with the ranger pets flaws and designs, none of which Mesmer "pets" suffer from. Really eksdee.) and prove nothing but trying to call me bad. LoL.

> > > > No prob, according to @"ArlAlt.1630" its extremely easy to beat a ranger on mesmer. Come to 1x1 my ranger while you can play any mesmer build(that you pretend to be OP), inb4 I'm NA !

> > > >

> > > > Ok. Since I'm bad ranger and just player and I beat top3 necro main then its pretty much a proof that ranger is just busted and should be nerfed into oblivion.

> > > > Contrary to some rangermain defenders that pet never hit moving targets - OWL is crippled, owl is CHILLED and still has no problems reaching necromancer and hit like a truck.

> > >

> > > Top 3 necro main??

> > >

> > > 1. At the start of the video he entered reaper shroud after getting hit by PBS instead of dodging or anti-projectiling it with his Death's Charge.

> > > 2. After you evaded and swapped into GS he spammed autos even though he should have known you had both weapon swap and the block up so he triggered Counterattack Kick stupidly.

> > > 3. He kept using Soul Spiral even after his stab from Infusing Terror ran out even though he just triggered Counterattack and then proceeded to NOT dodge the knockback from Counterattack Kick.

> > > 4. He used Executioner Scythe on your pet instead of targetting you...

> > > 5. He didn't dodge Hilt Hash.

> > > 6. Random evaded after you used Maul.

> > > 7. More than 10 second had passed (his shroud was back off cooldown), and yet he doesn't enter it to anti-projectile you or dodge the PBS after you swapped back into longbow.

> > > 8. Etc. etc. he didn't even use line of sight at all and decided to kite you by backpedaling and strafing in an open field.

> > >

> > > I don't know who this guy with the silver badge is but he played terribly.

> > I guess he bought his title from Helio... Oops, wrong region...

> > Ah yes, I forgot, forum warriors are always better than others. Point was that I'm terrible/the pet damage and despite bird swimmed in the chill aoe and axe3 cripple pet still hit him.

> > Ever heard about decay ? I guess not.

>

> How much more time will it take for you to realize that backpedaling means you move at the same speed as something that's crippled?

> That necro was literally backpedaling and strafing the whole fight and random dodging. He even used his executioner's scythe on your pet lmao. Are you seriously telling me that someone that misplayed basically every single time he pressed a button on his keyboard is a good example of how necro performs against ranger?

You expect him to cast his abilities while standing still? Good idea captain ! /s

When he was running straight forward bird caught you to him easly. Like whatever, nothing is proof for you.

Oh yes, nice attempt to scold him for tanking hilt bash under quickness and hilt bash isnt the most telegraphed skill in the game. :joy:

> Not to mention that the corrupts, condi, unblockable, and reveal from core necro are a much bigger counter to ranger and you showed a video of a power reaper. :joy:

Pre-patch power core necro couldnt do anything to me but either stall it or eventually die if they werent good.

[shadowpass.4236]

> @"Leonidrex.5649" said:

> 0:16. he runs, pets hit him anyways. he is not crippled or slowed.

> 0:18 happens again

> 0:25 he kites sideways away from the pet, it hits him anyways

 

At 15 seconds, he is crippled. The cripple ran out about half a second before the bird hit him.

At 18 seconds, he is also crippled.

Strafing moves slower than something running straight forward with swiftness.

 

lol... asides from the fact that he was crippled for the first two and moving slower in the 3rd, your point?

[shadowpass.4236]

> @"Odik.4587" said:

> > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > > > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > > > > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > > > > Read post above about derailing into mesmer thread (and doing it bad : problems associated with the ranger pets flaws and designs, none of which Mesmer "pets" suffer from. Really eksdee.) and prove nothing but trying to call me bad. LoL.

> > > > > No prob, according to @"ArlAlt.1630" its extremely easy to beat a ranger on mesmer. Come to 1x1 my ranger while you can play any mesmer build(that you pretend to be OP), inb4 I'm NA !

> > > > >

> > > > > Ok. Since I'm bad ranger and just player and I beat top3 necro main then its pretty much a proof that ranger is just busted and should be nerfed into oblivion.

> > > > > Contrary to some rangermain defenders that pet never hit moving targets - OWL is crippled, owl is CHILLED and still has no problems reaching necromancer and hit like a truck.

> > > >

> > > > Top 3 necro main??

> > > >

> > > > 1. At the start of the video he entered reaper shroud after getting hit by PBS instead of dodging or anti-projectiling it with his Death's Charge.

> > > > 2. After you evaded and swapped into GS he spammed autos even though he should have known you had both weapon swap and the block up so he triggered Counterattack Kick stupidly.

> > > > 3. He kept using Soul Spiral even after his stab from Infusing Terror ran out even though he just triggered Counterattack and then proceeded to NOT dodge the knockback from Counterattack Kick.

> > > > 4. He used Executioner Scythe on your pet instead of targetting you...

> > > > 5. He didn't dodge Hilt Hash.

> > > > 6. Random evaded after you used Maul.

> > > > 7. More than 10 second had passed (his shroud was back off cooldown), and yet he doesn't enter it to anti-projectile you or dodge the PBS after you swapped back into longbow.

> > > > 8. Etc. etc. he didn't even use line of sight at all and decided to kite you by backpedaling and strafing in an open field.

> > > >

> > > > I don't know who this guy with the silver badge is but he played terribly.

> > > I guess he bought his title from Helio... Oops, wrong region...

> > > Ah yes, I forgot, forum warriors are always better than others. Point was that I'm terrible/the pet damage and despite bird swimmed in the chill aoe and axe3 cripple pet still hit him.

> > > Ever heard about decay ? I guess not.

> >

> > How much more time will it take for you to realize that backpedaling means you move at the same speed as something that's crippled?

> > That necro was literally backpedaling and strafing the whole fight and random dodging. He even used his executioner's scythe on your pet lmao. Are you seriously telling me that someone that misplayed basically every single time he pressed a button on his keyboard is a good example of how necro performs against ranger?

> You expect him to cast his abilities while standing still? Good idea captain ! /s

> When he was running straight forward bird caught you to him easly. Like whatever, nothing is proof for you.

> Oh yes, nice attempt to scold him for tanking hilt bash under quickness and hilt bash isnt the most telegraphed skill in the game. :joy:

> > Not to mention that the corrupts, condi, unblockable, and reveal from core necro are a much bigger counter to ranger and you showed a video of a power reaper. :joy:

> Pre-patch power core necro couldnt do anything to me but either stall it or eventually die if they werent good.

 

Ah yes because backpedaling while a ranger is in greatsword is a good idea. /s

 

That necro literally chose to stay within range of your melee attacks. He didn't have to, and got hit by Hilt Bash and other GS skills as a result. I didn't see him dodge a single maul either lmao. Notice how at 15 seconds, when you have a movement impairing condition on you and he's running directly away, your maul doesn't hit? That's how he should kite you in melee but he didn't.

 

Not power core necro. I specifically stated _condi core necro_ but you misread.

[Odik.4587]

> @"LughLongArm.5460" said:

> > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > @"LughLongArm.5460" said:

> > Yesterday you told me that you agree that bird is OP, today is a different day? Thanks for calling me best mesmer you fought, that was very flattering ;)

> > What you have said about the pets is pretty much applies on all AI's/summons/clones etc.

> > Gazelle is not a glass cannon pet, check it stats few times ;)

> > >Rangers will love is to trade pets burst potential with utility(there is a reason why Smokescale is the most popular pets even after years of damage nerfs

> > The reason: it does okayish consistent damage, its pretty tanky, has a 2s knockdown and easly follows up enemies all around with smokeassault(does good damage) and smoke field for stealth? The best pet of all times.

> > Simply look at owl total stats 8159 vs 9623 gazelle vs 9244 smokesacle? Thats pure powercreep to me

> > On the side note they should review a lot of core pets/pof pets and bring them closer to each other and make their abilities more useful ? Many core pets are just so bad that no one would ever look their way, they should do something about it and I highly doubt they would. That deserves to have an entirely new thread and discussion, mine is not about it.

>

> I do think you are an amazing Mesmer, and not because you killed me like 3 times straight on an experimental trapper build I tried. I thought you were amazing because you interrupted all my most crucial abilities(heal, blast skill when I wanted to stealth etc) exactly at the most crucial moments. Having awareness and appreciation to another player's finesse is a key factor when considering balance issues. Another player would just call you a noob that is being carried by a noob build, then go on forums and post, MESMERS OP, PLEASE NERF.

>

> When I told you birds were OP, it was more of me agreeing it is very good ATM and also in the context of 1vs1. My reasoning is that 1vs1 is not a good benchmark to balance pets around. I did agree however that cats and birds coefficients should be examined for the sake of "standardization", some pets got coefficient reduction while other got none. But like other "standardization" changes for other classes I wish for those kind of nerfs to a start of an ongoing process to make pets more utility oriented and gear stats based.

>

> -It is true Gazelle got more tank heavy stats, but after last patch it is also not really a glass cannon, most players take take for the CC, not the damage. The pathing of this pet is the worst of all(due to the run to oblivion skill), resulting with this pet harder to sustain(this is my experience with it atleast).

>

> - Regarding somkescalre I agree. For it is a sample of a smart pet design. It is very well rounded, the damage is consistent but low(not OKish, like 3k every 16sec) and its winning point will always be the smoke field(utility).

Not like I claimed that I'm the best mesmer or thought fighting your weird trapper thing makes me a better player, I made a remark about it "good joke" if you remember :)

I have stated myself they should review pets and it would be better if they prioritize not quantity but quality of pets, but you cant compensate design flaws with slapping insane damage over and be like "yes, this should do it".

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > @"Leonidrex.5649" said:

> > 0:16. he runs, pets hit him anyways. he is not crippled or slowed.

> > 0:18 happens again

> > 0:25 he kites sideways away from the pet, it hits him anyways

>

> At 15 seconds, he is crippled. The cripple ran out about half a second before the bird hit him.

> At 18 second, he is also crippled.

> Strafing moves slower than something running straight forward with swiftness.

>

> lol... asides from the fact that he was crippled for the first two and moving slower in the 3rd, your point?

 

It's easy, don't you've an eu acc? Load up your necro, Odik plays ranger and have a duel. Don't forget to blame ping after your loss tho.

[shadowpass.4236]

> @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said:

> > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said:

> > > 0:16. he runs, pets hit him anyways. he is not crippled or slowed.

> > > 0:18 happens again

> > > 0:25 he kites sideways away from the pet, it hits him anyways

> >

> > At 15 seconds, he is crippled. The cripple ran out about half a second before the bird hit him.

> > At 18 second, he is also crippled.

> > Strafing moves slower than something running straight forward with swiftness.

> >

> > lol... asides from the fact that he was crippled for the first two and moving slower in the 3rd, your point?

>

> It's easy, don't you've an eu acc? Load up your necro, Odik plays ranger and have a duel. Don't forget to blame ping after your loss tho.

 

Dodging attacks like PBS relies on ping. You'll see in my videos I get hit by attacks mid-dodge animation pretty frequently.

 

[Like this](

)

[Or this](

)

 

Since my keyboard also got picked up by my mic, not only can you see me mid-dodge but you can hear me press it before the attacks hit as well. So no, I'm not going to fight him on EU when part of the strategy is to dodge specific attacks. However, I'll record some necro vs. ranger games on NA when I have some time.

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said:

> > > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said:

> > > > 0:16. he runs, pets hit him anyways. he is not crippled or slowed.

> > > > 0:18 happens again

> > > > 0:25 he kites sideways away from the pet, it hits him anyways

> > >

> > > At 15 seconds, he is crippled. The cripple ran out about half a second before the bird hit him.

> > > At 18 second, he is also crippled.

> > > Strafing moves slower than something running straight forward with swiftness.

> > >

> > > lol... asides from the fact that he was crippled for the first two and moving slower in the 3rd, your point?

> >

> > It's easy, don't you've an eu acc? Load up your necro, Odik plays ranger and have a duel. Don't forget to blame ping after your loss tho.

>

> Dodging attacks like PBS relies on ping. You'll see in my videos I get hit by attacks mid-dodge animation pretty frequently.

>

> [Like this](

)

> [Or this](

)

>

> Since my keyboard also got picked up by my mic, not only can you see me mid-dodge but you can hear me press it before the attacks hit as well. So no, I'm not going to fight him on EU when part of the strategy is to dodge specific attacks. However, I'll record some necro vs. ranger games on NA when I have some time.

 

Odik has always a trash ping too, so it is fair.

[shadowpass.4236]

> @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said:

> > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said:

> > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said:

> > > > > 0:16. he runs, pets hit him anyways. he is not crippled or slowed.

> > > > > 0:18 happens again

> > > > > 0:25 he kites sideways away from the pet, it hits him anyways

> > > >

> > > > At 15 seconds, he is crippled. The cripple ran out about half a second before the bird hit him.

> > > > At 18 second, he is also crippled.

> > > > Strafing moves slower than something running straight forward with swiftness.

> > > >

> > > > lol... asides from the fact that he was crippled for the first two and moving slower in the 3rd, your point?

> > >

> > > It's easy, don't you've an eu acc? Load up your necro, Odik plays ranger and have a duel. Don't forget to blame ping after your loss tho.

> >

> > Dodging attacks like PBS relies on ping. You'll see in my videos I get hit by attacks mid-dodge animation pretty frequently.

> >

> > [Like this](

)

> > [Or this](

)

> >

> > Since my keyboard also got picked up by my mic, not only can you see me mid-dodge but you can hear me press it before the attacks hit as well. So no, I'm not going to fight him on EU when part of the strategy is to dodge specific attacks. However, I'll record some necro vs. ranger games on NA when I have some time.

>

> Odik has always a trash ping too, so it is fair.

 

Dueling a good ranger when both parties have good ping is a better way to show mechanics. Having one person play on more than 6x their normal ping when it's pretty unnecessary, isn't.

 

I'll duel Eura, Kiri, or Stawk later if we're on at the same time.